Gaza War, Part 3

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Again - NO ONE IS PRO-HAMAS. Stop using that strawman to shut down discussion.

If you're making demands of Israel that you don't make of Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

BS. I hold Israel to a higher standard than terrorists; we all should. And again, Israel has failed to make the distinction between Palestinians and Hamas. Kind of ironic that people scream about double standards while engaging in the same behavior.

How easy is it to make that distinction, actually? Returned hostages have said they were held in apartments with families. One of the ordinary Palestinians holding Jewish hostages in his apartment with his family taught at a UNRWA school. One of the Gaza hospital chiefs was himself a Hamas officer. The sole adult male hostage released said he was returned by ordinary Palestinians to Hamas after he managed to escape captivity. And who were those throngs of ordinary Gazans beating the hostages when they were first abducted after the October 7th massacre? And the Gazan workers who provided intelligence support to Hamas when they planned their attacks on the Israeli border communities?

We want to believe there are ordinary Palestinians who don't provide practical support to Hamas and are merely forced to serve as their human shields at massive personal cost. But... where is the evidence that they don't support Hamas? Because they sure seem to.

Got it. So "kill them all, let God sort it out" is the justification?

No... Comrade? It would be better to deradicalize them, but that won't be possible until Hamas is defeated.

The many useful Marxist idiots among our colleagues, friends, and neighbors here would do well to see this reality more clearly, because they are playing right into the hands of, not only Hamas, but their backers Iran and Russia.

And in refusing to acknowledge that killing indiscriminately simply creates more terrorists, Israel is also playing into Hamas' hands. And let's not forget that the Israeli right wing (looking at you, Netanyahu) spents decades and millions of dollars propping up Hamas so they wouldn't have to deal with the Palestinian Authority's demands for a two-state solution. How'd that work out?

Ok, Comrade. Your proteges' policy of Intifada and embrace of terrorist violence created Bibi and strengthened Israel's right wing. How did that work out for any of us?

Whose policy of intifada and embrace of terrorist violence? WTH are you talking about? Are you seriously implying that attempts to bring the parties to the negotiation table as equals is somehow analogous to supporting terrorism?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The level of antisemitism is astounding here.
I am sure someone will soon post how Jews wrote how they would overtake the world in a Jewish Prague cemetery. They did not; haters wrote them, and people still believed them.
Is Israel overly aggressive now? Maybe. Are Palestinians Hamas fanatics? Maybe.
Yet, many of you sound like total racist trash, regardless of whom you are supporting, Israel or Hamas.

No one supports Hamas!!!!

You can’t even admit Israel has gone WAY PAST any norms and is just bombing it all and killing everyone.

A Now we’re at organ theft. Mutilated corpses. Decayed infants. They are never coming back from this on the world stage

This is an outright lie. It is a disgusting and disgraceful lie. Enough. You can be anti-Israel. Fine, get it. But to pass on these barbaric lies about organ theft. Good Lord - you’re taking a page right out of Blood Libel, FFS.

Decayed infants story is true.

Organ theft has happened in the past. Read the newsweek article cited earlier.

Mutilated corpses and organ theft was accused yesterday in a letter and was reported and the allegations were reported by the Washington Post. There was no comment from Israel at the time the Post published the story. You cannot say it is an outright lie.

PP from above has a good point. These were 80 bodies returned by Israel. What happened to these 80 people while under Israeli custody?

What’s happened to the 107 hostages, including young people and infants, that are still being kept by Hamas and Islamic Jihad?

Nice deflection. This has nothing to do with organ theft. If you listen to the rabid, dehumanizing, anti-Palestinian racism coming from Israel’s leaders, you’ll understand why and how organ theft has happened. If you can steal Palestinian land and lives, why would you not steal Palestinian organs?

Your whole argument is that Jews are just so terribly inherently evil, of course they will steal organs. If you think a person or group is the definition of evil, where evil literally flows from, everything that is bad on earth flows from them.

