Walt Whitman vs walter johnson

[Anonymous]

I agree with the posters who say it’s more about the kid than the school. If you have a smart, high-achieving kid at either school they will feel pressure and stress. Honestly OP, moving a kid in middle school so that they have all new kids in their classes and have to make new friends sounds like a terrible idea to me. That’s a really hard time to start over for a kid. If your kid is happy and thriving in their current friend group, why would you do that? I could see switching to a small private school but the notion of moving a mile or two away in the hopes of sheltering your kid from some unknown and speculative stress sounds a bit over the top to me.

[Anonymous]

+1 to this whole thread. My DS graduated from Whitman last year and has anxiety. Whitman is a high pressured environment and he is a high achiever. That said, he loved it and thrived (though still had anxiety). That environment was similar to friends he had at WJ. It's up to the parents to help ground the kids, push back against counselors pushing high achievers, and tune out talk of the Ivys. And it's up to the kids to avoid drugs, etc.

My other kid was probably going to buckle under that system, too big for her, and I moved her to private school before Pyle. I'm not sure WJ triangle would have been any different than Whitman.

Personally I always thought the advantage of WJ was they could walk to lunch near the school, but that's not enough of an advantage to move.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are considering moving from whitman cluster to WJ mainly for high school because of a lack of diversity and above normal mental health issues at Whitman. Can any WJ parent share if the mental health issues are any less at WJ? I feel the culture at Whitman is partly to blame. Not sure. Don’t flame me. Genuinely concerned about my younger child who will enter Whitman in a couple of years.

WJ > Whitman

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:OP here- I was specifically looking for mental health issues at WJ if they are similar to Whitman? None of these responses have been helpful. I know the test scores and not really care about the differences in them in regards to test scores.

You should have drawn an inference from the PP at WJ who suggested WJ kids need to take 12-14 AP courses to attend a good university.

And you think somehow they can take fewer AP courses at Whitman and sail right into Harvard? What a stupid inference that would be. WJ kids are competitive with Whitman kids for top colleges -- and I assume you understand that college admissions overall are extraordinarily competitive these days.

I don’t think that was their point. Pp was suggesting WJ is similarly cut throat if that’s the norm. That said, I have a good student at WJ who is on track for about 8 APs. I wouldn’t say 12-14 is the norm, unless a contender for Ivys.

I agree and I have kids at WJ. 12-14 is not the norm.

+1. It’s not necessary to have 12-14 APs. That’s insane actually.

It depends what you mean by ¨norm¨ The Apex (signature academic) program requires 9 AP classes as the minimum. [Program changed for class of 24 and on for those who had kids in the old program]

This is helpful information as I have younger kids who might be interested in APEX. Are you saying that the old minimum was 9 or the "new" minimum is 9?

Also, as someone with older kids who already graduated, there's a big difference between 9 APs and 12-14 APs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I think a kid with mental health challenges is going to have those no matter which school they are at. You can't insulate a kid by switching schools. I have three kids total, one who graduated from WJ, one at a magnet HS, and one entering WJ from a magnet MS.

We really like WJ, and think it's overall a happy school, but in our personal experience, we believe our two younger kids who have had mental health challenges would have had them regardless of the school. We have friends with kids in Whitman -- some of them have struggled and some of them have thrived and sailed right through. I believe from knowing the kids that the issues would have been the same irrespective of the school.

If you're concerned enough about your kid to consider moving schools, what other proactive steps have you taken? Is your child in therapy? Have they seen a psychiatrist or psychologist for an evaluation? If you have concerns, you should probably get a full neuropsychological examination and determine a) what your child's challenges are; b) whether medications are appropriate; c) what forms of therapy are appropriate; and d) whether your child needs accommodations in school (which are available for anxiety/depression, not just ADHD or learning disabilities).

You're looking for an answer from this board that I don't think you're going to find, because the answer is about your individual child and their needs, not about whether a particular high school will help them avoid mental health struggles.

This 100%

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I think a kid with mental health challenges is going to have those no matter which school they are at. You can't insulate a kid by switching schools. I have three kids total, one who graduated from WJ, one at a magnet HS, and one entering WJ from a magnet MS.

