Top Level Goalie Questions (Girls)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Through 15U most of the clubs will be splitting GKs (assuming they can roster 2 competitive keepers). By 16U, there is usually a starter and a backup. Strong GKs don’t want to be seen splitting time as they enter the recruiting years. There are some exceptions at regionally dominant clubs, but in the DMV that’s not the case. At the older ages clubs have a difficult time finding GKs that are strong.

This. If your DC has aspirations for playing on they need to be the number one GK on their team who plays against the better teams

Agree. By U16 you need to be able to call yourself the starting keeper in convos with coaches. No one at a top soccer school is looking to recruit the second keeper, especially when the colleges are recruiting possible starters only every 2nd or 3rd year. However, t are plenty of GKs recruited as practice players, but usually it’s quite clear that that’s where they’ll remain. Some of those slots may go to second keepers. If that works for your DD that is an option.

Starting is not the same as the number 1 keeper. The second half keeper in a tournament is the one doing PKs

Totally true, but that's not how many coaches understand it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If it were my DC I would look for a team where they can play every minute every game. The back up should be a keeper first but if they want to play. They should learn to be a field player for their minutes.

the problem is that backup then moves to a team where they can play. Your DC gets injured and now the random tall girl on the bench is playing keeper in league games

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Through 15U most of the clubs will be splitting GKs (assuming they can roster 2 competitive keepers). By 16U, there is usually a starter and a backup. Strong GKs don’t want to be seen splitting time as they enter the recruiting years. There are some exceptions at regionally dominant clubs, but in the DMV that’s not the case. At the older ages clubs have a difficult time finding GKs that are strong.

This. If your DC has aspirations for playing on they need to be the number one GK on their team who plays against the better teams

Agree. By U16 you need to be able to call yourself the starting keeper in convos with coaches. No one at a top soccer school is looking to recruit the second keeper, especially when the colleges are recruiting possible starters only every 2nd or 3rd year. However, t are plenty of GKs recruited as practice players, but usually it’s quite clear that that’s where they’ll remain. Some of those slots may go to second keepers. If that works for your DD that is an option.

Starting is not the same as the number 1 keeper. The second half keeper in a tournament is the one doing PKs

Splitting time is for an average to below average keeper. A good keeper should control the field and needs to be on the field. splitting time adds to confusion as to who the leader is. For those who say its normal to split time dont honestly realize that means you dont have a great keeper your blinded by personal interest.

[Anonymous]

I am not expert but am seeing it depends on the team. My DD team has one who ism average and possibly below average mainly because she is super short. I know the coach would love to add a second goalie to the mix as I don't think this one is a good long term option for this ECNL team. Meanwhile the coach also coaches an older ECNL team that has an amazing goalie. My guess is he would NOT look for another goalie for this team. This goalie is so good she could play anywhere and would be very unhappy with splitting time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am not expert but am seeing it depends on the team. My DD team has one who ism average and possibly below average mainly because she is super short. I know the coach would love to add a second goalie to the mix as I don't think this one is a good long term option for this ECNL team. Meanwhile the coach also coaches an older ECNL team that has an amazing goalie. My guess is he would NOT look for another goalie for this team. This goalie is so good she could play anywhere and would be very unhappy with splitting time.

Being short isn't a main pointer to being an average or below average keeper. Obviously being tall may help a keeper more easily cover the corners, but they would still need the other physical attributes to react quickly, dive further, etc. Realistically, being tall lets them play the goal differently than someone who is shorter and it may be more forgiving (ex. they forget their ball line but can still cover far post because of that extra few inches and a quick reaction speed). That being said, you can cover the net if you are on the short side. It's all about body positioning, understanding your ball line, and understanding where you can cover. There are coaches that look at height as the main factor for their gks, and it's just dumb.