Where do I say “Jews”? I say “Israel’s leaders.” Your claim is absurd. Please stop throwing up melodramatic smoke screens about Jew hatred in a blatant effort to hide Israel’s repugnant behavior. Israel has admitted to organ theft, especially skin theft, in the past, and it is at least possible it is still doing the same thing. This is not conduct an ethical person would want to support.

This is gross distortion of reports - unsubstantiated and denied by Israel - from almost a decade ago. There is no evidence this is happening now. This rumor has been fueled by unsubstantiated claims from a Hamas-aligned organization.

An ethical person isn’t spreading blood libel-type rumors to fuel hatred against Jews. Enough.

But the former head of the Abu Kabir forensic institute near Tel Aviv, Dr. Yehuda Hiss, acknowledged the practice, so your accusation that people are "spreading blood libel-type rumors to fuel hatred against Jews" is simply histrionic and illogical. Instead of throwing up a smoke screen in an attempt to silence concerns, why not call for an independent investigation to prove or disprove the claims?

Here is some further information:

"Israel has admitted pathologists harvested organs from dead Palestinians, and others, without the consent of their families – a practice it said ended in the 1990s – it emerged at the weekend."
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2009/dec/21/israeli-pathologists-harvested-organs

From the same report:

"Channel 2 TV reported that in the 1990s, specialists at Abu Kabir harvested skin, corneas, heart valves and bones from the bodies of Israeli soldiers, Israeli citizens, Palestinians and foreign workers, often without permission from relatives.

The Israeli military confirmed to the programme that the practice took place, but added: "This activity ended a decade ago and does not happen any longer."

Hiss said: "We started to harvest corneas ... whatever was done was highly informal. No permission was asked from the family.""

Jumping to the present ... Yesterday, Israel handed over about 80 corpses to officials in the Gaza Strip without any explanation of where they came from. Gaza authorities are saying there are signs of organ theft and have called for an independent international investigation. They are also saying there have been previous incidents since October 7 of corpses missing organs and exhumed corpses. They say Israelis dug up a mass grave and confiscated bodies and that the IDF confiscated dozens of corpses from two hospitals in Gaza.

Given Israel's history and the current information, the concerns are very reasonable. I'm sure we'd all welcome an independent investigation to clear up the matter one way or the other.

Can you tell me which organ can be harvested and TRANSPLANTED from a decaying body?

You can't reason with a conspiracy theorist.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The number of people here who have ignored atrocities in Africa, Central America, Ukraine, etc. but are breathlessly horrified that some bodies in a war zone in Israel decayed is not zero.

I'm glad you finally learned war is a horrible, horrible thing, Virginia. I wonder when you will learn that it is also a horrible, horrible thing to not know if there are bombs in a parked car near your elementary school or temple, or if that neighbor of yours for thirty years secretly wants you dead. Terrorist acts have consequences. And you, sitting in a Bethesda parking lot in your Saudi-powered SUV while the kids are at Mathnesium, have the luxury of no consequences.

So we shouldn't care when our closest "ally" is murdering women and children with our tax dollars?

You don't need to pay taxes, you can choose not to work. Or you can go back to the country that you care about so much. The U.S. doesn't need to change what it is doing at your command.

By the way, Israel is not our closest ally. They actually are not officially an ally. Ally has a defined meaning.

Oh gosh I hate to tell you that’s actually the whole point of elections.

If it takes Joe Biden losing an election to make him understand that young Americans do not want children killed in our name, so be it.

No one but Palestinians and Muslims are voting based on this issue. They do not care if a Republican win harms ordinary Americans day to day, all that matters is that BIden knows he didn't do what they wanted for their interest "back home". If your plan is to bring over all of your relatives from your home countries and have a lot of babies to form a group big enough to swing elections, go for it I guess, nothing we can do about it, America's open borders have consequences.

I am neither Palestinian nor Muslim but yes I will absolutely vote against the U.S.
enabling the killing of children. I am hoping our lawmakers change course before I am forced to vote against Biden but I will absolutely do so. I cannot look at my (half Jewish) child and tell her that I am just fine with children her age being killed every day by bombs the U.S. supplies. And yes I understand that means I may have to explain to her that is why we always have up to date passports in case we need to seek healthcare in Canada.