We really like WJ, and think it's overall a happy school, but in our personal experience, we believe our two younger kids who have had mental health challenges would have had them regardless of the school. We have friends with kids in Whitman -- some of them have struggled and some of them have thrived and sailed right through. I believe from knowing the kids that the issues would have been the same irrespective of the school.

If you're concerned enough about your kid to consider moving schools, what other proactive steps have you taken? Is your child in therapy? Have they seen a psychiatrist or psychologist for an evaluation? If you have concerns, you should probably get a full neuropsychological examination and determine a) what your child's challenges are; b) whether medications are appropriate; c) what forms of therapy are appropriate; and d) whether your child needs accommodations in school (which are available for anxiety/depression, not just ADHD or learning disabilities).

You're looking for an answer from this board that I don't think you're going to find, because the answer is about your individual child and their needs, not about whether a particular high school will help them avoid mental health struggles.

This 100%

OP here- thanks for the responses. I have 2 kids who went through Whitman. What I noticed is the number of kids at Whitman who are depressed have increased in the past 3 years. Suicides too. My first one had no friends who were depressed. They only knew of kids who were. Second had most friends who were depressed, had eating disorders, etc . My kids have been fine but the second kid was surrounded by kids with mental health issues and it was draining. They felt exhausted from worrying about the friends. Yes I know it would be stupid to move but I would like my 3rd kid to have happier high school environment, where most friends are happy instead of being depressed. There is not much I can do about it but I am just worried

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I think a kid with mental health challenges is going to have those no matter which school they are at. You can't insulate a kid by switching schools. I have three kids total, one who graduated from WJ, one at a magnet HS, and one entering WJ from a magnet MS.

We really like WJ, and think it's overall a happy school, but in our personal experience, we believe our two younger kids who have had mental health challenges would have had them regardless of the school. We have friends with kids in Whitman -- some of them have struggled and some of them have thrived and sailed right through. I believe from knowing the kids that the issues would have been the same irrespective of the school.

If you're concerned enough about your kid to consider moving schools, what other proactive steps have you taken? Is your child in therapy? Have they seen a psychiatrist or psychologist for an evaluation? If you have concerns, you should probably get a full neuropsychological examination and determine a) what your child's challenges are; b) whether medications are appropriate; c) what forms of therapy are appropriate; and d) whether your child needs accommodations in school (which are available for anxiety/depression, not just ADHD or learning disabilities).

You're looking for an answer from this board that I don't think you're going to find, because the answer is about your individual child and their needs, not about whether a particular high school will help them avoid mental health struggles.

This 100%

OP here- thanks for the responses. I have 2 kids who went through Whitman. What I noticed is the number of kids at Whitman who are depressed have increased in the past 3 years. Suicides too. My first one had no friends who were depressed. They only knew of kids who were. Second had most friends who were depressed, had eating disorders, etc . My kids have been fine but the second kid was surrounded by kids with mental health issues and it was draining. They felt exhausted from worrying about the friends. Yes I know it would be stupid to move but I would like my 3rd kid to have happier high school environment, where most friends are happy instead of being depressed. There is not much I can do about it but I am just worried

My kid is it a DCC high school and is depressed and anxious. I don’t think changing from Whitman to Walter Johnson is going to solve that. The past three years have been depressing for everyone because of the pandemic. Or for most people. I don’t understand why people think the pandemic shouldn’t be affecting teens. The world kind of sucks right now and kids can feel that too. And no it’s not because they had to wear masks. It’s because there’s a lot of bad things going on right now. That said, I would never have bought aim the Whitman school district because it’s so white.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP, I think a kid with mental health challenges is going to have those no matter which school they are at. You can't insulate a kid by switching schools. I have three kids total, one who graduated from WJ, one at a magnet HS, and one entering WJ from a magnet MS.

We really like WJ, and think it's overall a happy school, but in our personal experience, we believe our two younger kids who have had mental health challenges would have had them regardless of the school. We have friends with kids in Whitman -- some of them have struggled and some of them have thrived and sailed right through. I believe from knowing the kids that the issues would have been the same irrespective of the school.

If you're concerned enough about your kid to consider moving schools, what other proactive steps have you taken? Is your child in therapy? Have they seen a psychiatrist or psychologist for an evaluation? If you have concerns, you should probably get a full neuropsychological examination and determine a) what your child's challenges are; b) whether medications are appropriate; c) what forms of therapy are appropriate; and d) whether your child needs accommodations in school (which are available for anxiety/depression, not just ADHD or learning disabilities).

