Gaza War, Part 3

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

You forgot that all of those 100+ countries and their citizens must now also be branded as anti-semitic, too, since we’re being told (ordered?) to accept that opposition to the actions of the State of Israel is anti-semitic.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

What are you going on about? Are you just flooding this thread with vaguely anti-Israel nonsense to bury discussion about Hamas brutality and Palestinians' strategic embrace of terrorist violence?

The current discussion seems to be, any criticism of Israel’s conduct of the war, and the U.S.’ support thereof, is “pro-Hamas”.

So does that mean posters believe the vast majority of countries of the world are now pro-Hamas? Even the ones who supported Israel in October?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Again - NO ONE IS PRO-HAMAS. Stop using that strawman to shut down discussion.

If you're making demands of Israel that you don't make of Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

BS. I hold Israel to a higher standard than terrorists; we all should. And again, Israel has failed to make the distinction between Palestinians and Hamas. Kind of ironic that people scream about double standards while engaging in the same behavior.

How easy is it to make that distinction, actually? Returned hostages have said they were held in apartments with families. One of the ordinary Palestinians holding Jewish hostages in his apartment with his family taught at a UNRWA school. One of the Gaza hospital chiefs was himself a Hamas officer. The sole adult male hostage released said he was returned by ordinary Palestinians to Hamas after he managed to escape captivity. And who were those throngs of ordinary Gazans beating the hostages when they were first abducted after the October 7th massacre? And the Gazan workers who provided intelligence support to Hamas when they planned their attacks on the Israeli border communities?

We want to believe there are ordinary Palestinians who don't provide practical support to Hamas and are merely forced to serve as their human shields at massive personal cost. But... where is the evidence that they don't support Hamas? Because they sure seem to.

Got it. So "kill them all, let God sort it out" is the justification?

No... Comrade? It would be better to deradicalize them, but that won't be possible until Hamas is defeated.

The many useful Marxist idiots among our colleagues, friends, and neighbors here would do well to see this reality more clearly, because they are playing right into the hands of, not only Hamas, but their backers Iran and Russia.

And in refusing to acknowledge that killing indiscriminately simply creates more terrorists, Israel is also playing into Hamas' hands. And let's not forget that the Israeli right wing (looking at you, Netanyahu) spents decades and millions of dollars propping up Hamas so they wouldn't have to deal with the Palestinian Authority's demands for a two-state solution. How'd that work out?

Ok, Comrade. Your proteges' policy of Intifada and embrace of terrorist violence created Bibi and strengthened Israel's right wing. How did that work out for any of us?

Whose policy of intifada and embrace of terrorist violence? WTH are you talking about? Are you seriously implying that attempts to bring the parties to the negotiation table as equals is somehow analogous to supporting terrorism?

Comrade, are you unaware of Palestinians' embrace of terrorist violence over the previous decades? Really? You know nothing about all the hijackings of flights, suicide bombings in public places, mass shootings, knife attacks, car rammings, and rockets fired into Israel? And furthermore, you deny that having to live with this level of violence might cause some people to embrace a wannabe strongman type who says he will keep them safe even if the stuff he says doesn't sound that democratic? Okaaaaay...

Oh, you're talking about the Palestinians now. Yeah, not excusing them either.

The simple fact of the matter is that for the last 70 years we've seen both parties do everything to continue the cycle of violence and NOTHNG to negotiate a lasting peace. Hamas kills Jews, Israelis continue to gobble up more land in the West Bank, etc. etc. It's time for both sides to cut the crap. I hold both sides responsible. Nothing excuses 10/7, but then nothing excuses Israel's indiscriminate response either. Labeling people who want nothing more than peace as pro-Hamas or antisemitic is a cop-out.

So now you're claiming to be nothing more than a starry-eyed peacenik? OK, Comrade. So why do you imagine leaving terrorists in charge in Gaza will promote lasting peace?

Answer: you don't, because your side (Russia? Iran?) benefits from war.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

What are you going on about? Are you just flooding this thread with vaguely anti-Israel nonsense to bury discussion about Hamas brutality and Palestinians' strategic embrace of terrorist violence?

The current discussion seems to be, any criticism of Israel’s conduct of the war, and the U.S.’ support thereof, is “pro-Hamas”.

So does that mean posters believe the vast majority of countries of the world are now pro-Hamas? Even the ones who supported Israel in October?

