APS - NNAT2 scores

[Anonymous]

And remember, most kids are average!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They sent our scores home. To the worried PP, this test looks at ONE aspect of a kid's skills/intelligence. An average score doesn't necessarily mean your kid has an IQ of 100. Relax. Some people aren't as good at spatial reasoning (I'm not and did very well academically & earned a PhD in a science).

NNAT tests start next week in our APS school so I revived this thread to read about experiences last year. What I bolded above seems to be important. I have an IQ in the 140s, scored in the 99%-ile of SATs, ACTs, and LSATs, and have had an exceptional career. Last night I pulled up some example questions online and tried them, I struggled with quite a few. Showed them to my 2nd grader who missed one or two of maybe the seven or eight I showed her. She's also a whiz at things like jigsaw puzzles that require spatial reasoning.

My point is, like PP, don't fret over this one test.

[Anonymous]

My kid got a 160 on the NNAT2, v high Cogat, and a 158 on the WISC-IV. Denied admission to GT program at ASFS because "he doesn't seem to be interested in school." Face palm. We supplement at home, but it irks me that lesser qualified kids are sucking up all the resources and oxygen and are paraded around by their parents as in the GT club. Why does APS allow this at a public school? Let's stipulate that I'm bitter, to avoid the nasty mom club argument that uses that phrase like a weapon. Yep, I'm bitter that my kid is not interested in school because the administration doesn't do its job in providing a good education.

[Anonymous]

APS GT is horrible. Popularity contest at some schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They sent our scores home. To the worried PP, this test looks at ONE aspect of a kid's skills/intelligence. An average score doesn't necessarily mean your kid has an IQ of 100. Relax. Some people aren't as good at spatial reasoning (I'm not and did very well academically & earned a PhD in a science).

NNAT tests start next week in our APS school so I revived this thread to read about experiences last year. What I bolded above seems to be important. I have an IQ in the 140s, scored in the 99%-ile of SATs, ACTs, and LSATs, and have had an exceptional career. Last night I pulled up some example questions online and tried them, I struggled with quite a few. Showed them to my 2nd grader who missed one or two of maybe the seven or eight I showed her. She's also a whiz at things like jigsaw puzzles that require spatial reasoning.

My point is, like PP, don't fret over this one test.

I came in here for precisely this reason. And I have a child identical to yours - excellent at spatial tasks. I'll show my child some sample questions but I am not going to sweat it. Thank you for your post.

[Anonymous]

I'm another. Doctorate in a science and can't do lego sets...Just wondering what's the spread between when APS gives the test and when results get sent home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid got a 160 on the NNAT2, v high Cogat, and a 158 on the WISC-IV. Denied admission to GT program at ASFS because "he doesn't seem to be interested in school." Face palm. We supplement at home, but it irks me that lesser qualified kids are sucking up all the resources and oxygen and are paraded around by their parents as in the GT club. Why does APS allow this at a public school? Let's stipulate that I'm bitter, to avoid the nasty mom club argument that uses that phrase like a weapon. Yep, I'm bitter that my kid is not interested in school because the administration doesn't do its job in providing a good education.

Wow! I would appeal if I were you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They sent our scores home. To the worried PP, this test looks at ONE aspect of a kid's skills/intelligence. An average score doesn't necessarily mean your kid has an IQ of 100. Relax. Some people aren't as good at spatial reasoning (I'm not and did very well academically & earned a PhD in a science).

NNAT tests start next week in our APS school so I revived this thread to read about experiences last year. What I bolded above seems to be important. I have an IQ in the 140s, scored in the 99%-ile of SATs, ACTs, and LSATs, and have had an exceptional career. Last night I pulled up some example questions online and tried them, I struggled with quite a few. Showed them to my 2nd grader who missed one or two of maybe the seven or eight I showed her. She's also a whiz at things like jigsaw puzzles that require spatial reasoning.

My point is, like PP, don't fret over this one test.

Sorry you struggled with the test. That’s weird.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid got a 160 on the NNAT2, v high Cogat, and a 158 on the WISC-IV. Denied admission to GT program at ASFS because "he doesn't seem to be interested in school." Face palm. We supplement at home, but it irks me that lesser qualified kids are sucking up all the resources and oxygen and are paraded around by their parents as in the GT club. Why does APS allow this at a public school? Let's stipulate that I'm bitter, to avoid the nasty mom club argument that uses that phrase like a weapon. Yep, I'm bitter that my kid is not interested in school because the administration doesn't do its job in providing a good education.

