MCPS vs PGCPS

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wusa9.com/amp/article/news/local/maryland/glenarden-woods-elementary-school-takes-top-spot-in-mcap-assessment-for-performance/65-a159c358-c3ef-4939-99e8-b64de600ae2f I know many posters are often dismissive of MCAP scores, but they do provide a baseline for student achievement across the state. 90% of Glenarden’s students are children of color and 40% are economically disadvantaged. PGCPS has its faults, but they do many things differently from MCPS and those choices are starting noticeably to pay off. Rather than push “honors for all” in the name of equity, they offer rigorous programs for their gifted students. I was curious so I looked up the PGCPS student code of conduct and compared it to MCPS. There seemed to be much higher expectations for student conduct in PGCPS. For example, if an MCPS student is caught with alcohol or drugs, they will receive a “ restorative practice,” if it is their first offense. In PGCPS, students receive a short term suspension and mandatory counseling from the alternative to drugs and alcohol program. Is there any push in MCPS to adopt some of the policies that are used in PGCPS?

MCAP scores may someday provide a baseline, but that's only after the test has all the kinks worked out. Since the state created this new test there have been many issues the least of which the scores aren't a good metric.

I keep hearing that the scores are not a good metric, but what exactly does this mean? Is it just that the cut scores for each level at high thus making the test difficult?

Literally the MCAP is the exact same as the PARCC except a bit shorter. You can see released items online.

That’s what I thought. I’d heard the scores for proficiency might be high though which is why MCPS was raising the MAP on level scores.

I have also seen (and this is supported by teachers observations here and other states) that kids are showing up to ES unprepared to tackle school.

[Anonymous]

I think we rise and fall together, including MCPS and PGCPS, but this is a terrible data point.

As a PP pointed out, the school in question is a whole school gifted program. That is, every single child in the school is proficient at standardized tests, and were hand-selected for that skill in particular.

Yes, a school full of children who are good at tests is going to perform well on tests. That doesn't mean they aren't doing a good job -- there should be programs that serve high performing kids in a lower-performing district, but it tells us nothing about MCPS vs PGCPS.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wusa9.com/amp/article/news/local/maryland/glenarden-woods-elementary-school-takes-top-spot-in-mcap-assessment-for-performance/65-a159c358-c3ef-4939-99e8-b64de600ae2f I know many posters are often dismissive of MCAP scores, but they do provide a baseline for student achievement across the state. 90% of Glenarden’s students are children of color and 40% are economically disadvantaged. PGCPS has its faults, but they do many things differently from MCPS and those choices are starting noticeably to pay off. Rather than push “honors for all” in the name of equity, they offer rigorous programs for their gifted students. I was curious so I looked up the PGCPS student code of conduct and compared it to MCPS. There seemed to be much higher expectations for student conduct in PGCPS. For example, if an MCPS student is caught with alcohol or drugs, they will receive a “ restorative practice,” if it is their first offense. In PGCPS, students receive a short term suspension and mandatory counseling from the alternative to drugs and alcohol program. Is there any push in MCPS to adopt some of the policies that are used in PGCPS?

MCAP scores may someday provide a baseline, but that's only after the test has all the kinks worked out. Since the state created this new test there have been many issues the least of which the scores aren't a good metric.

I keep hearing that the scores are not a good metric, but what exactly does this mean? Is it just that the cut scores for each level at high thus making the test difficult?

Literally the MCAP is the exact same as the PARCC except a bit shorter. You can see released items online.

If that were true they would have just kept the PARCC. They didn't and the results were radically different since the PARCC was a national test that had been widely used.

[Anonymous]

MCAP is not the same as PARCC. One is a national test that has been in use for years. The other is a new test made by the state of MD, which has problems.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wusa9.com/amp/article/news/local/maryland/glenarden-woods-elementary-school-takes-top-spot-in-mcap-assessment-for-performance/65-a159c358-c3ef-4939-99e8-b64de600ae2f I know many posters are often dismissive of MCAP scores, but they do provide a baseline for student achievement across the state. 90% of Glenarden’s students are children of color and 40% are economically disadvantaged. PGCPS has its faults, but they do many things differently from MCPS and those choices are starting noticeably to pay off. Rather than push “honors for all” in the name of equity, they offer rigorous programs for their gifted students. I was curious so I looked up the PGCPS student code of conduct and compared it to MCPS. There seemed to be much higher expectations for student conduct in PGCPS. For example, if an MCPS student is caught with alcohol or drugs, they will receive a “ restorative practice,” if it is their first offense. In PGCPS, students receive a short term suspension and mandatory counseling from the alternative to drugs and alcohol program. Is there any push in MCPS to adopt some of the policies that are used in PGCPS?

