Noticing very chunky young kids

Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:In the same boat OP. We don’t withhold much of anything, they get a treat after dinner, and they have very low BMI. I don’t understand how children can become so overweight. It’s tragic and the parents should have to attend mandatory child nutrition classes.


I cook from scratch, don’t stock junk food but don’t withhold healthy food, have occasional treats, etc etc, and I have one 15th %ile kid who eats like a bird and one 90th %ile kid who will have thirds of chicken and rice and salad. It’s complicated.


What is complicated about this?? First off, because your kid is 90th percentile doesn’t mean he has high BMI, it’s how his weight is distributed relative to height. If he has high BMI, he is eating too much and you are responsible for making sure he cools it on the thirds or gets more exercise. Calories in calories out - IT IS NOT COMPLICATED FOR 8 YEAR OLDS


I think many parents don’t understand BMI vs. weight percentile. My teen’s weight percentile is 99% but his BMI is under 20 (and 50th percentile for kids BMI). Because he’s tall - so it makes sense that he’s relatively heavy.

And he also eats a ton compared to his younger siblings, because he NEEDS to eat a ton to support his current size and continued growth. His little sister doesn’t need to eat as much, and if I fed her exact same food in the exact same quantities as him, of course she’d get chunky. But I wouldn’t scratch my head and tell everyone “well I feed both of my kids the same and one is fat and one is thin! This is so darn complicated!”


DP, and I hate to break it to you, but it is in fact complicated.


I’m sorry, I guess I must be dense. Can you break it down for me further, please? What exactly is complicated about the concept of two entirely different people having two entirely different caloric needs?


Dense isn't the word I would have chosen, but your moral certitude could use a little examination. Here's a little tidbit, with the full article linked below.

"In the 2010s, as family doctors and school nurses across the country were instructing larger children to “eat less and exercise more,” clinicians and scientists who specialized in obesity were beginning to understand the phenomenon in a different way. They knew from seeing kids in the clinic that some of them couldn’t lose weight or maintain weight loss no matter how hard they tried. As far back as the early aughts, university hospitals had been performing bariatric surgeries on a small number of these children who fell into an obesity category the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention labels “severe.” It was, to a large degree, the study of post-bariatric patients that led doctors to see obesity not as a matter of simple arithmetic but as a “pathophysiological disorder” of the signals among a body’s gut, organs, hormones, fat tissue, and brain. Not all bariatric patients were able to maintain a lower weight, but for those who did, it seemed the operation had reduced their appetite — not only by limiting how much they could eat but also by rewiring their internal system. This new understanding, coupled with a goal of dispelling the belief that an inability to lose weight reflects a failure of will, led the American Medical Association to establish obesity as a disease in 2013.

But insight into obesity’s internal mechanisms did little to shed light on its prevalence. Why were there so many more kids with obesity? And why were so many of them so much more obese? In 2008, 36.5 percent of children ages 2 to 19 were overweight or obese; by 2018, that percentage was 41.5. Prevalence was climbing in children of every racial group, with the highest growth among Black, Hispanic, and Native American communities. By the end of 2020, children who were already obese were gaining weight at an accelerated rate. Pediatricians use growth charts to measure how a child’s size compares with the norm, and as the obesity epidemic escalated, they found themselves plotting more and more patients at the chart’s upper reaches, often above the 95th percentile of BMI, and sometimes off the grid entirely. When a phenomenon becomes so widespread, scientists look for causes beyond individuals and to their environment. The increase in obesity obviously correlated with the food kids ate — addictive, palatable, accessible at all hours — and their lack of physical activity: the phones, yes, but also reduced recess hours, unsafe neighborhoods, and lockdowns. Poverty and hunger correlate with obesity, as do other traumatic childhood experiences such as the death of a parent or sexual abuse. The frontier of obesity research lies here, in understanding how these external factors, as pervasive and variable as the weather, interact with each individual body — disrupting the metabolism, activating genes, or miscuing hunger signals — to produce the condition physicians call “obesity.”