Are you planning on driving her to Canada in your gasoline-powered car? Are the kids in Yemen who are also killed by bombs the US supplies in a different tranche for you?

Not voting for Biden "because Israel" is such an absurd idea I have to think you're not arguing as a real person. Is this your new Overton window, suggesting that left wingers don't vote democrat as "protest?"

It's absurd.

As it happens I sent quite a lot of mail to my elected officials about Yemen in the 2017-19 years. Thank you for asking. And I also didn’t support U.S. sales of weapons to Saudi, and didn’t vote for Trump.

Biden has a year before the election to listen to what the voters he needs to win are saying.

Thanks for asking though. You’ve identified my very strict foreign policy criteria of “bombing and starving children is bad”. I can’t believe that constitutes a bleeding heart position these days.

If you cared about babies you would ask Hamas to surrender. Will you be ok with Israel existing as an independent state? No, you won't. That is why you are so so concerned about U.S. funding, you think Israel would not exist w/o the funding. If only that money would go away your dream would come true!

Who would you like me to ask? What is their mailing address? Do I need an international stamp? Should I specify in my note that I believe they need to surrender to the ICC so there can be a public and international accounting for their crimes to counter the astonishing amount of mis and disinformation? You let me know. I’ll get on it.

In the meantime while you’re getting me that information I’ll work on influence the people facilitating the killing of children on the other side of the divide and doing so with my tax dollars. Israel will be just fine and continue to exist without U.S. money.

Go to any current US protest and ask them if Hamas should surrender

If you think someone is present at one of those protests who has the influence with Hamas leadership to demand the release of the hostages you should be calling the FBI not posting on DCUM.

DP. Nice deflection.

Fact is, many do support Hamas. Check the polls.

Ok then answer the prior unanswered question. Who is it you want us to “call on” to release hostages? Who do you want us to call? Who do you want us to write? Given there is no support to Hamas from the U.S. where do you get the delusion that Hamas cares in the slightest about U.S. taxpayer opinion?

You could just stop marching, protesting and writing in support of Hamas.

Easy.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Jeff should be embarrassed that he has allowed this thread to go on. He gave a platform to some real Quanon types to propagate conspiracies and hate. I hope some anti hate organizations take a look here.

There have been no conspiracies. There has only been hatred for the callous disregard for human life in the IDF’s vicious, premeditated execution of this war and past conflicts in the region (and the acts of terrorism by Hamas, by various Palestinian leadership groups, by the Israel government, by Israeli settlers, etc.).

But what you really want is censorship to help conceal the sins of Israel. You desperately want to make everyone go back to the days when the Israeli propaganda machine set the narrative and dictated to Americans what to think about the regional conflict.

Racist Islamophobes like you are in panic mode right now, desperate to stifle discussion that casts a horrifying light on your lack of humanity and desperate to restore your own image as the victim. It must be deeply unsettling. But attempting to intimidate critical voices by suggesting that they will be cancelled by the professionalized “anti-hate” industry is pathetic and a vibrant signal that you are, in fact, losing your shit over the narrative escaping your grasp.

Case in point. You are posting on anonymous board because you know that you are spreading hate and misinformation. I dare you to post this on Linkedin under your actual name.

Where’s the hate and disinformation? Grow a set and try to list the “lies” with a straight face.

There’s not a single thing in those three paragraphs that isn’t true. You are just freaking out because you cannot intimidate people into shutting TF up and enabling Israel to continue what it’s been doing for 76 years.

I don’t need to intimidate you. You are shaking in your boots already. Posting hateful comments anonymously because you know that if anyone finds out how vile you are, you will be cancelled. Don’t worry, sweetheart, people suspect it already.

Oh, so you fold that quickly? Not even a single pathetic attempt to point something out as a “lie” or “hateful” or “vile”. Just blanket, opaque accusations to try to shut down the discussion as fast as possible? Figures.