MCAP scores may someday provide a baseline, but that's only after the test has all the kinks worked out. Since the state created this new test there have been many issues the least of which the scores aren't a good metric.

I keep hearing that the scores are not a good metric, but what exactly does this mean? Is it just that the cut scores for each level at high thus making the test difficult?

Literally the MCAP is the exact same as the PARCC except a bit shorter. You can see released items online.

That’s what I thought. I’d heard the scores for proficiency might be high though which is why MCPS was raising the MAP on level scores.

I have also seen (and this is supported by teachers observations here and other states) that kids are showing up to ES unprepared to tackle school.

Do you mean kids are turning up to kindergarten without the pre-literacy and pre-numeracy skills needed? Or do you mean older kids showing up without having eaten or slept well?

Either way, I'm not surprised. More than 15,000 childcare centers/in-home providers closed permanently during the pandemic. Kids are more likely to be at home, or with a relative, and not in any sort of structured care center than they were before 2020.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wusa9.com/amp/article/news/local/maryland/glenarden-woods-elementary-school-takes-top-spot-in-mcap-assessment-for-performance/65-a159c358-c3ef-4939-99e8-b64de600ae2f I know many posters are often dismissive of MCAP scores, but they do provide a baseline for student achievement across the state. 90% of Glenarden’s students are children of color and 40% are economically disadvantaged. PGCPS has its faults, but they do many things differently from MCPS and those choices are starting noticeably to pay off. Rather than push “honors for all” in the name of equity, they offer rigorous programs for their gifted students. I was curious so I looked up the PGCPS student code of conduct and compared it to MCPS. There seemed to be much higher expectations for student conduct in PGCPS. For example, if an MCPS student is caught with alcohol or drugs, they will receive a “ restorative practice,” if it is their first offense. In PGCPS, students receive a short term suspension and mandatory counseling from the alternative to drugs and alcohol program. Is there any push in MCPS to adopt some of the policies that are used in PGCPS?

MCAP scores may someday provide a baseline, but that's only after the test has all the kinks worked out. Since the state created this new test there have been many issues the least of which the scores aren't a good metric.

I keep hearing that the scores are not a good metric, but what exactly does this mean? Is it just that the cut scores for each level at high thus making the test difficult?

Literally the MCAP is the exact same as the PARCC except a bit shorter. You can see released items online.

If that were true they would have just kept the PARCC. They didn't and the results were radically different since the PARCC was a national test that had been widely used.

PARCC collapsed due to the States Rights anti-CommonCore political posturing, so PARCC renamed to YourState Blahblah Test, with tweaks to satisfy politicians wanting to claim they did something and to make cross state comparisons harder.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/PARCC

[Anonymous]

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]We're in MCPS but have lots of friends in PGCPS. There doesn't seem to be much difference at all in terms of anything anyone here has mentioned; we're all generally happy with our schools. [/quote]

No one on this thread cares about PG. They are just grasping at straws to try to attack MCPS.

It's great to see PG showing some improvement at one school. The children of PG still need a LOT more help. [/quote]

And if those childre magically lived in MC instead of PG, without other changes to their situation, they'd still need a lot more help.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wusa9.com/amp/article/news/local/maryland/glenarden-woods-elementary-school-takes-top-spot-in-mcap-assessment-for-performance/65-a159c358-c3ef-4939-99e8-b64de600ae2f I know many posters are often dismissive of MCAP scores, but they do provide a baseline for student achievement across the state. 90% of Glenarden’s students are children of color and 40% are economically disadvantaged. PGCPS has its faults, but they do many things differently from MCPS and those choices are starting noticeably to pay off. Rather than push “honors for all” in the name of equity, they offer rigorous programs for their gifted students. I was curious so I looked up the PGCPS student code of conduct and compared it to MCPS. There seemed to be much higher expectations for student conduct in PGCPS. For example, if an MCPS student is caught with alcohol or drugs, they will receive a “ restorative practice,” if it is their first offense. In PGCPS, students receive a short term suspension and mandatory counseling from the alternative to drugs and alcohol program. Is there any push in MCPS to adopt some of the policies that are used in PGCPS?

