MCPS policy on not returning quizzes, tests and exams to students

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, the second formative in 7th grade math is this week. I have no idea whether this one will be a county formative or school-based one. The first one was a county formative, so can't use that to help prepare since it didn't come home. And it's all the same topic. What a shame. Stupid system.

Why don't you use the study guide from the teacher to study for the test?

Because my daughter wasn't issued one. They are county-wide. It is a teacher's decision.

[Anonymous]

They are not county-wide

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, the second formative in 7th grade math is this week. I have no idea whether this one will be a county formative or school-based one. The first one was a county formative, so can't use that to help prepare since it didn't come home. And it's all the same topic. What a shame. Stupid system.

Why don't you use the study guide from the teacher to study for the test?

We do. But having seen other formatives and how they throw in problems that haven't been practices in homework, it's best to practice all kinds of problems. The study guide didn't reflect some of the problems my kid had difficulty with and I'd really like to know how he did on those types of problems on the last formative. But since I haven't seen it I don't know. And he is not studying independently as a high school or college student would. So I want all the tools I can get to cover the material.

I get lost in the BS MCPS lingo - but a formative is different from a summative in the since that one or the other is a county assessment that is required to stay secure and does not come home.

An issue that I have discovered with the new 2.0 curriculum being implemented last year in Algebra and this year in Geometry, not all schools and teachers are on board with the revisions. Some teachers (either through lack of training or lack of access to the materials) are not changing their lesson plans from the previous courses. A child might do well on the classroom assessments but then have a great disadvantage on the county assessments. My child is also coming home from tests that had problems that he had not seen before.

Someone in this county should be held accountable for students who are not taught the new 2.0 curriculums. A clue would be low performing classes and schools on the county wide assessments. Unfortunately, these are the assessments that do not come home and carry the most weight in the course.

[Anonymous]

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

We're not just talking about one final exam, though, are we. We're talking about every county wide test, which are so frequent that some have already happened and it's not even October.

In what classes have there already been county-wide tests?

The USH 9 classes have one Unit a month (2 units per MP). If a student takes USH 9 or Honors USH 9, they take a County-made unit test in late September and another in late October. That's just one subject.

I believe that Math and FL also have units that are shorter than one MP.

[Anonymous]

It is just a lazy policy because MCPS doesn't want to change the tests each year. They rather keep them stale and parents not informed. But if you want to leave your job early multiple times a month so the teacher can show you the test you can. Don't they make that convenient?? Oh and the teachers get REALLY annoyed if you ask to come in for every test you can't see. Like we should just be okay with a little sheet that shows how many my child got right. Oh, and make sure you don't try to write a math problem down so your child can redo it at home to help them learn. It is not allowed. And make sure to ask if the teacher has the kids redo the problems in the class before moving onto the next section so they can understand what they did wrong. Most don't. Once the test is returned for 5-10 minutes to the child, they wipe the slate clean.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is just a lazy policy because MCPS doesn't want to change the tests each year. They rather keep them stale and parents not informed. But if you want to leave your job early multiple times a month so the teacher can show you the test you can. Don't they make that convenient?? Oh and the teachers get REALLY annoyed if you ask to come in for every test you can't see. Like we should just be okay with a little sheet that shows how many my child got right. Oh, and make sure you don't try to write a math problem down so your child can redo it at home to help them learn. It is not allowed. And make sure to ask if the teacher has the kids redo the problems in the class before moving onto the next section so they can understand what they did wrong. Most don't. Once the test is returned for 5-10 minutes to the child, they wipe the slate clean.

You're a hot neurotic mess.

Be prepared to find an MD who will sign off on a diagnosis of severe anxiety for your child as you make your kid school-phobic.

tightly wound, eh?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is just a lazy policy because MCPS doesn't want to change the tests each year. They rather keep them stale and parents not informed. But if you want to leave your job early multiple times a month so the teacher can show you the test you can. Don't they make that convenient?? Oh and the teachers get REALLY annoyed if you ask to come in for every test you can't see. Like we should just be okay with a little sheet that shows how many my child got right. Oh, and make sure you don't try to write a math problem down so your child can redo it at home to help them learn. It is not allowed. And make sure to ask if the teacher has the kids redo the problems in the class before moving onto the next section so they can understand what they did wrong. Most don't. Once the test is returned for 5-10 minutes to the child, they wipe the slate clean.

