AP physics without Algebra 2

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:B-CC had a meeting about course registration for rising 10th grade parents this week and they said honors physics is a prerequisite for AP physics. That seemed strange to me because it means you’d have to take physics twice if you want to do AP, but a parent asked for clarification and they confirmed that a sophomore wouldn’t be able to take AP physics because they have to take honors physics first. Anyone else hearing this at their HS?

That seems normal to me. Isn't honors chem a prereq for AP chem and honors bio a prereq for AP bio?

Those are more analogous to AP Physics C, not AP Physics 1 which has no prereqs.

And people should get over the idea that somehow this class is "easy." Calculus was invented for physics and doing an algebra-based physics class is not always intuitive. The College Board wants an "accessible" version, since not all kids get to Calculus, but has struggled to decide what this class should be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:B-CC had a meeting about course registration for rising 10th grade parents this week and they said honors physics is a prerequisite for AP physics. That seemed strange to me because it means you’d have to take physics twice if you want to do AP, but a parent asked for clarification and they confirmed that a sophomore wouldn’t be able to take AP physics because they have to take honors physics first. Anyone else hearing this at their HS?

That seems normal to me. Isn't honors chem a prereq for AP chem and honors bio a prereq for AP bio?

Those are more analogous to AP Physics C, not AP Physics 1 which has no prereqs.

BCC offers AP Physics C, not AP Physics 1.

[Anonymous]

What’s the typical sequence of math and science classes at BCC then?

[Anonymous]

What’s the typical sequence of math and science classes at BCC then for math loving kids. Next year my son will take geometry in ninth because the school district we are moving from had a slower role in math. He asked if he can take geometry and algebra two at the same time and they didn’t recommend it but said he can take summer school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
What’s the typical sequence of math and science classes at BCC then for math loving kids. Next year my son will take geometry in ninth because the school district we are moving from had a slower role in math. He asked if he can take geometry and algebra two at the same time and they didn’t recommend it but said he can take summer school.

For the math loving kids
:

Hns Alg 2/Hns Pre- Cal/Cal BC/Multi

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
What’s the typical sequence of math and science classes at BCC then for math loving kids. Next year my son will take geometry in ninth because the school district we are moving from had a slower role in math. He asked if he can take geometry and algebra two at the same time and they didn’t recommend it but said he can take summer school.

For the math loving kids
:

Hns Alg 2/Hns Pre- Cal/Cal BC/Multi

What about for science?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My current 9th grader, currently taking honors geometry and honors biology, wants to take AP Physics next year while also taking Algebra 2, because "all" of their friends will be in AP physics in 10th. My experience with my older kids is that they and most of their MoCo peers took chemistry in 10th grade, regardless of which science they'd had in 9th (i.e. regardless of whether they were on the faster or slower math track). (Clearly none of them was in a STEM magnet program.) Does anyone know if AP physics requires the completion of Algebra 2, or if it would at least be a good idea to have this math under their belt? DC is a pretty strong math and science student with a scientist parent who can help at home, but I'm not sure this is such a good plan. Also considering taking Alg2 over the summer, which DC's counselor has okayed.

At Blair, that's the norm. Kids who are currently taking A2 and are strong at math are recommended for AP Physics in 9th.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:B-CC had a meeting about course registration for rising 10th grade parents this week and they said honors physics is a prerequisite for AP physics. That seemed strange to me because it means you’d have to take physics twice if you want to do AP, but a parent asked for clarification and they confirmed that a sophomore wouldn’t be able to take AP physics because they have to take honors physics first. Anyone else hearing this at their HS?

Yes, @Blair 9th graders in Hon Algebra 2 are encouraged to jump straight into AP Physics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:B-CC had a meeting about course registration for rising 10th grade parents this week and they said honors physics is a prerequisite for AP physics. That seemed strange to me because it means you’d have to take physics twice if you want to do AP, but a parent asked for clarification and they confirmed that a sophomore wouldn’t be able to take AP physics because they have to take honors physics first. Anyone else hearing this at their HS?

Yes, @Blair 9th graders in Hon Algebra 2 are encouraged to jump straight into AP Physics.