A propensity for obesity is encoded in certain people’s genes. More than 70 genes correlated with obesity are already known, though the presence or absence of an obesity gene does not forecast a child’s future body shape. Nevertheless, the biggest known predictor of whether a child will develop obesity is if her parents have it; there is a 40 percent likelihood with one parent and an 80 percent likelihood with two. The question is which environmental factors (and in which combinations and at what levels of intensity) turn the genes “on.” Then, further into the realm of unknowns: What are the triggers for obesity beyond known genetic predispositions? Toxins in food may modify our DNA, an epigenetic disruption that can be passed to the next generation. Changes in an individual’s gut bacteria, caused by the biochemical composition of food, may have the downstream effect of altering metabolism. “There are many, many, many associations” between the environment and the body that can produce obesity, says Sarah Armstrong, a professor of pediatrics and an obesity specialist at Duke, “but no one smoking gun.”


https://www.thecut.com/article/weight-loss-drugs-ozempic-kids-childhood-obesity.html


There are thousands of genes associated with being overweight and obese. National health systems in many countries
that have conducted large studies including 100k-1M+ people to find causal variants for obesity/weight gain. Of course it’s is easier for some people to stay thin than others, but environmental factors and personal choices are very important. In the 1950s, only 10% of US adults were obese. Now around 40% of US adults are obese. Diets have become terrible, portion sizes have become much larger, people are getting less physical activity. Genes explain some variation between people in terms of susceptibility to weight gain, but they explain almost none of the exponential growth in obesity over the last 70 years. Population level genetic susceptibility to diseases doesn’t change much in two generations.


The truth and nothing but the truth so help me ja
Anonymous
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Anonymous wrote:I teach in a high poverty school and by 5th-6th grade, nearly every student is overweight. It's sad. Some of them stayed overweight as they grew but some of them were a normal weight and then just packed on the pounds.


Its all the cheap food loaded with unhealthy grains and sugar / high fructose corn syrup.

Healthy food is expensive.


No it isn’t. Can we just stop this? It is a cultural shift to eat crap as the majority of your food intake, especially for low income.


Haven’t you been reading thisnthread? It’s very clear that all the little UMC Larlo’s and Larla’s are getting fat because of their extra servings of chicken thighs and soup


I think it is both. Many people eat a lot of crap food, and many people overeat in general.

But wherever. All of your kids are likely to be fat eventually anyhow. It’s projected by 2050 >90% of adults will be overweight


That will certainly not happen with all of the highly effective weight loss medications currently on the market an in the development pipeline. Obesity will become a disease that is almost nonexistent among people that can afford these medications.


And those people will have other health issues as the story will unfold


Yes, I agree that there will definitely be some unforeseen long-term side effects. However, the benefits of taking GLP-1 inhibitors probably outweigh the risks. They appear create meaningful reductions for the risk of heart disease and cancer (-25% to -40%) in addition to helping with weight management. Just for perspective, reducing cancer by third would increase the average life expectancy of people taking the medication by around a year. So it will take very severe and frequent side effects to outweigh the health benefits.
Anonymous
There has been a big cultural shift in terms of social desirable/acceptable weight IMO. Especially with kids and teens. I grew up in a working class area of the Midwest (graduated HS 1996) and am raising my kids in an UMC suburban in the Southwest. For reference.

Growing up, most kids/teens were slim-average build, with downright skinny being the next most common. Then there were some chubby kids (not a lot), and rarely- an obese kid. Most of the chubby kids weren’t chubby until teen years and was considered social not ideal unless it was maybe a boy who played football.

At my kids’ HS, what we considered chubby back then is pretty much considered the ideal/norm for both boys and girls. Average-slim is considered skinny and not ideal- especially for boys. Still don’t see many obese kids in our area. All the teen girls try to exercise to build up a bigger butt/thighs and most of the boys are trying to gain weight to be bulkier looking.

I think ideal standards have shifted through the generations, and that is a part of this. Lots of skinny parents in my area (moms especially) and usually their teens are quite a bit heavier than they are.

I do wonder how things will go for these kids as adults. Most people gain weight over time/with age and if they are starting out heavier it seems to me they will have weight issues earlier than previous generations.

Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I teach in a high poverty school and by 5th-6th grade, nearly every student is overweight. It's sad. Some of them stayed overweight as they grew but some of them were a normal weight and then just packed on the pounds.


Schools are a huge part of the problem. Our high poverty school has free breakfast and lunch for all. It’s all garbage food. Considering the high obesity rate-kids aren’t starving, they are overfed. Schools need to keep it simple, have a couple heathy options and that is it. White milk, apples, peanut butter/cold cut sandwich. And no chips/candy as prizes and incentives for everything


You just made it clear you don't actually understand what food insecurity is like. It is not wasting away into thinness. It is the inability to afford healthy food. That can come with a lack of TIME as well. Shopping, cooking and food prep takes time, which many struggling families don't have. Have you ever thought about what the food in your house would look like if you have to take public transportation to collect it?

It is not simply "lazy poor parents feed their kids chips and soda all the time". It's much more complicated than that. But it gets you all off the hook to vote for people who might actually HELP these children if you can just blame their lazy, fat parents.



No, sorry, that is BS. Basics are cheap. Eggs, milk, oatmeal, beans are cheap. Immigrants and poor people in less developed countries manage to cook basic simple food on a tight budget. But American poor people can’t manage this. Easier to hit up the drive thru. It’s easy to eat a lot of junk when using the government money and free school food


I don’t know. I remember around 2008 when the housing crisis hit and my husband lost his company and left with some big debt. I could no longer go to the store and just buy groceries without looking at the prices. One time, and I’ll never forget it, I had $18 and some change to get two or three days worth of food. The generic whole wheat bread was twice as expensive as the generic white bread so I got the cheap white bread. I had to think of food that fills a stomach not quality food. Basic pasta with cheap tomato sauce, they had buy one hot dog pack get one free. No snacks or deserts. No fresh vegetables.

This lasted about three months of a very limited budget. I can’t imagine a lifetime. I suppose there are smart cooks out there who can take the basics and make something appetizing out of it but I couldn’t.


Poor quality low nutrient food can absolutely negatively impact your health in the long term. It will NOT, however, make you obese. Unless you eat TOO MUCH of it. Unless you think that a slice of white bread contains substantially more calories than wheat bread? (Hint: it doesn’t- maybe 10-20 calories per slice depending on the brand.)


There are foods that low income people count on that have a high caloric count. My small example was about poor quality food not excessive calories but I can see how that could happen over a long period of time. I know quite a few families from South America who are living in this country, some illegally, some not. They are all in good shape, not overweight. It’s more of an American problem not a genetic one.


You’ve never seen a fat Mexican ?


I don’t know anyone from Mexico. I’m not saying South Americans are all thin (Mexicans don’t come from South America). I’m just saying that low income doesn't always equal overweight.


How do you not know anyone from Mexico? What kind of rock do you live under?


I don’t know anyone personally from Mexico that I can think of. I have family members and friends from Puerto Rico, Peru, Colombia, Argentina, Brazil, but no Mexican friends.


It doesn’t have to be friends. You apparently have never met anyone from Mexico. Bizarre.
Anonymous
If you ever watched My 600 Lb Life, a lot of people experience serious abuse as children and it leads them to start over eating as kids. And then they stay obese throughout their teen and adult years too. There’s a lot of physical and sexual abuse of kids going on these days. People, even kids, overeat to cope.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:If you ever watched My 600 Lb Life, a lot of people experience serious abuse as children and it leads them to start over eating as kids. And then they stay obese throughout their teen and adult years too. There’s a lot of physical and sexual abuse of kids going on these days. People, even kids, overeat to cope.


Not more now than before though. That does not explain the current state. Something else has changed.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:In the same boat OP. We don’t withhold much of anything, they get a treat after dinner, and they have very low BMI. I don’t understand how children can become so overweight. It’s tragic and the parents should have to attend mandatory child nutrition classes.


I cook from scratch, don’t stock junk food but don’t withhold healthy food, have occasional treats, etc etc, and I have one 15th %ile kid who eats like a bird and one 90th %ile kid who will have thirds of chicken and rice and salad. It’s complicated.