I guess I suspected nothing less at this point - just smoke, no fire.

[Anonymous]

I cannot believe I am actually writing this but skin has to be harvested within 6 hours of death and preserved for future transplantation. Solid organs need to be harvested within 60 minutes of circulation cessation. I am shocked but what I read here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Again - NO ONE IS PRO-HAMAS. Stop using that strawman to shut down discussion.

If you're making demands of Israel that you don't make of Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

Hamas isn't directly leeching off my tax dollars the way Israel is. If we're forced to prop up Israel financially, we have some say in how it spends our money and how it behaves.

Hamas indirectly leeches off our tax dollars because Netanyahu has been propping it up for years.

This means our tax dollars are used to support two terrorist organizations -- Israel AND Hamas.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It boils down to posters asking me to sacrifice democracy here in the United State and all that we’ve fought for including women’s rights, the right to marry who we choose, and the strength of trusted institutions, for what exactly?
Trump will pour more money into Israel. The republicans have been clear and stead fast in their support of Netanyahu.
So …they are asking us to give up our democracy for… nothing.
Which make me think they don’t actually understand or support democracy.

This

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The number of people here who have ignored atrocities in Africa, Central America, Ukraine, etc. but are breathlessly horrified that some bodies in a war zone in Israel decayed is not zero.

I'm glad you finally learned war is a horrible, horrible thing, Virginia. I wonder when you will learn that it is also a horrible, horrible thing to not know if there are bombs in a parked car near your elementary school or temple, or if that neighbor of yours for thirty years secretly wants you dead. Terrorist acts have consequences. And you, sitting in a Bethesda parking lot in your Saudi-powered SUV while the kids are at Mathnesium, have the luxury of no consequences.

So we shouldn't care when our closest "ally" is murdering women and children with our tax dollars?

You don't need to pay taxes, you can choose not to work. Or you can go back to the country that you care about so much. The U.S. doesn't need to change what it is doing at your command.

By the way, Israel is not our closest ally. They actually are not officially an ally. Ally has a defined meaning.

Oh gosh I hate to tell you that’s actually the whole point of elections.

If it takes Joe Biden losing an election to make him understand that young Americans do not want children killed in our name, so be it.

No one but Palestinians and Muslims are voting based on this issue. They do not care if a Republican win harms ordinary Americans day to day, all that matters is that BIden knows he didn't do what they wanted for their interest "back home". If your plan is to bring over all of your relatives from your home countries and have a lot of babies to form a group big enough to swing elections, go for it I guess, nothing we can do about it, America's open borders have consequences.

I am neither Palestinian nor Muslim but yes I will absolutely vote against the U.S.
enabling the killing of children. I am hoping our lawmakers change course before I am forced to vote against Biden but I will absolutely do so. I cannot look at my (half Jewish) child and tell her that I am just fine with children her age being killed every day by bombs the U.S. supplies. And yes I understand that means I may have to explain to her that is why we always have up to date passports in case we need to seek healthcare in Canada.

Are you planning on driving her to Canada in your gasoline-powered car? Are the kids in Yemen who are also killed by bombs the US supplies in a different tranche for you?

Not voting for Biden "because Israel" is such an absurd idea I have to think you're not arguing as a real person. Is this your new Overton window, suggesting that left wingers don't vote democrat as "protest?"

It's absurd.

As it happens I sent quite a lot of mail to my elected officials about Yemen in the 2017-19 years. Thank you for asking. And I also didn’t support U.S. sales of weapons to Saudi, and didn’t vote for Trump.

Biden has a year before the election to listen to what the voters he needs to win are saying.

Thanks for asking though. You’ve identified my very strict foreign policy criteria of “bombing and starving children is bad”. I can’t believe that constitutes a bleeding heart position these days.

If you cared about babies you would ask Hamas to surrender. Will you be ok with Israel existing as an independent state? No, you won't. That is why you are so so concerned about U.S. funding, you think Israel would not exist w/o the funding. If only that money would go away your dream would come true!

