Gifted in DCPS

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...thank you--but somewhat discouraging news.

OP, I'd say half the kids at our JKLM school are "gifted," so I wouldn't sweat it. Just because DCPS doesn't haven't a program doesn't mean that he won't be in school with kids at the same level. You'll be surprised.

Gifted by what measure?

Not PP, but many parents have their kids take the IQ tests just in case they decide on private school instead; so they know whether the child tests in the gifted ranges. Others have educational batteries done for learning disabilities, which also gives IQ scores. Also many at least look into CTY even if they decide not to pay for any of the programming, so that is another measure for parents. I certainly have not asked what other kids IQs are, but knowing my child's scores and comparing DCs work to classmates, DC is not alone by a long shot. Also I do know some who are doing CTY because the child has a particular interest, so that is another way to know.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Yet DC resists adoption of robust G&T programs, it resists magnets or test-in schools to support the clear need that exists,

+1

I was the poster at 10:00.

I would certainly never say that the Deal/Wilson cluster is mediocre or terrible! In fact I am pretty impressed with what has been accomplished.

My point was simply, you can parse it however you want, talk about how many smart kids there are in certain DCPS schools (I would not disagree), but the fact is that DCPS/charters do not have G&T programs anything close to Fairfax. Most glaringly, there is no magnet MS or HS. Go on the FCPS forum here and talk to parents there to learn more - I live in DC and I don't have first-hand info on Fairfax, but I know they have G&T activity, in a structured way, with testing, from K onward and magnet schools for older grades.

I grew up in another city in an affluent area with an excellent school system, like Fairfax, with a proper G&T program. In ES I was in a G&T program, and then I went to magnets for MS/HS years - I had to take exams and interview to get in. All public. It was an excellent education.

And if my kids turn out to need/want G&T (they are young now), we will likely move to Fairfax to give them the best opportunities... magnet programs included. And it may be bittersweet to leave behind the fun urban lifestyle and short commute.

That's all I am saying. Not that Deal/Wilson cluster is bad, but that Fairfax is clearly #1 for funded, structured G&T programs, and deserves the recognition. Someone moving to the DC area with a grade 4 kid should seriously consider Fairfax or other suburban districts that offer these programs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here...thank you--but somewhat discouraging news.

OP, I'd say half the kids at our JKLM school are "gifted," so I wouldn't sweat it. Just because DCPS doesn't haven't a program doesn't mean that he won't be in school with kids at the same level. You'll be surprised.

Gifted by what measure?

Not PP, but many parents have their kids take the IQ tests just in case they decide on private school instead; so they know whether the child tests in the gifted ranges. Others have educational batteries done for learning disabilities, which also gives IQ scores. Also many at least look into CTY even if they decide not to pay for any of the programming, so that is another measure for parents. I certainly have not asked what other kids IQs are, but knowing my child's scores and comparing DCs work to classmates, DC is not alone by a long shot. Also I do know some who are doing CTY because the child has a particular interest, so that is another way to know.

When you're dealing with one of the worst school districts in the country overall, what does gifted mean? If all schools were as good as those West of the Park, would we be saying we have all these gifted students, I don't know? Difficult to tell without objective measures and again what does "gifted" really mean, in relation to your peers or are we referring to a cut-score?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:20:22, can you provide some objective examples of how the teaching is like G&T and what you mean by that? From an interested parent with kids not in school yet, would love to stay in DC but am not convinced that even the "best" DC schools are really challenging. Is having a smart cohort really sufficient?

In addition, to help the OP, do you plan to send your high honors CTY child to middle school in DC?

NP here. I am curious as to how you are formulating this opinion if you don't even have school-age children. Have you gone to open houses to observe instruction? Have you spoken to principals and teachers? Or are you basing this on reputation and things you've heard?

I just spent a weekend with my dear friend whose children attend school in the highest performing MCPS cluster. Her DC are both "behind" my Deal DC if you look at the courses they are taking. One will not have algebra until 8th grade (due to curriculum 2.0) and neither of them will begin language instruction until the 7th grade. They go to great schools and are doing very well. I point it out not to say that their education is inferior but that it is very possible to receive a high quality education in DCPS.

Will those mcps kids receive a challenging education at Whitman? Yes. I would worry more about Wilson, no matter which year one takes algebra.

Apparently, it's good enough for top colleges but I guess you know better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Washington DC has one of the highest concentrations of the bright and talented in the nation. Tons of analysts, researchers, and others come from all parts of the country and the world to work in Washington DC. The highest concentration of PhDs in the nation is right here in DC.

Accordingly, it stands to reason that many DC kids come from these brilliant parents are benefiting from growing up in households where academics and intelligence are highly valued.

Yet DC resists adoption of robust G&T programs, it resists magnets or test-in schools to support the clear need that exists, for one and only one reason: because it's political. It's because they fear it will skew white - a fear that is probably true, given how white students scored far above national averages per NAEP.

