Best for pre-med

[Anonymous]

What is (Brown's) PLME?

https://plme.med.brown.edu/ 8 year combined program for undergrad and med.

See https://www.browndailyherald.com/article/2024/10/for-brown-universitys-plme-students-lesser-known-benefits-enhance-experience

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The school’s with major medical complexes nearby tend to do well with med school placement - Vanderbilt, Duke, Harvard, Rice, Northwestern, Emory, Penn, WashU, Johns Hopkins. The caliber of students at these schools is strong and they have opportunities that often aren’t available at state flagships or SLACs.

But undergrad plus med school is incredibly expensive. So every med school is looking at state schools. But it’s harder for those students to distinguish themselves. And it might be harder to get a high MCAT score when expectations might be lower in undergrad at some schools.

Total nonsense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This site, which would seem to work best as a sampling, suggests Bates, Bowdoin, Brown, Duke, Hamilton, JHU, Princeton, Rice, Stanford and Union:

A Guide to The Best Colleges for Pre-Med Students - InGenius Prep https://ingeniusprep.com/blog/best-colleges-for-pre-med-students/

How? By what criteria? That's not how sampling works.

It seems you are thinking of statistical sampling, which was not the intended usage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This site, which would seem to work best as a sampling, suggests Bates, Bowdoin, Brown, Duke, Hamilton, JHU, Princeton, Rice, Stanford and Union:

A Guide to The Best Colleges for Pre-Med Students - InGenius Prep https://ingeniusprep.com/blog/best-colleges-for-pre-med-students/

How? By what criteria? That's not how sampling works.

It seems you are thinking of statistical sampling, which was not the intended usage.

Right but you did say it was representative- how?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Lots of schools of thought on this and much of it depends on finances and medical school goals. Many will say cheapest option where you can high gpa. Certainly in-state U of M will work well for finance side. Other factors to consider are class sizes for both classroom experience but also recommendations and opportunities, access to quality premed advising starting early, and I think easy access to plentiful clinical opportunities is a big help. If chasing a top medical school, a name brand school helps.

Adding mine was in-state at a different top public and also had a full-ride elsewhere, but they chose full-pay Ivy. I know most would think insane, but no regrets so far.

Mine is premed at an ivy too and it has been amazing. The matriculation lists are impressive and the students study hard and push each other in a good way

[Anonymous]

My kid's medical school (T20) classmates are mostly from state schools. Not dominated by Ivy league school graduates. Missing are P, M, and Caltech. At least 1 kid from all other Ivy schools + Duke + Stanford

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Brown. PLME is a VERY tough admit but if you make it you're golden. If you do the more typical pre med path, it's also great to be able to take your non-science classes S/NC--Brown's version of pass/fail--the semester you take organic chem.

Be careful with the "cheapest/highest GPA" undergrad path. I know 3 people who did this. None of the 3 got a good enough MCAT score to get into med school on their first try. One took a year off and went to one of those post-grad programs where you can take pre-med reqs. No financial aid available for those as far as I know. Anyway, the extra year wiped out the savings, but he did get into med school. One of the others is now a podiatrist--still had to take the MCAT, but a lower score was enough to get in for podiatry. Third is now a nurse-practitioner. Applied to med school 4 times before he gave up.

This. Top state/flagship ie UVA or WM if in Virginia are very good but beware below that level! We know so many friends’ kids even with dr parents where they were 3.9 in bio or neurosci at some non-top50ish and then you get the details and they did not get above 500 on the mcat after multiple tries. All undergrad education is not the same rigor and does not prepare for the mcat the same. Meanwhile T10/ivy kids getting in multiple MD programs with lower gpa but easily got 515+ first try after junior year

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Brown. PLME is a VERY tough admit but if you make it you're golden. If you do the more typical pre med path, it's also great to be able to take your non-science classes S/NC--Brown's version of pass/fail--the semester you take organic chem.