You're looking for an answer from this board that I don't think you're going to find, because the answer is about your individual child and their needs, not about whether a particular high school will help them avoid mental health struggles.

This 100%

Disagree, I think seeking consensus is a perfectly natural and helpful practice. Of course, they're taking steps, but nobody thinks of everything and perhaps others may have experience with this which could be helpful. Even if I'd sought help I'd still probably ask to make sure I'd thought of everyting.

[Anonymous]

I don't think we can take the stress and pressure of the last two years as anything but the experience of a global pandemic. One of my kids was hospitalized for suicidal ideation at the very beginning of the pandemic. She was struggling with anxiety and depression and was seeing a therapist who wasn't the best fit, and we were just about to make a move to switch therapists and find a psychiatrist for medical treatment and then boom, pandemic, hospital. Despite intensive treatment, she was hospitalized again a year later after a year of Zoom school.

We can't step in the same river twice, but I am pretty confident that she would not have gotten to the point of hospitalization if not for the pandemic and the social isolation (and the fear of social isolation for the first one). Two years (and a lot of treatment) later, she's doing great, but going back to in-person school and activities was such a huge component of that.

I know plenty of kids struggled with anxiety, depression, and suicidal ideation before the pandemic, but the pandemic and the resulting social isolation of teens were such a force multiplier that you just can't take those out of the equation when judging the last two years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here- I was specifically looking for mental health issues at WJ if they are similar to Whitman? None of these responses have been helpful. I know the test scores and not really care about the differences in them in regards to test scores.

You're not smart enough to read between the lines. The highest achieving school, on paper, in terms of grades - Whitman - probably has the biggest stressors, most suicides / accidental overdoses and outsourcing for therapists.

Do you have data to support that? Google WJ and suicide. There are kids with mental health issues at both. It’s important to differentiate between the issues of the kid and the issues of the school.

My DC went to Whitman and was one of those for whom it was a great fit and not high stress, despite taking a lot of AP classes. I’m sure he would have done fine at WJ too.

OP you may want to talk to the guidance counselors at each school to get a sense of the fit for your child’s particular mental health challenges. I’m sure they’ve seen similar kids before and can provide some perspective.

The counselors at those schools literally do not give a shit. They are about presenting a semblance only of "care". They process grades, they send transcripts, they field questions that they can rarely answer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here- I was specifically looking for mental health issues at WJ if they are similar to Whitman? None of these responses have been helpful. I know the test scores and not really care about the differences in them in regards to test scores.

You're not smart enough to read between the lines. The highest achieving school, on paper, in terms of grades - Whitman - probably has the biggest stressors, most suicides / accidental overdoses and outsourcing for therapists.

Do you have data to support that? Google WJ and suicide. There are kids with mental health issues at both. It’s important to differentiate between the issues of the kid and the issues of the school.

My DC went to Whitman and was one of those for whom it was a great fit and not high stress, despite taking a lot of AP classes. I’m sure he would have done fine at WJ too.

OP you may want to talk to the guidance counselors at each school to get a sense of the fit for your child’s particular mental health challenges. I’m sure they’ve seen similar kids before and can provide some perspective.

The counselors at those schools literally do not give a shit. They are about presenting a semblance only of "care". They process grades, they send transcripts, they field questions that they can rarely answer.

100% this

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here- I was specifically looking for mental health issues at WJ if they are similar to Whitman? None of these responses have been helpful. I know the test scores and not really care about the differences in them in regards to test scores.

You should have drawn an inference from the PP at WJ who suggested WJ kids need to take 12-14 AP courses to attend a good university.

And you think somehow they can take fewer AP courses at Whitman and sail right into Harvard? What a stupid inference that would be. WJ kids are competitive with Whitman kids for top colleges -- and I assume you understand that college admissions overall are extraordinarily competitive these days.

I don’t think that was their point. Pp was suggesting WJ is similarly cut throat if that’s the norm. That said, I have a good student at WJ who is on track for about 8 APs. I wouldn’t say 12-14 is the norm, unless a contender for Ivys.

I agree and I have kids at WJ. 12-14 is not the norm.

+1. It’s not necessary to have 12-14 APs. That’s insane actually.

