Swim Team Drama

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Parents complaining that their kid didn’t swim “X” stroke, parents telling the coach that their kid was VERY DISAPPOINTED that they didn’t make it to divisionals.

Otherwise it was a fun season.

Ugh my kid has been disappointed at not making it to divisionals and I’ve definitely mentioned that to others in conversation. It doesn’t mean I thought they should have been picked at all. The coach makes the right decisions and I’d never question them (and it’s been very clear cut) but it’s ok for kids to be disappointed!

Someone told me a parent was so disappointed, they sent a letter to the board for further investigation into how the lineup was chosen. It's ok for a kid to be disappointed. This is going to be the first of many disappointments in life. Move on. The parent needs to get a life!

DP. How do lineups get “chosen”? At our pool the top swimmers get to pick their strokes. If you have one of the top two times you are guaranteed your choice. The times can be from an A or B meet. If you’re lower down on the list you may not make it based on which strokes the top swimmers pick, but there’s not really any way to game this? Weird.

At our MCSL team for "A" meets, the coaches pick the lineups. It is always the top swimmers in those events, except for when you have swimmers are that have top 3 times in 4 events (MCSL has a 3 event max). Then it is a matter of trying to figure out how best to maximize points. For example in fly if the times for your 3 top swimmers are 27,28,29, and the other team has 24,23,24, then it's probably not worth burning that 27 swimmer in fly if they are better at their other events vs the other team. This only becomes a problem when you have a couple of exceptional swimmers in an age group and there's not a deep bench behind them. And yes, this can "hurt" that 27 fly swimmer IF they're on an improvement track and want to make individual all stars because there's only 6 meets possible (5A + divisionals) and you just "burned" one of them.

This is another area where I find MCSL to be so much more transparent than NVSL. Because an MCSL swimmer can swim 3/4 strokes plus the IM at A meets it is a lot harder to “game” someone out of points to help boost a coach’s favorite teammate.

Sounds like a lot more fun for the swimmers too, more opprtunities to compete and improve. Oh well. NVSL is going to stay in the dark ages.

Sounds like fewer kids swimming A meets and more kids getting discouraged and quitting

More opportunities for NVSL swimmers to get A meets/divisional slots than MCSL swimmers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents complaining that their kid didn’t swim “X” stroke, parents telling the coach that their kid was VERY DISAPPOINTED that they didn’t make it to divisionals.

Otherwise it was a fun season.

We had a parent who was “SO disappointed” about an award situation that she wrote and sent a multi-paragraph email while the end of season picnic was still happening.

Wow. I just drank my wine and went home early. Maybe she had a little TOO much wine. The awards at our pool were honestly laughable. Sometimes I am not sure why we let our kids participate in this farce: starting to understand why the older parents we know started planning vacations during swim season!

I rolled my eyes a little at our awards too (though it was a fun night overall). Definitely reflected the "who's who" of the families in the in-crowd. We also have a big team and some kids got multiple awards - seems like they could have spread those out a bit, especially some of the more subjective ones. (My kids are new and average and did not deserve nor get any special awards - but there were plenty of kids they could have given awards to without giving the same kids 2 or 3.)

They are all subjective, lol. There’s a noticeable drop off in participation in summer swim as the age groups go up. Trophies don’t have the same appeal when it’s obvious they aren’t earned—kids move on but not without some drama. Best not to encourage kids to get too invested in the awards, but that’s a topic for another day.

Except for MVP, at least at our pool. It is purely based on points earned in individual races ( not relays). We had a couple kids win all their races so they both got it.

And ours we have most improved and sportsmanship for both genders every age group and an over all coaches award separate from the MVP (which is high points). Everyone of those goes to a kid who swims for the coach's club every year. In some cases, it seems like he is throwing a bone to a kid who swims year rounds, but can't make A meets

We are MCSL and have most improved, coaches award and hardest worker. Out of those 6 (one male and female each), only one (most improved) went to a swimmer in the coaches year round club. That was for a kid who could barely make it across the pool last year, and this year had all star times - so completely warranted. I have never seen favoritism at our pool. Thankfully. Out coaches are pretty awesome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents complaining that their kid didn’t swim “X” stroke, parents telling the coach that their kid was VERY DISAPPOINTED that they didn’t make it to divisionals.