I teach for MCPS. I never get annoyed that parents want to see the County tests. I try to make it both painless and useful. I make appointments before school (as early as 6:30 AM), during my lunch period, and after school for parent's convenience. I prefer that the studen attend with the parent and I walk through each test item as well as the study guide that was provided and any related classwork, HW, or prior assessments.

I do get annoyed if parents blame me for the County policy, try to get me to violate the policy by sending the test home with the kid or scanned in an email, or attempt to violate the security of the test by taking notes or cell phone pics.

Luckily, most parents understand there is no value in shooting the messenger. But I get 3-4 parents a year who try to bully me because they know they can't bully Central office.

By the way, before I became a PS teacher, I worked for an educational testing and software company. I was trained to write good test questions. It took a long time to learn. It takes a long time to craft and field test each item. It's expensive to pay the test writers and run the field tests. MoCo parents already complain about the salaries of Central Office staff. Imagine how much more it would cost to write a new county test for each unit every year for 5-7 years to build up a sufficiently varied pool of high quality items. Or picture the outcry on DCUM if high-performing teachers were paid each summer to write hundreds of new test items.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is just a lazy policy because MCPS doesn't want to change the tests each year. They rather keep them stale and parents not informed. But if you want to leave your job early multiple times a month so the teacher can show you the test you can. Don't they make that convenient?? Oh and the teachers get REALLY annoyed if you ask to come in for every test you can't see. Like we should just be okay with a little sheet that shows how many my child got right. Oh, and make sure you don't try to write a math problem down so your child can redo it at home to help them learn. It is not allowed. And make sure to ask if the teacher has the kids redo the problems in the class before moving onto the next section so they can understand what they did wrong. Most don't. Once the test is returned for 5-10 minutes to the child, they wipe the slate clean.

Your DC's teacher signed a legal document that he or she would keep the test secure or face disciplinary action including termination and the cost of rewriting the test.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is just a lazy policy because MCPS doesn't want to change the tests each year. They rather keep them stale and parents not informed. But if you want to leave your job early multiple times a month so the teacher can show you the test you can. Don't they make that convenient?? Oh and the teachers get REALLY annoyed if you ask to come in for every test you can't see. Like we should just be okay with a little sheet that shows how many my child got right. Oh, and make sure you don't try to write a math problem down so your child can redo it at home to help them learn. It is not allowed. And make sure to ask if the teacher has the kids redo the problems in the class before moving onto the next section so they can understand what they did wrong. Most don't. Once the test is returned for 5-10 minutes to the child, they wipe the slate clean.

You're a hot neurotic mess.

Be prepared to find an MD who will sign off on a diagnosis of severe anxiety for your child as you make your kid school-phobic.

tightly wound, eh?

I guess I am tightly wound too because I don't like the policy either. For parents like you who don't give two craps where their kids are struggling, it is no big deal. My child struggled with certain concepts and unless i physically went in and saw with my own eyes, I had no idea how to help at home. Once the material is covered, the teachers do not care who understood and who didn't. They move on whether kids are struggling or not because they have to. I have one child in private and not only do they receive every test, quiz and project back, they must do all test corrections and returned it with a parent signature in 48hrs. I also know many people in nearby and faraway counties who also get returned tests home. Why MCPS can not do this but yet wonder why their final exams scores are horrific, is beyond me. I guess they will just slowly get rid of all tests that kids do bad on. Should "really" help our kids in college and the real world.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is just a lazy policy because MCPS doesn't want to change the tests each year. They rather keep them stale and parents not informed. But if you want to leave your job early multiple times a month so the teacher can show you the test you can. Don't they make that convenient?? Oh and the teachers get REALLY annoyed if you ask to come in for every test you can't see. Like we should just be okay with a little sheet that shows how many my child got right. Oh, and make sure you don't try to write a math problem down so your child can redo it at home to help them learn. It is not allowed. And make sure to ask if the teacher has the kids redo the problems in the class before moving onto the next section so they can understand what they did wrong. Most don't. Once the test is returned for 5-10 minutes to the child, they wipe the slate clean.