If you aren't trying to defeat Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:The number of people here who have ignored atrocities in Africa, Central America, Ukraine, etc. but are breathlessly horrified that some bodies in a war zone in Israel decayed is not zero.

I'm glad you finally learned war is a horrible, horrible thing, Virginia. I wonder when you will learn that it is also a horrible, horrible thing to not know if there are bombs in a parked car near your elementary school or temple, or if that neighbor of yours for thirty years secretly wants you dead. Terrorist acts have consequences. And you, sitting in a Bethesda parking lot in your Saudi-powered SUV while the kids are at Mathnesium, have the luxury of no consequences.

So we shouldn't care when our closest "ally" is murdering women and children with our tax dollars?

You don't need to pay taxes, you can choose not to work. Or you can go back to the country that you care about so much. The U.S. doesn't need to change what it is doing at your command.

By the way, Israel is not our closest ally. They actually are not officially an ally. Ally has a defined meaning.

Oh gosh I hate to tell you that’s actually the whole point of elections.

If it takes Joe Biden losing an election to make him understand that young Americans do not want children killed in our name, so be it.

No one but Palestinians and Muslims are voting based on this issue. They do not care if a Republican win harms ordinary Americans day to day, all that matters is that BIden knows he didn't do what they wanted for their interest "back home". If your plan is to bring over all of your relatives from your home countries and have a lot of babies to form a group big enough to swing elections, go for it I guess, nothing we can do about it, America's open borders have consequences.

I am neither Palestinian nor Muslim but yes I will absolutely vote against the U.S.
enabling the killing of children. I am hoping our lawmakers change course before I am forced to vote against Biden but I will absolutely do so. I cannot look at my (half Jewish) child and tell her that I am just fine with children her age being killed every day by bombs the U.S. supplies. And yes I understand that means I may have to explain to her that is why we always have up to date passports in case we need to seek healthcare in Canada.

Are you planning on driving her to Canada in your gasoline-powered car? Are the kids in Yemen who are also killed by bombs the US supplies in a different tranche for you?

Not voting for Biden "because Israel" is such an absurd idea I have to think you're not arguing as a real person. Is this your new Overton window, suggesting that left wingers don't vote democrat as "protest?"

It's absurd.

As it happens I sent quite a lot of mail to my elected officials about Yemen in the 2017-19 years. Thank you for asking. And I also didn’t support U.S. sales of weapons to Saudi, and didn’t vote for Trump.

Biden has a year before the election to listen to what the voters he needs to win are saying.

Thanks for asking though. You’ve identified my very strict foreign policy criteria of “bombing and starving children is bad”. I can’t believe that constitutes a bleeding heart position these days.

If you cared about babies you would ask Hamas to surrender. Will you be ok with Israel existing as an independent state? No, you won't. That is why you are so so concerned about U.S. funding, you think Israel would not exist w/o the funding. If only that money would go away your dream would come true!

Who would you like me to ask? What is their mailing address? Do I need an international stamp? Should I specify in my note that I believe they need to surrender to the ICC so there can be a public and international accounting for their crimes to counter the astonishing amount of mis and disinformation? You let me know. I’ll get on it.

In the meantime while you’re getting me that information I’ll work on influence the people facilitating the killing of children on the other side of the divide and doing so with my tax dollars. Israel will be just fine and continue to exist without U.S. money.

Go to any current US protest and ask them if Hamas should surrender

If you think someone is present at one of those protests who has the influence with Hamas leadership to demand the release of the hostages you should be calling the FBI not posting on DCUM.

DP. Nice deflection.

Fact is, many do support Hamas. Check the polls.

Ok then answer the prior unanswered question. Who is it you want us to “call on” to release hostages? Who do you want us to call? Who do you want us to write? Given there is no support to Hamas from the U.S. where do you get the delusion that Hamas cares in the slightest about U.S. taxpayer opinion?

You could just stop marching, protesting and writing in support of Hamas.

Easy.

That isn’t “calling on” anyone. I thought you wanted us to ask Hamas to release the hostages a few pages ago?

It sounds like what you are actually saying is “shut up about Israel’s conduct or we’ll keep saying you support Hamas”

Exactly. Propagate lies to justify the sins of Israel, then when those lies lose steam or completely derail under the weight of facts, just resort to employing every dirty trick in the book to shut down the discussion. It’s tired. It’s really, really tired at this point.

