USC - Still Apply?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No. USC was always the University of Spoled Children or University of Second Chance (after UCLA) decades ago whenI went to school and taught there. it is not worth 75K. A year unless you want to pay that for a party school. google USC news and read what former faculty and trustees are saying. USC code to look the other way too long and play the college admissions game. there will be a lo of further disclosures coming. go to a good state school. Bank the difference. get great grades and put your effort into getting into a truly xlnt grad program

How old are you and is you info?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Eh it’s always been a school for rich people to send their 3rd tier academics and 1st tiers academics on scholarship. Except for film where it is a standout, but if you aren’t a Coppola not sure if worth it.

And the neighborhood it is in is worse than Berry-era Anacostia.

His name was Barry, and, having been over there three weeks ago, I disagree. It's not very pretty, on the west side, though

[Anonymous]

No, USC got hit the hardest with this scandal because a high level faculty was involved.
This scandal is BIG and it even reaches international audiences.
To the layman and to non-alumni, the school's reputation as the university of spoiled children is effectively welded in.

Add in the fact that there is a large international rich and stupid chinese population that are also cheating their way through the school, most people will question the legitimacy of your education and skill set.
Also USC has the notoriety of regularly having classes that are the size of auditoriums.
Who knows how many international and Olivia Jades payed for someone to take their classes for them in those large and impersonal classes.
From the perspective of an employer, there will always be a doubt in the back of my mind when looking at resumes with USC.

[Anonymous]

Besides denigrating the Chinese, are you sure you’re not referring to the under publicized TOEFL cheating at UCLA?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. USC was always the University of Spoled Children or University of Second Chance (after UCLA) decades ago whenI went to school and taught there. it is not worth 75K. A year unless you want to pay that for a party school. google USC news and read what former faculty and trustees are saying. USC code to look the other way too long and play the college admissions game. there will be a lo of further disclosures coming. go to a good state school. Bank the difference. get great grades and put your effort into getting into a truly xlnt grad program

How old are you and is you info?

Info is current. Read. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-03-16/-university-of-scandal-admission-scam-is-latest-to-tar-hot-usc. No way would I invest 75K a year at USC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Of course people will still apply. It’s one of the best colleges in the US. This was not in the admissions department of any of the schools mentioned. It was bad actors in the athletics departments of the schools. The Georgetown coach was involved with at least 12 students. Will it affect Georgetown?

Last year, we saw the stories about deferral/rejections from donors to UVA being kicked back to UVA admissions to “take another look”. Those kicked back were for donating families in the several hundred thousand dollar range. This was in the UVA admissions office. Ironically, that 500k spent by Loughlin would have legally bought her a spot at UVA easily. For a spot at USC, Stanford, Yale, Georgetown, that 500k open donation won’t work.

UVA is a top public college. It’s still just that, a state school. All state schools are predominantly state residents; though Michigan does seem to be raising its OOS presence every year. The UC’s have 40 million residents to draw from. UVA isn’t even the best engineering school in its own state. Is Michigan? The only Public University’s that maybe belong in the top 30 are Berkeley, UCLA, and Michigan. And yes, I said maybe in the top 30. Graduate school is a different story. UVA’s Medical, Law, and Business schools keep their ranking high.

The top 30 colleges in the US are private’s and the top LAC’s;

Start with the Ivy’s and work your way up from the South, North, and out West.

Ivy’s - Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia, Penn, Dartmouth, Brown, Cornell (8).
South - Duke, Vanderbilt, Emory (3)
DC/North - Georgetown, Johns Hopkins, Notre Dame, Chicago, Northwestern, Carnegie Mellon, MIT, NYU, Tufts (9)
West - WUSL, Rice, Stanford, Cal Tech, USC (5)
LAC’s - Williams, Amherst, Swarthmore (3)

That’s 28 right there. Is anyone seriously going to choose UVA over any of these schools if cost isn’t an issue? You can start throwing in the Public’s around the mid to high twenties, and that list begins with Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan. Then the next tier of Public schools like UVA, GA Tech, UNC, UF, UT, UWash, UWisc. But they’re mixed in with the next layer of Private’s and LAC’s.

