Schools splitting from large ineffective school systems - could the 4 Ws split from MCPS?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ive said this here before but Ill say it again. I work in the county and the people at the tippy top are not secretive about their feelings about the W schools. The goal is to narrow the achievement gap, and focusing on enrichment or class size or resources or magnet access in the W schools is inconsistent with that goal. They view it as a moral imperative to level the playing field, and whether or not you agree, there are limited resources. So yes, the W schools are going to remain an afterthought and they're going to let parents do the enriching. Honestly, how could anyone look at the MCPS website and not see this mandate so clearly? It's been this way for YEARS. And by the way, they're also not sending the superstar principals the W schools way either. The good ones in the Ws tend to move up quickly. There are one or two exceptions, but at the high school level only. That's why you see a lot of teacher turnover in the W schools too--lack of good leadership.

It makes you wonder why people pay extra for the privilege of sending their kids to such under-resourced schools with second-rate staff, doesn't it?

It's a false narrative that people move to the Ws for schools. They move to the Ws because, generally speaking, they are the districts with easier commutes, safety (as compared to the eastern side of the county where commutes are similar), and proximity to amenities. That is primarily what drives the property value, not the schools. Poolesville has academic performance that's on par with the Ws, and the property value doesn't have any bump. Crown Farm is zoned for a district many people thing is bad and they're having no problem selling $1.5M homes right now. Dufief is zoned for Wootton, yet the outdated homes there can't sell for much.

This notion that there's some huge "W" premium on property values is a mostly a myth.

[Anonymous]

They do it for the peer group (educated families), and because they want to live close in, and because they CAN enrich, and perhaps because the system has been resting on its laurels for some time, and maybe because they rationalize, and for a lot of reasons. But that doesn't mean they're happy with the status quo.

[Anonymous]

They do it for the peer group (educated families), and because they want to live close in, and because they CAN enrich, and perhaps because the system has been resting on its laurels for some time, and maybe because they rationalize, and for a lot of reasons. But that doesn't mean they're happy with the status quo.

[Anonymous]

also people will keep buying in the W areas regardless, but maybe more will start sending to private school. plenty already do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:2017 MCPS annual report, includes test scores by grade level, by cohort (white, AA, Hispanic). Very easy to read power point. Nothing racist about it. Just the results.

http://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/annualreport/2017/

45% pass rate in parcc!?!?! More money ain’t going to fix that.

I think those black slides are for MAP, but they consistently show Hispanic scores, which are the lowest of any demographic, and 20-40 points behind Asian or White scores. And yes, looks like some of the MAP or assessments are 45%. Not sure where parcc is but I didn't click around much, interesting website and data though, too bad the reporters didn't dig in.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Honestly no one in the W schools cares about the DCC schools anymore than anyone in the DCC schools cares about the W schools. They do not interact or benefit each other. There is no programming or fluidity between the two.

Other than money, as a DCC resident what benefit do you derive from having the W schools as part of your school district?

Do you even know the $ value of how much the W schools are subsidizing your schools? It may not be as much as you think. Even though real estate value are extremely higher on the west, the volume is much lower. There is far more density in the other areas so you may not be losing the free money you think you are getting from them.

The high performance scores on the west side seem to only be giving you angst, guilt and insecurity.

Here at Whitman we know tons about our sister school, Wheaton HS. We help them fundraise, deploy capital and 10% of our donations to Whitman are carved out and sent to Wheaton.
Meanwhile, MCPS gives Wheaton more $$$ per student than at Whitman.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
It's a false narrative that people move to the Ws for schools. They move to the Ws because, generally speaking, they are the districts with easier commutes, safety (as compared to the eastern side of the county where commutes are similar), and proximity to amenities. That is primarily what drives the property value, not the schools. Poolesville has academic performance that's on par with the Ws, and the property value doesn't have any bump. Crown Farm is zoned for a district many people thing is bad and they're having no problem selling $1.5M homes right now. Dufief is zoned for Wootton, yet the outdated homes there can't sell for much.

This notion that there's some huge "W" premium on property values is a mostly a myth.

Define "much".

Also, safety, what? DTSS and Kensington are hotbeds of crime?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They do it for the peer group (educated families), and because they want to live close in, and because they CAN enrich, and perhaps because the system has been resting on its laurels for some time, and maybe because they rationalize, and for a lot of reasons. But that doesn't mean they're happy with the status quo.

They could have been unhappy with the status quo for cheaper, elsewhere in the county. Or even happy with the status quo for cheaper, elsewhere in the county!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ive said this here before but Ill say it again. I work in the county and the people at the tippy top are not secretive about their feelings about the W schools. The goal is to narrow the achievement gap, and focusing on enrichment or class size or resources or magnet access in the W schools is inconsistent with that goal. They view it as a moral imperative to level the playing field, and whether or not you agree, there are limited resources. So yes, the W schools are going to remain an afterthought and they're going to let parents do the enriching. Honestly, how could anyone look at the MCPS website and not see this mandate so clearly? It's been this way for YEARS. And by the way, they're also not sending the superstar principals the W schools way either. The good ones in the Ws tend to move up quickly. There are one or two exceptions, but at the high school level only. That's why you see a lot of teacher turnover in the W schools too--lack of good leadership.

It makes you wonder why people pay extra for the privilege of sending their kids to such under-resourced schools with second-rate staff, doesn't it?

because we like our 20 minute commutes to Arlington and downtown DC. plus we enrich our kids' curriculum. plus we both pre-common core C2.0 when there was ability tracking and more teacher curriculum discretion in ES and MS. now the teachers are hamstrung with the slow curriculum and constant practice computer testing. ES really only has three subjects nowadays - the parcc ones - math, reading, english.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:also people will keep buying in the W areas regardless, but maybe more will start sending to private school. plenty already do.

beats the traffic mess in Arlington/Fairfax/I-66 any weekday or weekend.
plus I cycle in a couple times a week on the crescent trail.