This is the "I know you are but what am I" argument a lot of social media trolls use. Note how this poster attempted to "shut down the discussion."

Get this ^ guy a map. You are lost if you think this amateur hour spin is tacky enough to stick, amigo.

The only ppl trying to shut fish the discussion are those sucking at the teat of the status quo.

Israel’s interests first, last and everywhere in between, amirite?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

What are you going on about? Are you just flooding this thread with vaguely anti-Israel nonsense to bury discussion about Hamas brutality and Palestinians' strategic embrace of terrorist violence?

The current discussion seems to be, any criticism of Israel’s conduct of the war, and the U.S.’ support thereof, is “pro-Hamas”.

So does that mean posters believe the vast majority of countries of the world are now pro-Hamas? Even the ones who supported Israel in October?

If you aren't trying to defeat Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

Tell us how the U.S. and Israel undermined all the non-violent resistance by the Palestinian side.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

What are you going on about? Are you just flooding this thread with vaguely anti-Israel nonsense to bury discussion about Hamas brutality and Palestinians' strategic embrace of terrorist violence?

The current discussion seems to be, any criticism of Israel’s conduct of the war, and the U.S.’ support thereof, is “pro-Hamas”.

So does that mean posters believe the vast majority of countries of the world are now pro-Hamas? Even the ones who supported Israel in October?

If you aren't trying to defeat Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

…so you believe all but ten members of the UN are “supporting Hamas”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Again - NO ONE IS PRO-HAMAS. Stop using that strawman to shut down discussion.

If you're making demands of Israel that you don't make of Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

BS. I hold Israel to a higher standard than terrorists; we all should. And again, Israel has failed to make the distinction between Palestinians and Hamas. Kind of ironic that people scream about double standards while engaging in the same behavior.

How easy is it to make that distinction, actually? Returned hostages have said they were held in apartments with families. One of the ordinary Palestinians holding Jewish hostages in his apartment with his family taught at a UNRWA school. One of the Gaza hospital chiefs was himself a Hamas officer. The sole adult male hostage released said he was returned by ordinary Palestinians to Hamas after he managed to escape captivity. And who were those throngs of ordinary Gazans beating the hostages when they were first abducted after the October 7th massacre? And the Gazan workers who provided intelligence support to Hamas when they planned their attacks on the Israeli border communities?

We want to believe there are ordinary Palestinians who don't provide practical support to Hamas and are merely forced to serve as their human shields at massive personal cost. But... where is the evidence that they don't support Hamas? Because they sure seem to.

Got it. So "kill them all, let God sort it out" is the justification?

No... Comrade? It would be better to deradicalize them, but that won't be possible until Hamas is defeated.

The many useful Marxist idiots among our colleagues, friends, and neighbors here would do well to see this reality more clearly, because they are playing right into the hands of, not only Hamas, but their backers Iran and Russia.

And in refusing to acknowledge that killing indiscriminately simply creates more terrorists, Israel is also playing into Hamas' hands. And let's not forget that the Israeli right wing (looking at you, Netanyahu) spents decades and millions of dollars propping up Hamas so they wouldn't have to deal with the Palestinian Authority's demands for a two-state solution. How'd that work out?

Ok, Comrade. Your proteges' policy of Intifada and embrace of terrorist violence created Bibi and strengthened Israel's right wing. How did that work out for any of us?

Whose policy of intifada and embrace of terrorist violence? WTH are you talking about? Are you seriously implying that attempts to bring the parties to the negotiation table as equals is somehow analogous to supporting terrorism?

Comrade, are you unaware of Palestinians' embrace of terrorist violence over the previous decades? Really? You know nothing about all the hijackings of flights, suicide bombings in public places, mass shootings, knife attacks, car rammings, and rockets fired into Israel? And furthermore, you deny that having to live with this level of violence might cause some people to embrace a wannabe strongman type who says he will keep them safe even if the stuff he says doesn't sound that democratic? Okaaaaay...

Oh, you're talking about the Palestinians now. Yeah, not excusing them either.

The simple fact of the matter is that for the last 70 years we've seen both parties do everything to continue the cycle of violence and NOTHNG to negotiate a lasting peace. Hamas kills Jews, Israelis continue to gobble up more land in the West Bank, etc. etc. It's time for both sides to cut the crap. I hold both sides responsible. Nothing excuses 10/7, but then nothing excuses Israel's indiscriminate response either. Labeling people who want nothing more than peace as pro-Hamas or antisemitic is a cop-out.