But the question is how they are doing in the class? Are they struggling? Is the teacher having to restructure lessons to make it understandable? Etc

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:B-CC had a meeting about course registration for rising 10th grade parents this week and they said honors physics is a prerequisite for AP physics. That seemed strange to me because it means you’d have to take physics twice if you want to do AP, but a parent asked for clarification and they confirmed that a sophomore wouldn’t be able to take AP physics because they have to take honors physics first. Anyone else hearing this at their HS?

Yes, @Blair 9th graders in Hon Algebra 2 are encouraged to jump straight into AP Physics.

But the question is how they are doing in the class? Are they struggling? Is the teacher having to restructure lessons to make it understandable? Etc

This. What are the AP scores like for the 9th graders? Are there older students also in the class or only 9th graders?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:B-CC had a meeting about course registration for rising 10th grade parents this week and they said honors physics is a prerequisite for AP physics. That seemed strange to me because it means you’d have to take physics twice if you want to do AP, but a parent asked for clarification and they confirmed that a sophomore wouldn’t be able to take AP physics because they have to take honors physics first. Anyone else hearing this at their HS?

Yes, @Blair 9th graders in Hon Algebra 2 are encouraged to jump straight into AP Physics.

I don't know where you are getting this but multiple admins, teachers and students spoke at the CAP parent meeting to actively discourage 9th graders in Alg. 2 from taking AP Physics because so many students were having a poor experience and struggling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My current 9th grader, currently taking honors geometry and honors biology, wants to take AP Physics next year while also taking Algebra 2, because "all" of their friends will be in AP physics in 10th. My experience with my older kids is that they and most of their MoCo peers took chemistry in 10th grade, regardless of which science they'd had in 9th (i.e. regardless of whether they were on the faster or slower math track). (Clearly none of them was in a STEM magnet program.) Does anyone know if AP physics requires the completion of Algebra 2, or if it would at least be a good idea to have this math under their belt? DC is a pretty strong math and science student with a scientist parent who can help at home, but I'm not sure this is such a good plan. Also considering taking Alg2 over the summer, which DC's counselor has okayed.

At Blair, that's the norm. Kids who are currently taking A2 and are strong at math are recommended for AP Physics in 9th.

No, that’s not the norm. Who would recommend those kids to take AP physics, the high school counselor, the tiger parents?

Do those strong students also take physics C? If they don’t, what’s the point of taking the less math intensive and less rigorous physics class? If they do, why take three years of physics with so much overlap?

No matter how you look at it, AP physics 1&2 make very little sense for a strong math student, it’s generally geared towards non STEM majors. It makes even less sense to take it concurent with algebra 2, while not having the required foundation for the class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My current 9th grader, currently taking honors geometry and honors biology, wants to take AP Physics next year while also taking Algebra 2, because "all" of their friends will be in AP physics in 10th. My experience with my older kids is that they and most of their MoCo peers took chemistry in 10th grade, regardless of which science they'd had in 9th (i.e. regardless of whether they were on the faster or slower math track). (Clearly none of them was in a STEM magnet program.) Does anyone know if AP physics requires the completion of Algebra 2, or if it would at least be a good idea to have this math under their belt? DC is a pretty strong math and science student with a scientist parent who can help at home, but I'm not sure this is such a good plan. Also considering taking Alg2 over the summer, which DC's counselor has okayed.

At Blair, that's the norm. Kids who are currently taking A2 and are strong at math are recommended for AP Physics in 9th.

No, that’s not the norm. Who would recommend those kids to take AP physics, the high school counselor, the tiger parents?

Do those strong students also take physics C? If they don’t, what’s the point of taking the less math intensive and less rigorous physics class? If they do, why take three years of physics with so much overlap?

No matter how you look at it, AP physics 1&2 make very little sense for a strong math student, it’s generally geared towards non STEM majors. It makes even less sense to take it concurent with algebra 2, while not having the required foundation for the class.

Who would recommend AP Physics 1 for ninth graders taking Algebra 2, you ask? Blair administration, for one, until very recently. There have been discussions in DCUM on this very madness:

http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1034358.page#21918207
http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/75/1035921.page#22014688

http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/345/850028.page#16446296
http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/375/850028.page#16450565


https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/904189.page

And Wheaton still does it; see "Engineering Application Program Course Sequence" table at

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/schools/wheatonhs/academies/Applicationprograms/

(Don't be misled by the math course name (Magnet precalculus) that ninth graders are placed in. It is a combined Algebra 2/precalculus course over two years - ninth and tenth grades, intended for students that did Geometry in eighth grade. So they are really doing Algebra 2 at the same time as AP Physics 1. They might as well call Magnet Precalc A/B as Magnet Algebra 2 A/B.)