Your DC's teacher signed a legal document that he or she would keep the test secure or face disciplinary action including termination and the cost of rewriting the test.

This post just speaks volumes how lame Montgomery County public schools are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is just a lazy policy because MCPS doesn't want to change the tests each year. They rather keep them stale and parents not informed. But if you want to leave your job early multiple times a month so the teacher can show you the test you can. Don't they make that convenient?? Oh and the teachers get REALLY annoyed if you ask to come in for every test you can't see. Like we should just be okay with a little sheet that shows how many my child got right. Oh, and make sure you don't try to write a math problem down so your child can redo it at home to help them learn. It is not allowed. And make sure to ask if the teacher has the kids redo the problems in the class before moving onto the next section so they can understand what they did wrong. Most don't. Once the test is returned for 5-10 minutes to the child, they wipe the slate clean.

Your DC's teacher signed a legal document that he or she would keep the test secure or face disciplinary action including termination and the cost of rewriting the test.

This post just speaks volumes how lame Montgomery County public schools are.

What do you suggest teachers do? Risk their jobs because the parent spare time at home to Google a similar math problem that tests the same skill/concept?

[Anonymous]

I would understand this policy if they were still typing up tests and running them on ditto machines. But technology has come a long way since then. It seems like there should be an easy and cost-effective way to draw up new tests. Perhaps not but maybe it's something the county should look into if they haven't already.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It is just a lazy policy because MCPS doesn't want to change the tests each year. They rather keep them stale and parents not informed. But if you want to leave your job early multiple times a month so the teacher can show you the test you can. Don't they make that convenient?? Oh and the teachers get REALLY annoyed if you ask to come in for every test you can't see. Like we should just be okay with a little sheet that shows how many my child got right. Oh, and make sure you don't try to write a math problem down so your child can redo it at home to help them learn. It is not allowed. And make sure to ask if the teacher has the kids redo the problems in the class before moving onto the next section so they can understand what they did wrong. Most don't. Once the test is returned for 5-10 minutes to the child, they wipe the slate clean.

I teach for MCPS. I never get annoyed that parents want to see the County tests. I try to make it both painless and useful. I make appointments before school (as early as 6:30 AM), during my lunch period, and after school for parent's convenience. I prefer that the studen attend with the parent and I walk through each test item as well as the study guide that was provided and any related classwork, HW, or prior assessments.

I do get annoyed if parents blame me for the County policy, try to get me to violate the policy by sending the test home with the kid or scanned in an email, or attempt to violate the security of the test by taking notes or cell phone pics.

Luckily, most parents understand there is no value in shooting the messenger. But I get 3-4 parents a year who try to bully me because they know they can't bully Central office.

By the way, before I became a PS teacher, I worked for an educational testing and software company. I was trained to write good test questions. It took a long time to learn. It takes a long time to craft and field test each item. It's expensive to pay the test writers and run the field tests. MoCo parents already complain about the salaries of Central Office staff. Imagine how much more it would cost to write a new county test for each unit every year for 5-7 years to build up a sufficiently varied pool of high quality items. Or picture the outcry on DCUM if high-performing teachers were paid each summer to write hundreds of new test items.

Teacher, thank you for your wonderful response. You sound like the kind of teacher any student would be lucky to have. Like another pp, we have one student in MCPS and one in private. Although it is possible to see the tests, it took us years to realize that this was an option & it took years to understand that there is not always a thorough review of missed work. After 6 years in MCPS, we are still paying for our earlier oversights - our child was passed up in "honors" classes with no attention to the basics of grammar. We've spent thousands trying to remediate this, and sadly we see the same issues with our younger child. It is very hard to "remediate" at home if both parents work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would understand this policy if they were still typing up tests and running them on ditto machines. But technology has come a long way since then. It seems like there should be an easy and cost-effective way to draw up new tests. Perhaps not but maybe it's something the county should look into if they haven't already.

Most other districts have already figured this out. MCPS is more concerned with covering up their failures, not encouraging them.