Who would you like me to ask? What is their mailing address? Do I need an international stamp? Should I specify in my note that I believe they need to surrender to the ICC so there can be a public and international accounting for their crimes to counter the astonishing amount of mis and disinformation? You let me know. I’ll get on it.

In the meantime while you’re getting me that information I’ll work on influence the people facilitating the killing of children on the other side of the divide and doing so with my tax dollars. Israel will be just fine and continue to exist without U.S. money.

Go to any current US protest and ask them if Hamas should surrender

If you think someone is present at one of those protests who has the influence with Hamas leadership to demand the release of the hostages you should be calling the FBI not posting on DCUM.

DP. Nice deflection.

Fact is, many do support Hamas. Check the polls.

Ok then answer the prior unanswered question. Who is it you want us to “call on” to release hostages? Who do you want us to call? Who do you want us to write? Given there is no support to Hamas from the U.S. where do you get the delusion that Hamas cares in the slightest about U.S. taxpayer opinion?

You could just stop marching, protesting and writing in support of Hamas.

Easy.

That isn’t “calling on” anyone. I thought you wanted us to ask Hamas to release the hostages a few pages ago?

It sounds like what you are actually saying is “shut up about Israel’s conduct or we’ll keep saying you support Hamas”

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Again - NO ONE IS PRO-HAMAS. Stop using that strawman to shut down discussion.

If you're making demands of Israel that you don't make of Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

BS. I hold Israel to a higher standard than terrorists; we all should. And again, Israel has failed to make the distinction between Palestinians and Hamas. Kind of ironic that people scream about double standards while engaging in the same behavior.

How easy is it to make that distinction, actually? Returned hostages have said they were held in apartments with families. One of the ordinary Palestinians holding Jewish hostages in his apartment with his family taught at a UNRWA school. One of the Gaza hospital chiefs was himself a Hamas officer. The sole adult male hostage released said he was returned by ordinary Palestinians to Hamas after he managed to escape captivity. And who were those throngs of ordinary Gazans beating the hostages when they were first abducted after the October 7th massacre? And the Gazan workers who provided intelligence support to Hamas when they planned their attacks on the Israeli border communities?

We want to believe there are ordinary Palestinians who don't provide practical support to Hamas and are merely forced to serve as their human shields at massive personal cost. But... where is the evidence that they don't support Hamas? Because they sure seem to.

Got it. So "kill them all, let God sort it out" is the justification?

No... Comrade? It would be better to deradicalize them, but that won't be possible until Hamas is defeated.

The many useful Marxist idiots among our colleagues, friends, and neighbors here would do well to see this reality more clearly, because they are playing right into the hands of, not only Hamas, but their backers Iran and Russia.

And in refusing to acknowledge that killing indiscriminately simply creates more terrorists, Israel is also playing into Hamas' hands. And let's not forget that the Israeli right wing (looking at you, Netanyahu) spents decades and millions of dollars propping up Hamas so they wouldn't have to deal with the Palestinian Authority's demands for a two-state solution. How'd that work out?

Ok, Comrade. Your proteges' policy of Intifada and embrace of terrorist violence created Bibi and strengthened Israel's right wing. How did that work out for any of us?

Whose policy of intifada and embrace of terrorist violence? WTH are you talking about? Are you seriously implying that attempts to bring the parties to the negotiation table as equals is somehow analogous to supporting terrorism?

Comrade, are you unaware of Palestinians' embrace of terrorist violence over the previous decades? Really? You know nothing about all the hijackings of flights, suicide bombings in public places, mass shootings, knife attacks, car rammings, and rockets fired into Israel? And furthermore, you deny that having to live with this level of violence might cause some people to embrace a wannabe strongman type who says he will keep them safe even if the stuff he says doesn't sound that democratic? Okaaaaay...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I cannot believe I am actually writing this but skin has to be harvested within 6 hours of death and preserved for future transplantation. Solid organs need to be harvested within 60 minutes of circulation cessation. I am shocked but what I read here.