Be careful with the "cheapest/highest GPA" undergrad path. I know 3 people who did this. None of the 3 got a good enough MCAT score to get into med school on their first try. One took a year off and went to one of those post-grad programs where you can take pre-med reqs. No financial aid available for those as far as I know. Anyway, the extra year wiped out the savings, but he did get into med school. One of the others is now a podiatrist--still had to take the MCAT, but a lower score was enough to get in for podiatry. Third is now a nurse-practitioner. Applied to med school 4 times before he gave up.

This. Top state/flagship ie UVA or WM if in Virginia are very good but beware below that level! We know so many friends’ kids even with dr parents where they were 3.9 in bio or neurosci at some non-top50ish and then you get the details and they did not get above 500 on the mcat after multiple tries. All undergrad education is not the same rigor and does not prepare for the mcat the same. Meanwhile T10/ivy kids getting in multiple MD programs with lower gpa but easily got 515+ first try after junior year

I absolutely hate unsubstantiated statements like this. Total nonsense. I bet your kid is Ivy/T10 premed. Don't brag until your kid has proven their worth.

[Anonymous]

I have a premed at Brown, they didn’t get into PLME and now think it’s a blessing. They love the school and Providence, but want to apply out. It is an incredible way to go through though, they get a lot of support and a lot less grade pressure with no MCAT. Those chosen seem to have compelling stories, my unhooked with perfect stats, loads of leadership, research, EMT and so on didn’t cut it. The classes are very rigorous and vast majority skip intro classes. MCAT scores are very high and don’t need as much prep time due to class difficulty. The premeds don’t take classes S/NC unless it’s the occasional English class that is mandatory S/NC. Haven’t applied yet, but they’ve had great experience. Met with advising starting as a first year and meet whenever they have a question or have a need.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Brown. PLME is a VERY tough admit but if you make it you're golden. If you do the more typical pre med path, it's also great to be able to take your non-science classes S/NC--Brown's version of pass/fail--the semester you take organic chem.

Be careful with the "cheapest/highest GPA" undergrad path. I know 3 people who did this. None of the 3 got a good enough MCAT score to get into med school on their first try. One took a year off and went to one of those post-grad programs where you can take pre-med reqs. No financial aid available for those as far as I know. Anyway, the extra year wiped out the savings, but he did get into med school. One of the others is now a podiatrist--still had to take the MCAT, but a lower score was enough to get in for podiatry. Third is now a nurse-practitioner. Applied to med school 4 times before he gave up.

This. Top state/flagship ie UVA or WM if in Virginia are very good but beware below that level! We know so many friends’ kids even with dr parents where they were 3.9 in bio or neurosci at some non-top50ish and then you get the details and they did not get above 500 on the mcat after multiple tries. All undergrad education is not the same rigor and does not prepare for the mcat the same. Meanwhile T10/ivy kids getting in multiple MD programs with lower gpa but easily got 515+ first try after junior year

And this is why a lot of people are off with their advice. Lower gpa at a top school is counteracted all the time, you just need the right MCAT-which top schools invest a lot more resources for each student to do well. Going to a top school (LAC or research university) also means you often get bias for good research positions and other opportunities. This will help drive your application. I wouldn’t advise a state school or low ranked private unless you’re cash strapped with other better options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Rice, Emory, WashU, Vandy, Duke no particular order. Umich is awful for premed.

False UMich places very well and has good advising, as long as the larger classes/other fit factors work for the student and the student can reasonably have a chance to be above the mean if not top 1/4 on the class curves. It is better than almost all flagships for premed, on par with UVA which also places very well. Some students prefer the size of a washU or rice or emory but these are not significantly better per se

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a premed at Brown, they didn’t get into PLME and now think it’s a blessing. They love the school and Providence, but want to apply out. It is an incredible way to go through though, they get a lot of support and a lot less grade pressure with no MCAT. Those chosen seem to have compelling stories, my unhooked with perfect stats, loads of leadership, research, EMT and so on didn’t cut it. The classes are very rigorous and vast majority skip intro classes. MCAT scores are very high and don’t need as much prep time due to class difficulty. The premeds don’t take classes S/NC unless it’s the occasional English class that is mandatory S/NC. Haven’t applied yet, but they’ve had great experience. Met with advising starting as a first year and meet whenever they have a question or have a need.

