How is the new pilot offering equivalent to TPMS/Eastern

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:jesus. can you wait until you see what it is before condemning it?

Has waiting to see whether someone really screws you over worked for ANYONE in the past?

Think before you type, PP.

We are entitled to more information and concrete plans for students rejected from magnets.

you got a plan, and a timeline. the magnets were MASSIVELY unfair before the new admissions process was put into place. what mcps is doing makes sense. if you don’t like it, move or go to a private.

This is not a proper plan! To me, it's like saying we can't give you that $2K bonus despite your equivalent performance to your coworker, but hey...here's $3 to go get yourself a snack from the vending machine.

they had to equalize the process. the old way was clearly bad for kids without in the know parents. this is the result. i really don’t feel bad for you that your snowflake might have to survive with just enriched programming, and not a full magnet program, because the county made a wholly logical decision.

This isn't equalizing the process.

yes it is, because it involves broad testing, rather than hinging the process on parent and teacher recommendations.

NP here.

Nobody's disputing that part. People are upset about the OTHER selection criteria - the "peer group" or "existing cohort", which is utter and complete social engineering on the part of MCPS. And that's illegal, plain and simple.

What MCPS is doing right now, is trying to avoid a lawsuit. This is a great opportunity to keep pushing for more advanced classes with peer groups of students, be they in magnet programs or regular schools.

you have no evidence they actually used race as a criteria. if they did, they should be sued, but on the face of it, the peer group logic is decent policy, provided they give peer groups adequate instruction at home schools. people are just assuming they’ll fail on the latter part, which is stupid before any of us have seen it play out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:jesus. can you wait until you see what it is before condemning it?

Has waiting to see whether someone really screws you over worked for ANYONE in the past?

Think before you type, PP.

We are entitled to more information and concrete plans for students rejected from magnets.

you got a plan, and a timeline. the magnets were MASSIVELY unfair before the new admissions process was put into place. what mcps is doing makes sense. if you don’t like it, move or go to a private.

This is not a proper plan! To me, it's like saying we can't give you that $2K bonus despite your equivalent performance to your coworker, but hey...here's $3 to go get yourself a snack from the vending machine.

they had to equalize the process. the old way was clearly bad for kids without in the know parents. this is the result. i really don’t feel bad for you that your snowflake might have to survive with just enriched programming, and not a full magnet program, because the county made a wholly logical decision.

This isn't equalizing the process.

yes it is, because it involves broad testing, rather than hinging the process on parent and teacher recommendations.

NP here.

Nobody's disputing that part. People are upset about the OTHER selection criteria - the "peer group" or "existing cohort", which is utter and complete social engineering on the part of MCPS. And that's illegal, plain and simple.

What MCPS is doing right now, is trying to avoid a lawsuit. This is a great opportunity to keep pushing for more advanced classes with peer groups of students, be they in magnet programs or regular schools.

You obviously don't understand the law. Please google "social engineering" and the law. You also don't understand the legal definition of discrimination.

[Anonymous]

MCPS doing this is a little like Florida raising the age to buy a gun, but not actually banning assault rifles. It’s a step, but not equivalent.

The magnets are multi-course, deep accelerations in various areas. It’s not interdisciplinary with teachers trained and with years of expertise in teaching highly gifted students.

I am glad to see MCPS start to address the issue, but, like usual, it’s a partial, after-the-fact response due to parental outcry. It’s hard to see how the system will truly fix the problems it has in educating its top students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:jesus. can you wait until you see what it is before condemning it?

Has waiting to see whether someone really screws you over worked for ANYONE in the past?

Think before you type, PP.

We are entitled to more information and concrete plans for students rejected from magnets.

you got a plan, and a timeline. the magnets were MASSIVELY unfair before the new admissions process was put into place. what mcps is doing makes sense. if you don’t like it, move or go to a private.

This is not a proper plan! To me, it's like saying we can't give you that $2K bonus despite your equivalent performance to your coworker, but hey...here's $3 to go get yourself a snack from the vending machine.

So what would be your plan?

If I had a real choice, I would open up magnets with the proper curriculum for all kids who are qualified. I would look at a child wholly. I would scrutinize their multiple test scores, grades and voice. Race, gender and geography would not matter. Kids who are outliers I would send to Eastern or TPMS. Kids who are just as qualified but happen to be geographically located at the same school, I would offer the exact magnet curriculum. That is how I would do it, if I could have a choice. I think MCPS had the right idea, but their execution in supporting those who are capable is sorely insufficient. I do feel like what they are offering these kids are not appropriate nor enough.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:jesus. can you wait until you see what it is before condemning it?

Has waiting to see whether someone really screws you over worked for ANYONE in the past?

Think before you type, PP.

