New Budget Recommendations -- eliminate AAP busing and centers

[Anonymous]

Also, anyone reading this board is unlikely to be FARMS, and understands exactly how the system works (and if they are FARMS, GMU will waive the WISC fee).

[Anonymous]

Life is not fair. My child sucks at sports but his grades are fabulous. He has to work at it. He stays after school for French club and the honor society.

Nothing but hard work, I do not let those around him define him.

[Anonymous]

HHI=High Household Income

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:HHI = Household Income

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:FCPS is also highly regarded, albeit public school system. FCPS could save lots of money and be a trailblazer by walking away from both AP and IB.

So walk away from academic rigor and excellence to save money. That's one way to live...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:HHI=High Household Income

Ah, thanks. That makes sense, though I think this same topic came up some weeks ago with posters noting that FCPS does more than many to identify and support disadvantaged or underrepresented groups through programs like Young Scholars.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

+1. Travel soccer teams have athletically talented kids (I could have my kids take hours of private lessons a day and they still wouldn't get in), youth orchestras have musically talented kids, and AAP has -- wait for it-- academically talented kids. According to a combination of work samples, teacher recommendations and standardized tests. And if you don't like the standardized tests, you can get an IQ test done and prove the COGAT wrong. So AAP is not just a "superior in their parents minds" thing. It's a designation that kids get after a vote by an objective panel weighs a number of factors. So yes, GE kids have been determined BY FCPS not to be as academically talented as the cutoff for the AAP pool. But, it is also a fact that any team, group or program that is not open admission (or lottery) will select some kids and not others based on talent and performance. Why is this okay in athletics but not academics? I don't accuse parents in my community of a "superiority complex" when they talk about their child making a "cut" team for a high school sport. I usually think, "Larla is a nice kid. Good for her." It takes nothing away for my kids to recognize that other kids are talented-- sometimes in areas where my kids struggle. It's not a zero sum game.

I wasn't going to come back to this thread after posting a long while back, but am glad I did. The bold statement is so true. Thanks to this PP.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

+1. Travel soccer teams have athletically talented kids (I could have my kids take hours of private lessons a day and they still wouldn't get in), youth orchestras have musically talented kids, and AAP has -- wait for it-- academically talented kids. According to a combination of work samples, teacher recommendations and standardized tests. And if you don't like the standardized tests, you can get an IQ test done and prove the COGAT wrong. So AAP is not just a "superior in their parents minds" thing. It's a designation that kids get after a vote by an objective panel weighs a number of factors. So yes, GE kids have been determined BY FCPS not to be as academically talented as the cutoff for the AAP pool. But, it is also a fact that any team, group or program that is not open admission (or lottery) will select some kids and not others based on talent and performance. Why is this okay in athletics but not academics? I don't accuse parents in my community of a "superiority complex" when they talk about their child making a "cut" team for a high school sport. I usually think, "Larla is a nice kid. Good for her." It takes nothing away for my kids to recognize that other kids are talented-- sometimes in areas where my kids struggle. It's not a zero sum game.

I wasn't going to come back to this thread after posting a long while back, but am glad I did. The bold statement is so true. Thanks to this PP.

+1

Where is the head slap emoji??

Travel soccer is within the boundaries of a PRIVATE entity paid for separately by parents.

We are discussing PUBLIC school and publicly funded programs.

[Anonymous]

If people were being honest, they would acknowledge that the impact of sorting kids into AAP and GenEd tracks at public schools is of a different nature than a kid making a travel soccer team. Not that one predicts success, or the other guarantees failure, but the message delivered and longer-term consequences are more significant.

But, please, carry on with the rationalizations. It's fairly amusing to watch the rhetorical somersaults when the truth is fairly obvious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If people were being honest, they would acknowledge that the impact of sorting kids into AAP and GenEd tracks at public schools is of a different nature than a kid making a travel soccer team. Not that one predicts success, or the other guarantees failure, but the message delivered and longer-term consequences are more significant.

But, please, carry on with the rationalizations. It's fairly amusing to watch the rhetorical somersaults when the truth is fairly obvious.