It's a fear, purely over optics - but it's ultimately a fear that ends up holding ALL students back, and it ends up holding DCPS itself back, as many of those bright and talented families who came to DC end up pulling out of DCPS or avoiding DCPS altogether to instead send their kids to privates, to charters, or moving to the burbs, and DCPS ends up cutting off its own nose to spite its face.

DCPS has a problem accepting reality.

The bright and talented kids are in the DCPS schools and they are NOT being held back.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Washington DC has one of the highest concentrations of the bright and talented in the nation. Tons of analysts, researchers, and others come from all parts of the country and the world to work in Washington DC. The highest concentration of PhDs in the nation is right here in DC.

Accordingly, it stands to reason that many DC kids come from these brilliant parents are benefiting from growing up in households where academics and intelligence are highly valued.

Yet DC resists adoption of robust G&T programs, it resists magnets or test-in schools to support the clear need that exists, for one and only one reason: because it's political. It's because they fear it will skew white - a fear that is probably true, given how white students scored far above national averages per NAEP.

It's a fear, purely over optics - but it's ultimately a fear that ends up holding ALL students back, and it ends up holding DCPS itself back, as many of those bright and talented families who came to DC end up pulling out of DCPS or avoiding DCPS altogether to instead send their kids to privates, to charters, or moving to the burbs, and DCPS ends up cutting off its own nose to spite its face.

DCPS has a problem accepting reality.

The bright and talented kids are in the DCPS schools and they are NOT being held back.

Some are in DCPS. But many leave. Why do you think there is so much demand for charters like Washington Latin and BASIS? Do you really not know? Why do you think so many families move out of DC when their kids reach middle school age? Do you really not know? It's because they want more robust academic options than what DCPS offers. In case you hadn't noticed, many of the charters blow the doors off of your vaunted DCPS counterparts in academic competitions, even despite the fact that the DCPS schools are bigger and more well-funded. Not held back? There's so much more that many of these kids are capable of achieving, if offered the opportunity. BASIS for example currently has kids who are on track to be taking Calculus by 8th grade. Many charter grads will end up with more AP and honors courses than DCPS could ever provide - but, they could do even more if provided the opportunity and support for it. If their potential is not being met, they are being held back. I'm sorry, but I think you are a bit out of touch on all of this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Washington DC has one of the highest concentrations of the bright and talented in the nation. Tons of analysts, researchers, and others come from all parts of the country and the world to work in Washington DC. The highest concentration of PhDs in the nation is right here in DC.

Accordingly, it stands to reason that many DC kids come from these brilliant parents are benefiting from growing up in households where academics and intelligence are highly valued.

Yet DC resists adoption of robust G&T programs, it resists magnets or test-in schools to support the clear need that exists, for one and only one reason: because it's political. It's because they fear it will skew white - a fear that is probably true, given how white students scored far above national averages per NAEP.

It's a fear, purely over optics - but it's ultimately a fear that ends up holding ALL students back, and it ends up holding DCPS itself back, as many of those bright and talented families who came to DC end up pulling out of DCPS or avoiding DCPS altogether to instead send their kids to privates, to charters, or moving to the burbs, and DCPS ends up cutting off its own nose to spite its face.

DCPS has a problem accepting reality.

The bright and talented kids are in the DCPS schools and they are NOT being held back.

Yes, they are. In 3rd, DS was told to stop reading ahead, for fear that he would become bored later. This was by both a teacher and a counselor.

DS is now at BASIS in 6th -- first time in his life that he has only been hold back a little bit.

There are quite a few stories like his.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Washington DC has one of the highest concentrations of the bright and talented in the nation. Tons of analysts, researchers, and others come from all parts of the country and the world to work in Washington DC. The highest concentration of PhDs in the nation is right here in DC.

Accordingly, it stands to reason that many DC kids come from these brilliant parents are benefiting from growing up in households where academics and intelligence are highly valued.

Yet DC resists adoption of robust G&T programs, it resists magnets or test-in schools to support the clear need that exists, for one and only one reason: because it's political. It's because they fear it will skew white - a fear that is probably true, given how white students scored far above national averages per NAEP.

It's a fear, purely over optics - but it's ultimately a fear that ends up holding ALL students back, and it ends up holding DCPS itself back, as many of those bright and talented families who came to DC end up pulling out of DCPS or avoiding DCPS altogether to instead send their kids to privates, to charters, or moving to the burbs, and DCPS ends up cutting off its own nose to spite its face.

DCPS has a problem accepting reality.

The bright and talented kids are in the DCPS schools and they are NOT being held back.

Yes, they are. In 3rd, DS was told to stop reading ahead, for fear that he would become bored later. This was by both a teacher and a counselor.

DS is now at BASIS in 6th -- first time in his life that he has only been hold back a little bit.

There are quite a few stories like his.

What school? I have a very bright third grader at a JKLMM and I have not experienced this happening.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Washington DC has one of the highest concentrations of the bright and talented in the nation. Tons of analysts, researchers, and others come from all parts of the country and the world to work in Washington DC. The highest concentration of PhDs in the nation is right here in DC.

Accordingly, it stands to reason that many DC kids come from these brilliant parents are benefiting from growing up in households where academics and intelligence are highly valued.

