Income of $22,000 a year is considered the poverty line for a family of four- WTH?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/957-Elmira-St_Mobile_AL_36604_M82071-38990?source=web

http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/176-Forbes-St_Amsterdam_NY_12010_M42626-68760?source=web

http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/5134-Tennis-Court-Cir_Tampa_FL_33617_M54554-17276?source=web

http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/2317-Carling-Dr-Unit-3_Madison_WI_53711_M84606-26361?source=web

http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/20-Mobile-Ave_Chelmsford_MA_01824_M36562-61720?source=web

These are for sale. Not rent.

Thank you for reminding us of how beyond belief the standard of living is in this area. That there are homes at that price in Madison, WI is very sobering.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:poverty is a difficult thing to understand and a horrible cycle to break. but really, many are poor by choice. what are the BIGGEST statistical factors in being poor? not graduating from high school. kids out of marriage. those are choices.

That's true for some, but not for all. When working in the local soup kitchen, I've met a few people who were just in the wrong place at the wrong time. There are some who didn't graduate high school because they really aren't the brightest people. I knew someone who failed HS and failed the GED twice (total three times). He gave up and just started working minimum wage type jobs. He often worked two or three jobs because he frequently could not get enough hours to work full-time at one job. At one point, he was working three part-time jobs as a mechanics assistant and he spent a lot of time walking around town (he couldn't afford a car and this was the suburbs, so the bus wasn't convenient for when he had to get places). Because he was part-time and unskilled labor, he was usually the first one to get hours cut when they needed to cut back. I could tell when he was working more, he would come to the soup kitchen less. When he was working more, he could afford food more easily. But when he was short of cash, he would pay the rent and then come to the soup kitchen to eat.

Your assertion that not graduating from HS is the typical thoughts for many of the "haves". But not all of the "have nots" are that bright and finishing high school may be very difficult for them.

This simply not true. There is no correlation, really. Think about it. If you are not that bright or have a severe learning disability and you are from a rich backround you can be protected from poverty. If you have these issues and you are born into poverty, you will slide further down. Children born into poverty are no more likely to be not so bright. MY GOD! The people that you are encountering at the soup kitchen may be unsophisticated and have huge cultural blind spots on many issues, but they aren't "dumber" than rich people...shaking my head and walking away now...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just saw this on NBC news and this was the statistic they cited. In what universe? I make $50K for me and DD and am struggling. Please don't say "DC is more expensive." 22K in ANY place in this country for four people is ridiculous. Anybody making only that... I just wonder how that family could survive.

And if your employer did not provide health insurance and you couldn't afford to buy your own healthcare for you and your DD, you would owe a tax penalty too every year (but still be uninsured). It's a F-d up world we live in now.

aren't the thresholds for the government programs adjusted up for HCOL areas? I mean, I know there are higher thresholds for school lunch programs.

There likely still are people who fall into that "too high income to qualify" rank, but I thought there were higher medicaid limits and a lower-income pool and what not that would help some folks that did not have employer provided healthcare to purchase it for fairly cheap.

I'm not saying it is the perfect solution and I am personally for single payer to take insurance companies out of the health care picture, but I think there is more background needed here.

[Anonymous]

As always, we can look to America's Finest News Source

http://www.theonion.com/articles/report-poor-people-pretty-much-fucked,1025/
Report: Poor People Pretty Much Fucked
WASHINGTON—According to the results of an intensive two-year study, Americans living below the poverty line are "pretty much fucked," Center for Social and Economic Research executive director Jameson Park announced Monday.
"Although poor people have never had it particularly sweet, America has long been considered the land of opportunity, where upward class mobility is hard work's reward," Park said. "However, our study shows that limited access to quality education and a shortage of employment opportunities in depressed areas all but ensure that, once fucked, an individual tends to stay fucked."

read the whole article. Although written in 2003, it's still true today.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:poverty is a difficult thing to understand and a horrible cycle to break. but really, many are poor by choice. what are the BIGGEST statistical factors in being poor? not graduating from high school. kids out of marriage. those are choices.

That's true for some, but not for all. When working in the local soup kitchen, I've met a few people who were just in the wrong place at the wrong time. There are some who didn't graduate high school because they really aren't the brightest people. I knew someone who failed HS and failed the GED twice (total three times). He gave up and just started working minimum wage type jobs. He often worked two or three jobs because he frequently could not get enough hours to work full-time at one job. At one point, he was working three part-time jobs as a mechanics assistant and he spent a lot of time walking around town (he couldn't afford a car and this was the suburbs, so the bus wasn't convenient for when he had to get places). Because he was part-time and unskilled labor, he was usually the first one to get hours cut when they needed to cut back. I could tell when he was working more, he would come to the soup kitchen less. When he was working more, he could afford food more easily. But when he was short of cash, he would pay the rent and then come to the soup kitchen to eat.

Your assertion that not graduating from HS is the typical thoughts for many of the "haves". But not all of the "have nots" are that bright and finishing high school may be very difficult for them.

This simply not true. There is no correlation, really. Think about it. If you are not that bright or have a severe learning disability and you are from a rich backround you can be protected from poverty. If you have these issues and you are born into poverty, you will slide further down. Children born into poverty are no more likely to be not so bright. MY GOD! The people that you are encountering at the soup kitchen may be unsophisticated and have huge cultural blind spots on many issues, but they aren't "dumber" than rich people...shaking mymplied "some" head and walking away now...