We are entitled to more information and concrete plans for students rejected from magnets.

you got a plan, and a timeline. the magnets were MASSIVELY unfair before the new admissions process was put into place. what mcps is doing makes sense. if you don’t like it, move or go to a private.

This is not a proper plan! To me, it's like saying we can't give you that $2K bonus despite your equivalent performance to your coworker, but hey...here's $3 to go get yourself a snack from the vending machine.

So what would be your plan?

If I had a real choice, I would open up magnets with the proper curriculum for all kids who are qualified. I would look at a child wholly. I would scrutinize their multiple test scores, grades and voice. Race, gender and geography would not matter. Kids who are outliers I would send to Eastern or TPMS. Kids who are just as qualified but happen to be geographically located at the same school, I would offer the exact magnet curriculum. That is how I would do it, if I could have a choice. I think MCPS had the right idea, but their execution in supporting those who are capable is sorely insufficient. I do feel like what they are offering these kids are not appropriate nor enough.

so you would do exactly what mcps is doing, except you would offer the full magnet program to kids at home schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:jesus. can you wait until you see what it is before condemning it?

Has waiting to see whether someone really screws you over worked for ANYONE in the past?

Think before you type, PP.

We are entitled to more information and concrete plans for students rejected from magnets.

you got a plan, and a timeline. the magnets were MASSIVELY unfair before the new admissions process was put into place. what mcps is doing makes sense. if you don’t like it, move or go to a private.

This is not a proper plan! To me, it's like saying we can't give you that $2K bonus despite your equivalent performance to your coworker, but hey...here's $3 to go get yourself a snack from the vending machine.

So what would be your plan?

If I had a real choice, I would open up magnets with the proper curriculum for all kids who are qualified. I would look at a child wholly. I would scrutinize their multiple test scores, grades and voice. Race, gender and geography would not matter. Kids who are outliers I would send to Eastern or TPMS. Kids who are just as qualified but happen to be geographically located at the same school, I would offer the exact magnet curriculum. That is how I would do it, if I could have a choice. I think MCPS had the right idea, but their execution in supporting those who are capable is sorely insufficient. I do feel like what they are offering these kids are not appropriate nor enough.

so you would do exactly what mcps is doing, except you would offer the full magnet program to kids at home schools.

Pretty big difference, don't you think?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:jesus. can you wait until you see what it is before condemning it?

Has waiting to see whether someone really screws you over worked for ANYONE in the past?

Think before you type, PP.

We are entitled to more information and concrete plans for students rejected from magnets.

you got a plan, and a timeline. the magnets were MASSIVELY unfair before the new admissions process was put into place. what mcps is doing makes sense. if you don’t like it, move or go to a private.

This is not a proper plan! To me, it's like saying we can't give you that $2K bonus despite your equivalent performance to your coworker, but hey...here's $3 to go get yourself a snack from the vending machine.

So what would be your plan?

If I had a real choice, I would open up magnets with the proper curriculum for all kids who are qualified. I would look at a child wholly. I would scrutinize their multiple test scores, grades and voice. Race, gender and geography would not matter. Kids who are outliers I would send to Eastern or TPMS. Kids who are just as qualified but happen to be geographically located at the same school, I would offer the exact magnet curriculum. That is how I would do it, if I could have a choice. I think MCPS had the right idea, but their execution in supporting those who are capable is sorely insufficient. I do feel like what they are offering these kids are not appropriate nor enough.

+1 Particularly since the home school enrichment is not in science/technology. They'll throw a little enrichment into the existing CM curriculum and call it a day. How is this a comparable curriculum?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:jesus. can you wait until you see what it is before condemning it?

Has waiting to see whether someone really screws you over worked for ANYONE in the past?

Think before you type, PP.

We are entitled to more information and concrete plans for students rejected from magnets.

you got a plan, and a timeline. the magnets were MASSIVELY unfair before the new admissions process was put into place. what mcps is doing makes sense. if you don’t like it, move or go to a private.

This is not a proper plan! To me, it's like saying we can't give you that $2K bonus despite your equivalent performance to your coworker, but hey...here's $3 to go get yourself a snack from the vending machine.

they had to equalize the process. the old way was clearly bad for kids without in the know parents. this is the result. i really don’t feel bad for you that your snowflake might have to survive with just enriched programming, and not a full magnet program, because the county made a wholly logical decision.

This isn't equalizing the process.

yes it is, because it involves broad testing, rather than hinging the process on parent and teacher recommendations.

NP here.

Nobody's disputing that part. People are upset about the OTHER selection criteria - the "peer group" or "existing cohort", which is utter and complete social engineering on the part of MCPS. And that's illegal, plain and simple.