What exactly is your complaint?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid got a 160 on the NNAT2, v high Cogat, and a 158 on the WISC-IV. Denied admission to GT program at ASFS because "he doesn't seem to be interested in school." Face palm. We supplement at home, but it irks me that lesser qualified kids are sucking up all the resources and oxygen and are paraded around by their parents as in the GT club. Why does APS allow this at a public school? Let's stipulate that I'm bitter, to avoid the nasty mom club argument that uses that phrase like a weapon. Yep, I'm bitter that my kid is not interested in school because the administration doesn't do its job in providing a good education.

What exactly is your complaint?

She's posted before. Something is clearly missing in the 1/2 story we are getting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid got a 160 on the NNAT2, v high Cogat, and a 158 on the WISC-IV. Denied admission to GT program at ASFS because "he doesn't seem to be interested in school." Face palm. We supplement at home, but it irks me that lesser qualified kids are sucking up all the resources and oxygen and are paraded around by their parents as in the GT club. Why does APS allow this at a public school? Let's stipulate that I'm bitter, to avoid the nasty mom club argument that uses that phrase like a weapon. Yep, I'm bitter that my kid is not interested in school because the administration doesn't do its job in providing a good education.

What exactly is your complaint?

She's posted before. Something is clearly missing in the 1/2 story we are getting.

How is it possible that they refuse to identify a child after test scores are available?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid got a 160 on the NNAT2, v high Cogat, and a 158 on the WISC-IV. Denied admission to GT program at ASFS because "he doesn't seem to be interested in school." Face palm. We supplement at home, but it irks me that lesser qualified kids are sucking up all the resources and oxygen and are paraded around by their parents as in the GT club. Why does APS allow this at a public school? Let's stipulate that I'm bitter, to avoid the nasty mom club argument that uses that phrase like a weapon. Yep, I'm bitter that my kid is not interested in school because the administration doesn't do its job in providing a good education.

What exactly is your complaint?

She's posted before. Something is clearly missing in the 1/2 story we are getting.

How is it possible that they refuse to identify a child after test scores are available?

As a general matter, APS uses the NNAT2 to identify children to evaluate for gifted services. Once they've been identified, the gifted services teacher works with the classroom teacher to review the child's class work to determine eligibility for gifted services; parents are also given an opportunity to fill out a form providing further information/examples to support eligibility. A child who is bored or who doesn't care for school will still be found eligible as long as they're willing to do school work and produce work that shows a strong understanding of the material and the ability to think at a higher level than the baseline curriculum. A child who isn't willing to engage at school won't be found eligible, though, because the evidence simply isn't there to support that they need or would benefit from greater challenge than they're already getting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid got a 160 on the NNAT2, v high Cogat, and a 158 on the WISC-IV. Denied admission to GT program at ASFS because "he doesn't seem to be interested in school." Face palm. We supplement at home, but it irks me that lesser qualified kids are sucking up all the resources and oxygen and are paraded around by their parents as in the GT club. Why does APS allow this at a public school? Let's stipulate that I'm bitter, to avoid the nasty mom club argument that uses that phrase like a weapon. Yep, I'm bitter that my kid is not interested in school because the administration doesn't do its job in providing a good education.

What exactly is your complaint?

She's posted before. Something is clearly missing in the 1/2 story we are getting.

How is it possible that they refuse to identify a child after test scores are available?

As a general matter, APS uses the NNAT2 to identify children to evaluate for gifted services. Once they've been identified, the gifted services teacher works with the classroom teacher to review the child's class work to determine eligibility for gifted services; parents are also given an opportunity to fill out a form providing further information/examples to support eligibility. A child who is bored or who doesn't care for school will still be found eligible as long as they're willing to do school work and produce work that shows a strong understanding of the material and the ability to think at a higher level than the baseline curriculum. A child who isn't willing to engage at school won't be found eligible, though, because the evidence simply isn't there to support that they need or would benefit from greater challenge than they're already getting.

DP. That's one of the reasons that GT programs were created -- to engage kids who have disengaged. I guess APS doesn't see GT that way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My kid got a 160 on the NNAT2, v high Cogat, and a 158 on the WISC-IV. Denied admission to GT program at ASFS because "he doesn't seem to be interested in school." Face palm. We supplement at home, but it irks me that lesser qualified kids are sucking up all the resources and oxygen and are paraded around by their parents as in the GT club. Why does APS allow this at a public school? Let's stipulate that I'm bitter, to avoid the nasty mom club argument that uses that phrase like a weapon. Yep, I'm bitter that my kid is not interested in school because the administration doesn't do its job in providing a good education.

