Gaza War, Part 3

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's a new word in the urban slang dictionary -- "Israeled." To be "Israeled" means someone takes something that is yours, shamelessly pretends that it's theirs, and plays the victim if anyone tries to hold them accountable.

When I was eight years old, an older and much larger child shamelessly stole my toy and waltzed off with it during the school lunch break. My friends and I tried to talk to her, but she blew us off, and we had to line up for class shortly thereafter. The next day, I discussed it with these same friends, and we decided to confront her. We told her to return the toy, or we would go to the principal. She SCREAMED, "If you ever call me a stinking Jew again, my mother is going to talk to the principal!" I was horrified. I had not known she was Jewish, and even if I had, I would rather have died than have said anything like that. I immediately backed down, and that manipulative kid kept my toy. I got "Israeled."

This is very childish and petty.

Very, and it's what the pro-Israel crowd is brainwashed to do. Scream "antisemite" the moment they are challenged. Now they're committing genocide, they can't understand why it doesn't work quite as well for them.

I don't know what you are seeing that doesn't work--responding with oh no I am not an anti Semitie isn't a new novel gotcha that hasn't been tries before, doesn't cancel out the truth of anti-semitism.
In any event, the post about Israeled was very childish and petty, so your response about yes this it was Jews so doesn't make any sense as a response.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's a new word in the urban slang dictionary -- "Israeled." To be "Israeled" means someone takes something that is yours, shamelessly pretends that it's theirs, and plays the victim if anyone tries to hold them accountable.

When I was eight years old, an older and much larger child shamelessly stole my toy and waltzed off with it during the school lunch break. My friends and I tried to talk to her, but she blew us off, and we had to line up for class shortly thereafter. The next day, I discussed it with these same friends, and we decided to confront her. We told her to return the toy, or we would go to the principal. She SCREAMED, "If you ever call me a stinking Jew again, my mother is going to talk to the principal!" I was horrified. I had not known she was Jewish, and even if I had, I would rather have died than have said anything like that. I immediately backed down, and that manipulative kid kept my toy. I got "Israeled."

This is very childish and petty.

Very, and it's what the pro-Israel crowd is brainwashed to do. Scream "antisemite" the moment they are challenged. Now they're committing genocide, they can't understand why it doesn't work quite as well for them.

I don't know what you are seeing that doesn't work--responding with oh no I am not an anti Semitie isn't a new novel gotcha that hasn't been tries before, doesn't cancel out the truth of anti-semitism.
In any event, the post about Israeled was very childish and petty, so your response about yes this it was Jews so doesn't make any sense as a response.

Actually, it is clear you didn't read the post the "childish and petty" refers to, you just saw "childish and petty" and started talking about Jews reflexively.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Israel, the land where you can be detained indefinitely for thought crimes (but only if you're not Jewish), for the simple fact of not being Jewish, or for not being outspoken enough in denouncing Hamas. Also, the country where people from Russian and Ukraine tell Americans that they should be subject to prosecution in the U.S. court system for criticizing the actions of the IDF!

What a country!

You have clearly never been. In the words of a great comedian, I would rather be getting head in Tel Aviv, than getting head blown off in Gaza.

What a great thing to be proud of. Just like furniture, the best bedrooms are the silent ones

upset much that people are actually free to get head in Tel Aviv?

Well that’s nice what Israeli men have to wine and dine Palestinian men in jail can get for free from the female Israeli soldiers/guards who often get fired for relations with inmates.


Based on the amount of pregnant women and kids there alone, I don’t think Palestinian men feel deprived sexually .women probably but certainly not the guys

A reminder that the author of this word salad is totes okay with the Saudis.

A reminder that the author of this word salad thinks bigotry and blanket statements are normal.

I’m ok with Saudis just like I’m ok with Israelis, Palestinians, Germans, Americans, everyone . I am human just like everyone else . What are you?

Someone who thinks when you stone people to death in public squares and encourage your children to martyr themselves you shouldn't be in charge of anything. In other words, a sane human being who doesn't support a pack of misogynist medieval zealots.

Don't get me wrong, I hate Bibi too, and anyone else who thinks they can use cannon fodder who think they're fighting a holy war to achieve their own ends... But something that was sadly missing in your undergraduate lecture "coloniasm is bad for children and other living things," was any understanding about what leads to foreign influence, consolidation of power and empire-building. It's really quite simple. Eventually enough people get tired of cosplaying the crusades and just want to live somewhere without bombs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone here read The Lemon Tree? It’s a book about the history of Isreal / Palestine incorporating personal histories of an Israeli and a Palestinian.

In that book, the Israeli (who is Jewish) notes she believes that
“the key to coexistence lay in what she called "the three A's": acknowledgment of what had happened to the Palestinians in 1948, apology for it, and amends.”