+100

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

+1. Travel soccer teams have athletically talented kids (I could have my kids take hours of private lessons a day and they still wouldn't get in), youth orchestras have musically talented kids, and AAP has -- wait for it-- academically talented kids. According to a combination of work samples, teacher recommendations and standardized tests. And if you don't like the standardized tests, you can get an IQ test done and prove the COGAT wrong. So AAP is not just a "superior in their parents minds" thing. It's a designation that kids get after a vote by an objective panel weighs a number of factors. So yes, GE kids have been determined BY FCPS not to be as academically talented as the cutoff for the AAP pool. But, it is also a fact that any team, group or program that is not open admission (or lottery) will select some kids and not others based on talent and performance. Why is this okay in athletics but not academics? I don't accuse parents in my community of a "superiority complex" when they talk about their child making a "cut" team for a high school sport. I usually think, "Larla is a nice kid. Good for her." It takes nothing away for my kids to recognize that other kids are talented-- sometimes in areas where my kids struggle. It's not a zero sum game.

I wasn't going to come back to this thread after posting a long while back, but am glad I did. The bold statement is so true. Thanks to this PP.

+1

Where is the head slap emoji??

Travel soccer is within the boundaries of a PRIVATE entity paid for separately by parents.

We are discussing PUBLIC school and publicly funded programs.

I read it more as not everyone can or will qualify for the travel team, same for AAP. It's not about parents thinking their child is superior.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The schools used to require certain grades in honors and teacher recommendations to be eligible to take AP classes. Many people would argue that that was a better system, because the classes were filled with kids who actually wanted to and could do the work. The only reason they dropped the pre-reqs was to increase their standings in the Washington Post high school rankings.

Many people would argue that the system as it stands today is far better. AP and Honors classes are still filled with kids able, eager, and enthusiastic to do the work. The difference is, the classes are open to far more students than they used to be. The curriculum and instruction is still the same - AP curriculum is standardized throughout the U.S. and the exams are all the same.

Of course, there will always be the disgruntled parents who feel that these classes should only be reserved for certain kids, as they currently are in elementary and middle school. Thankfully, high school is when those parents stop getting their way.

AP courses are supposed to be college level courses that prepare students to do well on a college level exam. Most schools used to require that students be ready for college level coursework to take AP classes. Then Jay Mathews started ranking schools on how many kids took AP classes and all requirements were dropped so that schools could attain a higher rank by simply allowing and encouraging any and all kids to take AP courses.

When half students in the class are not prepared for the level and pace of instruction in the class, it is frustrating for the teacher and for the students who are ready. AP courses are not what they used to be: many colleges have reduced the amount and type of credit and/or placement they will allow for AP courses. Colleges are recognizing that AP courses are not truly college level courses anymore.

I have a college freshman and a HS Junior and their experiences in the Honors and AP classes is that the vast majority of the class is ready, eager and willing to do the work, there will always be a few slackers (even in a test in program). They have had a very positive experience. The college freshman was granted enough credits to be considered a sophomore and they filled all but one of his non-major course requirements and one year of calculus. He has also found himself to be very well prepared.

A lot of the big state schools still give credit and placement but the more selective schools are giving less than they used to. Go to the websites of any top 20 or 25 schools and they have it spelled out. A kid in our neighborhood transferred from a big state school to UVa. The state school had given him sophomore status because of his many 5s on AP exams, but UVa gave much less credit, with most of it being elective credit. AP courses today are just not meeting the standards of the more selective schools.

Um, last I checked, UVA is a big state school.

UVa is on the smaller side for state universities with only 12,000 some undergrads. The big state schools have more like 30-45,000.

Check out the websites of different schools and you'll see a lot of variation in how much credit and placement they'll give for AP. It has changed a lot in the past 10-15 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

+1. Travel soccer teams have athletically talented kids (I could have my kids take hours of private lessons a day and they still wouldn't get in), youth orchestras have musically talented kids, and AAP has -- wait for it-- academically talented kids. According to a combination of work samples, teacher recommendations and standardized tests. And if you don't like the standardized tests, you can get an IQ test done and prove the COGAT wrong. So AAP is not just a "superior in their parents minds" thing. It's a designation that kids get after a vote by an objective panel weighs a number of factors. So yes, GE kids have been determined BY FCPS not to be as academically talented as the cutoff for the AAP pool. But, it is also a fact that any team, group or program that is not open admission (or lottery) will select some kids and not others based on talent and performance. Why is this okay in athletics but not academics? I don't accuse parents in my community of a "superiority complex" when they talk about their child making a "cut" team for a high school sport. I usually think, "Larla is a nice kid. Good for her." It takes nothing away for my kids to recognize that other kids are talented-- sometimes in areas where my kids struggle. It's not a zero sum game.