Otherwise it was a fun season.

Ugh my kid has been disappointed at not making it to divisionals and I’ve definitely mentioned that to others in conversation. It doesn’t mean I thought they should have been picked at all. The coach makes the right decisions and I’d never question them (and it’s been very clear cut) but it’s ok for kids to be disappointed!

Someone told me a parent was so disappointed, they sent a letter to the board for further investigation into how the lineup was chosen. It's ok for a kid to be disappointed. This is going to be the first of many disappointments in life. Move on. The parent needs to get a life!

DP. How do lineups get “chosen”? At our pool the top swimmers get to pick their strokes. If you have one of the top two times you are guaranteed your choice. The times can be from an A or B meet. If you’re lower down on the list you may not make it based on which strokes the top swimmers pick, but there’s not really any way to game this? Weird.

At our MCSL team for "A" meets, the coaches pick the lineups. It is always the top swimmers in those events, except for when you have swimmers are that have top 3 times in 4 events (MCSL has a 3 event max). Then it is a matter of trying to figure out how best to maximize points. For example in fly if the times for your 3 top swimmers are 27,28,29, and the other team has 24,23,24, then it's probably not worth burning that 27 swimmer in fly if they are better at their other events vs the other team. This only becomes a problem when you have a couple of exceptional swimmers in an age group and there's not a deep bench behind them. And yes, this can "hurt" that 27 fly swimmer IF they're on an improvement track and want to make individual all stars because there's only 6 meets possible (5A + divisionals) and you just "burned" one of them.

This is another area where I find MCSL to be so much more transparent than NVSL. Because an MCSL swimmer can swim 3/4 strokes plus the IM at A meets it is a lot harder to “game” someone out of points to help boost a coach’s favorite teammate.

Sounds like a lot more fun for the swimmers too, more opprtunities to compete and improve. Oh well. NVSL is going to stay in the dark ages.

Sounds like fewer kids swimming A meets and more kids getting discouraged and quitting

More opportunities for NVSL swimmers to get A meets/divisional slots than MCSL swimmers.

DP. How do you figure? If there is IM, that’s a whole extra event to fill. Kids can swim up to three events, and there are five events. Sounds fun to me. I think they have more relays too.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:Banquet drama. My sister and her DD went to the banquet, as my sister put it, "dressed for the pool." My sister has never known what to wear when, and is clueless with respect to fashion. She was furious that everyone else was dressed for a party, and made that really clear -- she caused a problem when she accused some of the 12 year old girls as "dressing like they are 16" because they had cute dresses on while her DD had on shorts and an old tshirt. She was really just insecure about how she and DD hadn't understood what to wear. But yeah, she blamed everyone else and made a thing about it. Lol. Par for the course with her.

Some years I dress for the pool, others I don’t. It doesn’t really matter. I’m sorry your sister in law felt awkward, she shouldn’t have. I would have jumped in the pool with her.

Same here. Our banquet is a mix of bathing suits and dresses. The kids get a kick out of dressing up, but in reality no one really cares. It’s definitely a “wear what you want” event at our pool.

We're new this year and I would have appreciated something in the emails about it's a dress up event for some (optional of course). We didn't know that and, since it was during pool hours and every other swim team thing has been beyond casual, assumed it was pool clothes. No one cared (which was great! it was fun!), but I think my kids would have had fun dressing up and it's one of those things they could have clued the newbies in on.

At our pool it really varies by year. The graduating senior girls always dress up. Some years other groups of girls will and some they won't. The drama comes in when girls who think they are part of a group aren't told

Ooooh. Yikes. I am a mother of boys, I do not have this issue. I guess it’s a thing!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents complaining that their kid didn’t swim “X” stroke, parents telling the coach that their kid was VERY DISAPPOINTED that they didn’t make it to divisionals.

Otherwise it was a fun season.

Ugh my kid has been disappointed at not making it to divisionals and I’ve definitely mentioned that to others in conversation. It doesn’t mean I thought they should have been picked at all. The coach makes the right decisions and I’d never question them (and it’s been very clear cut) but it’s ok for kids to be disappointed!

