NYT Op Ed from a pediatrician - again arguing against schools closures

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/17/opinion/schools-closing-covid.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage

I couldn't agree more and am really disappointed with MCPS and their non-scientific "health metrics" which we will certainly never meet, meaning no in-person school for our kids this year.

This isn’t about the kids. This is a workplace safety issue. The sooner you realize that and understand that your feelings as a parent are completely irrelevant, the sooner you will understand the reality of the situation.

Why the hell would a doctor write about schools? Maybe a teacher should write about the medical workplace?

Are you that myopic? Because DOCTORS CARE ABOUT CHILDREN'S HEALTH, that's why. It's. Not. All. About. COVID.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
There is a vocal handful on these boards that clamor for school openings and quote dubious claims by people who are not pandemic experts.
We must ignore them. They are literally pushing for more deaths.

Literally every health expert thinks schools should reopen. This is not a "handful" of voices. The only ones against it are teachers' unions.

Wrong.

1. DH and I are in the field. NO ONE we know think schools should open at this time.
2. There was some talk during the summer of opening schools. At the time the nation was not in a death spiral. Pay attention to timing of interviews or articles.
3. There are certain professionals who seek media attention, and may choose to take click-bait views. Remember that they do not talk for their profession.

You don't know a lot of people then. There's no way you'd find 100% consensus on keeping schools closed. You exaggerate and/or lie.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
There is a vocal handful on these boards that clamor for school openings and quote dubious claims by people who are not pandemic experts.
We must ignore them. They are literally pushing for more deaths.

Literally every health expert thinks schools should reopen. This is not a "handful" of voices. The only ones against it are teachers' unions.

Wrong.

1. DH and I are in the field. NO ONE we know think schools should open at this time.
2. There was some talk during the summer of opening schools. At the time the nation was not in a death spiral. Pay attention to timing of interviews or articles.
3. There are certain professionals who seek media attention, and may choose to take click-bait views. Remember that they do not talk for their profession.

1. Please link me to the position of a prominent public health authority or researcher who thinks that we should continue to keep schools closed no matter what. I certainly haven't read it. Instead, I've only seen statements that we need to work harder on reopening and prioritize schools, like this op-ed.

2. The "talk" at the beginning of the summer WHEN IT WAS SAFE should have been listened to. That was when kids could have gone back to school safely and have benefitted from 2-3 months in class. So that point just undermines your argument.

3. If your argument is that every single voice in favor of reopening schools is just a "click-bait view," I seriously don't know what to tell you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
There is a vocal handful on these boards that clamor for school openings and quote dubious claims by people who are not pandemic experts.
We must ignore them. They are literally pushing for more deaths.

Literally every health expert thinks schools should reopen. This is not a "handful" of voices. The only ones against it are teachers' unions.

Wrong.

1. DH and I are in the field. NO ONE we know think schools should open at this time.
2. There was some talk during the summer of opening schools. At the time the nation was not in a death spiral. Pay attention to timing of interviews or articles.
3. There are certain professionals who seek media attention, and may choose to take click-bait views. Remember that they do not talk for their profession.

You don't know a lot of people then. There's no way you'd find 100% consensus on keeping schools closed. You exaggerate and/or lie.

Yeah I wonder how "in the field" they are. I'm guessing they are some kind of marginal think tank workers in DC - who have already proven themselves to be way out of touch.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/17/opinion/schools-closing-covid.html?action=click&module=Opinion&pgtype=Homepage

I couldn't agree more and am really disappointed with MCPS and their non-scientific "health metrics" which we will certainly never meet, meaning no in-person school for our kids this year.

This isn’t about the kids. This is a workplace safety issue. The sooner you realize that and understand that your feelings as a parent are completely irrelevant, the sooner you will understand the reality of the situation.

Why the hell would a doctor write about schools? Maybe a teacher should write about the medical workplace?

I do understand the reality of the situation, which is that the education of public school kids in the DMV falls below the interests of private daycare kids, wealthy private school kids, Catholic school kids, bar patrons, gym goers, ESCAPE ROOMS, and pretty much everything else.

