Is the phrase “fresh off the boat” offensive in all circumstances?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:When I was at Harvard in the early/mid 2000s, there was a group of Asian-American friends on my floor, and they used the term "FOB" regularly, said in a joking tone that was also disparaging, to describe Asian students who had accents or were awkward/poorly dressed. (I'm white and never used that term myself). Asian-Americans are the only people I've ever heard using that term.

My great-grandparents were "fresh off the boat" from Eastern Europe. As a white person, I would not ever use that term to describe anyone, though, because the way I saw the term used in college was as an insult toward people who don't fit in with superficial standards (fashion, accent) that aren't their fault. It wasn't a neutral description.

Also know a few ABC (American born Chinese) who used it for the FOB older relatives - similar to how we use boomer today. With frustrated love or loving frustration.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I am fifty-five & Asian.

Growing up, I heard that term (especially in my teenage yrs!) as derogatory toward people of color so just to hear that phrase now, no matter who it is directed to…..just stings + brings back bad memories. 🤨

Though I realize this is only my personal experience.

Grow a thicker skin and get over rude things people say.

DP. You need to STFU.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:When I was at Harvard in the early/mid 2000s, there was a group of Asian-American friends on my floor, and they used the term "FOB" regularly, said in a joking tone that was also disparaging, to describe Asian students who had accents or were awkward/poorly dressed. (I'm white and never used that term myself). Asian-Americans are the only people I've ever heard using that term.

My great-grandparents were "fresh off the boat" from Eastern Europe. As a white person, I would not ever use that term to describe anyone, though, because the way I saw the term used in college was as an insult toward people who don't fit in with superficial standards (fashion, accent) that aren't their fault. It wasn't a neutral description.

Also know a few ABC (American born Chinese) who used it for the FOB older relatives - similar to how we use boomer today. With frustrated love or loving frustration.

This is how I’d always heard it — friends talking about relatives—so didn’t realize it was used as a slur or offensively. More like “give them a little grace — they just got here and don’t know the local norms yet.” It’s a little unusual because most slurs are developed by people outside the group (usually white peoole) and then maybe get adopted by the people in the group to reclaim power. But this seems like it was developed by people in the group and used both in a derogatory way and in a not derogatory way.

[Anonymous]

FOB is one of those words that is NBD and used commonly around in certain circles (eg 1st & 2nd gen asians) to each other, but it will sound a bit offensive if it comes from someone outside of their circle, esp if that person is white.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I guess I’ll just stop saying it altogether to be on the safe side, but i am sad! I love English and I am constantly learning and am secretly proud that I know so many set phrases and phrasal verbs and can be so eloquent and smooth lol

❤️❤️❤️
You are in good company here on DCUM. Please start any threads you like on language, expressions, idioms.

We can debate which ones sound off, old-fashioned, nerdy MBA speak, better versions, etc. I live for that.

[Anonymous]

DH and I are immigrants and we use this term sometimes jokingly among ourselves or close friends, but I would never say it to a stranger because you never know how it will be perceived. It’s true for a lot of things these days.

[Anonymous]

This is interesting to see different perspectives. I have a friend whose parents are Albanian immigrants and she regularly uses FOB while describing them/their actions. While I would never utilize it to describe someone, I have always interpreted her tone as loving exasperation and assumed most who utilized were first gen and were using the term as more of an endearment.

[Anonymous]

People in 2024 have gone insane with telling other people - even total strangers - what they are allowed to say and what they are NOT ALLOWED TO SAY!

And if you don’t obey other people’s “word rules,” they will judge you and hate you (even though they believe they “don’t judge” and they “don’t hate.”).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am fifty-five & Asian.

Growing up, I heard that term (especially in my teenage yrs!) as derogatory toward people of color so just to hear that phrase now, no matter who it is directed to…..just stings + brings back bad memories. 🤨

Though I realize this is only my personal experience.

“Fresh off the boat” originally had nothing to do with Asians at all. It originated in NY as a descriptive of people coming from Ireland and then Italy. It was never applied to Asians until the mid-19th century when immigration from China to the west coast began. But by then it had been used for various Europeans for 30+ years.

It was basically cultural appropriation of a slur originally intended for white people. It was stolen from us.

[Anonymous]

This is America. You have freedom of expression here.

Exercise your rights!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:People in 2024 have gone insane with telling other people - even total strangers - what they are allowed to say and what they are NOT ALLOWED TO SAY!

And if you don’t obey other people’s “word rules,” they will judge you and hate you (even though they believe they “don’t judge” and they “don’t hate.”).

+1

[Anonymous]

It’s a little like the N word. White people don’t get to use it, even to refer to themselves.

I’m Asian and my best friend is Afro-Latina. We are both second generation and fondly refer to friends and relatives as FOBby. You used the phrase awkwardly because it was inauthentic (you know he’s not marginalized in any way) and that’s what the DMV lady was picking up on. I know several white immigrants from England and Canada, and they never make jokes about being FOBs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am an immigrant but have been here for over a decade. I was finally able to bring my dad over and I took him to dmv to get his state ID. I was talking to the lady who was handing out the tickets and she asked if he ever had an ID from any state before, to which I said no, he is fresh off the boat.

For context we are both white. I thought it was ok to say it since 1) it’s directed at a white man and as a joke and 2) there’s a show by that name.
I would never use it towards any Asian person or any non white person for that matter, or even anyone who isn’t my close friend honestly.

The lady casually told me it wasn’t a good phrase (we were being a bit chatty with her). She wasn’t Asian but wasn’t white either (not sure if it matters).

So my question is: should I stop using the phrase completely? Even if it’s about my dad who is white?

Yes. Unless you're talking about bananas.

[Anonymous]

as a child i heard this from 1st generation irish relatives - i think it would be fine speaking of yourself - referring it to others probably taken differently

[Anonymous]

Better to avoid it.