Note to parents: Please disregard this poster. They have an elitist problem with state universities and don't know what they are talking about. They also don't know all the problems at USC over the last two decades (just google it - USC News - USC tried to move itself up the USN&WR ladder too fast and the sh*t is hitting the fan). The UVA story isn't true - WaPo did one of it's alleged undercover journalism pieces which led to nowhere and nothing. So disregard the WaPo piece if they come back with it. Also, there has been a changeover in President and Admissions at UVA.

The simple fact is that UVA has been the no. 1 2 or 3 public university in the USN&WR for the last 17 years. It has often tied with UCLA for no 1. In 2019 the line up is 1) UCLA ; 2) Berkeley; 3) UVA. In 2017 UVA was no. 2. The three have been playing footsie for those top three slots for a long time. They are followed by 4) UC Santa Barbara; 5) UNC Chapel Hill; 6) UCIrvine; 7) Georgia Tech and so on.https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities/top-public. UMD at 22. USN&WR has been the gold standard for rankings for decades and continues to be. If you are fortunate enough to get in by in-state or OOS to any of these schools on the USN@QR list GO, get xlnt grades and bank the difference for what really counts: Grad School, which is approaching $100K a year for some institutions. The private schools that PP is listing are now upwards of $75 to $80K a year and climbing. That's an obscene amount of money in after-tax dollars. This is why private institutions are rapidly becoming the provence of the rich and the full freight students (no MC or UMC students). The first thing any good public or private college counselor should tell parents is to look hard at your family's finances first (and additional costs of other children going thru the college system sequentially, taking care of aged parents, saving for retirement, etc.) and figure out what is affordable BEFORE you dangle a $75K a year place in front of your child. Merit scholarships don't exist at most of the Ivies or are drying up so don't count on anything merit. Run the calculators on the school's websites. Learn about FAFSA and CSS. A good counselor will also tell you to exhaust your in-state options first if they meet your needs. Any of the California schools as OOS is a great move but the number of those seats will be dwindling as 80% of the seats go to in-state Californians. Also, and I know DCUM doesn't want to hear it but one of the smartest ways to get a great education is the Virginia community college system followed by guaranteed admission to the UVA University of your choice if your students takes the required courses and gets a certain GPA. Make sound financial decisions. Grad school will be upon you before you know it. Whatever you do, do not pay $75K a year for your kid to go to a party school. The goal here is to get a great record and great recommendations to go on to a professional school or do grad work. It is not to let junior get drunk and play with the girls.

There are many xlnt resources out there. Start with your school's counselor and Naviance, if you have it but allocate for the fact that the numbers of applications to state schools (and indeed all schools) keeps rising as do the requisite SAT/ACT and GPA. There are many excellent books on selecting the right school for your child within your financial means.

[Anonymous]

USC is becoming a punchline to a really sad joke,

[Anonymous]

Sitting in the corner, clutching one’s pearls, whimpering “must love UVA”, “must love UVA”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: I know DCUM doesn't want to hear it but one of the smartest ways to get a great education is the Virginia community college system followed by guaranteed admission to the UVA University of your choice if your students takes the required courses and gets a certain GPA.

Thank you, PP for this info. We are in CA, and our college counselor just said no real chance on DD getting into UVA since they restrict OOS kids so much. We used to live in VA and while everyone is entitled to their own opinion, it's weird to me to read Virginians dismissing UVA, as to me it seems like such a benefit to live in VA and have UVA as an option.

FWIW, UCLA has a program just like this through Santa Monica (community) College. Many people here in LA take advantage of that program. It's crazy that UCLA is our neighborhood school and it's near impossible to get in to direct from our high school.