It depends what you mean by ¨norm¨ The Apex (signature academic) program requires 9 AP classes as the minimum. [Program changed for class of 24 and on for those who had kids in the old program]

This is helpful information as I have younger kids who might be interested in APEX. Are you saying that the old minimum was 9 or the "new" minimum is 9?

Also, as someone with older kids who already graduated, there's a big difference between 9 APs and 12-14 APs.

The current APEX minimum is 9, and they have de-emphazised the final senior project and AP Capstone class (although it is still available). There are core classes plus a subject matter pathway, must take 9 AP classes and have 6 exams with a 3 or better. That said, my kid just finished 9th today and could easily have 12 by Sr year. There are a lot of choices, but this year my student has thrived in the AP and APEX classes and has little interest in taking the regular honors classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here- I was specifically looking for mental health issues at WJ if they are similar to Whitman? None of these responses have been helpful. I know the test scores and not really care about the differences in them in regards to test scores.

You're not smart enough to read between the lines. The highest achieving school, on paper, in terms of grades - Whitman - probably has the biggest stressors, most suicides / accidental overdoses and outsourcing for therapists.

Do you have data to support that? Google WJ and suicide. There are kids with mental health issues at both. It’s important to differentiate between the issues of the kid and the issues of the school.

My DC went to Whitman and was one of those for whom it was a great fit and not high stress, despite taking a lot of AP classes. I’m sure he would have done fine at WJ too.

OP you may want to talk to the guidance counselors at each school to get a sense of the fit for your child’s particular mental health challenges. I’m sure they’ve seen similar kids before and can provide some perspective.

The counselors at those schools literally do not give a shit. They are about presenting a semblance only of "care". They process grades, they send transcripts, they field questions that they can rarely answer.

Not true. I am still in touch with my children's counselor (WJ), even though they are not there any longer. She cared, and still cares. When they come home from college, and visited the school, she was one they went to visit

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would check the school profiles. There's a huge difference between the two schools if you want your kid to go to college.

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04427.pdf

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04424.pdf

WJ -
% of Students Meeting University System of Maryland Entrance Requirements = 67.1%
School average SAT: 1234
% of Graduates Scoring 3 or Higher on AP Test or Scoring 4 or Higher on IB Test: 70.8

Whitman -
% of Students Meeting University System of Maryland Entrance Requirements = 81.4%
School average SAT: 1339
% of Graduates Scoring 3 or Higher on AP Test or Scoring 4 or Higher on IB Test: 84.0

I prefer to use the data the county released by high school sorted by demographic cohort. This makes it easier to factor in SES differences and get a sense of how these schools really stack up.

For the largest cohort common to these two schools, Whitman has an average of 1299 vs WJ which had 1275. Basically, both are fine schools and it's just a matter of splitting hairs.

https://ww2.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/sharedaccountability/reports/2017/1771102HS%20Princ_SAT%20Partic_Perf%20Class%20of%202017.pdf

You're quoting only White student scores!?!? OMG. Take off the hood. You need to quote ALL student scores, you racist b!!!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would check the school profiles. There's a huge difference between the two schools if you want your kid to go to college.

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04427.pdf

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/regulatoryaccountability/glance/currentyear/schools/04424.pdf

WJ -
% of Students Meeting University System of Maryland Entrance Requirements = 67.1%
School average SAT: 1234
% of Graduates Scoring 3 or Higher on AP Test or Scoring 4 or Higher on IB Test: 70.8

Whitman -
% of Students Meeting University System of Maryland Entrance Requirements = 81.4%
School average SAT: 1339
% of Graduates Scoring 3 or Higher on AP Test or Scoring 4 or Higher on IB Test: 84.0

I prefer to use the data the county released by high school sorted by demographic cohort. This makes it easier to factor in SES differences and get a sense of how these schools really stack up.

For the largest cohort common to these two schools, Whitman has an average of 1299 vs WJ which had 1275. Basically, both are fine schools and it's just a matter of splitting hairs.

https://ww2.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/sharedaccountability/reports/2017/1771102HS%20Princ_SAT%20Partic_Perf%20Class%20of%202017.pdf

You're quoting only White student scores!?!? OMG. Take off the hood. You need to quote ALL student scores, you racist b!!!!

The poster clearly stated they were comparing the largest common cohort to factor for demographic differences and get a head to head comparison.