MCPS Teachers: Why cling to grade inflation and disregard MAP?

[Anonymous]

In the school where I work, only about 40% of 5th graders are at the 50th percentile or above on MAP M. Many students are between the 1st and 10th percentile. So I can see where a student at the 39th percentile who seems to understand what is going on in class would be generally described as doing well. Parents may want their kids to be at the 90th percentile, but students want their whole class to meet grade level.

[Anonymous]

OP you are dead on and I fully support your analysis and would fully support you taking this up with the teaching team, math specialist and counselors. I also suggest following up about what factors are keeping lessons from being taught.

I understand that teachers have lots of kids and have to work with those farthest behind. But sugar coating where kids are truly at, and not paying attention to data being provide both by standardize test, class grading and observation by parent is just ridiculous and does a disservice to families who are trying to engage. This is exactly why parents say they don’t know what success looks like or is suppose to be in MCPS. It’s perfectly okay to tell a parent that their student is right on the cusp of grade level and with a little individualized support outside of school on some foundational concepts would likely pull up to on grade level. In fact saying this now while seeing these early warning signs it what prevents things from getting worse. Particularly in a subject like Math where things continually build on one another.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP you are dead on and I fully support your analysis and would fully support you taking this up with the teaching team, math specialist and counselors. I also suggest following up about what factors are keeping lessons from being taught.

I understand that teachers have lots of kids and have to work with those farthest behind. But sugar coating where kids are truly at, and not paying attention to data being provide both by standardize test, class grading and observation by parent is just ridiculous and does a disservice to families who are trying to engage. This is exactly why parents say they don’t know what success looks like or is suppose to be in MCPS. It’s perfectly okay to tell a parent that their student is right on the cusp of grade level and with a little individualized support outside of school on some foundational concepts would likely pull up to on grade level. In fact saying this now while seeing these early warning signs it what prevents things from getting worse. Particularly in a subject like Math where things continually build on one another.

OP here. THANK YOU!

[Anonymous]

Not the OP, but I also feel frustrated that there's just no transparency about how my kids are getting the grades that she's receiving. Occasionally we get a few reading assignments return to us and I've gotten zero math work back and as far as I can tell there's no test or quiz results under parentvue. We're just supposed to take it on faith that her work is earning the grades she's supposedly earned

[Anonymous]

My kids are much older. Their MAP scores never reflected their actual abilities. My 25th percentile kid is in advanced calculus in 11th grade having skipped a grade along the way. My other kids, not as bright, were also advanced in math with low MAP scores. I don’t get why you think grade inflation is the issue as opposed to the MAP itself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kids are much older. Their MAP scores never reflected their actual abilities. My 25th percentile kid is in advanced calculus in 11th grade having skipped a grade along the way. My other kids, not as bright, were also advanced in math with low MAP scores. I don’t get why you think grade inflation is the issue as opposed to the MAP itself.

I agree with you that MAP scores do not reflect their actual abilities. I don’t understand why mcps gives so much weight to MAP scores. The entire lottery for magnet/ces is based off of map scores.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In the school where I work, only about 40% of 5th graders are at the 50th percentile or above on MAP M. Many students are between the 1st and 10th percentile. So I can see where a student at the 39th percentile who seems to understand what is going on in class would be generally described as doing well. Parents may want their kids to be at the 90th percentile, but students want their whole class to meet grade level.

Which school is this? Probably not a W feeder school

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:By all means provide enrichment. What I was trying to tell you was if she is getting mostly A’s and B’s in class and an occasional C or D , the teacher is most likely to think your daughter is doing fine. But I agree that she needs help and mathnasium is a good place to get that help and get her on track.

That’s not grade inflation. That is a kid who needs a bit of help at home.

We do help her at home. Actually, what my daughter chiefly complains about is that the teacher doesn't spend enough time teaching the material and that leads her to not being able to complete the homework.

This is borne out by a message the teacher recently sent where she said, "Unfortunately, due to many factors, I do not have time to reteach this concept in whole group tomorrow, and we have to move on to the next lesson."

I don't know why she's short on time, but I would say my daughter, and likely other kids, need more time practicing and learning the material to have the confidence to do the homework effectively. So the material is being taught in rapid succession and the kids are retaining only a portion of it and then it's on to the next lesson before they've mastered what they were learning in the first place.

But nice try trying to pin the blame on the parent, as always.

It’s very telling that you characterize your responsibility as “blame.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don’t understand what you want to hear. You are in public school. The evidence is she is she is at a level that is not concerning and would meet the criteria now. If you want her to improve than it’s on you. Otherwise get out of public school. I feel for her teacher with a parent like you. You aren’t special.