Why can’t this an approach for Israel to take?

What should’ve happened in 1948 should’ve been Jews taking over East Germany as their state and dealing with the reality of the times. Tons of ethnic groups practically have their own state in Eastern Europe and many on religious ground as well (see Bosnia and Serbia).

The existence of a Jewish state of Israel thousands of years ago in the Biblical era is an insane reason to take back a country. That’s like Muslim Jihadists wanting to take back Europe/Spain like centuries past or the Confederate or Mayflower sympathizers who want to go back to a time Past.

Imagine if Native Americans came back thousands of years from today wanting to take back the entire United States after centuries. Much like Palestinians , we would be confused. Immigration from religious or ethnic persecution is always allowed but taking back, displacing the current population from their homes , and reviving an ancient Biblical state is something different.

Biblical "history," as written by the ancient Hebrews -- from their own perspective, of course -- is a non-starter in determining geographical boundaries. Egypt controlled ancient Canaan before the Israelites ever did, so anyone who really wants to go back thousands of years should support returning the land to Egypt. The Israelites were just one of several primitive tribes running around the southern Levant thousands of years ago and squabbling with other tribes, and there's no particular reason why the partial descendants, after several centuries of (often) intermingling with European and other groups, of the original Israelites should have any particular claim on the land. It's like saying we can all take over Ethiopia because our ancestors from 200,000 years back, the first homo sapiens, probably started out there.

The Israeli claims to the land, based on events described in the Bible, most of which almost certainly didn't happen, are patently absurd.

I've pointed this out before, but, technically, the current Levantine Arabs (Syrians, Lebanese, Joranians, and PALESTINIANS) are ethnically closer to those Canaanites and even to the ancient Israelis than are the current modern Ashkenazi Israelis.

Gulf Arabs call their Levantine cousins “leftovers of the crusaders”.

Ashenazi Israelis are tied genetically to the Middle East. The same Levant region as Israel. They are in Europe and elsewhere because they were run out of the Levant by Arabs.

So this notion that Ashkenzi Jews don’t have a tie to Israel, that they are “colonizers” is disgusting propaganda being waged by the same people who ran Jews out of their land in the Levant.

Um, Palestinians are tied genetically to the Middle East. I'm an Ashkenazi Jew, and more of my ancestors came from Poland than from the Levant. I "have a tie" to Poland. Does that mean I can take over Poland and ethnically cleanse the locals? If not, why not? Are only Jews allowed to ethnically cleanse other people? Why?

Before the Israelites were run out of the Levant by the Romans and the Arabs, they drove out many other groups. Remember, the Israelites weren't native to the area, even if you believe the biblical account. According to the biblical account, Abraham originally came from Ur -- not the Levant. The Israelites lived on the hilltops overlooking Canaan for decades before trying to drive out the locals. They then fought with other primitive tribes for centuries, telling themselves God had instructed them to kill everyone in their path. The Moabites, Amalekites, etc. probably told themselves the same nonsense.

In terms of real history, Egypt controlled Canaan until the middle of the 12th century. This was before Judaism had even been created. By the weird logic used in giving ownership of the land to the Jews, Egyptians had a prior tie to what is now Israel. Why shouldn't Egypt just take over?

Yeah. You don’t seem well versed in facts or history or Judaism for that matter.

Jews are traced to as early as 450
BCE in Egypt. This is historical fact and not controversial. So almost 800 years before your strange “mid 1200s” figure.

Also, you seem under-informed about your Jewishness. Your Polish ancestors fled the Levant. If you had a blood test - try 23 and Me - your Ashkenazi roots will pop up. Just like many refugees of religious persecution, Jews fled the Levant to locations across the world. That doesn’t mean they are less entitled to - or colonizers in - their homeland.

Egypt controlled Canaan until the middle of the 12th century BCE (sorry -- I left out whether it was BCE or CE). That was 800 years before 450 BCE. Egypt's domination of the region was a stable time, as Egypt pacified the land. Should Egyptians just move back into the area, as "they were there first"?

As for my Jewishness, my Polish ancestors did not flee the Levant. They were never in the Levant. Some of my Jewish ancestors, at some point and for whatever reason, left the Levant and moved to central Europe, where they intermarried with Europeans who converted to Judaism. That's why I, like most of my family, look like Central Europeans (fair hair and blue eyes) rather than looking like dark-haired, dark-eyed, olive-skinned people from the eastern Mediterranean. Does this give me the right to take over Poland? I'm thinking of finding a nice house in Krakow and kicking out whoever lives there so I can move in. I'm planning to take my extended family with me so we can start a nice settlement. I have ancestral ties to Poland, so I must have the right to do this, no? After all, if I don't steal one of their houses, someone else might get it first. And since some of my Polish ancestors were originally Catholic, I guess that also gives me the right to live in the Vatican. I think I'll demand a vacation home there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone here read The Lemon Tree? It’s a book about the history of Isreal / Palestine incorporating personal histories of an Israeli and a Palestinian.