What is complicated about this?? First off, because your kid is 90th percentile doesn’t mean he has high BMI, it’s how his weight is distributed relative to height. If he has high BMI, he is eating too much and you are responsible for making sure he cools it on the thirds or gets more exercise. Calories in calories out - IT IS NOT COMPLICATED FOR 8 YEAR OLDS


I think many parents don’t understand BMI vs. weight percentile. My teen’s weight percentile is 99% but his BMI is under 20 (and 50th percentile for kids BMI). Because he’s tall - so it makes sense that he’s relatively heavy.

And he also eats a ton compared to his younger siblings, because he NEEDS to eat a ton to support his current size and continued growth. His little sister doesn’t need to eat as much, and if I fed her exact same food in the exact same quantities as him, of course she’d get chunky. But I wouldn’t scratch my head and tell everyone “well I feed both of my kids the same and one is fat and one is thin! This is so darn complicated!”


DP, and I hate to break it to you, but it is in fact complicated.


I’m sorry, I guess I must be dense. Can you break it down for me further, please? What exactly is complicated about the concept of two entirely different people having two entirely different caloric needs?


It only gets "complicated" when one gets fat because they try to eat the same diet.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:If you ever watched My 600 Lb Life, a lot of people experience serious abuse as children and it leads them to start over eating as kids. And then they stay obese throughout their teen and adult years too. There’s a lot of physical and sexual abuse of kids going on these days. People, even kids, overeat to cope.


Not more now than before though. That does not explain the current state. Something else has changed.


Somehow it seems that people are much more willing to be the accomplices of these people. They seem to be home bound and have someone available to go on food runs for them and help them scrub in-between their fat rolls. In the past in a more hand to mouth existence who had the luxury to just sit in bed all day getting waited on hand and food? There was far less enabling of this type of behavior.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:I offer my kids the same meals. One is very hungry and wants a lot. One is not very hungry and does not want very much. They have similar activity levels. I’m serious — you guys thinks I should say “no you can’t have another bowl of soup, Larlo”?


Yes! And follow it up with "we feed our bodies enough that they take care of us, then we stop."
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:All the posters who are saying something along the lines of, “I let my kids eat whatever they want and they are still thin, I don’t understand how it’s possible for any kid to be overweight or obese” are in for a rude awakening when your kids head off to college. Armed without any substantive nutritional knowledge, 99% of the time these are the people who end up really struggling with their weight as adults.


I would kind of describe my family that way, but I think a lot of well-off/well-educated families just naturally have patterns where they eat meals together as a family, they have time to cook real food, days have structure and routine, kids go to bed at a specific time. Our kids go to camps in the summer where they are supervised and there are "snack times." We have healthy food in the pantry and the fridge along with junk food, and kids are used to eating both. My kids never drank a lot of soda or juice and now as older kids, 2 of the 3 largely prefer milk and water, even when offered soda. It is a much different reality from families that don't have any of these habits or patterns.


Why do so many of you people attribute your habits as the perfect housewife because you’re well-off/well-educated. It’s embarrassing. Many families regardless of their income have kids and parents with wildly different schedules. People with jobs sometimes travel or work long hours. Kids have activities that are scheduled through dinner time, even some for younger kids. And how about all those athletes with practices and games after school? STFU with your well educated people just naturally have patterns.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:All the posters who are saying something along the lines of, “I let my kids eat whatever they want and they are still thin, I don’t understand how it’s possible for any kid to be overweight or obese” are in for a rude awakening when your kids head off to college. Armed without any substantive nutritional knowledge, 99% of the time these are the people who end up really struggling with their weight as adults.


I would kind of describe my family that way, but I think a lot of well-off/well-educated families just naturally have patterns where they eat meals together as a family, they have time to cook real food, days have structure and routine, kids go to bed at a specific time. Our kids go to camps in the summer where they are supervised and there are "snack times." We have healthy food in the pantry and the fridge along with junk food, and kids are used to eating both. My kids never drank a lot of soda or juice and now as older kids, 2 of the 3 largely prefer milk and water, even when offered soda. It is a much different reality from families that don't have any of these habits or patterns.