Someone told me a parent was so disappointed, they sent a letter to the board for further investigation into how the lineup was chosen. It's ok for a kid to be disappointed. This is going to be the first of many disappointments in life. Move on. The parent needs to get a life!

DP. How do lineups get “chosen”? At our pool the top swimmers get to pick their strokes. If you have one of the top two times you are guaranteed your choice. The times can be from an A or B meet. If you’re lower down on the list you may not make it based on which strokes the top swimmers pick, but there’s not really any way to game this? Weird.

At our MCSL team for "A" meets, the coaches pick the lineups. It is always the top swimmers in those events, except for when you have swimmers are that have top 3 times in 4 events (MCSL has a 3 event max). Then it is a matter of trying to figure out how best to maximize points. For example in fly if the times for your 3 top swimmers are 27,28,29, and the other team has 24,23,24, then it's probably not worth burning that 27 swimmer in fly if they are better at their other events vs the other team. This only becomes a problem when you have a couple of exceptional swimmers in an age group and there's not a deep bench behind them. And yes, this can "hurt" that 27 fly swimmer IF they're on an improvement track and want to make individual all stars because there's only 6 meets possible (5A + divisionals) and you just "burned" one of them.

This is another area where I find MCSL to be so much more transparent than NVSL. Because an MCSL swimmer can swim 3/4 strokes plus the IM at A meets it is a lot harder to “game” someone out of points to help boost a coach’s favorite teammate.

Sounds like a lot more fun for the swimmers too, more opprtunities to compete and improve. Oh well. NVSL is going to stay in the dark ages.

Sounds like fewer kids swimming A meets and more kids getting discouraged and quitting

More opportunities for NVSL swimmers to get A meets/divisional slots than MCSL swimmers.

DP. How do you figure? If there is IM, that’s a whole extra event to fill. Kids can swim up to three events, and there are five events. Sounds fun to me. I think they have more relays too.

Nvsl Divisionals have 5 events and each team can have 2 swimmers in each event. So ten slots. Each swimmer can only swim twice…so you need at least five kids from each gender and age group at Divisionals.

Nvsl has a whole separate meet for relays called divisional relay carnival.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents complaining that their kid didn’t swim “X” stroke, parents telling the coach that their kid was VERY DISAPPOINTED that they didn’t make it to divisionals.

Otherwise it was a fun season.

Ugh my kid has been disappointed at not making it to divisionals and I’ve definitely mentioned that to others in conversation. It doesn’t mean I thought they should have been picked at all. The coach makes the right decisions and I’d never question them (and it’s been very clear cut) but it’s ok for kids to be disappointed!

Someone told me a parent was so disappointed, they sent a letter to the board for further investigation into how the lineup was chosen. It's ok for a kid to be disappointed. This is going to be the first of many disappointments in life. Move on. The parent needs to get a life!

DP. How do lineups get “chosen”? At our pool the top swimmers get to pick their strokes. If you have one of the top two times you are guaranteed your choice. The times can be from an A or B meet. If you’re lower down on the list you may not make it based on which strokes the top swimmers pick, but there’s not really any way to game this? Weird.

At our MCSL team for "A" meets, the coaches pick the lineups. It is always the top swimmers in those events, except for when you have swimmers are that have top 3 times in 4 events (MCSL has a 3 event max). Then it is a matter of trying to figure out how best to maximize points. For example in fly if the times for your 3 top swimmers are 27,28,29, and the other team has 24,23,24, then it's probably not worth burning that 27 swimmer in fly if they are better at their other events vs the other team. This only becomes a problem when you have a couple of exceptional swimmers in an age group and there's not a deep bench behind them. And yes, this can "hurt" that 27 fly swimmer IF they're on an improvement track and want to make individual all stars because there's only 6 meets possible (5A + divisionals) and you just "burned" one of them.

This is another area where I find MCSL to be so much more transparent than NVSL. Because an MCSL swimmer can swim 3/4 strokes plus the IM at A meets it is a lot harder to “game” someone out of points to help boost a coach’s favorite teammate.