-- DP

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:B-CC had a meeting about course registration for rising 10th grade parents this week and they said honors physics is a prerequisite for AP physics. That seemed strange to me because it means you’d have to take physics twice if you want to do AP, but a parent asked for clarification and they confirmed that a sophomore wouldn’t be able to take AP physics because they have to take honors physics first. Anyone else hearing this at their HS?

Yes, @Blair 9th graders in Hon Algebra 2 are encouraged to jump straight into AP Physics.

I don't know where you are getting this but multiple admins, teachers and students spoke at the CAP parent meeting to actively discourage 9th graders in Alg. 2 from taking AP Physics because so many students were having a poor experience and struggling.

+100 This is my guess too. A few ninth graders might do well but many will struggle and get turned off physics. You also would need an excellent teacher, which may be the case at Blair, I don’t know, as 9th graders are not yet adept at figuring things out on their own. AP Physics 1 is not an easy class. It is a little bit easier than AP Physics C Mechanics and a lot easier than AP Physics C E&M. It is not an easy AP by any means and best to take it in 10th or 11th grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My current 9th grader, currently taking honors geometry and honors biology, wants to take AP Physics next year while also taking Algebra 2, because "all" of their friends will be in AP physics in 10th. My experience with my older kids is that they and most of their MoCo peers took chemistry in 10th grade, regardless of which science they'd had in 9th (i.e. regardless of whether they were on the faster or slower math track). (Clearly none of them was in a STEM magnet program.) Does anyone know if AP physics requires the completion of Algebra 2, or if it would at least be a good idea to have this math under their belt? DC is a pretty strong math and science student with a scientist parent who can help at home, but I'm not sure this is such a good plan. Also considering taking Alg2 over the summer, which DC's counselor has okayed.

At Blair, that's the norm. Kids who are currently taking A2 and are strong at math are recommended for AP Physics in 9th.

No, that’s not the norm. Who would recommend those kids to take AP physics, the high school counselor, the tiger parents?

Do those strong students also take physics C? If they don’t, what’s the point of taking the less math intensive and less rigorous physics class? If they do, why take three years of physics with so much overlap?

No matter how you look at it, AP physics 1&2 make very little sense for a strong math student, it’s generally geared towards non STEM majors. It makes even less sense to take it concurent with algebra 2, while not having the required foundation for the class.

Who would recommend AP Physics 1 for ninth graders taking Algebra 2, you ask? Blair administration, for one, until very recently. There have been discussions in DCUM on this very madness:

http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/1034358.page#21918207
http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/75/1035921.page#22014688

http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/345/850028.page#16446296
http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/375/850028.page#16450565


https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/904189.page

And Wheaton still does it; see "Engineering Application Program Course Sequence" table at

https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/schools/wheatonhs/academies/Applicationprograms/

(Don't be misled by the math course name (Magnet precalculus) that ninth graders are placed in. It is a combined Algebra 2/precalculus course over two years - ninth and tenth grades, intended for students that did Geometry in eighth grade. So they are really doing Algebra 2 at the same time as AP Physics 1. They might as well call Magnet Precalc A/B as Magnet Algebra 2 A/B.)

-- DP

I don’t see a good argument for for that sequence, note that they recommend physics 1, but not physics 2, and then physics c optional as a senior.

Of course it depends on the student and intended major, but I’d think that a well rounded high school science education would include APs in physics, chemistry and biology. The forth year would be either another (post) AP or an introductory (honors) high school course.

Can you give a good argument on why it’s worth doing physics 1, that’s not essentially “someone recommended it”? As I said earlier it’s not as riguros as physics c, it takes too much time, and there’s too much overlap between the two.

On top of it, if taken concurrently with algebra 2 means there’s a very weak foundation in trigonometry for circular motion, oscillations and waves, as well as matrices for vector analysis (momentum, forces). In addition you’d be taking a no calculus based class so the treatment of energy and dynamics will be taught at a very simplistic level.