Ok back to the main topic, I'm a UCLA grad and have lived in LA for many years. My personal opinion is that USC is taking a huge beating around here, but for those who want to be in Southern California, it has a huge network and its graduates will always be well-taken-care-of in this area. However; my USC grad school graduate friend thinks differently. Her son, a 10th grader who has been a huge USC fan for his whole life (I've known him since preschool!) is furious and is reconsidering applying to his former #1 school pick. Yes I know n=1 here, but wow, if THIS local kid is turned off, a lot of local kids will be turned off.

For us connected to UCLA, USC was always University of Spoiled Children and had a lower quality of student, but a superior alumni network. Recently, USC was really coming along and was ditching that bad rap. Now, ugh, seems like we are back to square one. The pictures of the celebrity's daughter with Rick Caruso's daughter on Rick's yacht was huge news around here. As an aside, the recent gynecologist scandal--not sure it made a news dent nationally, but around here, it just kept reverberating.

[Anonymous]

It is sexist and obnoxious to recommend picking a school because it has “hot girls.” They are fellow scholars, not window dressing (like Dallas cowboy cheerleaders!!)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course people will still apply. It’s one of the best colleges in the US. This was not in the admissions department of any of the schools mentioned. It was bad actors in the athletics departments of the schools. The Georgetown coach was involved with at least 12 students. Will it affect Georgetown?

Last year, we saw the stories about deferral/rejections from donors to UVA being kicked back to UVA admissions to “take another look”. Those kicked back were for donating families in the several hundred thousand dollar range. This was in the UVA admissions office. Ironically, that 500k spent by Loughlin would have legally bought her a spot at UVA easily. For a spot at USC, Stanford, Yale, Georgetown, that 500k open donation won’t work.

UVA is a top public college. It’s still just that, a state school. All state schools are predominantly state residents; though Michigan does seem to be raising its OOS presence every year. The UC’s have 40 million residents to draw from. UVA isn’t even the best engineering school in its own state. Is Michigan? The only Public University’s that maybe belong in the top 30 are Berkeley, UCLA, and Michigan. And yes, I said maybe in the top 30. Graduate school is a different story. UVA’s Medical, Law, and Business schools keep their ranking high.

The top 30 colleges in the US are private’s and the top LAC’s;

Start with the Ivy’s and work your way up from the South, North, and out West.

Ivy’s - Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia, Penn, Dartmouth, Brown, Cornell (8).
South - Duke, Vanderbilt, Emory (3)
DC/North - Georgetown, Johns Hopkins, Notre Dame, Chicago, Northwestern, Carnegie Mellon, MIT, NYU, Tufts (9)
West - WUSL, Rice, Stanford, Cal Tech, USC (5)
LAC’s - Williams, Amherst, Swarthmore (3)

That’s 28 right there. Is anyone seriously going to choose UVA over any of these schools if cost isn’t an issue? You can start throwing in the Public’s around the mid to high twenties, and that list begins with Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan. Then the next tier of Public schools like UVA, GA Tech, UNC, UF, UT, UWash, UWisc. But they’re mixed in with the next layer of Private’s and LAC’s.

Note to parents: Please disregard this poster. They have an elitist problem with state universities and don't know what they are talking about. They also don't know all the problems at USC over the last two decades (just google it - USC News - USC tried to move itself up the USN&WR ladder too fast and the sh*t is hitting the fan). The UVA story isn't true - WaPo did one of it's alleged undercover journalism pieces which led to nowhere and nothing. So disregard the WaPo piece if they come back with it. Also, there has been a changeover in President and Admissions at UVA.