I wasn't going to come back to this thread after posting a long while back, but am glad I did. The bold statement is so true. Thanks to this PP.

+1

Where is the head slap emoji??

Travel soccer is within the boundaries of a PRIVATE entity paid for separately by parents.

We are discussing PUBLIC school and publicly funded programs.

I read it more as not everyone can or will qualify for the travel team, same for AAP. It's not about parents thinking their child is superior.

But this is a thread discussing the funding of public school programs. The comparisons don't measure up and are being used as theatrics to detract from the actual discussion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

+1. Travel soccer teams have athletically talented kids (I could have my kids take hours of private lessons a day and they still wouldn't get in), youth orchestras have musically talented kids, and AAP has -- wait for it-- academically talented kids. According to a combination of work samples, teacher recommendations and standardized tests. And if you don't like the standardized tests, you can get an IQ test done and prove the COGAT wrong. So AAP is not just a "superior in their parents minds" thing. It's a designation that kids get after a vote by an objective panel weighs a number of factors. So yes, GE kids have been determined BY FCPS not to be as academically talented as the cutoff for the AAP pool. But, it is also a fact that any team, group or program that is not open admission (or lottery) will select some kids and not others based on talent and performance. Why is this okay in athletics but not academics? I don't accuse parents in my community of a "superiority complex" when they talk about their child making a "cut" team for a high school sport. I usually think, "Larla is a nice kid. Good for her." It takes nothing away for my kids to recognize that other kids are talented-- sometimes in areas where my kids struggle. It's not a zero sum game.

I wasn't going to come back to this thread after posting a long while back, but am glad I did. The bold statement is so true. Thanks to this PP.

+1

Where is the head slap emoji??

Travel soccer is within the boundaries of a PRIVATE entity paid for separately by parents.

We are discussing PUBLIC school and publicly funded programs.

I read it more as not everyone can or will qualify for the travel team, same for AAP. It's not about parents thinking their child is superior.

But this is a thread discussing the funding of public school programs. The comparisons don't measure up and are being used as theatrics to detract from the actual discussion.

Every single thread on this forum degenerates to the same old back and forth, this thread strayed away from finances more than once. From the AAP label to the validity of AP courses in today's college scene. If you are willing to call those theatrics as well you have a point.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

+1. Travel soccer teams have athletically talented kids (I could have my kids take hours of private lessons a day and they still wouldn't get in), youth orchestras have musically talented kids, and AAP has -- wait for it-- academically talented kids. According to a combination of work samples, teacher recommendations and standardized tests. And if you don't like the standardized tests, you can get an IQ test done and prove the COGAT wrong. So AAP is not just a "superior in their parents minds" thing. It's a designation that kids get after a vote by an objective panel weighs a number of factors. So yes, GE kids have been determined BY FCPS not to be as academically talented as the cutoff for the AAP pool. But, it is also a fact that any team, group or program that is not open admission (or lottery) will select some kids and not others based on talent and performance. Why is this okay in athletics but not academics? I don't accuse parents in my community of a "superiority complex" when they talk about their child making a "cut" team for a high school sport. I usually think, "Larla is a nice kid. Good for her." It takes nothing away for my kids to recognize that other kids are talented-- sometimes in areas where my kids struggle. It's not a zero sum game.

I wasn't going to come back to this thread after posting a long while back, but am glad I did. The bold statement is so true. Thanks to this PP.

+1

Where is the head slap emoji??

Travel soccer is within the boundaries of a PRIVATE entity paid for separately by parents.

We are discussing PUBLIC school and publicly funded programs.

I read it more as not everyone can or will qualify for the travel team, same for AAP. It's not about parents thinking their child is superior.

But this is a thread discussing the funding of public school programs. The comparisons don't measure up and are being used as theatrics to detract from the actual discussion.

Every single thread on this forum degenerates to the same old back and forth, this thread strayed away from finances more than once. From the AAP label to the validity of AP courses in today's college scene. If you are willing to call those theatrics as well you have a point.

Yet those are still related to public schools.