What MCPS is doing right now, is trying to avoid a lawsuit. This is a great opportunity to keep pushing for more advanced classes with peer groups of students, be they in magnet programs or regular schools.

you have no evidence they actually used race as a criteria. if they did, they should be sued, but on the face of it, the peer group logic is decent policy, provided they give peer groups adequate instruction at home schools. people are just assuming they’ll fail on the latter part, which is stupid before any of us have seen it play out.

I don't think we need to prove racial discrimination. We need to prove socio-economic discrimination, and that is in fact what happened.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:jesus. can you wait until you see what it is before condemning it?

Has waiting to see whether someone really screws you over worked for ANYONE in the past?

Think before you type, PP.

We are entitled to more information and concrete plans for students rejected from magnets.

you got a plan, and a timeline. the magnets were MASSIVELY unfair before the new admissions process was put into place. what mcps is doing makes sense. if you don’t like it, move or go to a private.

This is not a proper plan! To me, it's like saying we can't give you that $2K bonus despite your equivalent performance to your coworker, but hey...here's $3 to go get yourself a snack from the vending machine.

they had to equalize the process. the old way was clearly bad for kids without in the know parents. this is the result. i really don’t feel bad for you that your snowflake might have to survive with just enriched programming, and not a full magnet program, because the county made a wholly logical decision.

This isn't equalizing the process.

yes it is, because it involves broad testing, rather than hinging the process on parent and teacher recommendations.

NP here.

Nobody's disputing that part. People are upset about the OTHER selection criteria - the "peer group" or "existing cohort", which is utter and complete social engineering on the part of MCPS. And that's illegal, plain and simple.

What MCPS is doing right now, is trying to avoid a lawsuit. This is a great opportunity to keep pushing for more advanced classes with peer groups of students, be they in magnet programs or regular schools.

you have no evidence they actually used race as a criteria. if they did, they should be sued, but on the face of it, the peer group logic is decent policy, provided they give peer groups adequate instruction at home schools. people are just assuming they’ll fail on the latter part, which is stupid before any of us have seen it play out.

I don't think we need to prove racial discrimination. We need to prove socio-economic discrimination, and that is in fact what happened.

umm you have no evidence for that either.

[Anonymous]

I honestly don't think MCPS will create a track for the "cohort". The whole point of the magnet reform is to bring "fairness" to the program. will tracking reduce achievement-gap? No, it'll probably make it worse.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I honestly don't think MCPS will create a track for the "cohort". The whole point of the magnet reform is to bring "fairness" to the program. will tracking reduce achievement-gap? No, it'll probably make it worse.

they are literally creating a track for math and/or humanities. sorry, but thanks for playing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:jesus. can you wait until you see what it is before condemning it?

Has waiting to see whether someone really screws you over worked for ANYONE in the past?

Think before you type, PP.

We are entitled to more information and concrete plans for students rejected from magnets.

you got a plan, and a timeline. the magnets were MASSIVELY unfair before the new admissions process was put into place. what mcps is doing makes sense. if you don’t like it, move or go to a private.

This is not a proper plan! To me, it's like saying we can't give you that $2K bonus despite your equivalent performance to your coworker, but hey...here's $3 to go get yourself a snack from the vending machine.

they had to equalize the process. the old way was clearly bad for kids without in the know parents. this is the result. i really don’t feel bad for you that your snowflake might have to survive with just enriched programming, and not a full magnet program, because the county made a wholly logical decision.

This isn't equalizing the process.

yes it is, because it involves broad testing, rather than hinging the process on parent and teacher recommendations.

NP here.

Nobody's disputing that part. People are upset about the OTHER selection criteria - the "peer group" or "existing cohort", which is utter and complete social engineering on the part of MCPS. And that's illegal, plain and simple.

What MCPS is doing right now, is trying to avoid a lawsuit. This is a great opportunity to keep pushing for more advanced classes with peer groups of students, be they in magnet programs or regular schools.

you have no evidence they actually used race as a criteria. if they did, they should be sued, but on the face of it, the peer group logic is decent policy, provided they give peer groups adequate instruction at home schools. people are just assuming they’ll fail on the latter part, which is stupid before any of us have seen it play out.

I don't think most of us are talking about race. There are a few racist people saying random things. Please don't let them mar this conversation. I am all for opening up and broadening the testing process. It's the later half of the process that was not well thought out. Yes, they might have an idea of piloting something a year ago, but it merely isn't enough. It is not enough time to train teachers (and teachers will feel resentful). It is not enough time to really bring a rich curriculum rather than a couple of ad hoc electives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:jesus. can you wait until you see what it is before condemning it?

Has waiting to see whether someone really screws you over worked for ANYONE in the past?

Think before you type, PP.

We are entitled to more information and concrete plans for students rejected from magnets.

you got a plan, and a timeline. the magnets were MASSIVELY unfair before the new admissions process was put into place. what mcps is doing makes sense. if you don’t like it, move or go to a private.

