Black enrollment falls below 8% for every top 20 ranked liberal arts college in the country

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The average Spelman/Howard (traditionally considered the best of the group) entering student is not going to get into any of these schools.

25-75% SAT at Spelman: 1128-1303
ACT: 22-29
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 25%


25-75% SAT at Howard: 1050-1250
ACT: 22-28
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: no info, but average GPA is 3.75 which isn't competitive for any of these LACs

25-75% SAT at Williams: 1500-1560
ACT: 34-35
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 89%

25-75% SAT at Richmond: 1430-1510
ACT: 33-35
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 70%

Actually many Spelman students are choosing between these schools and Spelman. Spelman is getting the best of the best but they also accept more students with potential.

There is more to intelligence than SAT scores. I work with some of the dumbest graduates and they are ivy grads. Smart but can't think themselves out of a paper bag. No common sense.

These gaps are large enough that we can say there is a gap in cognitive ability. Whatever intelligence people were blessed with, the group with 1560 SAT scores have developed it more than the ones with 1240 SAT scores

College Board did a study that showed racial SAT score gaps shrink substantially or disappear when students attend the same schools, take the same advanced courses, and have comparable test preparation. The study demonstrated that the observed gap is explained by differences in educational opportunity.

PP here.

OK. I agree. If you raise non-asian children the way asians raise their children, you get similar results. Or at least more similar results.

The fact is that kids of the same SES still have these large racial gaps. That isn't an opportunity gap, that is an effort gap. A cultural gap.

You’re conceding the key point and then ignoring it. If racial SAT gaps shrink or disappear when students attend the same schools, take the same advanced courses, and get the same prep, then opportunity clearly drives the gap not culture.

Higher SES does not mean same opportunity. If it were only due to culture or student effort, the gap wouldn't close when given the same opportunities.

It doesn't close; it shrinks.

At any given school, the asian students tend to outperform the rest of the students. This is effort and culture.

How many schools out there have a substantial Asian and black student population? Most black students don’t go to good schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The average Spelman/Howard (traditionally considered the best of the group) entering student is not going to get into any of these schools.

25-75% SAT at Spelman: 1128-1303
ACT: 22-29
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 25%


25-75% SAT at Howard: 1050-1250
ACT: 22-28
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: no info, but average GPA is 3.75 which isn't competitive for any of these LACs

25-75% SAT at Williams: 1500-1560
ACT: 34-35
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 89%

25-75% SAT at Richmond: 1430-1510
ACT: 33-35
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 70%

Actually many Spelman students are choosing between these schools and Spelman. Spelman is getting the best of the best but they also accept more students with potential.

There is more to intelligence than SAT scores. I work with some of the dumbest graduates and they are ivy grads. Smart but can't think themselves out of a paper bag. No common sense.

These gaps are large enough that we can say there is a gap in cognitive ability. Whatever intelligence people were blessed with, the group with 1560 SAT scores have developed it more than the ones with 1240 SAT scores

College Board did a study that showed racial SAT score gaps shrink substantially or disappear when students attend the same schools, take the same advanced courses, and have comparable test preparation. The study demonstrated that the observed gap is explained by differences in educational opportunity.

That’s the exact opposite of every study I’ve ever seen. Poor whites and Asians (<30k HHI) outperform the most affluent black students (250k HHI) on the SAT. I’d be interested in seeing this study if it exists.

Did not outperform mine

And it feels SO good being able to say that. I spent my entire parenting life getting my kids ready for your attacks. I went through it at a T10 when I was younger. You people f'd with me the entire time.

Now I have black children in top schools who got there with 99th percentile scores, AP and IB tassles, and the same dog whistle ECs you guys notice.

So, sitting here in my POS house in a middling neighborhood with a bus pass I feel smug as heck knowing I beat you.

But you know better than most that your kids are unicorns.
I wish them the best but top 1% is not that rare in some communities.
10% of asian kids get a 99th percentile test score.

Your single example doesn't really undermine the general argument being made above.

Got some support for that 10% of Asian kids number? My kids go to a top Bay Area private and I can say without a doubt that even among our privileged group far less than 10% of the Asian kids got anywhere near a top 1% score. A top 5% score maybe but not top 1%.

2022 SAT results

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The average Spelman/Howard (traditionally considered the best of the group) entering student is not going to get into any of these schools.