You read something into my statement I didn't even suggest. I didn't say all, most or even many people in the soup kitchen were dumb or unable to achieve. I said there were some who were no able to succeed. The point is that the PP was suggesting that those who fall into poverty have only done that because they made a choice to fail. While that may cover some, there are some that live below the poverty line that are there because they were not capable of succeeding under certain conditions including being able to succeed in school. In over 20 years of working at the soup kitchen, I have encounter a wide variety of people who have needed such support services. I have met some amazingly bright folks, like one young man who was eating at the kitchen because he had a disease and no insurance. He spent whatever disposable income he had on treatment in order to survive and regulate his illness. He ate in the soup kitchen in order to save his money. Because he never knew when he would have a medical issue which would preclude him from going to work, he was unable to keep a job (he had been fired from at least one job because his attendance was so questionable). Again, another person who was below the poverty level, but not because he chose to be there. His illness, not treated regularly, made him one of those left behind and struggling to survive.

[Anonymous]

Calm down everybody
Chipotle lady is argueing with herself

[Anonymous]

The poverty guidelines are national. We just happen to live in a hign cost area. In Alexandria, you can make $50,000 and still qualify for government housing assistance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Just saw this on NBC news and this was the statistic they cited. In what universe? I make $50K for me and DD and am struggling. Please don't say "DC is more expensive." 22K in ANY place in this country for four people is ridiculous. Anybody making only that... I just wonder how that family could survive.

And if your employer did not provide health insurance and you couldn't afford to buy your own healthcare for you and your DD, you would owe a tax penalty too every year (but still be uninsured). It's a F-d up world we live in now.

WRONG. Why do people like you talk out of your ass? Obamacare builds in exemptions and breaks for poverty line: " One aspect of PPACA is that people who make up to 133% of the poverty line -- for a household of two adults and one child, this would be $23,344 -- would be eligible for Medicaid at no cost. Meanwhile, families that make up to 400% of the poverty line -- for a household of two adults and one child, this would be $70,208 -- would be eligible for some form of discounted insurance rate, scaled to their income."


http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/06/28/obamacare-upheld-how-health-care-reform-will-affect-your-wallet/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:why don't they just work harder? I mean, jeez, work harder and all these problems will be solved.

(I hope you all can tell that this is DRIPPING with sarcasm...)

poverty is a difficult thing to understand and a horrible cycle to break. but really, many are poor by choice. what are the BIGGEST statistical factors in being poor? not graduating from high school. kids out of marriage. those are choices.

No, the biggest factor in poverty is poverty. And reality is that many people in poverty don't have or perceive that they have real "choices". If you're a kid in a poor family, are pressured to work to support your family and/or get no support from parents/grandparents to go to school and/or live in a dangerous environment where surviving takes priority over going to class, then graduating from high school isn't as much of a choice, especially when you're under 18. That's why inner city drop out rates are often upwards of 50%.

Kids out of marriage is a choice, but again, when your models are parents and grandparents who may have had children very young and out of wedlock and/or you are not provided access to information about birth control and/or you grew up in a broken home, then you get kids out of wedlock.

Thanks for this post. The ignorance of the PP is unbelievable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Why do people like you talk out of your ass? Obamacare builds in exemptions and breaks for poverty line: " One aspect of PPACA is that people who make up to 133% of the poverty line -- for a household of two adults and one child, this would be $23,344 -- would be eligible for Medicaid at no cost. Meanwhile, families that make up to 400% of the poverty line -- for a household of two adults and one child, this would be $70,208 -- would be eligible for some form of discounted insurance rate, scaled to their income."


http://www.dailyfinance.com/2012/06/28/obamacare-upheld-how-health-care-reform-will-affect-your-wallet/

Thank you - this is what I was trying to say in my post, but I didn't have the details.

[Anonymous]

In Alexandria, you can make $50,000 and still qualify for government housing assistance.

Yeah, I live in Alexandria and have moet some parents at the playground who get housing assistance. A number of them have jobs that kid of suprised me - e.g., metro operator, police officer. I mean, they aren't super high earners, but it is sad that people who have relatively normal jobs can't afford to live in this area.

[Anonymous]

Alexandria has made an effort to include "workforce housing" in the local housing stock. As a resident, I wholeheartedly support this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:poverty is a difficult thing to understand and a horrible cycle to break. but really, many are poor by choice. what are the BIGGEST statistical factors in being poor? not graduating from high school. kids out of marriage. those are choices.

That's true for some, but not for all. When working in the local soup kitchen, I've met a few people who were just in the wrong place at the wrong time. There are some who didn't graduate high school because they really aren't the brightest people. I knew someone who failed HS and failed the GED twice (total three times). He gave up and just started working minimum wage type jobs. He often worked two or three jobs because he frequently could not get enough hours to work full-time at one job. At one point, he was working three part-time jobs as a mechanics assistant and he spent a lot of time walking around town (he couldn't afford a car and this was the suburbs, so the bus wasn't convenient for when he had to get places). Because he was part-time and unskilled labor, he was usually the first one to get hours cut when they needed to cut back. I could tell when he was working more, he would come to the soup kitchen less. When he was working more, he could afford food more easily. But when he was short of cash, he would pay the rent and then come to the soup kitchen to eat.

Your assertion that not graduating from HS is the typical thoughts for many of the "haves". But not all of the "have nots" are that bright and finishing high school may be very difficult for them.

This simply not true. There is no correlation, really. Think about it. If you are not that bright or have a severe learning disability and you are from a rich backround you can be protected from poverty. If you have these issues and you are born into poverty, you will slide further down. Children born into poverty are no more likely to be [b]not so bright. MY GOD! The people that you are encountering at the soup kitchen may be unsophisticated and have huge cultural blind spots on many issues, but they aren't "dumber" than rich people...shaking my head and walking away now...

[/b]

Actually there is an established correlation between poverty and IQ. That doesn't mean that all poor people have lower IQs and all rich people have high IQs but overall, poverty and lower IQ are related. Many reasons for this.

[Anonymous]

IQ tests notoriously favor upper-middle to upper-class subjects.

[Anonymous]

So do dipstick tests.