Sounds like a lot more fun for the swimmers too, more opprtunities to compete and improve. Oh well. NVSL is going to stay in the dark ages.

Sounds like fewer kids swimming A meets and more kids getting discouraged and quitting

More opportunities for NVSL swimmers to get A meets/divisional slots than MCSL swimmers.

DP. How do you figure? If there is IM, that’s a whole extra event to fill. Kids can swim up to three events, and there are five events. Sounds fun to me. I think they have more relays too.

5 events means that you have a total of 15 possible swims per age group. Each kid can swim 3, so you need at least 5 swimmers. NVSL is only 4 events, so 12 possible swims, but each kid can only swim 2 events so you need at least 6 swimmers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents complaining that their kid didn’t swim “X” stroke, parents telling the coach that their kid was VERY DISAPPOINTED that they didn’t make it to divisionals.

Otherwise it was a fun season.

Ugh my kid has been disappointed at not making it to divisionals and I’ve definitely mentioned that to others in conversation. It doesn’t mean I thought they should have been picked at all. The coach makes the right decisions and I’d never question them (and it’s been very clear cut) but it’s ok for kids to be disappointed!

Someone told me a parent was so disappointed, they sent a letter to the board for further investigation into how the lineup was chosen. It's ok for a kid to be disappointed. This is going to be the first of many disappointments in life. Move on. The parent needs to get a life!

DP. How do lineups get “chosen”? At our pool the top swimmers get to pick their strokes. If you have one of the top two times you are guaranteed your choice. The times can be from an A or B meet. If you’re lower down on the list you may not make it based on which strokes the top swimmers pick, but there’s not really any way to game this? Weird.

At our MCSL team for "A" meets, the coaches pick the lineups. It is always the top swimmers in those events, except for when you have swimmers are that have top 3 times in 4 events (MCSL has a 3 event max). Then it is a matter of trying to figure out how best to maximize points. For example in fly if the times for your 3 top swimmers are 27,28,29, and the other team has 24,23,24, then it's probably not worth burning that 27 swimmer in fly if they are better at their other events vs the other team. This only becomes a problem when you have a couple of exceptional swimmers in an age group and there's not a deep bench behind them. And yes, this can "hurt" that 27 fly swimmer IF they're on an improvement track and want to make individual all stars because there's only 6 meets possible (5A + divisionals) and you just "burned" one of them.

This is another area where I find MCSL to be so much more transparent than NVSL. Because an MCSL swimmer can swim 3/4 strokes plus the IM at A meets it is a lot harder to “game” someone out of points to help boost a coach’s favorite teammate.

Sounds like a lot more fun for the swimmers too, more opprtunities to compete and improve. Oh well. NVSL is going to stay in the dark ages.

Sounds like fewer kids swimming A meets and more kids getting discouraged and quitting

More opportunities for NVSL swimmers to get A meets/divisional slots than MCSL swimmers.

DP. How do you figure? If there is IM, that’s a whole extra event to fill. Kids can swim up to three events, and there are five events. Sounds fun to me. I think they have more relays too.

In mcsl a swimmer can do 4 events for divisionals. For our pool they generally took the two fastest all around kids for each age group who each did 4 events and then two others who only did one event each.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents complaining that their kid didn’t swim “X” stroke, parents telling the coach that their kid was VERY DISAPPOINTED that they didn’t make it to divisionals.

Otherwise it was a fun season.

Ugh my kid has been disappointed at not making it to divisionals and I’ve definitely mentioned that to others in conversation. It doesn’t mean I thought they should have been picked at all. The coach makes the right decisions and I’d never question them (and it’s been very clear cut) but it’s ok for kids to be disappointed!

Someone told me a parent was so disappointed, they sent a letter to the board for further investigation into how the lineup was chosen. It's ok for a kid to be disappointed. This is going to be the first of many disappointments in life. Move on. The parent needs to get a life!

DP. How do lineups get “chosen”? At our pool the top swimmers get to pick their strokes. If you have one of the top two times you are guaranteed your choice. The times can be from an A or B meet. If you’re lower down on the list you may not make it based on which strokes the top swimmers pick, but there’s not really any way to game this? Weird.

