Abortion foes begin to focus on reducing NEED for abortions instead of laws....

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I was uninsured for many years. It was Planned Parenthood that helped me by offering affordable exams and birth control to me (taken for reasons other than pregnancy prevention). They even offered to mail them to my house if I was unable to pick them up. Unplanned pregnancy was not on my list of concerns as a lesbian. Planned Parenthood reaches out to offer health services to people in my community with compassion, even though we don't fit into their perceived agenda. I haven't seen any churches offering annual testing and exams to low-income women.

Then maybe you should do some more research...

Most of the crisis pregnancy centers in the area are funded by money and donations not just from "regular old citizens", but sponsored heavily by churches. These centers have relationships with OB/GYN's who do perform testing and exams to women for little or nothing. Including bartering (yes, someone brought in a chicken for the doctor one time).

There are few churches that would turn away someone in need for an exam or testing...they would get them the money or the means to be healthy.

I would love to write more - but I'll only be criticized and ridiculed. The hatred of all things good or church-related is astounding when someone disagrees with you. I'd love for you to come to church with me sometime and see the phenomenal efforts and groups put together to help people in need. Even women who need birth control...

[Anonymous]

I was simply stating that I have never seen a church that offers pap smears, breast exams and BCPs. If you have, then please feel free to tell us about it. The only testing I have seen take place at a church is pregnancy testing.

I'm not attacking anyone by sharing my experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a Catholic who has had an abortion, I can tell you there is much emotional rhetoric that has no basis in truth regarding this topic.

This may seem a bit off topic, but it I hope to show how misinformed people are in all phases of this this topic. After my unfortunate experience, I have been embraced in a nonjudgmental, loving way by the Catholic Church. However, family was not so supportive. My family ("professionals") have banned us from their home.

Abortion is a hot topic. However, the God we believe in is a loving, caring God. Whatever higher power you believe in, I doubt that entity would be supportive of the judgemental banter surrounding this topic.

Just wondering why you told them? Isn't this a private thing?

[Anonymous]

I hope that people on both sides of the debate will take a more nuanced approach to the topic.

I wish that free and easily accessible abortions were available to everyone before 8 weeks. (When that mass of cells begins to reseumble a human and has a beating heart). Certainly, many women aren't prepared to make such a quick decision -- and many don't even know that they're pregnant that early. But it would eliminate so many of those later abortions that I personally find so heartbreaking.

There is new research showing that the pain receptors of a fetus's brain have developed by 14 weeks, so it seems that it should be everyone's goal to have as few abortions happening after that point as possible.

As for late-term abortions, I personally know what a "fetus" looks like on the cusp between the second and third trimester. I gave preterm birth to one (and she did not live), and I can tell you that she was no mere fetus. She looked exactly like her sibling -- just smaller. At that stage of a pregnancy, I truly believe that abortion should happen only to save the life of the mother, or if the baby is certain to die anyway. (I know a couple that chose that course after finding out that if their baby survived to birth, he would certainly die within minutes of being born. They were heartbroken, and I was so sorry for them).

I am glad that pro-lifers and pro-choice advocates are trying to find common ground. I find that I cannot condemn any woman for her choice. It is a terrible terrible position to be in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I hope that people on both sides of the debate will take a more nuanced approach to the topic.

I wish that free and easily accessible abortions were available to everyone before 8 weeks. (When that mass of cells begins to reseumble a human and has a beating heart). Certainly, many women aren't prepared to make such a quick decision -- and many don't even know that they're pregnant that early. But it would eliminate so many of those later abortions that I personally find so heartbreaking.

There is new research showing that the pain receptors of a fetus's brain have developed by 14 weeks, so it seems that it should be everyone's goal to have as few abortions happening after that point as possible.

As for late-term abortions, I personally know what a "fetus" looks like on the cusp between the second and third trimester. I gave preterm birth to one (and she did not live), and I can tell you that she was no mere fetus. She looked exactly like her sibling -- just smaller. At that stage of a pregnancy, I truly believe that abortion should happen only to save the life of the mother, or if the baby is certain to die anyway. (I know a couple that chose that course after finding out that if their baby survived to birth, he would certainly die within minutes of being born. They were heartbroken, and I was so sorry for them).

I am glad that pro-lifers and pro-choice advocates are trying to find common ground. I find that I cannot condemn any woman for her choice. It is a terrible terrible position to be in.

I would hope that anyone reading the above, whatever their political or religious beliefs, would feel common ground with PP. There must be common ground, and that is what we (this nation) should be searching for, not victory for purist positions on either side.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I hope that people on both sides of the debate will take a more nuanced approach to the topic.

I wish that free and easily accessible abortions were available to everyone before 8 weeks. (When that mass of cells begins to reseumble a human and has a beating heart). Certainly, many women aren't prepared to make such a quick decision -- and many don't even know that they're pregnant that early. But it would eliminate so many of those later abortions that I personally find so heartbreaking.

There is new research showing that the pain receptors of a fetus's brain have developed by 14 weeks, so it seems that it should be everyone's goal to have as few abortions happening after that point as possible.

As for late-term abortions, I personally know what a "fetus" looks like on the cusp between the second and third trimester. I gave preterm birth to one (and she did not live), and I can tell you that she was no mere fetus. She looked exactly like her sibling -- just smaller. At that stage of a pregnancy, I truly believe that abortion should happen only to save the life of the mother, or if the baby is certain to die anyway. (I know a couple that chose that course after finding out that if their baby survived to birth, he would certainly die within minutes of being born. They were heartbroken, and I was so sorry for them).

I am glad that pro-lifers and pro-choice advocates are trying to find common ground. I find that I cannot condemn any woman for her choice. It is a terrible terrible position to be in.