100%
If we were in a true stay-at-home order, with bars and gyms, and restaurants closed, then I could understand schools also being closed.
But the fact that bars are open and schools are closed.... it's truly incomprehensible.
Walking by crowded bars, seeing all these unmasked people sharing tables "eating".... while having my 8 year old trying to learn through mediocre DL... it's infuriating.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
There is a vocal handful on these boards that clamor for school openings and quote dubious claims by people who are not pandemic experts.
We must ignore them. They are literally pushing for more deaths.

Literally every health expert thinks schools should reopen. This is not a "handful" of voices. The only ones against it are teachers' unions.

Wrong.

1. DH and I are in the field. NO ONE we know think schools should open at this time.
2. There was some talk during the summer of opening schools. At the time the nation was not in a death spiral. Pay attention to timing of interviews or articles.
3. There are certain professionals who seek media attention, and may choose to take click-bait views. Remember that they do not talk for their profession.

I kind of agree with both of you.

I think there's a very broad set of public health professionals that think improperly prioritized with reopening. Meaning, some combination of taking stronger inventions besides closing schools, along with accepting greater risks to in order to reopen schools.

But yes, in the *current* situation that we've found ourselves in I think there's relatively few that would be arguing to reopen schools *right now.*

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
1. Cases have never been higher in MD.
2. Hospitalizations are EXPLODING and will be back to spring pandemic levels in the next few weeks.
3. Deaths are still low but will inevitably increase as hospitalization stays extend.



The factor to watch right now is hospitalizations. The curve is practically vertical. It's an extremely worrying sign.

No one should be talking about opening schools unless they have a death wish for the state of Maryland.

The rates are going to go down in a few months. If we don't talk seriously about reopening now, schools will NEVER reopen. Which is untenable. At this point, we need to be talking not only about getting kids back to school at the earliest possible moment, but also a Marshall Plan for remediating all the learning loss.

MCPS and others have made plans and will not stop developing those plans. MCPS even sent out a survey last week for parents to formally choose virtual or hybrid, which was widely panned because the nature of in-person education lacked definition. This is not MCPS's fault, but a sign of the volatility and low-visibility of pandemic evolution, which is not under any school's control. Schools are doing the best they can.

Full openings depend on mass vaccination. This school year will be 100% virtual, because the vaccines won't be distributed in time. The next school year will have a virtual option, since not enough adults will have received a vaccine and children will not be vaccinated yet.

This is not a discussion on future openings. OP is clearly looking for a fight on whether we should open NOW. We need to shut this down. The school trolls are just like the Trump trolls on the politics forum, always looking to sow doubt and divide the population in matters of life and death.

[Anonymous]

Education is not a priority during an out of control pandemic.
Also, just because restaurants and other entertainment are still open, contrary to all safety rules, it doesn't mean schools should open. Basic logic. We must not accumulate risks. If you want the reverse, open schools and closed everything else, please lobby your government, but I'm not holding my breath.

This is what's happening whether you like it or not. You could save yourselves some heartache and lower your blood pressure if you just figured out a way to deal with the reality of the situation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
1. Cases have never been higher in MD.
2. Hospitalizations are EXPLODING and will be back to spring pandemic levels in the next few weeks.
3. Deaths are still low but will inevitably increase as hospitalization stays extend.



The factor to watch right now is hospitalizations. The curve is practically vertical. It's an extremely worrying sign.

No one should be talking about opening schools unless they have a death wish for the state of Maryland.

The rates are going to go down in a few months. If we don't talk seriously about reopening now, schools will NEVER reopen. Which is untenable. At this point, we need to be talking not only about getting kids back to school at the earliest possible moment, but also a Marshall Plan for remediating all the learning loss.

MCPS and others have made plans and will not stop developing those plans. MCPS even sent out a survey last week for parents to formally choose virtual or hybrid, which was widely panned because the nature of in-person education lacked definition. This is not MCPS's fault, but a sign of the volatility and low-visibility of pandemic evolution, which is not under any school's control. Schools are doing the best they can.

Full openings depend on mass vaccination. This school year will be 100% virtual, because the vaccines won't be distributed in time. The next school year will have a virtual option, since not enough adults will have received a vaccine and children will not be vaccinated yet.

This is not a discussion on future openings. OP is clearly looking for a fight on whether we should open NOW. We need to shut this down. The school trolls are just like the Trump trolls on the politics forum, always looking to sow doubt and divide the population in matters of life and death.