MCAP scores may someday provide a baseline, but that's only after the test has all the kinks worked out. Since the state created this new test there have been many issues the least of which the scores aren't a good metric.

I keep hearing that the scores are not a good metric, but what exactly does this mean? Is it just that the cut scores for each level at high thus making the test difficult?

Literally the MCAP is the exact same as the PARCC except a bit shorter. You can see released items online.

If that were true they would have just kept the PARCC. They didn't and the results were radically different since the PARCC was a national test that had been widely used.

PARCC collapsed due to the States Rights anti-CommonCore political posturing, so PARCC renamed to YourState Blahblah Test, with tweaks to satisfy politicians wanting to claim they did something and to make cross state comparisons harder.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/PARCC

Regardless my kids got nearly perfect scores on either test so MCPS seems to be working for them. Maybe these scores simply reflect family values.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wusa9.com/amp/article/news/local/maryland/glenarden-woods-elementary-school-takes-top-spot-in-mcap-assessment-for-performance/65-a159c358-c3ef-4939-99e8-b64de600ae2f I know many posters are often dismissive of MCAP scores, but they do provide a baseline for student achievement across the state. 90% of Glenarden’s students are children of color and 40% are economically disadvantaged. PGCPS has its faults, but they do many things differently from MCPS and those choices are starting noticeably to pay off. Rather than push “honors for all” in the name of equity, they offer rigorous programs for their gifted students. I was curious so I looked up the PGCPS student code of conduct and compared it to MCPS. There seemed to be much higher expectations for student conduct in PGCPS. For example, if an MCPS student is caught with alcohol or drugs, they will receive a “ restorative practice,” if it is their first offense. In PGCPS, students receive a short term suspension and mandatory counseling from the alternative to drugs and alcohol program. Is there any push in MCPS to adopt some of the policies that are used in PGCPS?

MCAP scores may someday provide a baseline, but that's only after the test has all the kinks worked out. Since the state created this new test there have been many issues the least of which the scores aren't a good metric.

I keep hearing that the scores are not a good metric, but what exactly does this mean? Is it just that the cut scores for each level at high thus making the test difficult?

Literally the MCAP is the exact same as the PARCC except a bit shorter. You can see released items online.

That’s what I thought. I’d heard the scores for proficiency might be high though which is why MCPS was raising the MAP on level scores.

I have also seen (and this is supported by teachers observations here and other states) that kids are showing up to ES unprepared to tackle school.

Do you mean kids are turning up to kindergarten without the pre-literacy and pre-numeracy skills needed? Or do you mean older kids showing up without having eaten or slept well?

Either way, I'm not surprised. More than 15,000 childcare centers/in-home providers closed permanently during the pandemic. Kids are more likely to be at home, or with a relative, and not in any sort of structured care center than they were before 2020.

Both, but there definitely seems to be an increase in kids showing up without the pre-literacy and pre-numeracy skills needed. They are showing up not knowing the alphabet or letter sounds, not being able to count to 20, not knowing how to spell or recognize their own name, not knowing how to hold a pencil, etc. All of which makes it difficult to then perform well on any assessment given how much more difficult the standards are now.

At this point some thing needs to change. Longer school days so we know that students are experiencing the full academic and social experiences needed to be successful, or starting school at age 7 instead of 5, or evaluating all kiddos at age 5 and determining whether they are placed in K, jr/sr pre-k.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wusa9.com/amp/article/news/local/maryland/glenarden-woods-elementary-school-takes-top-spot-in-mcap-assessment-for-performance/65-a159c358-c3ef-4939-99e8-b64de600ae2f I know many posters are often dismissive of MCAP scores, but they do provide a baseline for student achievement across the state. 90% of Glenarden’s students are children of color and 40% are economically disadvantaged. PGCPS has its faults, but they do many things differently from MCPS and those choices are starting noticeably to pay off. Rather than push “honors for all” in the name of equity, they offer rigorous programs for their gifted students. I was curious so I looked up the PGCPS student code of conduct and compared it to MCPS. There seemed to be much higher expectations for student conduct in PGCPS. For example, if an MCPS student is caught with alcohol or drugs, they will receive a “ restorative practice,” if it is their first offense. In PGCPS, students receive a short term suspension and mandatory counseling from the alternative to drugs and alcohol program. Is there any push in MCPS to adopt some of the policies that are used in PGCPS?