I would hope that anyone reading the above, whatever their political or religious beliefs, would feel common ground with PP. There must be common ground, and that is what we (this nation) should be searching for, not victory for purist positions on either side.

I agree with PP, as long it is availabe when ammino is safe...

[Anonymous]

People who call themselves prolife support all choices, except for those choices which would infringe on another person's right to life.

Umm, this is not supporting choice. Choice of the mother. You don't want an abortion, don't have one. Simple.
I don't LIKE abortion but believe it should be safe and legal and an option. Having had a child, I would NEVER presume to force a pregnancy and birth (and the resulting demands of having a child -- which I personally embrace) on anyone. Sorry. Just will not do it. And, there are any number of reasons why an abortion may be a better option . . . see the case of "Baby P" in England. Sorry, that poor, tortured little soul would have been better off not being born, imo.

And, please don't tell me that donating clothes, strollers and diapers is any sort of meaningful "support" of new mothers. Those things are nice but don't amount to the type of support that is really needed: child care, time off work when needed, consistent financial support, emotional support. If you think your donation of an umbrella stroller is enough . . . well, that is silly. How about you adopt or foster one of these unwanted but non-aborted children? You want to talk the talk, etc., THAT is how you put your money where your mouth is!

The fact is, people are going to have sex. They just are. While I'm not opposed to encouraging abstinence, it is foolish imo to rely solely on that (and the numbers bear out that this does not work; just read something in the news recently about the numbers of teenagers having sex remaining steady since the '50s. And, no I don't have the article on hand. If you're on here you know how to use a computer so google it). Sex eduction, readily available contraception and, yes, abortion services (as hopefully last result) are all part of this program.

[Anonymous]

Oh and as for using tax money to support things that you don't agree with . . . happens ALL THE TIME. Not just to "pro lifers." War in Iraq, anyone?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I was simply stating that I have never seen a church that offers pap smears, breast exams and BCPs. If you have, then please feel free to tell us about it. The only testing I have seen take place at a church is pregnancy testing.

I'm not attacking anyone by sharing my experience.

How about this from the Harrisburg PA Patriot this weekend (full article was longer)?

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2008/11/hospital_adds_maternity_ward.html

This is a Roman Catholic hospital. They will perform all ob/gyn services BUT terminate a pregnancy.

Churches DO sponsor much more than just pregnancy testing. Hopefully this expands your 'experience.'

Happy Thanksgiving.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I hope that people on both sides of the debate will take a more nuanced approach to the topic.

I wish that free and easily accessible abortions were available to everyone before 8 weeks. (When that mass of cells begins to reseumble a human and has a beating heart). Certainly, many women aren't prepared to make such a quick decision -- and many don't even know that they're pregnant that early. But it would eliminate so many of those later abortions that I personally find so heartbreaking.

I sadly miscarried twin embryos at 8 weeks. I miscarried at home. Without getting too specific, I can say that what I observed was NOT a "baby" in any way. It just wasn't. I know what a "baby" is, and what I saw -- and disposed of via the toilet -- wasn't a "baby" -- by any stretch of the imagination.

Yes, they (the embryos) had the potential to become babies, the potential to become separate, deeply desired human children -- but what the end result was, was a mass of cells and tissue. This experienced solidified my belief that ending a pregnancy before 8 weeks does not end a "human life".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:PP, bear in mind that many pro-life organizations, especially the Roman Catholic Church, are also firm proponents of abstinence and support organizations such as Birth Right with time, talent and treasure. However, to ask them to support birth control, to which they are doctrinally opposed, is a bridge too far.

Catholics like myself take very seriously the protection of life, born and unborn, and we DO support all efforts to help pregnant women have the option of life for their baby, not death. To think we just say "don't do it" and leave it at that is very wrong. I invite you to attend a Catholic Mass on Sunday - I am confident that both from the altar and in the bulletin you will find opportunities and encouragement to support the unborn and their mothers.

Here's the real deal: Not everyone is religious. So by preaching God this and God that and abstinence, you're only alienating those who don't share your faith.

If pro-lifers love children, shouldn't they broaden their horizons by realizing that there are young girls out there who don't attend your masses and who don't understand the basics of pregnancy prevention? Don't you think that perhaps ALL pro-lifers should put aside their religious beliefs in order to educate these young girls who are in need of contraception in order to PREVENT unwanted pregnancies?

Prevention is the key. Shoving religion down someone's throat in an effort to prevent pregnancy is useless. And then try to find another loving home for one more unplanned baby.

And by the way, I'm Catholic, I attend church, my kids attend the parish school, and no - they do not participate in pro-life marches.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Churches DO sponsor much more than just pregnancy testing. Hopefully this expands your 'experience.'

It does not expand my experience, since I have never experienced it. The quotation marks make it seem like you don't consider my experience to be real (or relavant?). I hope that was a misuse of punctuation and not intentional.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Churches DO sponsor much more than just pregnancy testing. Hopefully this expands your 'experience.'

It does not expand my experience, since I have never experienced it. The quotation marks make it seem like you don't consider my experience to be real (or relavant?). I hope that was a misuse of punctuation and not intentional.

Odd, I was simply following up on YOUR invitation to broaden your experience. Did you not say...

If you have, then please feel free to tell us about it.

?

Perhaps I was wrong and you prefer to remain uninformed of the many services religious organizations provide for women that don't fit into your neat little stereotype?

[Anonymous]

Yet another wonderful thread arguing about abortion.

I think we should also discuss euthanasia, whether prostitution should be legal, whether gays should be allowed to marry, whether marijuana should be legal, and finish it off with a debate about the death penalty. I'm sure everyone will have new ideas to share that no one had ever considered before, and many minds will be changed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Odd, I was simply following up on YOUR invitation to broaden your experience.

The words "informed" and "experienced" are not interchangeable; they have different meanings.