The simple fact is that UVA has been the no. 1 2 or 3 public university in the USN&WR for the last 17 years. It has often tied with UCLA for no 1. In 2019 the line up is 1) UCLA ; 2) Berkeley; 3) UVA. In 2017 UVA was no. 2. The three have been playing footsie for those top three slots for a long time. They are followed by 4) UC Santa Barbara; 5) UNC Chapel Hill; 6) UCIrvine; 7) Georgia Tech and so on.https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities/top-public. UMD at 22. USN&WR has been the gold standard for rankings for decades and continues to be. If you are fortunate enough to get in by in-state or OOS to any of these schools on the USN@QR list GO, get xlnt grades and bank the difference for what really counts: Grad School, which is approaching $100K a year for some institutions. The private schools that PP is listing are now upwards of $75 to $80K a year and climbing. That's an obscene amount of money in after-tax dollars. This is why private institutions are rapidly becoming the provence of the rich and the full freight students (no MC or UMC students). The first thing any good public or private college counselor should tell parents is to look hard at your family's finances first (and additional costs of other children going thru the college system sequentially, taking care of aged parents, saving for retirement, etc.) and figure out what is affordable BEFORE you dangle a $75K a year place in front of your child. Merit scholarships don't exist at most of the Ivies or are drying up so don't count on anything merit. Run the calculators on the school's websites. Learn about FAFSA and CSS. A good counselor will also tell you to exhaust your in-state options first if they meet your needs. Any of the California schools as OOS is a great move but the number of those seats will be dwindling as 80% of the seats go to in-state Californians. Also, and I know DCUM doesn't want to hear it but one of the smartest ways to get a great education is the Virginia community college system followed by guaranteed admission to the UVA University of your choice if your students takes the required courses and gets a certain GPA. Make sound financial decisions. Grad school will be upon you before you know it. Whatever you do, do not pay $75K a year for your kid to go to a party school. The goal here is to get a great record and great recommendations to go on to a professional school or do grad work. It is not to let junior get drunk and play with the girls.

There are many xlnt resources out there. Start with your school's counselor and Naviance, if you have it but allocate for the fact that the numbers of applications to state schools (and indeed all schools) keeps rising as do the requisite SAT/ACT and GPA. There are many excellent books on selecting the right school for your child within your financial means.

The problem with everything you are saying is that you keep referring to USNWR. That list is a scam itself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is sexist and obnoxious to recommend picking a school because it has “hot girls.” They are fellow scholars, not window dressing (like Dallas cowboy cheerleaders!!)

Yep Olivia jade is a real scholar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course people will still apply. It’s one of the best colleges in the US. This was not in the admissions department of any of the schools mentioned. It was bad actors in the athletics departments of the schools. The Georgetown coach was involved with at least 12 students. Will it affect Georgetown?

Last year, we saw the stories about deferral/rejections from donors to UVA being kicked back to UVA admissions to “take another look”. Those kicked back were for donating families in the several hundred thousand dollar range. This was in the UVA admissions office. Ironically, that 500k spent by Loughlin would have legally bought her a spot at UVA easily. For a spot at USC, Stanford, Yale, Georgetown, that 500k open donation won’t work.

UVA is a top public college. It’s still just that, a state school. All state schools are predominantly state residents; though Michigan does seem to be raising its OOS presence every year. The UC’s have 40 million residents to draw from. UVA isn’t even the best engineering school in its own state. Is Michigan? The only Public University’s that maybe belong in the top 30 are Berkeley, UCLA, and Michigan. And yes, I said maybe in the top 30. Graduate school is a different story. UVA’s Medical, Law, and Business schools keep their ranking high.

The top 30 colleges in the US are private’s and the top LAC’s;

Start with the Ivy’s and work your way up from the South, North, and out West.

Ivy’s - Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia, Penn, Dartmouth, Brown, Cornell (8).
South - Duke, Vanderbilt, Emory (3)
DC/North - Georgetown, Johns Hopkins, Notre Dame, Chicago, Northwestern, Carnegie Mellon, MIT, NYU, Tufts (9)
West - WUSL, Rice, Stanford, Cal Tech, USC (5)
LAC’s - Williams, Amherst, Swarthmore (3)

That’s 28 right there. Is anyone seriously going to choose UVA over any of these schools if cost isn’t an issue? You can start throwing in the Public’s around the mid to high twenties, and that list begins with Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan. Then the next tier of Public schools like UVA, GA Tech, UNC, UF, UT, UWash, UWisc. But they’re mixed in with the next layer of Private’s and LAC’s.

