Waitlist transparency (or lack thereof)

[Anonymous]

OP is trolling. If she has a question or concern specific to a particular school then she should put on her big girl pants and set up a meeting with the principal. I suppose she could also ask other parents in the neighborhood if there is some real concern, but that puts her at risk of being perceived as a churlish shrew.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:First, CH = Columbia Heights, please stop using it for the Hill as it's confusing. the Hill is short enough already.

Second, given the complaints I hear from teachers on the Hill who have been unable to get their kids into their own school (despite sibling and proximity) I doubt it's true.

Columbia Heights is Columbia Heights, and nobody cared about it until the Target opened so please don't tell everyone what we must or must not say. As far as I know, Capitol Hill, the Hill or CH has been important in this city since its inception. In any event, it's had a metro stop with it's own name since the blue/orange opened as opposed to 2000.

No, I don't live in either one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Someone posted on MOTH that there are (to paraphrase) sketchy things going on with the wait lists at some schools. For example, this person said that there have been waivers approved for non-inbound children without enrolled siblings ahead of inbound children with or without enrolled siblings on the wait list. And that some of these children were accepted outside the lottery (their parents didn't participate in the lottery).

This person also said that children of DCPS staff who wouldn't otherwise receive preference have been accepted ahead of children of the general public with inbound preference and who have a valid wait list number.

Anyone know if there is any truth to this?

In DCPS? Absolutely.

Definitely doesn't happen in our HRCS though. Considering how much people want in, I almost wish there was a preference system.

Everyone knows DCPS gets to cheat and charters don't.

Because everyone knows that charters would never enroll PG residents to reap the benefits of per pupil funding. Spare us the sanctimony.

Charters with WLs in the hundreds don't enroll anyone from PG, dear.

You are so naive.

Two Rivers has over a thousand names on its WL and DC convinced them to take an old DCPS and open a second campus. They don't need residency cheats from MD and yes, they do care. At Watkins and LT, residency cheats are a problem, but at the HRCS, not so much.

Again, how would you know if there are not students who reside in ohter jurisdictins attending the school? Everyone provides the necesary information, just like at DCPS, and no one verifies.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP is trolling. If she has a question or concern specific to a particular school then she should put on her big girl pants and set up a meeting with the principal. I suppose she could also ask other parents in the neighborhood if there is some real concern, but that puts her at risk of being perceived as a churlish shrew.

Totally agree. This whole thread is pointless as an "abstract discussion". Without naming schools who are allegedly doing this, there is no way to identify or confirm/refute whether these things are happening. I know in my HRCS (different poster from others mentioning HRCSs) it's NOT happening, not by a long shot, because some of the people with connections who tried to exert influence to get in were very vocal in their displeasure about not getting in. But that's one school. If anything is happening anywhere else, posting what OP did at the start of this thread will do ZERO to get her an answer because without speficics, it's all rumors and guessing and silliness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP is trolling. If she has a question or concern specific to a particular school then she should put on her big girl pants and set up a meeting with the principal. I suppose she could also ask other parents in the neighborhood if there is some real concern, but that puts her at risk of being perceived as a churlish shrew.

Totally agree. This whole thread is pointless as an "abstract discussion". Without naming schools who are allegedly doing this, there is no way to identify or confirm/refute whether these things are happening. I know in my HRCS (different poster from others mentioning HRCSs) it's NOT happening, not by a long shot, because some of the people with connections who tried to exert influence to get in were very vocal in their displeasure about not getting in. But that's one school. If anything is happening anywhere else, posting what OP did at the start of this thread will do ZERO to get her an answer because without speficics, it's all rumors and guessing and silliness.

This is OP. And what you describe is exactly why I posted here. What was posted on MOTH was vague and the school wasn't mentioned, so I don't have specifics. However, if this is how the wait lists secretly work, I want to know, so I can do what I can to get my kid into school. And if that means calling the school every week, and monitoring things very closely, I need to know that. What I thought was that the Waitlist would be respected. Apparently not at some schools.

[Anonymous]

This is one reason why I am glad that the myschooldc site will be handling waitlists next year, not principals.