At our MCSL team for "A" meets, the coaches pick the lineups. It is always the top swimmers in those events, except for when you have swimmers are that have top 3 times in 4 events (MCSL has a 3 event max). Then it is a matter of trying to figure out how best to maximize points. For example in fly if the times for your 3 top swimmers are 27,28,29, and the other team has 24,23,24, then it's probably not worth burning that 27 swimmer in fly if they are better at their other events vs the other team. This only becomes a problem when you have a couple of exceptional swimmers in an age group and there's not a deep bench behind them. And yes, this can "hurt" that 27 fly swimmer IF they're on an improvement track and want to make individual all stars because there's only 6 meets possible (5A + divisionals) and you just "burned" one of them.

This is another area where I find MCSL to be so much more transparent than NVSL. Because an MCSL swimmer can swim 3/4 strokes plus the IM at A meets it is a lot harder to “game” someone out of points to help boost a coach’s favorite teammate.

Sounds like a lot more fun for the swimmers too, more opprtunities to compete and improve. Oh well. NVSL is going to stay in the dark ages.

Sounds like fewer kids swimming A meets and more kids getting discouraged and quitting

More opportunities for NVSL swimmers to get A meets/divisional slots than MCSL swimmers.

DP. How do you figure? If there is IM, that’s a whole extra event to fill. Kids can swim up to three events, and there are five events. Sounds fun to me. I think they have more relays too.

5 events means that you have a total of 15 possible swims per age group. Each kid can swim 3, so you need at least 5 swimmers. NVSL is only 4 events, so 12 possible swims, but each kid can only swim 2 events so you need at least 6 swimmers.

Oh interesting. Does MCSL add in a free relay? I was under the impression they do heated A meets (so six swimmers per event per team) but maybe I’m wrong. I know some west coast leagues that do that.

[Anonymous]

NVSL A Meets - Free, Back, Breast, Fly plus Relays.
3 swimmers per event, and a max of 2 events (plus relays) per swimmer.
You need a minimum of 6 swimmers per age group

NVSL Divisionals - Free, Back, Breast, Fly, IM
2 swimmers per pool and a max of 2 events per swimmer
You need a minimum of 5 swimmers per age group

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents complaining that their kid didn’t swim “X” stroke, parents telling the coach that their kid was VERY DISAPPOINTED that they didn’t make it to divisionals.

Otherwise it was a fun season.

Ugh my kid has been disappointed at not making it to divisionals and I’ve definitely mentioned that to others in conversation. It doesn’t mean I thought they should have been picked at all. The coach makes the right decisions and I’d never question them (and it’s been very clear cut) but it’s ok for kids to be disappointed!

Someone told me a parent was so disappointed, they sent a letter to the board for further investigation into how the lineup was chosen. It's ok for a kid to be disappointed. This is going to be the first of many disappointments in life. Move on. The parent needs to get a life!

DP. How do lineups get “chosen”? At our pool the top swimmers get to pick their strokes. If you have one of the top two times you are guaranteed your choice. The times can be from an A or B meet. If you’re lower down on the list you may not make it based on which strokes the top swimmers pick, but there’s not really any way to game this? Weird.

At our MCSL team for "A" meets, the coaches pick the lineups. It is always the top swimmers in those events, except for when you have swimmers are that have top 3 times in 4 events (MCSL has a 3 event max). Then it is a matter of trying to figure out how best to maximize points. For example in fly if the times for your 3 top swimmers are 27,28,29, and the other team has 24,23,24, then it's probably not worth burning that 27 swimmer in fly if they are better at their other events vs the other team. This only becomes a problem when you have a couple of exceptional swimmers in an age group and there's not a deep bench behind them. And yes, this can "hurt" that 27 fly swimmer IF they're on an improvement track and want to make individual all stars because there's only 6 meets possible (5A + divisionals) and you just "burned" one of them.

This is another area where I find MCSL to be so much more transparent than NVSL. Because an MCSL swimmer can swim 3/4 strokes plus the IM at A meets it is a lot harder to “game” someone out of points to help boost a coach’s favorite teammate.

Sounds like a lot more fun for the swimmers too, more opprtunities to compete and improve. Oh well. NVSL is going to stay in the dark ages.

