Bilingual Kids in Language Immersion ES Programs, Which Programs Have Many & Strive to Attract Them?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

+100. Lord Hear our Prayer. Cantonese speaker, offered YY spot early on, didn't bite, stayed IB. Guessed that we wouldn't be able to speak freely, that they wouldn't get us, that we'd feel out of place. Lost sleep over concept of extended family strenuously objecting to our heading to school w/admins who don't speak Chinese. Though, seriously, if the principal had broken out in beautiful Mandarin to YeYe and MaMa (grandpa & grandma) I'm confident I could have won them over on the AA issue, employing shaming tactics. Whatever the case. Enjoyed big Chinese New Year party at MoCo heritage school with DC families as per usual.



I am PP 12:15. This is the kind of sentiment I am talking about. My parents and relatives have plenty of prejudice against AAs. It's not something I am proud of...and certainly NOT something I would try to cater to!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Getting back to OP's question, I think it's fair to say that YY is making more of an effort to strive to attract bilingual kids than several years ago, at least according to parents we keep in touch with there. But noting like the Spanish immersion schools, where administrators tend to be native speakers themselves, and most non-ethnic parents have studied the language and know the culture somewhat.

We left YY for our IB school after AY 2011-2012, mainly because my spouse (we speak a dialect at home) was tired of walking on eggshells there as a bilingual immigrant parent. He didn't relate well to the many liberal white and AA parents, or even the highly assimilated Chinese parents, who felt that the school was super inclusive. It wasn't so much that he didn't feel welcome as that he didn't feel comfortable, or able to discuss our situation in the school community without opening himself to accusations of whining and wanting preferential treatment. He wasn't crazy about how parents tended to assume that the Asian kids spoke Chinese at home, when this was seldom the case. Different times when he suggested that the PA push to hire an ethnic, dialect-speaking administrator, he met with such an unpleasant reaction that he came home feeling low. So we bailed with him saying "If we're going to be token Chinese immigrants, let's do it IB and relax." We miss a few things about YY, mainly having a public school teach our children to write Chinese (now we rush off to private MoCo classes), but mostly we are grateful to feel at ease in a school community where we don't have to watch ourselves most the time, taking great care not to seem demanding or entitled.

When PPs say, some parents just aren't going to like any school, you're missing the point. It's not a lot of fun to feel like a token, muzled bilingual in a school teaching your own language and culture.

This is quite telling. These threads always seem to come out the same. Nobody complains about YY's ability to teach Mandarin. The basic complaint is that YY isn't Chinese enough for the Chinese because there are not:

1. More ethnic Chinese families
2. Chinese administrators
3. Extra support for dialect speakers

#1 is blamed on #2 & 3, along with complaints that YY doesn't do enough to cater to or reach out to native speakers:

4. By having more Chinese people at open houses or other events.
5. By having the open house in Chinese.
6. (and the worst example from a thread last year) Having an AA principal offends some racist Chinese people

Of course, you don't complain that your IB school doesn't have these things, and other posters have said the same about MoCo. So what makes you any less comfortable at Yu Ying than at any other school run by non-Chinese administrators with few dialect speakers and no support for them (other than ESL if appropriate)? You say it yourself -- because Yu Ying is teaching "your own language and culture." What you view as Yu Ying's sins all stem from the fact that non-Chinese started a Chinese immersion school. When you say your DH had to walk on eggshells and not seem demanding or entitled, what you mean is that he had to suppress the urge to be demanding and entitled, because he thinks he knows better than the white/AA administrators/PA leadership what makes a good Chinese school.

I'm not trying to attack you. Think back to college when you had that class where there was an older student who thought that his or her experience in the army or as an engineer or simply by being 50 years old gave him some special insight into history or government or literature or whatever the subject was. You know you had that person. We all did. If you went to law school you definitely know what I'm talking about. That's who you are. But the truth is that you've never run a Mandarin immersion school either, and likely have never run any school. So go ahead and have your opinions about how YY should do this or that to cater to native speakers, but don't pretend that those opinions aren't a symptom of feeling like you should be treated special as compared to white or AA parents.

It reminds me of the Seinfeld episode where Mrs. Costanza is upset because she learns that "Donna Chang" isn't Chinese and decides to ignore her advice -- "I thought I was getting advice from a Chinese woman!" You kids could be taught in Mandarin 5 days out of 10. Does it really matter if the principal (a qualified and experienced administrator BTW) doesn't speak it?