In that book, the Israeli (who is Jewish) notes she believes that
“the key to coexistence lay in what she called "the three A's": acknowledgment of what had happened to the Palestinians in 1948, apology for it, and amends.”

Why can’t this an approach for Israel to take?

What should’ve happened in 1948 should’ve been Jews taking over East Germany as their state and dealing with the reality of the times. Tons of ethnic groups practically have their own state in Eastern Europe and many on religious ground as well (see Bosnia and Serbia).

The existence of a Jewish state of Israel thousands of years ago in the Biblical era is an insane reason to take back a country. That’s like Muslim Jihadists wanting to take back Europe/Spain like centuries past or the Confederate or Mayflower sympathizers who want to go back to a time Past.

Imagine if Native Americans came back thousands of years from today wanting to take back the entire United States after centuries. Much like Palestinians , we would be confused. Immigration from religious or ethnic persecution is always allowed but taking back, displacing the current population from their homes , and reviving an ancient Biblical state is something different.

Biblical "history," as written by the ancient Hebrews -- from their own perspective, of course -- is a non-starter in determining geographical boundaries. Egypt controlled ancient Canaan before the Israelites ever did, so anyone who really wants to go back thousands of years should support returning the land to Egypt. The Israelites were just one of several primitive tribes running around the southern Levant thousands of years ago and squabbling with other tribes, and there's no particular reason why the partial descendants, after several centuries of (often) intermingling with European and other groups, of the original Israelites should have any particular claim on the land. It's like saying we can all take over Ethiopia because our ancestors from 200,000 years back, the first homo sapiens, probably started out there.

The Israeli claims to the land, based on events described in the Bible, most of which almost certainly didn't happen, are patently absurd.

I've pointed this out before, but, technically, the current Levantine Arabs (Syrians, Lebanese, Joranians, and PALESTINIANS) are ethnically closer to those Canaanites and even to the ancient Israelis than are the current modern Ashkenazi Israelis.

Gulf Arabs call their Levantine cousins “leftovers of the crusaders”.

Ashenazi Israelis are tied genetically to the Middle East. The same Levant region as Israel. They are in Europe and elsewhere because they were run out of the Levant by Arabs.

So this notion that Ashkenzi Jews don’t have a tie to Israel, that they are “colonizers” is disgusting propaganda being waged by the same people who ran Jews out of their land in the Levant.

Um, Palestinians are tied genetically to the Middle East. I'm an Ashkenazi Jew, and more of my ancestors came from Poland than from the Levant. I "have a tie" to Poland. Does that mean I can take over Poland and ethnically cleanse the locals? If not, why not? Are only Jews allowed to ethnically cleanse other people? Why?

Before the Israelites were run out of the Levant by the Romans and the Arabs, they drove out many other groups. Remember, the Israelites weren't native to the area, even if you believe the biblical account. According to the biblical account, Abraham originally came from Ur -- not the Levant. The Israelites lived on the hilltops overlooking Canaan for decades before trying to drive out the locals. They then fought with other primitive tribes for centuries, telling themselves God had instructed them to kill everyone in their path. The Moabites, Amalekites, etc. probably told themselves the same nonsense.

In terms of real history, Egypt controlled Canaan until the middle of the 12th century. This was before Judaism had even been created. By the weird logic used in giving ownership of the land to the Jews, Egyptians had a prior tie to what is now Israel. Why shouldn't Egypt just take over?

Yeah. You don’t seem well versed in facts or history or Judaism for that matter.

Jews are traced to as early as 450
BCE in Egypt. This is historical fact and not controversial. So almost 800 years before your strange “mid 1200s” figure.

Also, you seem under-informed about your Jewishness. Your Polish ancestors fled the Levant. If you had a blood test - try 23 and Me - your Ashkenazi roots will pop up. Just like many refugees of religious persecution, Jews fled the Levant to locations across the world. That doesn’t mean they are less entitled to - or colonizers in - their homeland.

Egypt controlled Canaan until the middle of the 12th century BCE (sorry -- I left out whether it was BCE or CE). That was 800 years before 450 BCE. Egypt's domination of the region was a stable time, as Egypt pacified the land. Should Egyptians just move back into the area, as "they were there first"?