Note to parents: Please disregard this poster. They have an elitist problem with state universities and don't know what they are talking about. They also don't know all the problems at USC over the last two decades (just google it - USC News - USC tried to move itself up the USN&WR ladder too fast and the sh*t is hitting the fan). The UVA story isn't true - WaPo did one of it's alleged undercover journalism pieces which led to nowhere and nothing. So disregard the WaPo piece if they come back with it. Also, there has been a changeover in President and Admissions at UVA.

The simple fact is that UVA has been the no. 1 2 or 3 public university in the USN&WR for the last 17 years. It has often tied with UCLA for no 1. In 2019 the line up is 1) UCLA ; 2) Berkeley; 3) UVA. In 2017 UVA was no. 2. The three have been playing footsie for those top three slots for a long time. They are followed by 4) UC Santa Barbara; 5) UNC Chapel Hill; 6) UCIrvine; 7) Georgia Tech and so on.https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities/top-public. UMD at 22. USN&WR has been the gold standard for rankings for decades and continues to be. If you are fortunate enough to get in by in-state or OOS to any of these schools on the USN@QR list GO, get xlnt grades and bank the difference for what really counts: Grad School, which is approaching $100K a year for some institutions. The private schools that PP is listing are now upwards of $75 to $80K a year and climbing. That's an obscene amount of money in after-tax dollars. This is why private institutions are rapidly becoming the provence of the rich and the full freight students (no MC or UMC students). The first thing any good public or private college counselor should tell parents is to look hard at your family's finances first (and additional costs of other children going thru the college system sequentially, taking care of aged parents, saving for retirement, etc.) and figure out what is affordable BEFORE you dangle a $75K a year place in front of your child. Merit scholarships don't exist at most of the Ivies or are drying up so don't count on anything merit. Run the calculators on the school's websites. Learn about FAFSA and CSS. A good counselor will also tell you to exhaust your in-state options first if they meet your needs. Any of the California schools as OOS is a great move but the number of those seats will be dwindling as 80% of the seats go to in-state Californians. Also, and I know DCUM doesn't want to hear it but one of the smartest ways to get a great education is the Virginia community college system followed by guaranteed admission to the UVA University of your choice if your students takes the required courses and gets a certain GPA. Make sound financial decisions. Grad school will be upon you before you know it. Whatever you do, do not pay $75K a year for your kid to go to a party school. The goal here is to get a great record and great recommendations to go on to a professional school or do grad work. It is not to let junior get drunk and play with the girls.

There are many xlnt resources out there. Start with your school's counselor and Naviance, if you have it but allocate for the fact that the numbers of applications to state schools (and indeed all schools) keeps rising as do the requisite SAT/ACT and GPA. There are many excellent books on selecting the right school for your child within your financial means.

The problem with everything you are saying is that you keep referring to USNWR. That list is a scam itself.

Sadly not. I'm a college counselor. It is the gold standard. It's been around the longest (since 1983) and it is the list maker that people pay attention to. I don't agree with all the subcategories that it evaluates institutions on, but it is what it is. From wikipedia: "Best colleges
Main article: U.S. News & World Report Best Colleges Ranking

2016 Best Colleges cover
In 1983, U.S. News & World Report published its first "America's Best Colleges" report.[20] The rankings have been compiled and published annually since 1987. These rankings are based upon data that U.S. News & World Report collects from each educational institution from an annual survey sent to each school. The rankings are also based upon opinion surveys of university faculties and administrators who do not belong to the schools. In addition to colleges, U.S. News & World Report also ranks graduate schools and academic programs in a number of specific disciplines, including business, law, engineering, nursing, and medicine.[21]