What exactly is your complaint?

She's posted before. Something is clearly missing in the 1/2 story we are getting.

How is it possible that they refuse to identify a child after test scores are available?

As a general matter, APS uses the NNAT2 to identify children to evaluate for gifted services. Once they've been identified, the gifted services teacher works with the classroom teacher to review the child's class work to determine eligibility for gifted services; parents are also given an opportunity to fill out a form providing further information/examples to support eligibility. A child who is bored or who doesn't care for school will still be found eligible as long as they're willing to do school work and produce work that shows a strong understanding of the material and the ability to think at a higher level than the baseline curriculum. A child who isn't willing to engage at school won't be found eligible, though, because the evidence simply isn't there to support that they need or would benefit from greater challenge than they're already getting.

DP. That's one of the reasons that GT programs were created -- to engage kids who have disengaged. I guess APS doesn't see GT that way.

There is a difference between disengaged and won't engage. A child who is disengaged because the material is too easy but who will engage when presented with something more challenging will be found eligible, and seeing how they respond to this kind of additional challenge is typically part of the evaluation process. A child who is disengaged generally and refuses to engage with more challenging material won't be found eligible because they can't know if the child has the baseline knowledge and ability to access more advanced material if the child refuses to demonstrate that baseline knowledge/ability. And really, what would the child get from GT services anyway if they refuse to actually engage with any of it?

I tend to agree with the other posters who say there's probably more to the story that OP isn't sharing. First, the list of tests OP provided goes beyond what APS administers, which suggests her child has had an outside evaluation for something. Second, a sufficient unwillingness to engage at school that they would find the child ineligible for services in any subject area (as opposed to, for instance, only finding him eligible only in subject areas he particularly likes and thus is willing to do the work, even though he may be capable in all of the subject areas) tends to suggest there may be something else going on that needs to be evaluated and treated to allow the child to access school curriculum; I don't know if OP has gone through that evaluation process or what it might have found. APS GT teachers get lots of training in working with 2e kids, so if they know about a potentially confounding factor such as ADHD, dyslexia, etc., that might otherwise obscure a child's academic talents, they can account for that in the evaluation process (e.g., for a child who struggles with focusing on written work product due to ADHD, they might have a discussion with the child about a book they read rather than reviewing writing exercises about the book). But first they need to know the issue is there before they can account for it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DP. That's one of the reasons that GT programs were created -- to engage kids who have disengaged. I guess APS doesn't see GT that way.

There is a difference between disengaged and won't engage. A child who is disengaged because the material is too easy but who will engage when presented with something more challenging will be found eligible, and seeing how they respond to this kind of additional challenge is typically part of the evaluation process. A child who is disengaged generally and refuses to engage with more challenging material won't be found eligible because they can't know if the child has the baseline knowledge and ability to access more advanced material if the child refuses to demonstrate that baseline knowledge/ability. And really, what would the child get from GT services anyway if they refuse to actually engage with any of it?

I tend to agree with the other posters who say there's probably more to the story that OP isn't sharing. First, the list of tests OP provided goes beyond what APS administers, which suggests her child has had an outside evaluation for something. Second, a sufficient unwillingness to engage at school that they would find the child ineligible for services in any subject area (as opposed to, for instance, only finding him eligible only in subject areas he particularly likes and thus is willing to do the work, even though he may be capable in all of the subject areas) tends to suggest there may be something else going on that needs to be evaluated and treated to allow the child to access school curriculum; I don't know if OP has gone through that evaluation process or what it might have found. APS GT teachers get lots of training in working with 2e kids, so if they know about a potentially confounding factor such as ADHD, dyslexia, etc., that might otherwise obscure a child's academic talents, they can account for that in the evaluation process (e.g., for a child who struggles with focusing on written work product due to ADHD, they might have a discussion with the child about a book they read rather than reviewing writing exercises about the book). But first they need to know the issue is there before they can account for it.

I agree that there is probably more to the story, and that PP has posted in other threads. However, more generally, you are defending that a well-run GT program should properly decline to accept a child with a WISC of 158 because of disengagement with school work? Because the school has failed the child so far, a reputable GT program should continue to fail the child? That doesn't make sense to me.