As for my Jewishness, my Polish ancestors did not flee the Levant. They were never in the Levant. Some of my Jewish ancestors, at some point and for whatever reason, left the Levant and moved to central Europe, where they intermarried with Europeans who converted to Judaism. That's why I, like most of my family, look like Central Europeans (fair hair and blue eyes) rather than looking like dark-haired, dark-eyed, olive-skinned people from the eastern Mediterranean. Does this give me the right to take over Poland? I'm thinking of finding a nice house in Krakow and kicking out whoever lives there so I can move in. I'm planning to take my extended family with me so we can start a nice settlement. I have ancestral ties to Poland, so I must have the right to do this, no? After all, if I don't steal one of their houses, someone else might get it first. And since some of my Polish ancestors were originally Catholic, I guess that also gives me the right to live in the Vatican. I think I'll demand a vacation home there.

It amazes me that Jeff is fine with posts like this but deletes the one where I said, "blood and soil is bad, mmkay?"

Again, Israel has plenty of reasons to exist that are grounded in the last century. We don't need to go digging around what your ten thousand different ancestors were all doing three thousand years ago. (my math sucks, but from a genetic standpoint you are probably more related to me than you are to anyone long dead.)

There are ways to study history. To learn from history. All the ways that rely on justifying terrible behavior based on events that happened a few millennia back... events none of us have the context to even understand... are all bad. Worse, they're puppet string causes--ways to manipulate you into more terrible, xenophobic behavior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's a new word in the urban slang dictionary -- "Israeled." To be "Israeled" means someone takes something that is yours, shamelessly pretends that it's theirs, and plays the victim if anyone tries to hold them accountable.

When I was eight years old, an older and much larger child shamelessly stole my toy and waltzed off with it during the school lunch break. My friends and I tried to talk to her, but she blew us off, and we had to line up for class shortly thereafter. The next day, I discussed it with these same friends, and we decided to confront her. We told her to return the toy, or we would go to the principal. She SCREAMED, "If you ever call me a stinking Jew again, my mother is going to talk to the principal!" I was horrified. I had not known she was Jewish, and even if I had, I would rather have died than have said anything like that. I immediately backed down, and that manipulative kid kept my toy. I got "Israeled."

This is very childish and petty.

Very, and it's what the pro-Israel crowd is brainwashed to do. Scream "antisemite" the moment they are challenged. Now they're committing genocide, they can't understand why it doesn't work quite as well for them.

I don't know what you are seeing that doesn't work--responding with oh no I am not an anti Semitie isn't a new novel gotcha that hasn't been tries before, doesn't cancel out the truth of anti-semitism.
In any event, the post about Israeled was very childish and petty, so your response about yes this it was Jews so doesn't make any sense as a response.

Oh, I know what the poster was doing. I just chose to turn it around. Someone taught that kid to claim victimhood by screaming antisemitism when she was challenged. She intimidated my 8yo self, which allowed her to get away with stealing from me. Isn't that what Israel has done? Stolen land and then screamed "Antisemitism!" and "But the holocaust!" when challenged? This isn't about true Judaism (many Orthodox Jews are passionately anti-Zionist). It's about Zionism that leverages victimhood to get what it wants. It's the MO of the illegal settlers in the West Bank.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Read the story of Izzeddin Nawasra, a young Gazan murdered in a refugee camp by Israel this week.

It's truly heartbreaking.

My heart has turned to stone when it comes to any Jews, wherever located, who support the depraved Israeli government. Whenever they die, under any circumstances, I will feign sympathy, but in fact only think of Izzedin and wish they could have died earlier so perhaps his life could have been spared.

How about when Hamas kills its own Palestinians who were approaching an aid truck with food on it. They shot the boy to prevent him from reaching the aid so they could take it themselves.

Outraged about that? Or only at Jews?

https://www.ynetnews.com/article/b1bhublvt

I’m a DP, but this is a great example of something I do not get.

Why are you unable to look at tragedy and call it tragedy? What would it harm you to admit something terrible is happening?

Most people who want a ceasefire in Gaza also mourned the loss of Israeli, Thai, Bedouin and other lives on October 7. Why are Israel’s supporters incapable of seeing any other life as having equal meaning? It baffles me.

Simple,

With Hamas staying in power, there Will be future attacks like 10/7 on Israelis. They will happen over and over again. Leaving Hamas in power guarantees that.


Also leaving Hamas in power also is detrimental to the typical Gaza resident. All aid, food, construction materials go to build rockets and concrete tunnels, rather than schools and hospitals. If you speak up against Hamas, you will be murdered. Hamas is also holding the Palestinians hostage in yet another way.

No peace without Hamas gone. Even Egypt just brokered a deal that Hamas rejected. The deal was there was a permanent ceasefire if Hamas leaves Gaza and allows UN to run area. Israel would stop war and Hamas would need to release prisoners.