The popularity of U.S. News & World Report's Best Colleges rankings is reflected in its 2014 release, which brought 2.6 million unique visitors and 18.9 million page views to usnews.com in one day.[22] Traffic came from over 3,000 sites, including Facebook and Google.[22] U.S. News & World Report continues to publish comprehensive college guides in book form.[23] Robert Morse created the U.S. News Best Colleges rankings methodology, and continues to oversee its application as chief data strategist at U.S. News. In 2014, The Washington Post featured a profile of Morse, exploring his 30-year career with the publication.[24]"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Eh it’s always been a school for rich people to send their 3rd tier academics and 1st tiers academics on scholarship. Except for film where it is a standout, but if you aren’t a Coppola not sure if worth it.

And the neighborhood it is in is worse than Berry-era Anacostia.

If it's basically a school where you send your kid to party and rub shoulders with rich kids w/o the expectation of actually getting an education...then I would call that more of a country club than a university. I'm guessing that there must be some serious students there who actually value their educations and truly work hard to earn their degrees.

Then why has it galloped through US News ranking and is at a higher spot than Michigan? I understand the film, accounting, and business schools are excellent, but as a whole university?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Of course people will still apply. It’s one of the best colleges in the US. This was not in the admissions department of any of the schools mentioned. It was bad actors in the athletics departments of the schools. The Georgetown coach was involved with at least 12 students. Will it affect Georgetown?

Last year, we saw the stories about deferral/rejections from donors to UVA being kicked back to UVA admissions to “take another look”. Those kicked back were for donating families in the several hundred thousand dollar range. This was in the UVA admissions office. Ironically, that 500k spent by Loughlin would have legally bought her a spot at UVA easily. For a spot at USC, Stanford, Yale, Georgetown, that 500k open donation won’t work.

UVA is a top public college. It’s still just that, a state school. All state schools are predominantly state residents; though Michigan does seem to be raising its OOS presence every year. The UC’s have 40 million residents to draw from. UVA isn’t even the best engineering school in its own state. Is Michigan? The only Public University’s that maybe belong in the top 30 are Berkeley, UCLA, and Michigan. And yes, I said maybe in the top 30. Graduate school is a different story. UVA’s Medical, Law, and Business schools keep their ranking high.

The top 30 colleges in the US are private’s and the top LAC’s;

Start with the Ivy’s and work your way up from the South, North, and out West.

Ivy’s - Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia, Penn, Dartmouth, Brown, Cornell (8).
South - Duke, Vanderbilt, Emory (3)
DC/North - Georgetown, Johns Hopkins, Notre Dame, Chicago, Northwestern, Carnegie Mellon, MIT, NYU, Tufts (9)
West - WUSL, Rice, Stanford, Cal Tech, USC (5)
LAC’s - Williams, Amherst, Swarthmore (3)

That’s 28 right there. Is anyone seriously going to choose UVA over any of these schools if cost isn’t an issue? You can start throwing in the Public’s around the mid to high twenties, and that list begins with Berkeley, UCLA, Michigan. Then the next tier of Public schools like UVA, GA Tech, UNC, UF, UT, UWash, UWisc. But they’re mixed in with the next layer of Private’s and LAC’s.

Note to parents: Please disregard this poster. They have an elitist problem with state universities and don't know what they are talking about. They also don't know all the problems at USC over the last two decades (just google it - USC News - USC tried to move itself up the USN&WR ladder too fast and the sh*t is hitting the fan). The UVA story isn't true - WaPo did one of it's alleged undercover journalism pieces which led to nowhere and nothing. So disregard the WaPo piece if they come back with it. Also, there has been a changeover in President and Admissions at UVA.