Well said.

We are an Asian family at YY, not Chinese. We feel welcomed at YY and have no issues with the administration: They do a good job creating an inclusive environment for us and we also have a child with SN.

I like the principal. So what if she is not Chinese? DC is 1/2 AA and it makes sense to have someone at the head who will attract many kids who would benefit from an immersion education who don't necessary have any interest in China or Chinese. It's the school's job to create interest and an affiliation while they attend YY and families see that happening.

Nearly 1/2 of the population of DC is AA so having an AA principal as the head of a Mandarin immersion school does that. Families like mine who already have a strong affiliation with China and Mandarin will find their way in or attempt to whether they're recruited/given preference or not; as seen by this thread, they are working every angle to try to get a spot. YY is the only game in town for immersion Mandarin.

Good luck in the lottery, everyone!

[Anonymous]

We are an Asian family at YY, not Chinese. We feel welcomed at YY and have no issues with the administration: They do a good job creating an inclusive environment for us and we also have a child with SN.

I like the principal. So what if she is not Chinese? DC is 1/2 AA and it makes sense to have someone at the head who will attract many kids who would benefit from an immersion education who don't necessary have any interest in China or Chinese. It's the school's job to create interest and an affiliation while they attend YY and families see that happening.

Nearly 1/2 of the population of DC is AA so having an AA principal as the head of a Mandarin immersion school does that. Families like mine who already have a strong affiliation with China and Mandarin will find their way in or attempt to whether they're recruited/given preference or not; as seen by this thread, they are working every angle to try to get a spot. YY is the only game in town for immersion Mandarin.Good luck in the lottery, everyone!

YY isn't in fact the only game in town for immersion Mandarin. It's the only game in town unless a family doesn't speak Chinese at home, and isn't willing to work at the writing. I've done the math, and we provide more immersion Chinese at home than YY provides at school. What you say works if you're satisfied with the current number of bilingual families/kids. If you aren't, and it doesn't sound like many parents are, not having an ethnic administrator is indeed an issue. The principal certainly doesn't have to be Chinese for many more bilingual families to embrace the school, but s/he does need to speak Chinese, and there needs to be at least one ethnic administrator. Otherwise, status quo, I'd bet on it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a first generation Chinese American, I am really horrified at the posts here that appear to imply that a DC charter school should somehow cater to the prejudices of the immigrant community towards African Americans. Complaint about the lack of Chinese administrators and prinicipal, fine. But it is shocking that other Chinese Americans would actually say out loud that the numbers of AA students or the AA principal are reasons their "old school" grandparents are not comfortable with the school. As if a charter school--paid for by public dollars-- should cater to these prejudices?? Hello? In DC, a majority AA city, no less. Wow, I am embarassed to be associated with such thoughts.

I'm not Chinese American but I am truly troubled by that too. It is very unfortunate. But it's also kind of how Darwinism works - sounds like these families are also self-selecting out. Maybe that's not a bad thing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

We are an Asian family at YY, not Chinese. We feel welcomed at YY and have no issues with the administration: They do a good job creating an inclusive environment for us and we also have a child with SN.

I like the principal. So what if she is not Chinese? DC is 1/2 AA and it makes sense to have someone at the head who will attract many kids who would benefit from an immersion education who don't necessary have any interest in China or Chinese. It's the school's job to create interest and an affiliation while they attend YY and families see that happening.

Nearly 1/2 of the population of DC is AA so having an AA principal as the head of a Mandarin immersion school does that. Families like mine who already have a strong affiliation with China and Mandarin will find their way in or attempt to whether they're recruited/given preference or not; as seen by this thread, they are working every angle to try to get a spot. YY is the only game in town for immersion Mandarin.Good luck in the lottery, everyone!

YY isn't in fact the only game in town for immersion Mandarin. It's the only game in town unless a family doesn't speak Chinese at home, and isn't willing to work at the writing. I've done the math, and we provide more immersion Chinese at home than YY provides at school. What you say works if you're satisfied with the current number of bilingual families/kids. If you aren't, and it doesn't sound like many parents are, not having an ethnic administrator is indeed an issue. The principal certainly doesn't have to be Chinese for many more bilingual families to embrace the school, but s/he does need to speak Chinese, and there needs to be at least one ethnic administrator. Otherwise, status quo, I'd bet on it.