Sounds like fewer kids swimming A meets and more kids getting discouraged and quitting

More opportunities for NVSL swimmers to get A meets/divisional slots than MCSL swimmers.

DP. How do you figure? If there is IM, that’s a whole extra event to fill. Kids can swim up to three events, and there are five events. Sounds fun to me. I think they have more relays too.

In mcsl a swimmer can do 4 events for divisionals. For our pool they generally took the two fastest all around kids for each age group who each did 4 events and then two others who only did one event each.

In NVSL, it's a maximum of 2 so you need at least 5 kids per age group.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents complaining that their kid didn’t swim “X” stroke, parents telling the coach that their kid was VERY DISAPPOINTED that they didn’t make it to divisionals.

Otherwise it was a fun season.

Ugh my kid has been disappointed at not making it to divisionals and I’ve definitely mentioned that to others in conversation. It doesn’t mean I thought they should have been picked at all. The coach makes the right decisions and I’d never question them (and it’s been very clear cut) but it’s ok for kids to be disappointed!

Someone told me a parent was so disappointed, they sent a letter to the board for further investigation into how the lineup was chosen. It's ok for a kid to be disappointed. This is going to be the first of many disappointments in life. Move on. The parent needs to get a life!

DP. How do lineups get “chosen”? At our pool the top swimmers get to pick their strokes. If you have one of the top two times you are guaranteed your choice. The times can be from an A or B meet. If you’re lower down on the list you may not make it based on which strokes the top swimmers pick, but there’s not really any way to game this? Weird.

At our MCSL team for "A" meets, the coaches pick the lineups. It is always the top swimmers in those events, except for when you have swimmers are that have top 3 times in 4 events (MCSL has a 3 event max). Then it is a matter of trying to figure out how best to maximize points. For example in fly if the times for your 3 top swimmers are 27,28,29, and the other team has 24,23,24, then it's probably not worth burning that 27 swimmer in fly if they are better at their other events vs the other team. This only becomes a problem when you have a couple of exceptional swimmers in an age group and there's not a deep bench behind them. And yes, this can "hurt" that 27 fly swimmer IF they're on an improvement track and want to make individual all stars because there's only 6 meets possible (5A + divisionals) and you just "burned" one of them.

This is another area where I find MCSL to be so much more transparent than NVSL. Because an MCSL swimmer can swim 3/4 strokes plus the IM at A meets it is a lot harder to “game” someone out of points to help boost a coach’s favorite teammate.

Sounds like a lot more fun for the swimmers too, more opprtunities to compete and improve. Oh well. NVSL is going to stay in the dark ages.

Sounds like fewer kids swimming A meets and more kids getting discouraged and quitting

More opportunities for NVSL swimmers to get A meets/divisional slots than MCSL swimmers.

DP. How do you figure? If there is IM, that’s a whole extra event to fill. Kids can swim up to three events, and there are five events. Sounds fun to me. I think they have more relays too.

In mcsl a swimmer can do 4 events for divisionals. For our pool they generally took the two fastest all around kids for each age group who each did 4 events and then two others who only did one event each.

In NVSL, it's a maximum of 2 so you need at least 5 kids per age group.

DP again. This is really interesting. If MCSL limited the number of divisional swims a swimmer could do to 2, like NVSL, I think I’d prefer their organization. Not that I’m starting my own swim league or anything but there are areas of NOVA that might want to take notes.

[Anonymous]

We have parents that want Breather Ribbons. Even rewarding kids who get DQed. The kid did not do the stroke correctly, why reward that? You breathe, you get a ribbon. But they don't want to volunteer and be ribbon writers (ribbon stickers). Sheesh!

[Anonymous]

There is drama on our team because coach is accused of targeting certain kids for special punishment in circumstances where others are
given a pass. He gives me the creeps. I hope he’s gone next year but I don’t have high hopes. The team is a mess. Keeping my kid the hell away from him, and definitely will not be letting my kid work as an assistant coach.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parents complaining that their kid didn’t swim “X” stroke, parents telling the coach that their kid was VERY DISAPPOINTED that they didn’t make it to divisionals.

Otherwise it was a fun season.