The simple fact is that UVA has been the no. 1 2 or 3 public university in the USN&WR for the last 17 years. It has often tied with UCLA for no 1. In 2019 the line up is 1) UCLA ; 2) Berkeley; 3) UVA. In 2017 UVA was no. 2. The three have been playing footsie for those top three slots for a long time. They are followed by 4) UC Santa Barbara; 5) UNC Chapel Hill; 6) UCIrvine; 7) Georgia Tech and so on.https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities/top-public. UMD at 22. USN&WR has been the gold standard for rankings for decades and continues to be. If you are fortunate enough to get in by in-state or OOS to any of these schools on the USN@QR list GO, get xlnt grades and bank the difference for what really counts: Grad School, which is approaching $100K a year for some institutions. The private schools that PP is listing are now upwards of $75 to $80K a year and climbing. That's an obscene amount of money in after-tax dollars. This is why private institutions are rapidly becoming the provence of the rich and the full freight students (no MC or UMC students). The first thing any good public or private college counselor should tell parents is to look hard at your family's finances first (and additional costs of other children going thru the college system sequentially, taking care of aged parents, saving for retirement, etc.) and figure out what is affordable BEFORE you dangle a $75K a year place in front of your child. Merit scholarships don't exist at most of the Ivies or are drying up so don't count on anything merit. Run the calculators on the school's websites. Learn about FAFSA and CSS. A good counselor will also tell you to exhaust your in-state options first if they meet your needs. Any of the California schools as OOS is a great move but the number of those seats will be dwindling as 80% of the seats go to in-state Californians. Also, and I know DCUM doesn't want to hear it but one of the smartest ways to get a great education is the Virginia community college system followed by guaranteed admission to the UVA University of your choice if your students takes the required courses and gets a certain GPA. Make sound financial decisions. Grad school will be upon you before you know it. Whatever you do, do not pay $75K a year for your kid to go to a party school. The goal here is to get a great record and great recommendations to go on to a professional school or do grad work. It is not to let junior get drunk and play with the girls.

There are many xlnt resources out there. Start with your school's counselor and Naviance, if you have it but allocate for the fact that the numbers of applications to state schools (and indeed all schools) keeps rising as do the requisite SAT/ACT and GPA. There are many excellent books on selecting the right school for your child within your financial means.

The problem with everything you are saying is that you keep referring to USNWR. [b]That list is a scam itself.[/b]

Sadly not. I'm a college counselor. It is the gold standard. It's been around the longest (since 1983) and it is the list maker that people pay attention to. I don't agree with all the subcategories that it evaluates institutions on, but it is what it is. From wikipedia: "Best colleges
Main article: U.S. News & World Report Best Colleges Ranking

2016 Best Colleges cover
In 1983, U.S. News & World Report published its first "America's Best Colleges" report.[20] The rankings have been compiled and published annually since 1987. These rankings are based upon data that U.S. News & World Report collects from each educational institution from an annual survey sent to each school. The rankings are also based upon opinion surveys of university faculties and administrators who do not belong to the schools. In addition to colleges, U.S. News & World Report also ranks graduate schools and academic programs in a number of specific disciplines, including business, law, engineering, nursing, and medicine.[21]

The popularity of U.S. News & World Report's Best Colleges rankings is reflected in its 2014 release, which brought 2.6 million unique visitors and 18.9 million page views to usnews.com in one day.[22] Traffic came from over 3,000 sites, including Facebook and Google.[22] U.S. News & World Report continues to publish comprehensive college guides in book form.[23] Robert Morse created the U.S. News Best Colleges rankings methodology, and continues to oversee its application as chief data strategist at U.S. News. In 2014, The Washington Post featured a profile of Morse, exploring his 30-year career with the publication.[24]"

The USNews list is both a scam and the gold standard, which is problematic. There is no doubt that institutions have done things that do not necessarily improve educational outcomes to improve rankings, and the USNews focus on resources rather than efficiency has contributed to the runaway costs in higher education, making the U.S. system the most expensive system in the world (while having completion rates and outcomes that are mid pack in developed countries) and driving student loan debt to about $1.6 Trillion.