Why do so many of you people attribute your habits as the perfect housewife because you’re well-off/well-educated. It’s embarrassing. Many families regardless of their income have kids and parents with wildly different schedules. People with jobs sometimes travel or work long hours. Kids have activities that are scheduled through dinner time, even some for younger kids. And how about all those athletes with practices and games after school? STFU with your well educated people just naturally have patterns.


So do batch cooking and eat leftovers or eat picnic dinners, etc. It’s not Chick-fil-A or nothing.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I offer my kids the same meals. One is very hungry and wants a lot. One is not very hungry and does not want very much. They have similar activity levels. I’m serious — you guys thinks I should say “no you can’t have another bowl of soup, Larlo”?


Yes! And follow it up with "we feed our bodies enough that they take care of us, then we stop."


And then all of us here at DCUM can look for mom’s post when kid starts sneaking out of bed at night to raid the fridge.

Awesome that you have all the answers, though.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:There has been a big cultural shift in terms of social desirable/acceptable weight IMO. Especially with kids and teens. I grew up in a working class area of the Midwest (graduated HS 1996) and am raising my kids in an UMC suburban in the Southwest. For reference.

Growing up, most kids/teens were slim-average build, with downright skinny being the next most common. Then there were some chubby kids (not a lot), and rarely- an obese kid. Most of the chubby kids weren’t chubby until teen years and was considered social not ideal unless it was maybe a boy who played football.

At my kids’ HS, what we considered chubby back then is pretty much considered the ideal/norm for both boys and girls. Average-slim is considered skinny and not ideal- especially for boys. Still don’t see many obese kids in our area. All the teen girls try to exercise to build up a bigger butt/thighs and most of the boys are trying to gain weight to be bulkier looking.

I think ideal standards have shifted through the generations, and that is a part of this. Lots of skinny parents in my area (moms especially) and usually their teens are quite a bit heavier than they are.

I do wonder how things will go for these kids as adults. Most people gain weight over time/with age and if they are starting out heavier it seems to me they will have weight issues earlier than previous generations.



Yes, this is how it is at our private school…the moms are so much thinner than their teenage kids. Not sure why this is? It was the opposite when I was a teen!
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:There has been a big cultural shift in terms of social desirable/acceptable weight IMO. Especially with kids and teens. I grew up in a working class area of the Midwest (graduated HS 1996) and am raising my kids in an UMC suburban in the Southwest. For reference.

Growing up, most kids/teens were slim-average build, with downright skinny being the next most common. Then there were some chubby kids (not a lot), and rarely- an obese kid. Most of the chubby kids weren’t chubby until teen years and was considered social not ideal unless it was maybe a boy who played football.

At my kids’ HS, what we considered chubby back then is pretty much considered the ideal/norm for both boys and girls. Average-slim is considered skinny and not ideal- especially for boys. Still don’t see many obese kids in our area. All the teen girls try to exercise to build up a bigger butt/thighs and most of the boys are trying to gain weight to be bulkier looking.

I think ideal standards have shifted through the generations, and that is a part of this. Lots of skinny parents in my area (moms especially) and usually their teens are quite a bit heavier than they are.

I do wonder how things will go for these kids as adults. Most people gain weight over time/with age and if they are starting out heavier it seems to me they will have weight issues earlier than previous generations.



Yes, this is how it is at our private school…the moms are so much thinner than their teenage kids. Not sure why this is? It was the opposite when I was a teen!


It’s the gentle parenting, kids in charge generation. “No that’s enough. Go play.” Used to be a totally acceptable thing to say to kids.
Anonymous
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
Anonymous wrote:I offer my kids the same meals. One is very hungry and wants a lot. One is not very hungry and does not want very much. They have similar activity levels. I’m serious — you guys thinks I should say “no you can’t have another bowl of soup, Larlo”?


Yes! And follow it up with "we feed our bodies enough that they take care of us, then we stop."


And then all of us here at DCUM can look for mom’s post when kid starts sneaking out of bed at night to raid the fridge.

Awesome that you have all the answers, though.


So you haven’t even tried it and you’re already making up ridiculous scenarios as to the inevitable, catastrophic results.
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