Ok so now I have a really basic question: Does the AA Adminstrator/Principal of YY speak Mandarin or not, and if so, at what level (however you can best describe language levels)? I absolutely was under the impression she does speak Mandarin, though obviously not a native speaker. I assumed she is conversational - is that not true? Not that I don't believe she can be a great prinicipal at a DC Mandarin immersion school and not speak it - if she's a great administrator she could still pull it off well but you have to have native Chinese staff. But does she speak Mandarin and if so, how much?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

We are an Asian family at YY, not Chinese. We feel welcomed at YY and have no issues with the administration: They do a good job creating an inclusive environment for us and we also have a child with SN.

I like the principal. So what if she is not Chinese? DC is 1/2 AA and it makes sense to have someone at the head who will attract many kids who would benefit from an immersion education who don't necessary have any interest in China or Chinese. It's the school's job to create interest and an affiliation while they attend YY and families see that happening.

Nearly 1/2 of the population of DC is AA so having an AA principal as the head of a Mandarin immersion school does that. Families like mine who already have a strong affiliation with China and Mandarin will find their way in or attempt to whether they're recruited/given preference or not; as seen by this thread, they are working every angle to try to get a spot. YY is the only game in town for immersion Mandarin.Good luck in the lottery, everyone!

YY isn't in fact the only game in town for immersion Mandarin. It's the only game in town unless a family doesn't speak Chinese at home, and isn't willing to work at the writing. I've done the math, and we provide more immersion Chinese at home than YY provides at school. What you say works if you're satisfied with the current number of bilingual families/kids. If you aren't, and it doesn't sound like many parents are, not having an ethnic administrator is indeed an issue. The principal certainly doesn't have to be Chinese for many more bilingual families to embrace the school, but s/he does need to speak Chinese, and there needs to be at least one ethnic administrator. Otherwise, status quo, I'd bet on it.

We're really happy with the school and while we would like more bilingual speakers, we prefer the diversity over giving anyone preference (yup, have an opinion although it's moot since the charter board doesn't allow it anyway). Our child is in the lower grades, the jumbo K class, and no family I'm aware of has left b/c they were dissatisfied with the school only for work, etc. When I speak with other parents in my child's class, they seem happy overall with the school and I know many/most of the Mandarin/Cantonese parents. So I agree with you, status quo it'll stay.

[Anonymous]

We're really happy with the school and while we would like more bilingual speakers, we prefer the diversity over giving anyone preference (yup, have an opinion although it's moot since the charter board doesn't allow it anyway). Our child is in the lower grades, the jumbo K class, and no family I'm aware of has left b/c they were dissatisfied with the school only for work, etc. When I speak with other parents in my child's class, they seem happy overall with the school and I know many/most of the Mandarin/Cantonese parents. So I agree with you, status quo it'll stay.

Forget preference, what about striving to give bilingual Chinese more reason to come to raise Mandarin teaching and learning standards? I also know most of the Mandarin/Cantonese families and they are a highly assimilated bunch. We stopped arranging Cantonese playdates with several after discovering that their kids hardly spoke any. Sure you know why parents leave? We feigned happiness like Broadway performers, and told everyone that our commute had changed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

We're really happy with the school and while we would like more bilingual speakers, we prefer the diversity over giving anyone preference (yup, have an opinion although it's moot since the charter board doesn't allow it anyway). Our child is in the lower grades, the jumbo K class, and no family I'm aware of has left b/c they were dissatisfied with the school only for work, etc. When I speak with other parents in my child's class, they seem happy overall with the school and I know many/most of the Mandarin/Cantonese parents. So I agree with you, status quo it'll stay.

Forget preference, what about striving to give bilingual Chinese more reason to come to raise Mandarin teaching and learning standards? I also know most of the Mandarin/Cantonese families and they are a highly assimilated bunch. We stopped arranging Cantonese playdates with several after discovering that their kids hardly spoke any. Sure you know why parents leave? We feigned happiness like Broadway performers, and told everyone that our commute had changed.

