Bullycide of Rutgers Freshman

[Anonymous]

This is such a complicated case, bullying does not do it justice. The invasion of privacy, the dissemination without consent, the sexual orientation aspect. Gosh, it's so twisted and tragic.

[Anonymous]

You are NEVER EVERY going to get rid of bullies. Never, it is not going away. Humans can be vicious to each other, it is human nature.

What you CAN do it to teach your kids that people can be creul, life can be harsh, but you have to grow thick skin. We cannot protect our kids forever, keep them in a bubble of kindness, fairness, in the land of participation awards for all, and then drop them into the real world where people don't give a shit about your feelings.

You will never change people, but you can change your reaction to people and instill in your kids that they are valuable people who have the right to stand up for themselves and punch back without their gloves. I think we need to stop slicing off our kids balls in the name of progress.

[Anonymous]

This was a premeditated act, wasn't it?

So, couldn't the roommate(s) be charged with involuntary manslaughter? ...maybe if the victim's family had a good lawyer?

[Anonymous]

Agree with PP to the extent that cruelty, even on an anonymous board, can have a tragic result in some instances like suicide. It could be the straw that breaks the camel's back.

[Anonymous]

22:15 - I understand your point, but to all but encourage bullying? Doesn't make it right.

This board as an analogy is not that far off, and indicative of adults (sadly) often taking matters too far, with little if any regard for others. Obviously not as far as the Rutgers case, but again, that doesn't make it right.

Is it so wrong to instill a basic sense of right and wrong? Or are we that insecure ourselves? Do we fear somehow losing the competitive edge if we do our job as a parent?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:22:15 - I understand your point, but to all but encourage bullying? Doesn't make it right.

This board as an analogy is not that far off, and indicative of adults (sadly) often taking matters too far, with little if any regard for others. Obviously not as far as the Rutgers case, but again, that doesn't make it right.

Is it so wrong to instill a basic sense of right and wrong? Or are we that insecure ourselves? Do we fear somehow losing the competitive edge if we do our job as a parent?

Human existence is insecure. It's a perpetual fight for limited resources.

[Anonymous]

When I first read this story, I was just absolutely appalled and horrified. As I read more about it, though, I started to wonder if maybe the victim had some other underlying issues. I am fairly certain that he WAS out, and even had a comment about kissing boys on his facebook profile. I have also read that he was not having sex, he was making out with another guy. While this would unquestionably be a very embarrassing situation, I guess I just don't think it would be QUITE as bad to have a video of making out when everyone knows you are gay anyway. I don't know. That just doesn't seem suicide worthy in my opinion. Now, if no one knew he was gay and all of a sudden he is having gay sex on the internet, THAT I can see an average kid turning to drastic measures because of embarrassment, shame, etc. Not making excuses at all for the Rutgers kids (they sound like scum) but if someone had put a video of me making out with my college bf on the internet, I would not exactly have gone and killed myself. It would have been very upsetting, but not jumping off a bridge upsetting. I do think there was a level of personal responsibility here with the victim in regards to the choice that he made, that has to be addressed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When I first read this story, I was just absolutely appalled and horrified. As I read more about it, though, I started to wonder if maybe the victim had some other underlying issues. I am fairly certain that he WAS out, and even had a comment about kissing boys on his facebook profile. I have also read that he was not having sex, he was making out with another guy. While this would unquestionably be a very embarrassing situation, I guess I just don't think it would be QUITE as bad to have a video of making out when everyone knows you are gay anyway. I don't know. That just doesn't seem suicide worthy in my opinion. Now, if no one knew he was gay and all of a sudden he is having gay sex on the internet, THAT I can see an average kid turning to drastic measures because of embarrassment, shame, etc. Not making excuses at all for the Rutgers kids (they sound like scum) but if someone had put a video of me making out with my college bf on the internet, I would not exactly have gone and killed myself. It would have been very upsetting, but not jumping off a bridge upsetting. I do think there was a level of personal responsibility here with the victim in regards to the choice that he made, that has to be addressed.

But this is EXACTLY what we can't expect of bullied children and teenagers. Children and teenagers are not good long-term thinkers. They are impulsive. They are irresponsible. They are not good at thinking "this will blow over and my life will go on, this is only a little incident." This is why bullied gay teenagers tend to kill themselves.

You have no idea what you would have done if this had happened to you as a teenager. You are looking back through the lens of adulthood, with totally different cognitive skills, different values, and different emotions. You are not a teenager.

[Anonymous]

Tyler, the young man who jumped off the bridge, was filmed without his knowledge during what he thought was a private encounter. And then, even though he was behind closed doors in his own dorm room, to learn that he was filmed and the film was posted on the Internet? It's beyond horrible.

[Anonymous]

If it were hetero sex, it would have been just as devastating.
Young people are too sloppy with IT. Too much info for irresponsible children.
I hope they get the max sentence of 5 years, and serve it.
I knew something like this would happen soon.
There is a chance that the victim was not gay, but exploring, and that seems to be the most painful, they have trouble coming back to a hetero life once the gay history is revealed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So sad. Please, kids, be respectful of each other. And please do not kill yourself. Have faith that whatever problems you're facing now are temporary.

Silly....you've never worked with teens, obviously.

[Anonymous]

I've been thinking about Tyler Clementi all morning. He was a freshman, right? Imagine that you've only been at school a matter of weeks and your roommate -- this person you will be living with for 8 or 9 months -- does this to you. How alone he must have felt! How could anyone be that cruel!?

[Anonymous]

5:11 Yes he had other issues, he was an adolescent, the adolescent mind is still developing, adolescents do impulsive things. Remember, he had to ROOM with this fellow after this indignity, which was not only broadcast but commented on by the perpetrator on Twitter. And even if he was out, this invasion of privacy and the dissemination of a private moment and the comments around it would turn the most mature, rational human, straight or not, into a bundle of paranoid nerves. I mean, a camera aimed at your bed?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When I first read this story, I was just absolutely appalled and horrified. As I read more about it, though, I started to wonder if maybe the victim had some other underlying issues. I am fairly certain that he WAS out, and even had a comment about kissing boys on his facebook profile. I have also read that he was not having sex, he was making out with another guy. While this would unquestionably be a very embarrassing situation, I guess I just don't think it would be QUITE as bad to have a video of making out when everyone knows you are gay anyway. I don't know. That just doesn't seem suicide worthy in my opinion. Now, if no one knew he was gay and all of a sudden he is having gay sex on the internet, THAT I can see an average kid turning to drastic measures because of embarrassment, shame, etc. Not making excuses at all for the Rutgers kids (they sound like scum) but if someone had put a video of me making out with my college bf on the internet, I would not exactly have gone and killed myself. It would have been very upsetting, but not jumping off a bridge upsetting. I do think there was a level of personal responsibility here with the victim in regards to the choice that he made, that has to be addressed.

So a kid who was stronger could have handled it better. So what! I dare say my kid could have handled it better than he did. So f'ing what! The kid's dead and he most likely wouldn't be dead now if these people hadn't played this cruel joke on him. Apparently Tyler was a very shy kid -- it should have been obvious that he would have had a terrible time handling public humiliation.

Next time your kid does something self destructive in response to harassment, just think about what it's like to be a young person and how alone that can feel. Will you tell yourself -- oh my kid should have been stronger and should have known how to manage this?

[Anonymous]

One thing that we need to remember, most of the "outings" that I know of were done by other gays, very shameful thing to do either way.