Are Mormons Christians?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They say they are, but most other denominations would consider them heretics at best based on their beliefs

+1

No, they’re not Christians.

But they follow Christ, right? Why do you get to decide?

Members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints unequivocally affirm themselves to be Christians. They worship God the Eternal Father in the name of Jesus Christ. When asked what the Latter-day Saints believe, Joseph Smith put Christ at the center: “The fundamental principles of our religion is the testimony of the apostles and prophets concerning Jesus Christ, ‘that he died, was buried, and rose again the third day, and ascended up into heaven;’ and all other things are only appendages to these, which pertain to our religion.” The modern-day Quorum of the Twelve Apostles reaffirmed that testimony when they proclaimed, “Jesus is the Living Christ, the immortal Son of God. … His way is the path that leads to happiness in this life and eternal life in the world to come.”

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics-essays/christians?lang=eng

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I was Mormon for most of my life. Mormons think of themselves as Christians, but they disagree with the Nicene Creed, so their beliefs would have made them “anathema” to the leaders of christianity in in the first century.

It depends on how you define “Christian.”

Here is the original text of the the Nicene Creed from AD 325:
The (Original) Nicene Creed of 325
We believe in one God, the Father almighty, Maker of heaven and earth, and of all things visible and invisible.
And in one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the only-begotten, begotten of the Father before all ages.
Light of Light, true God of true God, begotten not made,
of one essence with the Father by whom all things were made; who for us men and for our salvation, came down from heaven, and was incarnate of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary
and became man.
And He was crucified for us under Pontius Pilate,
and suffered, and was buried.
And the third day He rose again, according to the Scriptures;
and ascended into heaven, and sits at the right hand of the Father; and He shall come again with glory to judge the living and the dead; whose Kingdom shall have no end.
And in the Holy Spirit.
But as for those who say, There was when He was not, and, before being born He was not, and that He came into existence out of nothing, or who assert that the Son of God is from a different hypostasis or substance, or is created, or is subject to alteration or change – these the Catholic Church anathematizes.

There are several things here Mormons disavow. First, the idea of the Trinity that God the Father and God the Son and the Holy Spirit are the same. Mormons definitely teach that each of those are separate entities. They also don’t technically believe that God is “almighty” (or “omnipotent” as it is also translated), because they believe that there is a fundamental law that preexists God. That good is good and evil is evil and that God is powerful because He is so fully aligned with good as to be able to master the universe that is based on this goodness. The idea that God is omnipotent implies that good is whatever he says it is. There is no fundamental good that he cannot alter merely by willing it to be so.

All That said, you can tell that at the time of it’s writing, there were competing ideas about Christ and his origins and the nature of God, because they specifically disavow the idea that anything existed before Christ/God. So a Mormon would say that the idea of the Trinity was not a fundamental doctrine taught by Christ, but was a doctrine of men, added later and perpetuated by those seeking unjust authority.

As for the idea that Mormons only read “their own scriptures” and not the Bible, that is laughable. Mormons study scriptures on a four-year rotation, with one year being the Old Testament, then the New Testament, then the Book of Mormon, then concluding with the Doctrine and Covenants (which is essentially the writings of Joseph Smith and the early history of the church prior to his death). In high school, Mormon teens attend an additional scripture class 5 days a week during the school year and each year they study one of the 4 books above. Then in college they are encouraged to attend additional “Institute” classes that cover the same material (and not just at BYU). I had read the KJV cover to cover before I reached adulthood, and continued to study it in particular and alongside Mormon-specific texts throughout my time in the LDS Church. Compared to some of my friends of charismatic faiths growing up in the “Bible” Belt, I was a downright biblical scholar!

What made you get out?

Personally, I was a victim of sexual abuse as a young child and healing from that inside of the church became impossible. More intellectually, what pushed me over the edge was the failure of those in leadership to stand up to those many church members who are devout members of the Trump cult. I can’t follow someone as a “prophet of god” if they aren’t willing to stand up to evil and call it what it is. And I don’t mean that Trump is evil (I don’t think I can judge any person’s soul), but I don’t think you can honestly claim to be a follower of Christ and unless you take seriously His command to prioritize caring for the “least of these.” Children, immigrants, the poor, the politically disenfranchised, and anyone who is oppressed should be our concern. Not maintaining the comfort of the most comfortable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm agnostic, and I think all religions are cults, but in terms of personal integrity and behavior the Mormons I have known have been some of the nicest, most honest, hardest-working people I've come across. I've worked in organizations where, at the end of the day, people of one religion definitely displayed favoritism towards others of the same religion (I guess because of a shared belief they are "God's chosen"), and that's not been the case with Mormons.

So if they want to call themselves Christians, that's fine by me.

Lol. You need to meet more Mormons.

+10000 Just move to Utah as a non-Mormon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm agnostic, and I think all religions are cults, but in terms of personal integrity and behavior the Mormons I have known have been some of the nicest, most honest, hardest-working people I've come across. I've worked in organizations where, at the end of the day, people of one religion definitely displayed favoritism towards others of the same religion (I guess because of a shared belief they are "God's chosen"), and that's not been the case with Mormons.

So if they want to call themselves Christians, that's fine by me.

Lol. You need to meet more Mormons.

+10000 Just move to Utah as a non-Mormon.

Or Arizona or anyplace where they’re a large community.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm agnostic, and I think all religions are cults, but in terms of personal integrity and behavior the Mormons I have known have been some of the nicest, most honest, hardest-working people I've come across. I've worked in organizations where, at the end of the day, people of one religion definitely displayed favoritism towards others of the same religion (I guess because of a shared belief they are "God's chosen"), and that's not been the case with Mormons.

So if they want to call themselves Christians, that's fine by me.