Hamas rejected the deal to keep fighting and keep power. They don’t give a darn about the typical Gaza resident. They are using them as human shields.

I'm sure Israel can think of a different strategy to nuetralize Hamas that doesn't require blowing up their human shields.

You have guidance for Israel--what guidance do you have for Hamas.
I've noticed this, everyone loves to critique (the new word du jour) Israel, but I don't hear lots of critiques for Hamas.

Israel has killed more innocent people than Hamas has. The number of critiques you hear are proportional.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's a new word in the urban slang dictionary -- "Israeled." To be "Israeled" means someone takes something that is yours, shamelessly pretends that it's theirs, and plays the victim if anyone tries to hold them accountable.

When I was eight years old, an older and much larger child shamelessly stole my toy and waltzed off with it during the school lunch break. My friends and I tried to talk to her, but she blew us off, and we had to line up for class shortly thereafter. The next day, I discussed it with these same friends, and we decided to confront her. We told her to return the toy, or we would go to the principal. She SCREAMED, "If you ever call me a stinking Jew again, my mother is going to talk to the principal!" I was horrified. I had not known she was Jewish, and even if I had, I would rather have died than have said anything like that. I immediately backed down, and that manipulative kid kept my toy. I got "Israeled."

This is very childish and petty.

Very, and it's what the pro-Israel crowd is brainwashed to do. Scream "antisemite" the moment they are challenged. Now they're committing genocide, they can't understand why it doesn't work quite as well for them.

I don't know what you are seeing that doesn't work--responding with oh no I am not an anti Semitie isn't a new novel gotcha that hasn't been tries before, doesn't cancel out the truth of anti-semitism.
In any event, the post about Israeled was very childish and petty, so your response about yes this it was Jews so doesn't make any sense as a response.

Oh, I know what the poster was doing. I just chose to turn it around. Someone taught that kid to claim victimhood by screaming antisemitism when she was challenged. She intimidated my 8yo self, which allowed her to get away with stealing from me. Isn't that what Israel has done? Stolen land and then screamed "Antisemitism!" and "But the holocaust!" when challenged? This isn't about true Judaism (many Orthodox Jews are passionately anti-Zionist). It's about Zionism that leverages victimhood to get what it wants. It's the MO of the illegal settlers in the West Bank.

You were challenged because your story is not true. Not only is it not true it’s pretty dumb and ridiculous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Read the story of Izzeddin Nawasra, a young Gazan murdered in a refugee camp by Israel this week.

It's truly heartbreaking.

My heart has turned to stone when it comes to any Jews, wherever located, who support the depraved Israeli government. Whenever they die, under any circumstances, I will feign sympathy, but in fact only think of Izzedin and wish they could have died earlier so perhaps his life could have been spared.

How about when Hamas kills its own Palestinians who were approaching an aid truck with food on it. They shot the boy to prevent him from reaching the aid so they could take it themselves.

Outraged about that? Or only at Jews?

https://www.ynetnews.com/article/b1bhublvt

I’m a DP, but this is a great example of something I do not get.

Why are you unable to look at tragedy and call it tragedy? What would it harm you to admit something terrible is happening?

Most people who want a ceasefire in Gaza also mourned the loss of Israeli, Thai, Bedouin and other lives on October 7. Why are Israel’s supporters incapable of seeing any other life as having equal meaning? It baffles me.

Simple,

With Hamas staying in power, there Will be future attacks like 10/7 on Israelis. They will happen over and over again. Leaving Hamas in power guarantees that.


Also leaving Hamas in power also is detrimental to the typical Gaza resident. All aid, food, construction materials go to build rockets and concrete tunnels, rather than schools and hospitals. If you speak up against Hamas, you will be murdered. Hamas is also holding the Palestinians hostage in yet another way.

No peace without Hamas gone. Even Egypt just brokered a deal that Hamas rejected. The deal was there was a permanent ceasefire if Hamas leaves Gaza and allows UN to run area. Israel would stop war and Hamas would need to release prisoners.

Hamas rejected the deal to keep fighting and keep power. They don’t give a darn about the typical Gaza resident. They are using them as human shields.

I'm sure Israel can think of a different strategy to nuetralize Hamas that doesn't require blowing up their human shields.

You have guidance for Israel--what guidance do you have for Hamas.
I've noticed this, everyone loves to critique (the new word du jour) Israel, but I don't hear lots of critiques for Hamas.

Israel has killed more innocent people than Hamas has. The number of critiques you hear are proportional.

It's a tired old chestnut that bears repeating, sadly.

Israel is at war. Yeah, it's horrible. It's horrible in the Sudan too. It was horrible in Rwanda. Yemen. Etc.