[Anonymous]

To PP above ^^, OP is saying people are saying that even with MySchoolDC this is happening. What is it that you think will be different next year and where has that officially been announced?

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP is trolling. If she has a question or concern specific to a particular school then she should put on her big girl pants and set up a meeting with the principal. I suppose she could also ask other parents in the neighborhood if there is some real concern, but that puts her at risk of being perceived as a churlish shrew.

Totally agree. This whole thread is pointless as an "abstract discussion". Without naming schools who are allegedly doing this, there is no way to identify or confirm/refute whether these things are happening. I know in my HRCS (different poster from others mentioning HRCSs) it's NOT happening, not by a long shot, because some of the people with connections who tried to exert influence to get in were very vocal in their displeasure about not getting in. But that's one school. If anything is happening anywhere else, posting what OP did at the start of this thread will do ZERO to get her an answer because without speficics, it's all rumors and guessing and silliness.

This is OP. And what you describe is exactly why I posted here. What was posted on MOTH was vague and the school wasn't mentioned, so I don't have specifics. However, if this is how the wait lists secretly work, I want to know, so I can do what I can to get my kid into school. And if that means calling the school every week, and monitoring things very closely, I need to know that. What I thought was that the Waitlist would be respected. Apparently not at some schools.

OP, you are still basically in the same position you were before posting though. You still don't know which schools this applies to, and no one who knows which schools is going to publicly say so because they don't want to ruin their own chances (or get someone in trouble)(even if it's totally unfair!). So you still are left to figure out how common it is and whether it applies to the schools you want your kid in. But yes, I think it's safe to say that if well-connected people can still get their kids into some DCPS schools, mysteriously and miractulously OOB or without even being in the lottery... then yes, there is still some DCPS Principal flexibility that some schools probably use more than others. Hardly hear of the charters doing this, but it may happen here and there... trick is, how will you find out where?

[dcmom]

Next year, after the lottery occurs, the principals will no longer manage the waitlists, according to the MSDC people at the focus group I attended. All waitlists will be managed centrally through MSDC. This year, MSDC only did the lottery, not the waitlist management.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First, CH = Columbia Heights, please stop using it for the Hill as it's confusing. the Hill is short enough already.

Second, given the complaints I hear from teachers on the Hill who have been unable to get their kids into their own school (despite sibling and proximity) I doubt it's true.

Columbia Heights is Columbia Heights, and nobody cared about it until the Target opened so please don't tell everyone what we must or must not say. As far as I know, Capitol Hill, the Hill or CH has been important in this city since its inception. In any event, it's had a metro stop with it's own name since the blue/orange opened as opposed to 2000.

No, I don't live in either one.

"nobody"? By "nobody" do you mean rich white people? Because I can assure you that people have been living in and caring about Columbia Heights since long before the Target opened. There is NO history outside of DCUM of calling the Hill "CH". Friggin ridiculous. Now go back to your sheltered little all white enclave.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Someone posted on MOTH that there are (to paraphrase) sketchy things going on with the wait lists at some schools. For example, this person said that there have been waivers approved for non-inbound children without enrolled siblings ahead of inbound children with or without enrolled siblings on the wait list. And that some of these children were accepted outside the lottery (their parents didn't participate in the lottery).

This person also said that children of DCPS staff who wouldn't otherwise receive preference have been accepted ahead of children of the general public with inbound preference and who have a valid wait list number.

Anyone know if there is any truth to this?

In DCPS? Absolutely.

Definitely doesn't happen in our HRCS though. Considering how much people want in, I almost wish there was a preference system.

Everyone knows DCPS gets to cheat and charters don't.

Because everyone knows that charters would never enroll PG residents to reap the benefits of per pupil funding. Spare us the sanctimony.

Wrong. DCPS schools (especially on the Hill) are famous for allowing residency cheaters, but charters can't. The documentation is stricter and there's no "Principal discretion."