The brainwashing and conspiracy theories are pretty shocking.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The number of people here who have ignored atrocities in Africa, Central America, Ukraine, etc. but are breathlessly horrified that some bodies in a war zone in Israel decayed is not zero.

I'm glad you finally learned war is a horrible, horrible thing, Virginia. I wonder when you will learn that it is also a horrible, horrible thing to not know if there are bombs in a parked car near your elementary school or temple, or if that neighbor of yours for thirty years secretly wants you dead. Terrorist acts have consequences. And you, sitting in a Bethesda parking lot in your Saudi-powered SUV while the kids are at Mathnesium, have the luxury of no consequences.

So we shouldn't care when our closest "ally" is murdering women and children with our tax dollars?

You don't need to pay taxes, you can choose not to work. Or you can go back to the country that you care about so much. The U.S. doesn't need to change what it is doing at your command.

By the way, Israel is not our closest ally. They actually are not officially an ally. Ally has a defined meaning.

Oh gosh I hate to tell you that’s actually the whole point of elections.

If it takes Joe Biden losing an election to make him understand that young Americans do not want children killed in our name, so be it.

No one but Palestinians and Muslims are voting based on this issue. They do not care if a Republican win harms ordinary Americans day to day, all that matters is that BIden knows he didn't do what they wanted for their interest "back home". If your plan is to bring over all of your relatives from your home countries and have a lot of babies to form a group big enough to swing elections, go for it I guess, nothing we can do about it, America's open borders have consequences.

I am neither Palestinian nor Muslim but yes I will absolutely vote against the U.S.
enabling the killing of children. I am hoping our lawmakers change course before I am forced to vote against Biden but I will absolutely do so. I cannot look at my (half Jewish) child and tell her that I am just fine with children her age being killed every day by bombs the U.S. supplies. And yes I understand that means I may have to explain to her that is why we always have up to date passports in case we need to seek healthcare in Canada.

Are you planning on driving her to Canada in your gasoline-powered car? Are the kids in Yemen who are also killed by bombs the US supplies in a different tranche for you?

Not voting for Biden "because Israel" is such an absurd idea I have to think you're not arguing as a real person. Is this your new Overton window, suggesting that left wingers don't vote democrat as "protest?"

It's absurd.

As it happens I sent quite a lot of mail to my elected officials about Yemen in the 2017-19 years. Thank you for asking. And I also didn’t support U.S. sales of weapons to Saudi, and didn’t vote for Trump.

Biden has a year before the election to listen to what the voters he needs to win are saying.

Thanks for asking though. You’ve identified my very strict foreign policy criteria of “bombing and starving children is bad”. I can’t believe that constitutes a bleeding heart position these days.

If you cared about babies you would ask Hamas to surrender. Will you be ok with Israel existing as an independent state? No, you won't. That is why you are so so concerned about U.S. funding, you think Israel would not exist w/o the funding. If only that money would go away your dream would come true!

Who would you like me to ask? What is their mailing address? Do I need an international stamp? Should I specify in my note that I believe they need to surrender to the ICC so there can be a public and international accounting for their crimes to counter the astonishing amount of mis and disinformation? You let me know. I’ll get on it.

In the meantime while you’re getting me that information I’ll work on influence the people facilitating the killing of children on the other side of the divide and doing so with my tax dollars. Israel will be just fine and continue to exist without U.S. money.

Go to any current US protest and ask them if Hamas should surrender

If you think someone is present at one of those protests who has the influence with Hamas leadership to demand the release of the hostages you should be calling the FBI not posting on DCUM.

DP. Nice deflection.

Fact is, many do support Hamas. Check the polls.

Ok then answer the prior unanswered question. Who is it you want us to “call on” to release hostages? Who do you want us to call? Who do you want us to write? Given there is no support to Hamas from the U.S. where do you get the delusion that Hamas cares in the slightest about U.S. taxpayer opinion?

You could just stop marching, protesting and writing in support of Hamas.

Easy.

That isn’t “calling on” anyone. I thought you wanted us to ask Hamas to release the hostages a few pages ago?