MCAP scores may someday provide a baseline, but that's only after the test has all the kinks worked out. Since the state created this new test there have been many issues the least of which the scores aren't a good metric.

I keep hearing that the scores are not a good metric, but what exactly does this mean? Is it just that the cut scores for each level at high thus making the test difficult?

Literally the MCAP is the exact same as the PARCC except a bit shorter. You can see released items online.

That’s what I thought. I’d heard the scores for proficiency might be high though which is why MCPS was raising the MAP on level scores.

I have also seen (and this is supported by teachers observations here and other states) that kids are showing up to ES unprepared to tackle school.

Do you mean kids are turning up to kindergarten without the pre-literacy and pre-numeracy skills needed? Or do you mean older kids showing up without having eaten or slept well?

Either way, I'm not surprised. More than 15,000 childcare centers/in-home providers closed permanently during the pandemic. Kids are more likely to be at home, or with a relative, and not in any sort of structured care center than they were before 2020.

Both, but there definitely seems to be an increase in kids showing up without the pre-literacy and pre-numeracy skills needed. They are showing up not knowing the alphabet or letter sounds, not being able to count to 20, not knowing how to spell or recognize their own name, not knowing how to hold a pencil, etc. All of which makes it difficult to then perform well on any assessment given how much more difficult the standards are now.

At this point some thing needs to change. Longer school days so we know that students are experiencing the full academic and social experiences needed to be successful, or starting school at age 7 instead of 5, or evaluating all kiddos at age 5 and determining whether they are placed in K, jr/sr pre-k.

Wow, you really have no idea about education do you? Finland and Denmark, who both have arguably MUCH better educational systems than the US, have 4-6 hour school days max. More time spent in school during the day is absolutely non-productive. Students start to stop caring mid-afternoon as it is, but sure, let's keep them in school longer for the sake of doing so. So you can feel like you're "doing" something.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wusa9.com/amp/article/news/local/maryland/glenarden-woods-elementary-school-takes-top-spot-in-mcap-assessment-for-performance/65-a159c358-c3ef-4939-99e8-b64de600ae2f I know many posters are often dismissive of MCAP scores, but they do provide a baseline for student achievement across the state. 90% of Glenarden’s students are children of color and 40% are economically disadvantaged. PGCPS has its faults, but they do many things differently from MCPS and those choices are starting noticeably to pay off. Rather than push “honors for all” in the name of equity, they offer rigorous programs for their gifted students. I was curious so I looked up the PGCPS student code of conduct and compared it to MCPS. There seemed to be much higher expectations for student conduct in PGCPS. For example, if an MCPS student is caught with alcohol or drugs, they will receive a “ restorative practice,” if it is their first offense. In PGCPS, students receive a short term suspension and mandatory counseling from the alternative to drugs and alcohol program. Is there any push in MCPS to adopt some of the policies that are used in PGCPS?

MCAP scores may someday provide a baseline, but that's only after the test has all the kinks worked out. Since the state created this new test there have been many issues the least of which the scores aren't a good metric.

I keep hearing that the scores are not a good metric, but what exactly does this mean? Is it just that the cut scores for each level at high thus making the test difficult?

Literally the MCAP is the exact same as the PARCC except a bit shorter. You can see released items online.

That’s what I thought. I’d heard the scores for proficiency might be high though which is why MCPS was raising the MAP on level scores.

I have also seen (and this is supported by teachers observations here and other states) that kids are showing up to ES unprepared to tackle school.

Do you mean kids are turning up to kindergarten without the pre-literacy and pre-numeracy skills needed? Or do you mean older kids showing up without having eaten or slept well?

Either way, I'm not surprised. More than 15,000 childcare centers/in-home providers closed permanently during the pandemic. Kids are more likely to be at home, or with a relative, and not in any sort of structured care center than they were before 2020.

Both, but there definitely seems to be an increase in kids showing up without the pre-literacy and pre-numeracy skills needed. They are showing up not knowing the alphabet or letter sounds, not being able to count to 20, not knowing how to spell or recognize their own name, not knowing how to hold a pencil, etc. All of which makes it difficult to then perform well on any assessment given how much more difficult the standards are now.

At this point some thing needs to change. Longer school days so we know that students are experiencing the full academic and social experiences needed to be successful, or starting school at age 7 instead of 5, or evaluating all kiddos at age 5 and determining whether they are placed in K, jr/sr pre-k.