I don't get it. Why lie on your way out the door? What are you afraid of, and why if it was bad enough to drive you out would you feel the need to act happy and then make up a reason for leaving?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

We're really happy with the school and while we would like more bilingual speakers, we prefer the diversity over giving anyone preference (yup, have an opinion although it's moot since the charter board doesn't allow it anyway). Our child is in the lower grades, the jumbo K class, and no family I'm aware of has left b/c they were dissatisfied with the school only for work, etc. When I speak with other parents in my child's class, they seem happy overall with the school and I know many/most of the Mandarin/Cantonese parents. So I agree with you, status quo it'll stay.

Forget preference, what about striving to give bilingual Chinese more reason to come to raise Mandarin teaching and learning standards? I also know most of the Mandarin/Cantonese families and they are a highly assimilated bunch. We stopped arranging Cantonese playdates with several after discovering that their kids hardly spoke any. Sure you know why parents leave? We feigned happiness like Broadway performers, and told everyone that our commute had changed.

Very few families have left in the current K... the only one I know about wasn't Chinese and the class size grew from 107 to 114 kids and they only took sibs this year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

We're really happy with the school and while we would like more bilingual speakers, we prefer the diversity over giving anyone preference (yup, have an opinion although it's moot since the charter board doesn't allow it anyway). Our child is in the lower grades, the jumbo K class, and no family I'm aware of has left b/c they were dissatisfied with the school only for work, etc. When I speak with other parents in my child's class, they seem happy overall with the school and I know many/most of the Mandarin/Cantonese parents. So I agree with you, status quo it'll stay.

Forget preference, what about striving to give bilingual Chinese more reason to come to raise Mandarin teaching and learning standards? I also know most of the Mandarin/Cantonese families and they are a highly assimilated bunch. We stopped arranging Cantonese playdates with several after discovering that their kids hardly spoke any. Sure you know why parents leave? We feigned happiness like Broadway performers, and told everyone that our commute had changed.

I don't get it. Why lie on your way out the door? What are you afraid of, and why if it was bad enough to drive you out would you feel the need to act happy and then make up a reason for leaving?

They really need to specify the grade b/c each grade seems to have it's own dynamic. For instance, for our grade K - everyone seems pretty content: no one has left other than for work reasons. The class size grew although they did not accept anyone through the lottery for K - only sibs. The classroom dynamics are peaceful without the out-of-control behavior I've read about on DCUM. The current K class is the first class where preK was all in Mandarin and the bilingual parents seem very happy with their kid's progress in reading, writing and speaking Mandarin. I have not heard any complaints at all... Granted most of the Mandarin/Cantonese parents I know are well assimilated, mostly in mixed marriages with biracial kids. Also, some of the best Mandarin speaking parents in the current K class are white people

[Anonymous]

Ok so now I have a really basic question: Does the AA Adminstrator/Principal of YY speak Mandarin or not, and if so, at what level (however you can best describe language levels)? I absolutely was under the impression she does speak Mandarin, though obviously not a native speaker. I assumed she is conversational - is that not true? Not that I don't believe she can be a great prinicipal at a DC Mandarin immersion school and not speak it - if she's a great administrator she could still pull it off well but you have to have native Chinese staff. But does she speak Mandarin and if so, how much?

She's learned a little since she came on board, maybe around a college semester's worth, not great on the tones.

[Anonymous]

I don't get it. Why lie on your way out the door? What are you afraid of, and why if it was bad enough to drive you out would you feel the need to act happy and then make up a reason for leaving?

Few YY parents get much of anything about Chinese immigrants, or you wouldn't be reading most of these posts. We are not known for being confrontational. We'd already decided to go for reasons guaranteed to make us unpopular. We fibbed our way out the door as the path of least resistance in the hopes of staying friendly with some of the parents we met there.

[Anonymous]

+1. I'd have done the same. No point in burning bridges when the battle was already lost.

[Anonymous]

Hear that, YY community? You need to ignore the words spoken by parents at the school. The only accurate information about the needs of Chinese parents is found posted anonymously on this board.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Hear that, YY community? You need to ignore the words spoken by parents at the school. The only accurate information about the needs of Chinese parents is found posted anonymously on this board.

Oh shut up, these board serve a purpose. If you disagree, stay away. We're OK with YY so far (though, to be honest, our kid's Cantonese sucks), but when we go, we won't involve a megaphone either. Call it a cultural thing.