25-75% SAT at Spelman: 1128-1303
ACT: 22-29
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 25%


25-75% SAT at Howard: 1050-1250
ACT: 22-28
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: no info, but average GPA is 3.75 which isn't competitive for any of these LACs

25-75% SAT at Williams: 1500-1560
ACT: 34-35
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 89%

25-75% SAT at Richmond: 1430-1510
ACT: 33-35
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 70%

Actually many Spelman students are choosing between these schools and Spelman. Spelman is getting the best of the best but they also accept more students with potential.

There is more to intelligence than SAT scores. I work with some of the dumbest graduates and they are ivy grads. Smart but can't think themselves out of a paper bag. No common sense.

These gaps are large enough that we can say there is a gap in cognitive ability. Whatever intelligence people were blessed with, the group with 1560 SAT scores have developed it more than the ones with 1240 SAT scores

College Board did a study that showed racial SAT score gaps shrink substantially or disappear when students attend the same schools, take the same advanced courses, and have comparable test preparation. The study demonstrated that the observed gap is explained by differences in educational opportunity.

That’s the exact opposite of every study I’ve ever seen. Poor whites and Asians (<30k HHI) outperform the most affluent black students (250k HHI) on the SAT. I’d be interested in seeing this study if it exists.

Did not outperform mine

And it feels SO good being able to say that. I spent my entire parenting life getting my kids ready for your attacks. I went through it at a T10 when I was younger. You people f'd with me the entire time.

Now I have black children in top schools who got there with 99th percentile scores, AP and IB tassles, and the same dog whistle ECs you guys notice.

So, sitting here in my POS house in a middling neighborhood with a bus pass I feel smug as heck knowing I beat you.

But you know better than most that your kids are unicorns.
I wish them the best but top 1% is not that rare in some communities.
10% of asian kids get a 99th percentile test score.

Your single example doesn't really undermine the general argument being made above.

Got some support for that 10% of Asian kids number? My kids go to a top Bay Area private and I can say without a doubt that even among our privileged group far less than 10% of the Asian kids got anywhere near a top 1% score. A top 5% score maybe but not top 1%.

If 10% of the kids at your school are not getting at least 1520 on their SATs then you are NOT going to a top private in your area. The top 10% of the kids at some of the better BASE public schools around here are getting more than that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The average Spelman/Howard (traditionally considered the best of the group) entering student is not going to get into any of these schools.

25-75% SAT at Spelman: 1128-1303
ACT: 22-29
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 25%


25-75% SAT at Howard: 1050-1250
ACT: 22-28
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: no info, but average GPA is 3.75 which isn't competitive for any of these LACs

25-75% SAT at Williams: 1500-1560
ACT: 34-35
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 89%

25-75% SAT at Richmond: 1430-1510
ACT: 33-35
Ranked in top 10% of their HS class: 70%

Actually many Spelman students are choosing between these schools and Spelman. Spelman is getting the best of the best but they also accept more students with potential.

There is more to intelligence than SAT scores. I work with some of the dumbest graduates and they are ivy grads. Smart but can't think themselves out of a paper bag. No common sense.

These gaps are large enough that we can say there is a gap in cognitive ability. Whatever intelligence people were blessed with, the group with 1560 SAT scores have developed it more than the ones with 1240 SAT scores

College Board did a study that showed racial SAT score gaps shrink substantially or disappear when students attend the same schools, take the same advanced courses, and have comparable test preparation. The study demonstrated that the observed gap is explained by differences in educational opportunity.

PP here.

OK. I agree. If you raise non-asian children the way asians raise their children, you get similar results. Or at least more similar results.

The fact is that kids of the same SES still have these large racial gaps. That isn't an opportunity gap, that is an effort gap. A cultural gap.

You’re conceding the key point and then ignoring it. If racial SAT gaps shrink or disappear when students attend the same schools, take the same advanced courses, and get the same prep, then opportunity clearly drives the gap not culture.

Higher SES does not mean same opportunity. If it were only due to culture or student effort, the gap wouldn't close when given the same opportunities.

It doesn't close; it shrinks.

At any given school, the asian students tend to outperform the rest of the students. This is effort and culture.

How many schools out there have a substantial Asian and black student population? Most black students don’t go to good schools.

The studies I have seen compare asians and whites.

[Anonymous]

A couple of things are at play

1) Affirmative Action Ban

2) Kids are not even applying because of lower Black Enrollment, (From what i hear from friends at Penn, racism have gotten worse, they are still calling the Blacks who remain DEI students)

2) Kids are going to to Mid and Flagship State Colleges

3) Kids Are Going to HBCU, even Black immigrants (who generally but not always have higher test scores than Black American are choosing HBCU)