[Anonymous]

ECNL parent here, U15, and I've never watch a game where the other team doesn't switch keepers at halftime. I like, one game Loudoun had one keeper the whole time, but the most recent game, they had two and switched at half. Never seen a single game keeper.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not expert but am seeing it depends on the team. My DD team has one who ism average and possibly below average mainly because she is super short. I know the coach would love to add a second goalie to the mix as I don't think this one is a good long term option for this ECNL team. Meanwhile the coach also coaches an older ECNL team that has an amazing goalie. My guess is he would NOT look for another goalie for this team. This goalie is so good she could play anywhere and would be very unhappy with splitting time.

Being short isn't a main pointer to being an average or below average keeper. Obviously being tall may help a keeper more easily cover the corners, but they would still need the other physical attributes to react quickly, dive further, etc. Realistically, being tall lets them play the goal differently than someone who is shorter and it may be more forgiving (ex. they forget their ball line but can still cover far post because of that extra few inches and a quick reaction speed). That being said, you can cover the net if you are on the short side. It's all about body positioning, understanding your ball line, and understanding where you can cover. There are coaches that look at height as the main factor for their gks, and it's just dumb.

you're assuming that there aren't also tall girls who also know how to play the position. The short keeper isn't competing for time with tall stiffs- those kids aren't even being considered- they're competing with tall girls who are probably just as athletic and know the position

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not expert but am seeing it depends on the team. My DD team has one who ism average and possibly below average mainly because she is super short. I know the coach would love to add a second goalie to the mix as I don't think this one is a good long term option for this ECNL team. Meanwhile the coach also coaches an older ECNL team that has an amazing goalie. My guess is he would NOT look for another goalie for this team. This goalie is so good she could play anywhere and would be very unhappy with splitting time.

Being short isn't a main pointer to being an average or below average keeper. Obviously being tall may help a keeper more easily cover the corners, but they would still need the other physical attributes to react quickly, dive further, etc. Realistically, being tall lets them play the goal differently than someone who is shorter and it may be more forgiving (ex. they forget their ball line but can still cover far post because of that extra few inches and a quick reaction speed). That being said, you can cover the net if you are on the short side. It's all about body positioning, understanding your ball line, and understanding where you can cover. There are coaches that look at height as the main factor for their gks, and it's just dumb.

Watch good ECNL strikers... so many shots are high. Why? Because overwhelming majority of keepers at about 5'6-5'8" and can't get the crossbar or diagonal upper dive. Height is increasingly important as we continue up the U-brackets and I've seen the taller keepers easily handle good teams because they shoot it shoulder high to crossbar 9 of 10 times.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We have had two since U13. Always 50/50 game time and same halves each game. Definitely no clear #1/#2 by coach, but my DD is on 7 games with 0 conceded.

so from one parent of a female GK to another, you daughter is on a team with a rock solid defense

your comment about 7 games 0 conceded gave me a good laugh, thank you

Its so good to see parents recognize the bolded.

-Parent of a defender

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:two per team is 100% normal. No worry about being scouted. As an example, Jeff Cup has keeper specific training day that's an hour and a half of just keepers (usually) in front of scouts. A "great" keeper can easily go a whole game barely touching the ball if the team they play is inferior and you're a great team. Unlike majority of field players who'll get lots of action, keepers are hit or miss. There is no issue with two keepers per team and likely is smart on the coach to do so there isn't a massive gaping hole in your team if they go down. Good luck.

Because opportunities are hit or miss, a keeper should seek to play all the minutes. Splitting time cuts their opportunities to shine in half. Coaches will say they want two, but they really want one great keeper and someone to fill in when that keeper can’t play.

Bollocks. Coaches of competitive teams want one good keeper on hand for every game, regardless of circumstance or injury. The reality, especially for girls youth soccer, is that injuries occur and that means competitive teams need two good keepers on the roster. You don't have to look too far to see that is the case; you just don't see any elite youth, college, or pro teams with only one keeper. Since a big part of being good is the mental part, coaches who understand the position will rotate time equally except for when critical games are on the line. If your team isn't doing this, they either just couldn't find a suitable second keeper, the team isn't playing at a level where depth becomes important, or the coach does not understand how to develop the position.