So now you're claiming to be nothing more than a starry-eyed peacenik? OK, Comrade. So why do you imagine leaving terrorists in charge in Gaza will promote lasting peace?

Answer: you don't, because your side (Russia? Iran?) benefits from war.

Ask Netanyahu, who funneled money to Hamas so he wouldn't have to negotiate with the Palestinian Authority. That was a deliberate calculation on his part, and it came back to bite him. He's MASSIVELY unpoluar right now in Israel becaus of that (and other things, like ignoring intelligence reports) - are they antisemitic now too?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

What are you going on about? Are you just flooding this thread with vaguely anti-Israel nonsense to bury discussion about Hamas brutality and Palestinians' strategic embrace of terrorist violence?

The current discussion seems to be, any criticism of Israel’s conduct of the war, and the U.S.’ support thereof, is “pro-Hamas”.

So does that mean posters believe the vast majority of countries of the world are now pro-Hamas? Even the ones who supported Israel in October?

Yes, probably much of the global south is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

What are you going on about? Are you just flooding this thread with vaguely anti-Israel nonsense to bury discussion about Hamas brutality and Palestinians' strategic embrace of terrorist violence?

The current discussion seems to be, any criticism of Israel’s conduct of the war, and the U.S.’ support thereof, is “pro-Hamas”.

So does that mean posters believe the vast majority of countries of the world are now pro-Hamas? Even the ones who supported Israel in October?

If you aren't trying to defeat Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

…so you believe all but ten members of the UN are “supporting Hamas”.

yes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

why would it be impossible that they are not? The common narrative now is to support the poorly-treated brown people against their white oppressors/occupiers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

What are you going on about? Are you just flooding this thread with vaguely anti-Israel nonsense to bury discussion about Hamas brutality and Palestinians' strategic embrace of terrorist violence?

The current discussion seems to be, any criticism of Israel’s conduct of the war, and the U.S.’ support thereof, is “pro-Hamas”.

So does that mean posters believe the vast majority of countries of the world are now pro-Hamas? Even the ones who supported Israel in October?

If you aren't trying to defeat Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

…so you believe all but ten members of the UN are “supporting Hamas”.

yes.

Ok thank you for clarifying that position.

I understand your perspective somewhat better now.

[Anonymous]

When you want to erase a people, you destroy their libraries, their cemeteries, their cultural artifacts, the beautiful things they've built. Israel and Azerbaijan excel in this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Again - NO ONE IS PRO-HAMAS. Stop using that strawman to shut down discussion.

If you're making demands of Israel that you don't make of Hamas, you are supporting Hamas.

Hamas isn't directly leeching off my tax dollars the way Israel is. If we're forced to prop up Israel financially, we have some say in how it spends our money and how it behaves.

Hamas indirectly leeches off our tax dollars because Netanyahu has been propping it up for years.

This means our tax dollars are used to support two terrorist organizations -- Israel AND Hamas.

you care more about your tax dollars (or the long term goal of seeing Israel wither on the vine and die w/o U.S. support) than actually helping the people in Gaza--you focus on the former instead of calling for immediate solutions (Hamas surrendering) that would help the people in a flash of an eye.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To be super clear, the pro-Israel argument here is that all but ten members of the UN General Assembly— representing the overwhelming majority of the population of the world— are all pro-Hamas? Most of Europe, Japan, Australia…all pro-Hamas now?

https://time.com/6452308/us-votes-against-un-gaza-ceasefire-reactions/

why would it be impossible that they are not? The common narrative now is to support the poorly-treated brown people against their white oppressors/occupiers.

Impossible? No.

Incredibly implausible to the point of requiring a worldview in which Europe— notoriously anti-Muslim to the point of letting children drown in the Med rather than reach safety— suddenly supports
a terrorist group recognized as such by the EU. It’s just wildly illogical.

But, it does clarify the perspective of the poster who believes it to be true.

The posters who are advocating for a ceasefire/criticizing IDF conduct see themselves as punching up— Israel is well funded, incredibly well armed, etc.

But if you believe there is a literal worldwide pro-Hamas agenda than you also believe you are punching up in vociferously defending Israel.