It sounds like what you are actually saying is “shut up about Israel’s conduct or we’ll keep saying you support Hamas”

Exactly. Propagate lies to justify the sins of Israel, then when those lies lose steam or completely derail under the weight of facts, just resort to employing every dirty trick in the book to shut down the discussion. It’s tired. It’s really, really tired at this point.

[Anonymous]

To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The number of people here who have ignored atrocities in Africa, Central America, Ukraine, etc. but are breathlessly horrified that some bodies in a war zone in Israel decayed is not zero.

I'm glad you finally learned war is a horrible, horrible thing, Virginia. I wonder when you will learn that it is also a horrible, horrible thing to not know if there are bombs in a parked car near your elementary school or temple, or if that neighbor of yours for thirty years secretly wants you dead. Terrorist acts have consequences. And you, sitting in a Bethesda parking lot in your Saudi-powered SUV while the kids are at Mathnesium, have the luxury of no consequences.

So we shouldn't care when our closest "ally" is murdering women and children with our tax dollars?

You don't need to pay taxes, you can choose not to work. Or you can go back to the country that you care about so much. The U.S. doesn't need to change what it is doing at your command.

By the way, Israel is not our closest ally. They actually are not officially an ally. Ally has a defined meaning.

Oh gosh I hate to tell you that’s actually the whole point of elections.

If it takes Joe Biden losing an election to make him understand that young Americans do not want children killed in our name, so be it.

No one but Palestinians and Muslims are voting based on this issue. They do not care if a Republican win harms ordinary Americans day to day, all that matters is that BIden knows he didn't do what they wanted for their interest "back home". If your plan is to bring over all of your relatives from your home countries and have a lot of babies to form a group big enough to swing elections, go for it I guess, nothing we can do about it, America's open borders have consequences.

I am neither Palestinian nor Muslim but yes I will absolutely vote against the U.S.
enabling the killing of children. I am hoping our lawmakers change course before I am forced to vote against Biden but I will absolutely do so. I cannot look at my (half Jewish) child and tell her that I am just fine with children her age being killed every day by bombs the U.S. supplies. And yes I understand that means I may have to explain to her that is why we always have up to date passports in case we need to seek healthcare in Canada.

Are you planning on driving her to Canada in your gasoline-powered car? Are the kids in Yemen who are also killed by bombs the US supplies in a different tranche for you?

Not voting for Biden "because Israel" is such an absurd idea I have to think you're not arguing as a real person. Is this your new Overton window, suggesting that left wingers don't vote democrat as "protest?"

It's absurd.

As it happens I sent quite a lot of mail to my elected officials about Yemen in the 2017-19 years. Thank you for asking. And I also didn’t support U.S. sales of weapons to Saudi, and didn’t vote for Trump.

Biden has a year before the election to listen to what the voters he needs to win are saying.

Thanks for asking though. You’ve identified my very strict foreign policy criteria of “bombing and starving children is bad”. I can’t believe that constitutes a bleeding heart position these days.

If you cared about babies you would ask Hamas to surrender. Will you be ok with Israel existing as an independent state? No, you won't. That is why you are so so concerned about U.S. funding, you think Israel would not exist w/o the funding. If only that money would go away your dream would come true!

Who would you like me to ask? What is their mailing address? Do I need an international stamp? Should I specify in my note that I believe they need to surrender to the ICC so there can be a public and international accounting for their crimes to counter the astonishing amount of mis and disinformation? You let me know. I’ll get on it.

In the meantime while you’re getting me that information I’ll work on influence the people facilitating the killing of children on the other side of the divide and doing so with my tax dollars. Israel will be just fine and continue to exist without U.S. money.

Go to any current US protest and ask them if Hamas should surrender

If you think someone is present at one of those protests who has the influence with Hamas leadership to demand the release of the hostages you should be calling the FBI not posting on DCUM.

DP. Nice deflection.

Fact is, many do support Hamas. Check the polls.