But terrorists are hard to fight. That's the nature of them. That's why (and apparently this bears repeating) you don't let them win.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone here read The Lemon Tree? It’s a book about the history of Isreal / Palestine incorporating personal histories of an Israeli and a Palestinian.

In that book, the Israeli (who is Jewish) notes she believes that
“the key to coexistence lay in what she called "the three A's": acknowledgment of what had happened to the Palestinians in 1948, apology for it, and amends.”

Why can’t this an approach for Israel to take?

What should’ve happened in 1948 should’ve been Jews taking over East Germany as their state and dealing with the reality of the times. Tons of ethnic groups practically have their own state in Eastern Europe and many on religious ground as well (see Bosnia and Serbia).

The existence of a Jewish state of Israel thousands of years ago in the Biblical era is an insane reason to take back a country. That’s like Muslim Jihadists wanting to take back Europe/Spain like centuries past or the Confederate or Mayflower sympathizers who want to go back to a time Past.

Imagine if Native Americans came back thousands of years from today wanting to take back the entire United States after centuries. Much like Palestinians , we would be confused. Immigration from religious or ethnic persecution is always allowed but taking back, displacing the current population from their homes , and reviving an ancient Biblical state is something different.

This is why people want the U.S. to stop giving money to Israel--to facilitate reversing the above, they think Israel will be alone and vulnerable and will fall under their attack of the pesky U.S. get out of the way. The protests are not about what is currently going on in Gaza, they don't care about that.

You and the PP are so woefully ignorant of Jews in the Middle East. Jew aren’t just connected to the region from biblical times …. They’ve been in the region and ethnically cleansed and persecuted and eradicated over recent decades. This isn’t far off history. This is recent memory.

You people talk about Israeli “propaganda”. But it’s clear that so much of what is driving the current anti-Jewish sentiment is Arab propaganda aimed at diminishing the presence of Jews in the Middle East. Look at countries like Tunisia, Algeria, Iraq, Egypt, and Iran … Jews essentially eradicated over the last century. This isn’t ancient history.

They weren’t eradicated. They’re in Israel honey. Majority of Israel are Middle Eastern Jews expelled after the state of Israel was created in 1948 by European colonialist Jews who didn’t even like or treat Middle Eastern Jewish brethren fairly in the first place. They still never elected an Mizrahi prime minister despite Askhenazis being the minority in the country and we all know why that is.


Mizrahi Jews were second class citizens in Israel until the Ethiopian Beta Israel came in the 80s

Oh sweetie, I know you Googled real hard to get smart on “Baseless Nonsense About Jews” but it’s going to take more than that.

Not going to dismantle all the ridiculous things, but to start, Ashkenazi Jews are middle eastern Jews. They aren’t European non-Jews who became Jewish and then came to Israel. They are people who were from the Levant, escaped horrific persecution at the hands of invaders - Christian and Islamic and in more recent decades, Arabs.

There are genetic studies that show that middle eastern Jews and Palestinians are descended from common ancestors. Ashkenazi Jews are genetically descended from a mix of middle eastern Jews and Europeans.

The Bible / Torah is not scientific evidence of what happened 2k years ago.

Based on the genetic evidence it’s clear to me that some Jews left and mixed with Europeans. Historical accounts shown these European Jews suffered horribly at the hands of Europeans (Spanish Inquisition, Russian Pogroms, Holocaust are notable events bi there were others for sure). Meanwhile, back in the Middle East some Arab Jews converted and become Muslim (there could have been force conversion for sure) and others did not. Middle Eastern Jews, Christians and Muslims loved tougher. I am sure there was friction but it wasn’t really documented in the historical records until Zionism was on the rise and the other Arab states expelled Their Jewish population in response to Israel not allowing the Palestinian right of return.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Read the story of Izzeddin Nawasra, a young Gazan murdered in a refugee camp by Israel this week.

It's truly heartbreaking.

My heart has turned to stone when it comes to any Jews, wherever located, who support the depraved Israeli government. Whenever they die, under any circumstances, I will feign sympathy, but in fact only think of Izzedin and wish they could have died earlier so perhaps his life could have been spared.

How about when Hamas kills its own Palestinians who were approaching an aid truck with food on it. They shot the boy to prevent him from reaching the aid so they could take it themselves.

Outraged about that? Or only at Jews?

https://www.ynetnews.com/article/b1bhublvt

I’m a DP, but this is a great example of something I do not get.

Why are you unable to look at tragedy and call it tragedy? What would it harm you to admit something terrible is happening?

Most people who want a ceasefire in Gaza also mourned the loss of Israeli, Thai, Bedouin and other lives on October 7. Why are Israel’s supporters incapable of seeing any other life as having equal meaning? It baffles me.