Agree with the PP's messaging summary on W schools the last 5 years:
* Bring back ability tracking and more flexible curriculum in ES and MS home schools
* Cut the standardize testing and practice time each quarter
* Cut the class sizes (<25)
* Build more capacity at the overcrowded schools (6 lunch periods from 10am to 2pm is asinine, as is not being able to walk through hallways or stairwells during period changes)
* Stop the teacher turnover, build a community better
* Cut the chromebook hours per day and week in ES. Unacceptable. Bring back class discussions led by a teacher.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ive said this here before but Ill say it again. I work in the county and the people at the tippy top are not secretive about their feelings about the W schools. The goal is to narrow the achievement gap, and focusing on enrichment or class size or resources or magnet access in the W schools is inconsistent with that goal. They view it as a moral imperative to level the playing field, and whether or not you agree, there are limited resources. So yes, the W schools are going to remain an afterthought and they're going to let parents do the enriching. Honestly, how could anyone look at the MCPS website and not see this mandate so clearly? It's been this way for YEARS. And by the way, they're also not sending the superstar principals the W schools way either. The good ones in the Ws tend to move up quickly. There are one or two exceptions, but at the high school level only. That's why you see a lot of teacher turnover in the W schools too--lack of good leadership.

It makes you wonder why people pay extra for the privilege of sending their kids to such under-resourced schools with second-rate staff, doesn't it?

because we like our 20 minute commutes to Arlington and downtown DC. plus we enrich our kids' curriculum. plus we both pre-common core C2.0 when there was ability tracking and more teacher curriculum discretion in ES and MS. now the teachers are hamstrung with the slow curriculum and constant practice computer testing. ES really only has three subjects nowadays - the parcc ones - math, reading, english.

Well, then, that's the trade-off. Convenient commutes with lousy "W" schools, or less convenient commutes with better non-"W" schools.

[Anonymous]

yes it seems the posters asking why people stay when they could live elsewhere for cheaper are missing the point. people choose places to live for reasons beyond schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ive said this here before but Ill say it again. I work in the county and the people at the tippy top are not secretive about their feelings about the W schools. The goal is to narrow the achievement gap, and focusing on enrichment or class size or resources or magnet access in the W schools is inconsistent with that goal. They view it as a moral imperative to level the playing field, and whether or not you agree, there are limited resources. So yes, the W schools are going to remain an afterthought and they're going to let parents do the enriching. Honestly, how could anyone look at the MCPS website and not see this mandate so clearly? It's been this way for YEARS. And by the way, they're also not sending the superstar principals the W schools way either. The good ones in the Ws tend to move up quickly. There are one or two exceptions, but at the high school level only. That's why you see a lot of teacher turnover in the W schools too--lack of good leadership.

It makes you wonder why people pay extra for the privilege of sending their kids to such under-resourced schools with second-rate staff, doesn't it?

It's a false narrative that people move to the Ws for schools. They move to the Ws because, generally speaking, they are the districts with easier commutes, safety (as compared to the eastern side of the county where commutes are similar), and proximity to amenities. That is primarily what drives the property value, not the schools. Poolesville has academic performance that's on par with the Ws, and the property value doesn't have any bump. Crown Farm is zoned for a district many people thing is bad and they're having no problem selling $1.5M homes right now. Dufief is zoned for Wootton, yet the outdated homes there can't sell for much.

This notion that there's some huge "W" premium on property values is a mostly a myth.

You might be able to sell a new home for 1.5m anywhere, but what is different is that in a good school district the homes will hold their value. In a bad school district that home will be valuable when it’s new but then it will decrease.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:yes it seems the posters asking why people stay when they could live elsewhere for cheaper are missing the point. people choose places to live for reasons beyond schools.

But surely not in the W areas, where all parents place a high value on their children's education?!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Ive said this here before but Ill say it again. I work in the county and the people at the tippy top are not secretive about their feelings about the W schools. The goal is to narrow the achievement gap, and focusing on enrichment or class size or resources or magnet access in the W schools is inconsistent with that goal. They view it as a moral imperative to level the playing field, and whether or not you agree, there are limited resources. So yes, the W schools are going to remain an afterthought and they're going to let parents do the enriching. Honestly, how could anyone look at the MCPS website and not see this mandate so clearly? It's been this way for YEARS. And by the way, they're also not sending the superstar principals the W schools way either. The good ones in the Ws tend to move up quickly. There are one or two exceptions, but at the high school level only. That's why you see a lot of teacher turnover in the W schools too--lack of good leadership.

It makes you wonder why people pay extra for the privilege of sending their kids to such under-resourced schools with second-rate staff, doesn't it?

It's a false narrative that people move to the Ws for schools. They move to the Ws because, generally speaking, they are the districts with easier commutes, safety (as compared to the eastern side of the county where commutes are similar), and proximity to amenities. That is primarily what drives the property value, not the schools. Poolesville has academic performance that's on par with the Ws, and the property value doesn't have any bump. Crown Farm is zoned for a district many people thing is bad and they're having no problem selling $1.5M homes right now. Dufief is zoned for Wootton, yet the outdated homes there can't sell for much.

This notion that there's some huge "W" premium on property values is a mostly a myth.

You might be able to sell a new home for 1.5m anywhere, but what is different is that in a good school district the homes will hold their value. In a bad school district that home will be valuable when it’s new but then it will decrease.

Totally untrue on both counts.