Ok then answer the prior unanswered question. Who is it you want us to “call on” to release hostages? Who do you want us to call? Who do you want us to write? Given there is no support to Hamas from the U.S. where do you get the delusion that Hamas cares in the slightest about U.S. taxpayer opinion?

You could just stop marching, protesting and writing in support of Hamas.

Easy.

That isn’t “calling on” anyone. I thought you wanted us to ask Hamas to release the hostages a few pages ago?

It sounds like what you are actually saying is “shut up about Israel’s conduct or we’ll keep saying you support Hamas”

Exactly. Propagate lies to justify the sins of Israel, then when those lies lose steam or completely derail under the weight of facts, just resort to employing every dirty trick in the book to shut down the discussion. It’s tired. It’s really, really tired at this point.

This is the "I know you are but what am I" argument a lot of social media trolls use. Note how this poster attempted to "shut down the discussion."

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Again - NO ONE IS PRO-HAMAS. Stop using that strawman to shut down discussion.

If you're making demands of Israel that you don't make of Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

BS. I hold Israel to a higher standard than terrorists; we all should. And again, Israel has failed to make the distinction between Palestinians and Hamas. Kind of ironic that people scream about double standards while engaging in the same behavior.

How easy is it to make that distinction, actually? Returned hostages have said they were held in apartments with families. One of the ordinary Palestinians holding Jewish hostages in his apartment with his family taught at a UNRWA school. One of the Gaza hospital chiefs was himself a Hamas officer. The sole adult male hostage released said he was returned by ordinary Palestinians to Hamas after he managed to escape captivity. And who were those throngs of ordinary Gazans beating the hostages when they were first abducted after the October 7th massacre? And the Gazan workers who provided intelligence support to Hamas when they planned their attacks on the Israeli border communities?

We want to believe there are ordinary Palestinians who don't provide practical support to Hamas and are merely forced to serve as their human shields at massive personal cost. But... where is the evidence that they don't support Hamas? Because they sure seem to.

Got it. So "kill them all, let God sort it out" is the justification?

No... Comrade? It would be better to deradicalize them, but that won't be possible until Hamas is defeated.

The many useful Marxist idiots among our colleagues, friends, and neighbors here would do well to see this reality more clearly, because they are playing right into the hands of, not only Hamas, but their backers Iran and Russia.

And in refusing to acknowledge that killing indiscriminately simply creates more terrorists, Israel is also playing into Hamas' hands. And let's not forget that the Israeli right wing (looking at you, Netanyahu) spents decades and millions of dollars propping up Hamas so they wouldn't have to deal with the Palestinian Authority's demands for a two-state solution. How'd that work out?

Ok, Comrade. Your proteges' policy of Intifada and embrace of terrorist violence created Bibi and strengthened Israel's right wing. How did that work out for any of us?

Whose policy of intifada and embrace of terrorist violence? WTH are you talking about? Are you seriously implying that attempts to bring the parties to the negotiation table as equals is somehow analogous to supporting terrorism?

Comrade, are you unaware of Palestinians' embrace of terrorist violence over the previous decades? Really? You know nothing about all the hijackings of flights, suicide bombings in public places, mass shootings, knife attacks, car rammings, and rockets fired into Israel? And furthermore, you deny that having to live with this level of violence might cause some people to embrace a wannabe strongman type who says he will keep them safe even if the stuff he says doesn't sound that democratic? Okaaaaay...

Oh, you're talking about the Palestinians now. Yeah, not excusing them either.

The simple fact of the matter is that for the last 70 years we've seen both parties do everything to continue the cycle of violence and NOTHNG to negotiate a lasting peace. Hamas kills Jews, Israelis continue to gobble up more land in the West Bank, etc. etc. It's time for both sides to cut the crap. I hold both sides responsible. Nothing excuses 10/7, but then nothing excuses Israel's indiscriminate response either. Labeling people who want nothing more than peace as pro-Hamas or antisemitic is a cop-out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

What are you going on about? Are you just flooding this thread with vaguely anti-Israel nonsense to bury discussion about Hamas brutality and Palestinians' strategic embrace of terrorist violence?