PLME is beneficial talent for brown. They need those kids more than those kids need brown. The type of person who gets into PLME would probably get into Harvard Med or Stanford Med, but brown gets to hold onto that talent with guaranteed med school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a premed at Brown, they didn’t get into PLME and now think it’s a blessing. They love the school and Providence, but want to apply out. It is an incredible way to go through though, they get a lot of support and a lot less grade pressure with no MCAT. Those chosen seem to have compelling stories, my unhooked with perfect stats, loads of leadership, research, EMT and so on didn’t cut it. The classes are very rigorous and vast majority skip intro classes. MCAT scores are very high and don’t need as much prep time due to class difficulty. The premeds don’t take classes S/NC unless it’s the occasional English class that is mandatory S/NC. Haven’t applied yet, but they’ve had great experience. Met with advising starting as a first year and meet whenever they have a question or have a need.

PLME is beneficial talent for brown. They need those kids more than those kids need brown. The type of person who gets into PLME would probably get into Harvard Med or Stanford Med, but brown gets to hold onto that talent with guaranteed med school.

Don’t know, just know one parent is always sourcing tutors so not all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a premed at Brown, they didn’t get into PLME and now think it’s a blessing. They love the school and Providence, but want to apply out. It is an incredible way to go through though, they get a lot of support and a lot less grade pressure with no MCAT. Those chosen seem to have compelling stories, my unhooked with perfect stats, loads of leadership, research, EMT and so on didn’t cut it. The classes are very rigorous and vast majority skip intro classes. MCAT scores are very high and don’t need as much prep time due to class difficulty. The premeds don’t take classes S/NC unless it’s the occasional English class that is mandatory S/NC. Haven’t applied yet, but they’ve had great experience. Met with advising starting as a first year and meet whenever they have a question or have a need.

PLME is beneficial talent for brown. They need those kids more than those kids need brown. The type of person who gets into PLME would probably get into Harvard Med or Stanford Med, but brown gets to hold onto that talent with guaranteed med school.

Yeah sure, if they are that talented, how come Brown med school is never in T20? PLME's been around for many many years.

To PPP. I agree with your assessment (i.e., "they didn't get into PLME..."). If your kid is high performing, I'd not want to lock them up in one program. They can try for UCSF, Hopkins, Harvard...etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a premed at Brown, they didn’t get into PLME and now think it’s a blessing. They love the school and Providence, but want to apply out. It is an incredible way to go through though, they get a lot of support and a lot less grade pressure with no MCAT. Those chosen seem to have compelling stories, my unhooked with perfect stats, loads of leadership, research, EMT and so on didn’t cut it. The classes are very rigorous and vast majority skip intro classes. MCAT scores are very high and don’t need as much prep time due to class difficulty. The premeds don’t take classes S/NC unless it’s the occasional English class that is mandatory S/NC. Haven’t applied yet, but they’ve had great experience. Met with advising starting as a first year and meet whenever they have a question or have a need.

PLME is beneficial talent for brown. They need those kids more than those kids need brown. The type of person who gets into PLME would probably get into Harvard Med or Stanford Med, but brown gets to hold onto that talent with guaranteed med school.

Yeah sure, if they are that talented, how come Brown med school is never in T20? PLME's been around for many many years.

To PPP. I agree with your assessment (i.e., "they didn't get into PLME..."). If your kid is high performing, I'd not want to lock them up in one program. They can try for UCSF, Hopkins, Harvard...etc.

Because that’s not how med school rankings work? Apologies, but who are you and what do you know about med school?