Yet DC resists adoption of robust G&T programs, it resists magnets or test-in schools to support the clear need that exists, for one and only one reason: because it's political. It's because they fear it will skew white - a fear that is probably true, given how white students scored far above national averages per NAEP.

It's a fear, purely over optics - but it's ultimately a fear that ends up holding ALL students back, and it ends up holding DCPS itself back, as many of those bright and talented families who came to DC end up pulling out of DCPS or avoiding DCPS altogether to instead send their kids to privates, to charters, or moving to the burbs, and DCPS ends up cutting off its own nose to spite its face.

DCPS has a problem accepting reality.

The bright and talented kids are in the DCPS schools and they are NOT being held back.

Yes, they are. In 3rd, DS was told to stop reading ahead, for fear that he would become bored later. This was by both a teacher and a counselor.

DS is now at BASIS in 6th -- first time in his life that he has only been hold back a little bit.

There are quite a few stories like his.

What school? I have a very bright third grader at a JKLMM and I have not experienced this happening.

+1 I have a kid being pulled out for an advanced math class. Though I'm sure that's not good enough for some posters as it's only 1x/week.

[Anonymous]

I think it would be helpful if everyone in the jklm schools would stay out of any discussion of gifted and talented in dcps, because they have some approximation of this and classes filled with students at grade level.

Unless OP can buy in upper NW, if OP sends DC to a dcps, there will be an appalling lack of interest in gifted and talented students. Period.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here. I have a child in PK3 whose teachers are working with her a grade or two ahead on some things. What is the CTY program?

Is this a joke?

Another new poster, my PK4 kid is several grade levels ahead of his peers (reading at 3rd/4th grade level). It happens. And his teachers work with him on it. And, yes, PK3 and PK4 are GRADES in public schools in the district.

Thank you. Yes, this is a DC public schools forum and PK3 is a grade in DC public schools.

I love it. A 36-month-old can now be in a grade. With a curriculum.

And yes, I know that really is the case in dcps but I think it's stupid.

-- mom of talented 5th grader who was pooping his pants occasionally at age 3, squeezing play dough, building free-form towers and so on. It's so weird to me that a dc resident now has to PAY serious cash to get that kind of developmentally appropriate nursery school experience in a private preschool. "I want my kid to fingerpaint all day, so that means tuition!"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:NP here. I have a child in PK3 whose teachers are working with her a grade or two ahead on some things. What is the CTY program?

Is this a joke?

Another new poster, my PK4 kid is several grade levels ahead of his peers (reading at 3rd/4th grade level). It happens. And his teachers work with him on it. And, yes, PK3 and PK4 are GRADES in public schools in the district.

Thank you. Yes, this is a DC public schools forum and PK3 is a grade in DC public schools.

I love it. A 36-month-old can now be in a grade. With a curriculum.

And yes, I know that really is the case in dcps but I think it's stupid.

-- mom of talented 5th grader who was pooping his pants occasionally at age 3, squeezing play dough, building free-form towers and so on. It's so weird to me that a dc resident now has to PAY serious cash to get that kind of developmentally appropriate nursery school experience in a private preschool. "I want my kid to fingerpaint all day, so that means tuition!"

Your post is so myopic I don't even know where to begin.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I love it. A 36-month-old can now be in a grade. With a curriculum.

And yes, I know that really is the case in dcps but I think it's stupid.

-- mom of talented 5th grader who was pooping his pants occasionally at age 3, squeezing play dough, building free-form towers and so on. It's so weird to me that a dc resident now has to PAY serious cash to get that kind of developmentally appropriate nursery school experience in a private preschool. "I want my kid to fingerpaint all day, so that means tuition!"

But this goes right to the heart of it. DC is a historically struggling school district. Thus almost every dollar is focused on remedial work, and that's why there is a curriculum at 3 yrs old yet no gifted magnet for MS or HS.

The public preK3/4 program wasn't designed to provide free daycare as a perk to affluent DC residents. It exists because of the high % of impoverished, female-headed households in the district.

The charter schools weren't designed to provide a free alternative to private school for the wealthy. They were a solution to a broken public school system with off the charts drop-out rates and poor test scores.

None of this was designed with the DCUM segment in mind.

Well-adjusted people in affluent school districts don't worry terribly about their 3 yo olds - they just let them play (with some pre-reading, pre-numeracy). That's a key aspect of privilege in america: not having to worry too much about things, because you know they will work out. DC's parents historically have not had that luxury, and the system as a whole is not built around that luxury.

I totally agree with you (PP) from a parenting perspective, BTW.

[Anonymous]

My gifted kid was challenged at Wilson. AP classes kept DC busy. Senior year DC was enrolled at Georgetown through HISCIP and took three classes, one fall semester, two in the spring. DC was able to transfer 12 credits from Georgetown freshman year of college.

[Anonymous]

^ +1

Anyone who thinks the typical DCPS school can meet G&T needs or that it's about ridiculous things like "special fingerpainting for toddlers" is thoroughly clueless and is really not even remotely qualified to speak on the topic.