Resignation, Impeachment, or Mortality?

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10/15/2019 17:31

Subject: Resignation, Impeachment, or Mortality?

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Anonymous wrote:How about using the election process?

You assume the election process isn't already rigged. The senators certainly seem to be unconcerned.

And there is a very good reason that the Constitution has several mechanisms for removing those who have been elected.

Several?? Try one which is a vote of a 2/3 majority on the Senate. Most people in America including myself support an impeachment vote. We should have an impeachment hearing. Why not? It has been called for since day one. Get on with one it already. If Trump is guilty of more than just simply what was on the transcript of a phone call then he should be removed if it meets the approval of 2/3 of the Senate. Right now, there is not enough yet to convince the super majority and remove from office. There are many reasons not to support Trump. I feel a vote or election would be the proper way to decide. Impeaching and failing to convict in the senate would not be good for any of us and would tip the scales toward his re-election.

“Guilty of more than just simply what was on the transcript of the call?” When did that become the new goalpost? Do you think what we saw on the transcript was ok?

If the Democrats come to electoral harm for pursuing impeachment, so be it. It is the only possible response in a country of laws.

I actually would like to see Trump impeached. However, what is the basis of this impeachment? We keep waiting for a "smoking gun" a "whistleblower" it does not matter what you or I or the people on this board think. What will convince the Senate? I do not like the idea of impeachment AND removal being used as a tool to remove a very bad president. That is what the election process is for. I do not think he will be removed from office and I think it will help him in the election. NOT A GOOD outcome.

The House will present the basis of this impeachment - the whistleblower at this point is almost moot. It will likely have something to do with encouraging a foreign power to meddle in domestic US politics. And will likely have something to do with obstruction of justice. Once they have gathered the data for their case, they will take a vote to impeach. If the vote is successful, the House will make a case to the Senate where each Senator will have to go on record and cast a vote on whether the evidence is strong enough for them as a body to remove the President from office. However they chose to vote, the Senators will be accountable to their constituents in the next election cycle (like their House brethren). Neither you nor I know what the penalty for either those that vote for or against impeachment (in the House) and for or against removal (in the Senate) will be. But I stand by my earlier claim that the democratic House has to stand on principle and impeach based on what is in the open domain (and undisputed by the Administration) regardless of the political fall out.

Your summary is accurate and well thought out. I agree this looks to be the likely scenario. The issue I see is that even in your own words the basis of impeachment will only likely have something to do with obstruction and have something to do with encouraging a foreign power. These are not solid definitions of impeachable offenses in my opinion. This was also true in the Clinton impeachment. A senator can likely opine about the case was simply not strong enough. The content of the transcript of the phone call in and of itself is not enough to ensure a conviction in the Senate it just isn't. If it were, there would be an impeachment vote tomorrow. It is reprehensible foreign policy but not unique and not enough to remove from office. I am not a democrat and I am likely to vote for a third party candidate as I would never accept a party label, but I would encourage the opposition to Trump to simply build the case against him at the ballot box. Elections are another way to remove a bad actor from office. Impeachment, which I think will fail in the Senate, makes the majority (those not on the far right or left) feel disenfranchised as if their vote could be overturned in the future. Accuse me of bias if you think you must, this is simply they way I see it. I do think Trump will be impeached in the house and not removed by the Senate. There are so many ways to campaign against him. This is politically not the best path forward. How does it help if he is not removed from office?

Because the House has the power of the subpoena to get evidence and review it in public. It will likely continue to expose worse and worse news for Trump. It will influence HOW voters view DJT in the 2020 election, especially if Democrats find more foreign election influence.

The process of impeachment confers great power to those conducting the proceedings. Democrats would be foolish not to utilize it, even if it means a corrupt and degenerate Senate does not convict a law breaking POTUS. Let them all face the wrath of the voters.