All players and keepers are seeking to play every minute, that is a given. Nobody plays this game to ride the bench.

I get your perspective, but this leans heavily on having a coach that actually understands the position. I find that hard to come by. Most coaches have no idea what makes a good keeper other than the score line and physical attributes. Having a coach that understands which of their two keepers is actually better is like a unicorn. I've experienced many coaches who don't understand that difference and their better keeper is sitting on the bench in a close/critical game.

I disagree with your premise that a coach only carrying one keeper "doesn't how to develop the position", that they couldn't find a good second, or that they don't play at a high level. Maybe they value consistency over competition as well as stability for their defense. Having competing styles and messages from different keepers can screw up game flow and plan. I believe having 2 (or more) keepers is the norm after u13, but that doesn't mean that system is better than having a single keeper.

well sure, if you could have one good keeper that was always there and never got hurt or sick, that is obviously the best scenario for the team, and that keeper. But it's just not reality, and most coaches can't afford the dropoff with a second rate backup. You can't develop a second keeper without letting them play. This position, more than any other, requires game time to master.

[Anonymous]

by U-15 every ECNL/DA/GA team keeps two keepers. You can do that with one keeper on the team and another keeper that is on a lower team and plays part time or even two or three.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am not expert but am seeing it depends on the team. My DD team has one who ism average and possibly below average mainly because she is super short. I know the coach would love to add a second goalie to the mix as I don't think this one is a good long term option for this ECNL team. Meanwhile the coach also coaches an older ECNL team that has an amazing goalie. My guess is he would NOT look for another goalie for this team. This goalie is so good she could play anywhere and would be very unhappy with splitting time.

Being short isn't a main pointer to being an average or below average keeper. Obviously being tall may help a keeper more easily cover the corners, but they would still need the other physical attributes to react quickly, dive further, etc. Realistically, being tall lets them play the goal differently than someone who is shorter and it may be more forgiving (ex. they forget their ball line but can still cover far post because of that extra few inches and a quick reaction speed). That being said, you can cover the net if you are on the short side. It's all about body positioning, understanding your ball line, and understanding where you can cover. There are coaches that look at height as the main factor for their gks, and it's just dumb.

Watch good ECNL strikers... so many shots are high. Why? Because overwhelming majority of keepers at about 5'6-5'8" and can't get the crossbar or diagonal upper dive. Height is increasingly important as we continue up the U-brackets and I've seen the taller keepers easily handle good teams because they shoot it shoulder high to crossbar 9 of 10 times.

Which is all funny. I've seen a ton of "tall" keepers look ridiculous when they let in anything lower than their waist. I guess what I'm saying is that being tall combined with having every physical attribute, knowing the game, and being mentally though is the holy grail it's not all there in many cases. Not having the height but having the other things can work for many gks. They might let in a few more high/top corner shots, but cover their range much better than many others.

[Anonymous]

When I think of someone saying "tall" is needed, it's not ONLY thing, it's the addition of the regular traits taught to a keeper accompanying the height. You can show a keeper literally everything except height. I can help your quickness, IQ, defense alignment... but dammit, I cannot teach you to get your hand on the crossbar to stop a high shot. Period.

[Anonymous]

find me a center in basketball that's shorter than the power forward and i will show you a losing team. some positions need height, some speed, so why act like height doesnt matter but constantly claim speed is critical to other positions

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When I think of someone saying "tall" is needed, it's not ONLY thing, it's the addition of the regular traits taught to a keeper accompanying the height. You can show a keeper literally everything except height. I can help your quickness, IQ, defense alignment... but dammit, I cannot teach you to get your hand on the crossbar to stop a high shot. Period.

The trouble is, most of your taller youth keepers fundamentally lack quickness and power because they simply have grown faster and/or earlier. The rare ones catch up, but you can't tell which ones. I would choose the "athlete" every time, regardless of size.