LOL. Here you go, Blueprint for Maryland's Future, which requires universal pre-K beginning at ages 3 and 4: https://blueprint.marylandpublicschools.org/ece/

[Anonymous]

MCPS is ~50% proficient on MCAP, above state average

PGPS is ~30% proficient on MCAP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No. MCPS is too concerned about “closing the gap” to be concerned with accountability. The gap will never be closed if students know there are not consequences for fighting, missed assignments, skipping classes and blaming all misbehavior on racial inequity. As a current MCPS teacher (who is also a woman and minority), I’ve seen first hand the disservice MCPS has shown ALL students by refusing to remediate the foundational skill gap present for so many of our students (only offering honors english for 9th and 10th grade students is just one example) combined with the lottery system for magnet school selection (watering down the accelerated / advanced course material). Sad to say but MCPS is no longer the gold standard it once was in the past.

And don't even get me started on the dumb teachers.

Please. Tell us how the people teaching your children are dumb. That would be more a reflection on you rather than the teachers.

Not the PP however as my children went through MCPS the teacher quality went down for sure. Change of career teachers are the worst. We had a lawyer for English, sales guy for history and AP Psychology ugh sports broh.... We also had teachers that stayed in the sytem too long.

Ew you sound gross. Why didn't you homeschool then

Homeschoolers actually ARE people from all fields. Don't send this PP our way.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:https://www.wusa9.com/amp/article/news/local/maryland/glenarden-woods-elementary-school-takes-top-spot-in-mcap-assessment-for-performance/65-a159c358-c3ef-4939-99e8-b64de600ae2f I know many posters are often dismissive of MCAP scores, but they do provide a baseline for student achievement across the state. 90% of Glenarden’s students are children of color and 40% are economically disadvantaged. PGCPS has its faults, but they do many things differently from MCPS and those choices are starting noticeably to pay off. Rather than push “honors for all” in the name of equity, they offer rigorous programs for their gifted students. I was curious so I looked up the PGCPS student code of conduct and compared it to MCPS. There seemed to be much higher expectations for student conduct in PGCPS. For example, if an MCPS student is caught with alcohol or drugs, they will receive a “ restorative practice,” if it is their first offense. In PGCPS, students receive a short term suspension and mandatory counseling from the alternative to drugs and alcohol program. Is there any push in MCPS to adopt some of the policies that are used in PGCPS?

MCAP scores may someday provide a baseline, but that's only after the test has all the kinks worked out. Since the state created this new test there have been many issues the least of which the scores aren't a good metric.

I keep hearing that the scores are not a good metric, but what exactly does this mean? Is it just that the cut scores for each level at high thus making the test difficult?

Literally the MCAP is the exact same as the PARCC except a bit shorter. You can see released items online.

That’s what I thought. I’d heard the scores for proficiency might be high though which is why MCPS was raising the MAP on level scores.

I have also seen (and this is supported by teachers observations here and other states) that kids are showing up to ES unprepared to tackle school.

Do you mean kids are turning up to kindergarten without the pre-literacy and pre-numeracy skills needed? Or do you mean older kids showing up without having eaten or slept well?

Either way, I'm not surprised. More than 15,000 childcare centers/in-home providers closed permanently during the pandemic. Kids are more likely to be at home, or with a relative, and not in any sort of structured care center than they were before 2020.

Both, but there definitely seems to be an increase in kids showing up without the pre-literacy and pre-numeracy skills needed. They are showing up not knowing the alphabet or letter sounds, not being able to count to 20, not knowing how to spell or recognize their own name, not knowing how to hold a pencil, etc. All of which makes it difficult to then perform well on any assessment given how much more difficult the standards are now.

At this point some thing needs to change. Longer school days so we know that students are experiencing the full academic and social experiences needed to be successful, or starting school at age 7 instead of 5, or evaluating all kiddos at age 5 and determining whether they are placed in K, jr/sr pre-k.

Wow, you really have no idea about education do you? Finland and Denmark, who both have arguably MUCH better educational systems than the US, have 4-6 hour school days max. More time spent in school during the day is absolutely non-productive. Students start to stop caring mid-afternoon as it is, but sure, let's keep them in school longer for the sake of doing so. So you can feel like you're "doing" something.

Wow ,you really have no idea how very different Finland’s and Denmark’s society is compared to the U.S. or how their education system are setup. And if we could get our society and education overhauled that might be viable. But alas