I don't think that's true
http://www.ward5heartbeat.org/news/local-public-schools-found-to-have-non-d-c-residents-enrolled/

[Anonymous]

dcmom wrote:Next year, after the lottery occurs, the principals will no longer manage the waitlists, according to the MSDC people at the focus group I attended. All waitlists will be managed centrally through MSDC. This year, MSDC only did the lottery, not the waitlist management.

there are 2 separate things at play:
1. Waitlist mgmt - are they following the order of the waitlist
2. Principal discretion - does the principal allow someone into the school outside of the standards of inbounds and waitlists.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

dcmom wrote:Next year, after the lottery occurs, the principals will no longer manage the waitlists, according to the MSDC people at the focus group I attended. All waitlists will be managed centrally through MSDC. This year, MSDC only did the lottery, not the waitlist management.

there are 2 separate things at play:
1. Waitlist mgmt - are they following the order of the waitlist
2. Principal discretion - does the principal allow someone into the school outside of the standards of inbounds and waitlists.

But next year onwards a principal won't be able to do this second thing above without the central office noticing the discrepancy between waitlist and enrollment. After a quick and computer automated accounting they'll say wait, those last two kids you admitted to fill the class, they weren't next on the list. Where did they come from? And so principals will have to justify such things on the basis of hardship or whatever criteria. It will be a lot harder to cheat waitlists, provided central office does a proper job. Bravo.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

dcmom wrote:Next year, after the lottery occurs, the principals will no longer manage the waitlists, according to the MSDC people at the focus group I attended. All waitlists will be managed centrally through MSDC. This year, MSDC only did the lottery, not the waitlist management.

there are 2 separate things at play:
1. Waitlist mgmt - are they following the order of the waitlist
2. Principal discretion - does the principal allow someone into the school outside of the standards of inbounds and waitlists.

But next year onwards a principal won't be able to do this second thing above without the central office noticing the discrepancy between waitlist and enrollment. After a quick and computer automated accounting they'll say wait, those last two kids you admitted to fill the class, they weren't next on the list. Where did they come from? And so principals will have to justify such things on the basis of hardship or whatever criteria. It will be a lot harder to cheat waitlists, provided central office does a proper job. Bravo.

My money is on "WL management by central office" stopping at the first day if school and there's done finagling occurring after that for sure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

dcmom wrote:Next year, after the lottery occurs, the principals will no longer manage the waitlists, according to the MSDC people at the focus group I attended. All waitlists will be managed centrally through MSDC. This year, MSDC only did the lottery, not the waitlist management.

there are 2 separate things at play:
1. Waitlist mgmt - are they following the order of the waitlist
2. Principal discretion - does the principal allow someone into the school outside of the standards of inbounds and waitlists.

But next year onwards a principal won't be able to do this second thing above without the central office noticing the discrepancy between waitlist and enrollment. After a quick and computer automated accounting they'll say wait, those last two kids you admitted to fill the class, they weren't next on the list. Where did they come from? And so principals will have to justify such things on the basis of hardship or whatever criteria. It will be a lot harder to cheat waitlists, provided central office does a proper job. Bravo.

Or how about the children who got in originally as IB - but the following year moved and the principal allowed them to stay? There are so many nuances - do you think kids are "coded" throughout the system?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

dcmom wrote:Next year, after the lottery occurs, the principals will no longer manage the waitlists, according to the MSDC people at the focus group I attended. All waitlists will be managed centrally through MSDC. This year, MSDC only did the lottery, not the waitlist management.

there are 2 separate things at play:
1. Waitlist mgmt - are they following the order of the waitlist
2. Principal discretion - does the principal allow someone into the school outside of the standards of inbounds and waitlists.

But next year onwards a principal won't be able to do this second thing above without the central office noticing the discrepancy between waitlist and enrollment. After a quick and computer automated accounting they'll say wait, those last two kids you admitted to fill the class, they weren't next on the list. Where did they come from? And so principals will have to justify such things on the basis of hardship or whatever criteria. It will be a lot harder to cheat waitlists, provided central office does a proper job. Bravo.

Or how about the children who got in originally as IB - but the following year moved and the principal allowed them to stay? There are so many nuances - do you think kids are "coded" throughout the system?

Or when the parents bring the proof of residency documents with a new address the office staff "forgets" to update the address in the computer...