Does that mean next school year 2021-2022, MCPS will be virtual at least for sure? But, how likely MCPS will open full time 5 days ( before covid time) next school year? 50% or more if no kid vaccine is available?

[Anonymous]

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/11/16/935559102/over-1-million-children-tested-positive-for-coronavirus-in-the-united-states?utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_term=nprnews&fbclid=IwAR22a3AlJHp3DfQY5x2CIP0Q3L1COZoTQCmuns7zKzgkBUWQVZSkZA0Fk6A

Over 1 Million Children Tested Positive For Coronavirus In The United States

Most of the schools in non-urban areas are already open.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
1. Cases have never been higher in MD.
2. Hospitalizations are EXPLODING and will be back to spring pandemic levels in the next few weeks.
3. Deaths are still low but will inevitably increase as hospitalization stays extend.



The factor to watch right now is hospitalizations. The curve is practically vertical. It's an extremely worrying sign.

No one should be talking about opening schools unless they have a death wish for the state of Maryland.

The rates are going to go down in a few months. If we don't talk seriously about reopening now, schools will NEVER reopen. Which is untenable. At this point, we need to be talking not only about getting kids back to school at the earliest possible moment, but also a Marshall Plan for remediating all the learning loss.

MCPS and others have made plans and will not stop developing those plans. MCPS even sent out a survey last week for parents to formally choose virtual or hybrid, which was widely panned because the nature of in-person education lacked definition. This is not MCPS's fault, but a sign of the volatility and low-visibility of pandemic evolution, which is not under any school's control. Schools are doing the best they can.

Full openings depend on mass vaccination. This school year will be 100% virtual, because the vaccines won't be distributed in time. The next school year will have a virtual option, since not enough adults will have received a vaccine and children will not be vaccinated yet.

This is not a discussion on future openings. OP is clearly looking for a fight on whether we should open NOW. We need to shut this down. The school trolls are just like the Trump trolls on the politics forum, always looking to sow doubt and divide the population in matters of life and death.

Does that mean next school year 2021-2022, MCPS will be virtual at least for sure? But, how likely MCPS will open full time 5 days ( before covid time) next school year? 50% or more if no kid vaccine is available?

They’ll be open next year (likely 5 day) with a DL option. The educational outcomes are going to be disastrous this year, and they have to start fixing that before it’s too late. Enough people will be vaccinated, including teachers, to cut virus numbers significantly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Does that mean next school year 2021-2022, MCPS will be virtual at least for sure? But, how likely MCPS will open full time 5 days ( before covid time) next school year? 50% or more if no kid vaccine is available?

Given the adult vaccine projections, and given that there is no child vaccine AT ALL right now, there should be a virtual option for the duration of the 2021-2022 school year. I don't know what the other option will look like: perhaps full time in-person, with masks. Not because it's safe, but because hybrid poses enormous logistical problems for public schools. You'll notice very few school systems actually implemented a hybrid plan. It's a planning and operational nightmare.

Privates may choose to reopen fully, no virtual.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
There is a vocal handful on these boards that clamor for school openings and quote dubious claims by people who are not pandemic experts.
We must ignore them. They are literally pushing for more deaths.

OK, union rep. Everyone on this board who cares for children and believes in science: remember, the teacher's union and the politicians on the Apple Ballot have destroyed your children's lives for the past four months. They should have been in school, but instead we've had bars and restaurants open while teachers collect their paychecks and coast towards their pensions--and they want to keep schools closed for as long as possible. Remember this at the polls; write to County Council; remember that this organization is doing a lifetime of damage to your kids.

[Anonymous]

If only the author were an infectious disease doc. Instead, he's a frustrated ped who blogs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/11/16/935559102/over-1-million-children-tested-positive-for-coronavirus-in-the-united-states?utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=npr&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_term=nprnews&fbclid=IwAR22a3AlJHp3DfQY5x2CIP0Q3L1COZoTQCmuns7zKzgkBUWQVZSkZA0Fk6A

Over 1 Million Children Tested Positive For Coronavirus In The United States

Most of the schools in non-urban areas are already open.

Were.

Some closed recently. Some will have to close soon, even the ones in safety-resistant states. Many should have closed a long time ago, but didn't, and that's why hospitals are overwhelmed and people are dying in large numbers.