Actually, that's not clear. As parents we are told of the importance of our kids being at or on grade level. She's below it, though slightly. So I'm responding exactly how the school district, which conducts the MAP tests and distributes the reports to parents, has instructed me to. It is the teacher, contrary to what MCPS says, who is telling me to disregard MAP.

If you're a teacher, I feel sorry for any parents or students who have to suffer with ridiculous superiority complex.

Im a parent, not a teacher, and PP is correct. You just don’t like hearing it. Oh well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP you are dead on and I fully support your analysis and would fully support you taking this up with the teaching team, math specialist and counselors. I also suggest following up about what factors are keeping lessons from being taught.

I understand that teachers have lots of kids and have to work with those farthest behind. But sugar coating where kids are truly at, and not paying attention to data being provide both by standardize test, class grading and observation by parent is just ridiculous and does a disservice to families who are trying to engage. This is exactly why parents say they don’t know what success looks like or is suppose to be in MCPS. It’s perfectly okay to tell a parent that their student is right on the cusp of grade level and with a little individualized support outside of school on some foundational concepts would likely pull up to on grade level. In fact saying this now while seeing these early warning signs it what prevents things from getting worse. Particularly in a subject like Math where things continually build on one another.

OP here. THANK YOU!

So THIS was the purpose of your post. To get others to tell you how “right” you are.

Figures.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP you are dead on and I fully support your analysis and would fully support you taking this up with the teaching team, math specialist and counselors. I also suggest following up about what factors are keeping lessons from being taught.

I understand that teachers have lots of kids and have to work with those farthest behind. But sugar coating where kids are truly at, and not paying attention to data being provide both by standardize test, class grading and observation by parent is just ridiculous and does a disservice to families who are trying to engage. This is exactly why parents say they don’t know what success looks like or is suppose to be in MCPS. It’s perfectly okay to tell a parent that their student is right on the cusp of grade level and with a little individualized support outside of school on some foundational concepts would likely pull up to on grade level. In fact saying this now while seeing these early warning signs it what prevents things from getting worse. Particularly in a subject like Math where things continually build on one another.

OP here. THANK YOU!

So THIS was the purpose of your post. To get others to tell you how “right” you are.

Figures.

What was your purpose in responding to the post?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kids are much older. Their MAP scores never reflected their actual abilities. My 25th percentile kid is in advanced calculus in 11th grade having skipped a grade along the way. My other kids, not as bright, were also advanced in math with low MAP scores. I don’t get why you think grade inflation is the issue as opposed to the MAP itself.

OP here. I think it's highly unusual that a kid in the 25th percentile could be in advanced calculus in 11th grade without some kind of context or explanation. I.e. that they purposely bombed the MAP tests. But anyway, that's your experience with your children, so I won't invalidate that.

However, the MAP scores matched the various observations I've observed that led me to conclude my daughter does in fact need a little bit of extra support to really be successful with math. So in my case, MAP was right and it was a valuable tool.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In the school where I work, only about 40% of 5th graders are at the 50th percentile or above on MAP M. Many students are between the 1st and 10th percentile. So I can see where a student at the 39th percentile who seems to understand what is going on in class would be generally described as doing well. Parents may want their kids to be at the 90th percentile, but students want their whole class to meet grade level.

Correct, it is not. Like 80% of MCPS schools are not.

Which school is this? Probably not a W feeder school

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Mathnasium has a strong financial incentive to tell you that your kid is behind at the beginning and then, after months of classes there, they will probably proudly announce that she is fixed, thanks to them!

I wouldn’t assume that the teacher is hiding something and mathnasium is the objective arbiter here.

Ok so first the OP shouldn’t trust MAP because kids fall asleep during it. Then she shouldn’t trust an outside provider because they have a financial incentive. Her child has gotten a C and D on quizzes that should be relatively straightforward — will you say sh en shouldn’t trust those other?

OP, good for you for being on top of this, but I agree t that it is a shame for kids whose parents don’t have the resources or knowledge to do so.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP you are dead on and I fully support your analysis and would fully support you taking this up with the teaching team, math specialist and counselors. I also suggest following up about what factors are keeping lessons from being taught.

I understand that teachers have lots of kids and have to work with those farthest behind. But sugar coating where kids are truly at, and not paying attention to data being provide both by standardize test, class grading and observation by parent is just ridiculous and does a disservice to families who are trying to engage. This is exactly why parents say they don’t know what success looks like or is suppose to be in MCPS. It’s perfectly okay to tell a parent that their student is right on the cusp of grade level and with a little individualized support outside of school on some foundational concepts would likely pull up to on grade level. In fact saying this now while seeing these early warning signs it what prevents things from getting worse. Particularly in a subject like Math where things continually build on one another.

OP here. THANK YOU!

So THIS was the purpose of your post. To get others to tell you how “right” you are.

Figures.

Exactly. This OP is exactly why teachers are leaving. So entitled.