Lol. You need to meet more Mormons.

+10000 Just move to Utah as a non-Mormon.

Or Arizona or anyplace where they’re a large community.

I knew an exchange student who was hosted by a Mormon family in Utah, she had a nice experience and found everyone to be friendly and welcoming. It wasn't an issue at all that she was not a Mormon

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Mormons explicitly deny the Trinity, which makes them pretty far removed from any Christian doctrine.

Unitarians (not to be confused with Unitarian-Universalists in the US) also deny the Trinity and consider themselves to be Christian.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm agnostic, and I think all religions are cults, but in terms of personal integrity and behavior the Mormons I have known have been some of the nicest, most honest, hardest-working people I've come across. I've worked in organizations where, at the end of the day, people of one religion definitely displayed favoritism towards others of the same religion (I guess because of a shared belief they are "God's chosen"), and that's not been the case with Mormons.

So if they want to call themselves Christians, that's fine by me.

Lol. You need to meet more Mormons.

+10000 Just move to Utah as a non-Mormon.

Or Arizona or anyplace where they’re a large community.

I knew an exchange student who was hosted by a Mormon family in Utah, she had a nice experience and found everyone to be friendly and welcoming. It wasn't an issue at all that she was not a Mormon

An exchange student is not a peer. She is there for a limited proscribed time as an outsider.

A neighbor who has settled into a neighborhood is a peer. The expectation is that they are staying, are asking to be treated on the same footing as everyone else, and yet have not accepted the tenets of the LDS Church. They are living in the community as a community member, but they reject (or don't accept, or don't hew to) some of the common community standards cherished by other members.

Totally different situations. Totally different reactions overall.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mormons explicitly deny the Trinity, which makes them pretty far removed from any Christian doctrine.

Unitarians (not to be confused with Unitarian-Universalists in the US) also deny the Trinity and consider themselves to be Christian.

And they’re also not Christian.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Mormons explicitly deny the Trinity, which makes them pretty far removed from any Christian doctrine.

Can you show me the Bible verse that says "trinity?" No, because it doesn't exist. It's made up. There's God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. But nowhere in the Bible does it say they are a triad or three part god-head with equal divinity. In fact, Jesus himself said quite the opposite.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mormons explicitly deny the Trinity, which makes them pretty far removed from any Christian doctrine.

Unitarians (not to be confused with Unitarian-Universalists in the US) also deny the Trinity and consider themselves to be Christian.

Not true. Non-Christian Unitarian here. I would venture that most Unitarians in the US do NOT consider themselves to be Christian. In a highly diverse faith community like ours this may be a rare area of near-unity. Most are not Christians.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If your definition of Christian is some who believes in a follows Christ, then yes. It’s even in their name - The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints

As a former Mormon, l can tell in you practise there is equal emphasis and time spent on the Bible and Book of Mormon in Sunday school etc

The name was created for marketing/PR purposes, to normalize the religion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mormons explicitly deny the Trinity, which makes them pretty far removed from any Christian doctrine.

Unitarians (not to be confused with Unitarian-Universalists in the US) also deny the Trinity and consider themselves to be Christian.

Not true. Non-Christian Unitarian here. I would venture that most Unitarians in the US do NOT consider themselves to be Christian. In a highly diverse faith community like ours this may be a rare area of near-unity. Most are not Christians.

Okay reading your original post regarding Unitarianism more carefully - you’re referring Unitarians OUTSIDE the US? why? I’m that case what you say maybe true but why would you bring up Non-US Unitarians in a conversation about Mormons?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm agnostic, and I think all religions are cults, but in terms of personal integrity and behavior the Mormons I have known have been some of the nicest, most honest, hardest-working people I've come across. I've worked in organizations where, at the end of the day, people of one religion definitely displayed favoritism towards others of the same religion (I guess because of a shared belief they are "God's chosen"), and that's not been the case with Mormons.

So if they want to call themselves Christians, that's fine by me.

Lol. You need to meet more Mormons.

+1

Go live in Utah for a year or two and then come back and tell us what that was like, as a non-Mormon.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your definition of Christian is some who believes in a follows Christ, then yes. It’s even in their name - The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints

As a former Mormon, l can tell in you practise there is equal emphasis and time spent on the Bible and Book of Mormon in Sunday school etc

The name was created for marketing/PR purposes, to normalize the religion.

Definition of a Christian is a member of the mainstream Christian churches, one who is able to recognize a member from another denomination as also a Christian.
Such a person can visit and attend service in any church and be seen as a fellow believer.
Mormons do not see a Lutheran or an episcopalian as a fellow believer, but as a mission field that needs to be converted.

Once you add the belief that only members of your church are people who will be saved
then you are too exclusionary

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Mormons explicitly deny the Trinity, which makes them pretty far removed from any Christian doctrine.

Unitarians (not to be confused with Unitarian-Universalists in the US) also deny the Trinity and consider themselves to be Christian.

Not true. Non-Christian Unitarian here. I would venture that most Unitarians in the US do NOT consider themselves to be Christian. In a highly diverse faith community like ours this may be a rare area of near-unity. Most are not Christians.

Okay reading your original post regarding Unitarianism more carefully - you’re referring Unitarians OUTSIDE the US? why? I’m that case what you say maybe true but why would you bring up Non-US Unitarians in a conversation about Mormons?

The post to which I responded said that Mormons do not recognize the Trinity and therefore, we’re not Christian. I was providing another religion that also does not recognize the Trinity, but does consider themselves to be Christian. Unitarians have been around since the beginning of Christianity. When the Nicene Creed was developed, they lost he political battle to the Trinitarians and were declared heretics and squashed. However, they kept popping up from time to time. They were able to establish a foothold in what is now Transylvania in the 1500’s - that still continues today.