Simple,

With Hamas staying in power, there Will be future attacks like 10/7 on Israelis. They will happen over and over again. Leaving Hamas in power guarantees that.


Also leaving Hamas in power also is detrimental to the typical Gaza resident. All aid, food, construction materials go to build rockets and concrete tunnels, rather than schools and hospitals. If you speak up against Hamas, you will be murdered. Hamas is also holding the Palestinians hostage in yet another way.

No peace without Hamas gone. Even Egypt just brokered a deal that Hamas rejected. The deal was there was a permanent ceasefire if Hamas leaves Gaza and allows UN to run area. Israel would stop war and Hamas would need to release prisoners.

Hamas rejected the deal to keep fighting and keep power. They don’t give a darn about the typical Gaza resident. They are using them as human shields.

I'm sure Israel can think of a different strategy to nuetralize Hamas that doesn't require blowing up their human shields.

You have guidance for Israel--what guidance do you have for Hamas.
I've noticed this, everyone loves to critique (the new word du jour) Israel, but I don't hear lots of critiques for Hamas.

Israel has killed more innocent people than Hamas has. The number of critiques you hear are proportional.

It's a tired old chestnut that bears repeating, sadly.

Israel is at war. Yeah, it's horrible. It's horrible in the Sudan too. It was horrible in Rwanda. Yemen. Etc.

But terrorists are hard to fight. That's the nature of them. That's why (and apparently this bears repeating) you don't let them win.

+1

The Pollyannas bring a painful combination of naivete and righteousness that bears no meaningful relationship to reality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We don’t have universal healthcare, daycare, college, maternity leave pay.
Nothing.

Young people are not drinking the koolaid anymore. The country needs to retreat and focus on self for once

Ok, Trumper

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There's a new word in the urban slang dictionary -- "Israeled." To be "Israeled" means someone takes something that is yours, shamelessly pretends that it's theirs, and plays the victim if anyone tries to hold them accountable.

When I was eight years old, an older and much larger child shamelessly stole my toy and waltzed off with it during the school lunch break. My friends and I tried to talk to her, but she blew us off, and we had to line up for class shortly thereafter. The next day, I discussed it with these same friends, and we decided to confront her. We told her to return the toy, or we would go to the principal. She SCREAMED, "If you ever call me a stinking Jew again, my mother is going to talk to the principal!" I was horrified. I had not known she was Jewish, and even if I had, I would rather have died than have said anything like that. I immediately backed down, and that manipulative kid kept my toy. I got "Israeled."

This is very childish and petty.

Very, and it's what the pro-Israel crowd is brainwashed to do. Scream "antisemite" the moment they are challenged. Now they're committing genocide, they can't understand why it doesn't work quite as well for them.

Nah, you’re just a POS.

Sincerely, a (lapsed) Protestant

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Has anyone here read The Lemon Tree? It’s a book about the history of Isreal / Palestine incorporating personal histories of an Israeli and a Palestinian.

In that book, the Israeli (who is Jewish) notes she believes that
“the key to coexistence lay in what she called "the three A's": acknowledgment of what had happened to the Palestinians in 1948, apology for it, and amends.”

Why can’t this an approach for Israel to take?

What should’ve happened in 1948 should’ve been Jews taking over East Germany as their state and dealing with the reality of the times. Tons of ethnic groups practically have their own state in Eastern Europe and many on religious ground as well (see Bosnia and Serbia).

The existence of a Jewish state of Israel thousands of years ago in the Biblical era is an insane reason to take back a country. That’s like Muslim Jihadists wanting to take back Europe/Spain like centuries past or the Confederate or Mayflower sympathizers who want to go back to a time Past.

Imagine if Native Americans came back thousands of years from today wanting to take back the entire United States after centuries. Much like Palestinians , we would be confused. Immigration from religious or ethnic persecution is always allowed but taking back, displacing the current population from their homes , and reviving an ancient Biblical state is something different.

This is why people want the U.S. to stop giving money to Israel--to facilitate reversing the above, they think Israel will be alone and vulnerable and will fall under their attack of the pesky U.S. get out of the way. The protests are not about what is currently going on in Gaza, they don't care about that.

You and the PP are so woefully ignorant of Jews in the Middle East. Jew aren’t just connected to the region from biblical times …. They’ve been in the region and ethnically cleansed and persecuted and eradicated over recent decades. This isn’t far off history. This is recent memory.

You people talk about Israeli “propaganda”. But it’s clear that so much of what is driving the current anti-Jewish sentiment is Arab propaganda aimed at diminishing the presence of Jews in the Middle East. Look at countries like Tunisia, Algeria, Iraq, Egypt, and Iran … Jews essentially eradicated over the last century. This isn’t ancient history.