This is not a proper plan! To me, it's like saying we can't give you that $2K bonus despite your equivalent performance to your coworker, but hey...here's $3 to go get yourself a snack from the vending machine.

they had to equalize the process. the old way was clearly bad for kids without in the know parents. this is the result. i really don’t feel bad for you that your snowflake might have to survive with just enriched programming, and not a full magnet program, because the county made a wholly logical decision.

This isn't equalizing the process.

yes it is, because it involves broad testing, rather than hinging the process on parent and teacher recommendations.

NP here.

Nobody's disputing that part. People are upset about the OTHER selection criteria - the "peer group" or "existing cohort", which is utter and complete social engineering on the part of MCPS. And that's illegal, plain and simple.

What MCPS is doing right now, is trying to avoid a lawsuit. This is a great opportunity to keep pushing for more advanced classes with peer groups of students, be they in magnet programs or regular schools.

you have no evidence they actually used race as a criteria. if they did, they should be sued, but on the face of it, the peer group logic is decent policy, provided they give peer groups adequate instruction at home schools. people are just assuming they’ll fail on the latter part, which is stupid before any of us have seen it play out.

I don't think we need to prove racial discrimination. We need to prove socio-economic discrimination, and that is in fact what happened.

Again, no understanding of the law. Even if you prove "socio-economic" discrimination, it is not a recognized form of discrimination by the law. MCPS has a well paid legal counsel--I'm sure they consulted their lawyers before they proceeded with this plan.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a teacher not a parent, and I believe there should be differentiation for gifted kids, but here are my predictions:

Admin and counselors at places like Cabin John and Pyle get DELUGED with calls/emails from parents who think their child should be in the pilot classes. “We wanted to be close to home so we didn’t apply to the magnet, but my child could have gotten in and therefore they should be in that section.” There probably are way more qualified kids at a huge school like Pyle than there are spots in those classes.

Teachers get ticked off that they have five minutes to learn yet another curriculum, knowing that many parents will be displeased with the rollout and they’ll be the ones to bear the brunt of that.

Mega scheduling problems—yet to be determined, sure to happen. Tons of annoyed counselors upset that they too have yet another thing to deal with. Hopefully that master scheduling training will be done well.

Totally irritated principals who have disdain for the “pushy” gifted community who think their children are “special snowflakes”—and who’ve been trying to head off this type of differentiation for years. They now will have to admit defeat on the matter, at least temporarily.

It won’t be enough. No matter what, it won’t be enough. And there will be a lot of unhappy parents whose kids don’t get to take these classes. And so...

Eventually everyone will get to take the magnet-ish classes, and we’ll all be back to where we started. ?

Thank you for your honest input.

The passages in bold accurately capture the attitude of MCPS admin and to a lesser extent teachers towards parents who believe their children are underserved by MCPS

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:jesus. can you wait until you see what it is before condemning it?

Has waiting to see whether someone really screws you over worked for ANYONE in the past?

Think before you type, PP.

We are entitled to more information and concrete plans for students rejected from magnets.

you got a plan, and a timeline. the magnets were MASSIVELY unfair before the new admissions process was put into place. what mcps is doing makes sense. if you don’t like it, move or go to a private.

This is not a proper plan! To me, it's like saying we can't give you that $2K bonus despite your equivalent performance to your coworker, but hey...here's $3 to go get yourself a snack from the vending machine.

they had to equalize the process. the old way was clearly bad for kids without in the know parents. this is the result. i really don’t feel bad for you that your snowflake might have to survive with just enriched programming, and not a full magnet program, because the county made a wholly logical decision.

This isn't equalizing the process.

yes it is, because it involves broad testing, rather than hinging the process on parent and teacher recommendations.

NP here.

Nobody's disputing that part. People are upset about the OTHER selection criteria - the "peer group" or "existing cohort", which is utter and complete social engineering on the part of MCPS. And that's illegal, plain and simple.

What MCPS is doing right now, is trying to avoid a lawsuit. This is a great opportunity to keep pushing for more advanced classes with peer groups of students, be they in magnet programs or regular schools.

you have no evidence they actually used race as a criteria. if they did, they should be sued, but on the face of it, the peer group logic is decent policy, provided they give peer groups adequate instruction at home schools. people are just assuming they’ll fail on the latter part, which is stupid before any of us have seen it play out.

I don't think most of us are talking about race. There are a few racist people saying random things. Please don't let them mar this conversation. I am all for opening up and broadening the testing process. It's the later half of the process that was not well thought out. Yes, they might have an idea of piloting something a year ago, but it merely isn't enough. It is not enough time to train teachers (and teachers will feel resentful). It is not enough time to really bring a rich curriculum rather than a couple of ad hoc electives.

yes, but what’s the alternative? opening the process makes it inevitable that more kids will be left out. that means they have to do something to compensate. what would you do?