They weren’t eradicated. They’re in Israel honey. Majority of Israel are Middle Eastern Jews expelled after the state of Israel was created in 1948 by European colonialist Jews who didn’t even like or treat Middle Eastern Jewish brethren fairly in the first place. They still never elected an Mizrahi prime minister despite Askhenazis being the minority in the country and we all know why that is.


Mizrahi Jews were second class citizens in Israel until the Ethiopian Beta Israel came in the 80s

Oh sweetie, I know you Googled real hard to get smart on “Baseless Nonsense About Jews” but it’s going to take more than that.

Not going to dismantle all the ridiculous things, but to start, Ashkenazi Jews are middle eastern Jews. They aren’t European non-Jews who became Jewish and then came to Israel. They are people who were from the Levant, escaped horrific persecution at the hands of invaders - Christian and Islamic and in more recent decades, Arabs.

There are genetic studies that show that middle eastern Jews and Palestinians are descended from common ancestors. Ashkenazi Jews are genetically descended from a mix of middle eastern Jews and Europeans.

The Bible / Torah is not scientific evidence of what happened 2k years ago.

Based on the genetic evidence it’s clear to me that some Jews left and mixed with Europeans. Historical accounts shown these European Jews suffered horribly at the hands of Europeans (Spanish Inquisition, Russian Pogroms, Holocaust are notable events bi there were others for sure). Meanwhile, back in the Middle East some Arab Jews converted and become Muslim (there could have been force conversion for sure) and others did not. Middle Eastern Jews, Christians and Muslims loved tougher. I am sure there was friction but it wasn’t really documented in the historical records until Zionism was on the rise and the other Arab states expelled Their Jewish population in response to Israel not allowing the Palestinian right of return.

Just because you don’t know know of something (because you are clearly a newly minted ME expert), doesn’t mean it didn’t occur. You may want to look into what happened in Safed in 1834, in the “there was some friction”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Read the story of Izzeddin Nawasra, a young Gazan murdered in a refugee camp by Israel this week.

It's truly heartbreaking.

My heart has turned to stone when it comes to any Jews, wherever located, who support the depraved Israeli government. Whenever they die, under any circumstances, I will feign sympathy, but in fact only think of Izzedin and wish they could have died earlier so perhaps his life could have been spared.

How about when Hamas kills its own Palestinians who were approaching an aid truck with food on it. They shot the boy to prevent him from reaching the aid so they could take it themselves.

Outraged about that? Or only at Jews?

https://www.ynetnews.com/article/b1bhublvt

I’m a DP, but this is a great example of something I do not get.

Why are you unable to look at tragedy and call it tragedy? What would it harm you to admit something terrible is happening?

Most people who want a ceasefire in Gaza also mourned the loss of Israeli, Thai, Bedouin and other lives on October 7. Why are Israel’s supporters incapable of seeing any other life as having equal meaning? It baffles me.

Simple,

With Hamas staying in power, there Will be future attacks like 10/7 on Israelis. They will happen over and over again. Leaving Hamas in power guarantees that.


Also leaving Hamas in power also is detrimental to the typical Gaza resident. All aid, food, construction materials go to build rockets and concrete tunnels, rather than schools and hospitals. If you speak up against Hamas, you will be murdered. Hamas is also holding the Palestinians hostage in yet another way.

No peace without Hamas gone. Even Egypt just brokered a deal that Hamas rejected. The deal was there was a permanent ceasefire if Hamas leaves Gaza and allows UN to run area. Israel would stop war and Hamas would need to release prisoners.

Hamas rejected the deal to keep fighting and keep power. They don’t give a darn about the typical Gaza resident. They are using them as human shields.

I'm sure Israel can think of a different strategy to nuetralize Hamas that doesn't require blowing up their human shields.

You have guidance for Israel--what guidance do you have for Hamas.
I've noticed this, everyone loves to critique (the new word du jour) Israel, but I don't hear lots of critiques for Hamas.

Israel has killed more innocent people than Hamas has. The number of critiques you hear are proportional.

It's a tired old chestnut that bears repeating, sadly.

Israel is at war. Yeah, it's horrible. It's horrible in the Sudan too. It was horrible in Rwanda. Yemen. Etc.

But terrorists are hard to fight. That's the nature of them. That's why (and apparently this bears repeating) you don't let them win.

+1

The Pollyannas bring a painful combination of naivete and righteousness that bears no meaningful relationship to reality.

It's not real to them. It's an ideological litmus test, or an armchair chess game. I've become more and more convinced that people with the luxury of so much remove should learn that some of their opinions can actually have a body count. They remind me of Irish Americans in the 80s, celebrating the IRA.