Ugh my kid has been disappointed at not making it to divisionals and I’ve definitely mentioned that to others in conversation. It doesn’t mean I thought they should have been picked at all. The coach makes the right decisions and I’d never question them (and it’s been very clear cut) but it’s ok for kids to be disappointed!

Someone told me a parent was so disappointed, they sent a letter to the board for further investigation into how the lineup was chosen. It's ok for a kid to be disappointed. This is going to be the first of many disappointments in life. Move on. The parent needs to get a life!

DP. How do lineups get “chosen”? At our pool the top swimmers get to pick their strokes. If you have one of the top two times you are guaranteed your choice. The times can be from an A or B meet. If you’re lower down on the list you may not make it based on which strokes the top swimmers pick, but there’s not really any way to game this? Weird.

At our MCSL team for "A" meets, the coaches pick the lineups. It is always the top swimmers in those events, except for when you have swimmers are that have top 3 times in 4 events (MCSL has a 3 event max). Then it is a matter of trying to figure out how best to maximize points. For example in fly if the times for your 3 top swimmers are 27,28,29, and the other team has 24,23,24, then it's probably not worth burning that 27 swimmer in fly if they are better at their other events vs the other team. This only becomes a problem when you have a couple of exceptional swimmers in an age group and there's not a deep bench behind them. And yes, this can "hurt" that 27 fly swimmer IF they're on an improvement track and want to make individual all stars because there's only 6 meets possible (5A + divisionals) and you just "burned" one of them.

This is another area where I find MCSL to be so much more transparent than NVSL. Because an MCSL swimmer can swim 3/4 strokes plus the IM at A meets it is a lot harder to “game” someone out of points to help boost a coach’s favorite teammate.

Sounds like a lot more fun for the swimmers too, more opprtunities to compete and improve. Oh well. NVSL is going to stay in the dark ages.

Sounds like fewer kids swimming A meets and more kids getting discouraged and quitting

More opportunities for NVSL swimmers to get A meets/divisional slots than MCSL swimmers.

DP. How do you figure? If there is IM, that’s a whole extra event to fill. Kids can swim up to three events, and there are five events. Sounds fun to me. I think they have more relays too.

In mcsl a swimmer can do 4 events for divisionals. For our pool they generally took the two fastest all around kids for each age group who each did 4 events and then two others who only did one event each.

In NVSL, it's a maximum of 2 so you need at least 5 kids per age group.

DP again. This is really interesting. If MCSL limited the number of divisional swims a swimmer could do to 2, like NVSL, I think I’d prefer their organization. Not that I’m starting my own swim league or anything but there are areas of NOVA that might want to take notes.

MCSLs rules make it much harder to game the system as described by some of the NVSL posters. MCSL regular season has 2 heats, 6 swimmers each, of freestyle in each age group so that is where people further down the ladder get a chance to swim at an A meet. Since each swimmer can also only swim 3 of the strokes (not including IM), it also still gives an opportunity for kids further down the ladder in the specialty strokes. This is a selfish point, but as the parent of a club swimmer it was nice not to have to slog through the 4 hour B meets given all the time we spend at club meets, plus the Saturday A meets, plus double practices, plus social events.

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Anonymous wrote:Parents complaining that their kid didn’t swim “X” stroke, parents telling the coach that their kid was VERY DISAPPOINTED that they didn’t make it to divisionals.

Otherwise it was a fun season.

Ugh my kid has been disappointed at not making it to divisionals and I’ve definitely mentioned that to others in conversation. It doesn’t mean I thought they should have been picked at all. The coach makes the right decisions and I’d never question them (and it’s been very clear cut) but it’s ok for kids to be disappointed!

Someone told me a parent was so disappointed, they sent a letter to the board for further investigation into how the lineup was chosen. It's ok for a kid to be disappointed. This is going to be the first of many disappointments in life. Move on. The parent needs to get a life!

DP. How do lineups get “chosen”? At our pool the top swimmers get to pick their strokes. If you have one of the top two times you are guaranteed your choice. The times can be from an A or B meet. If you’re lower down on the list you may not make it based on which strokes the top swimmers pick, but there’s not really any way to game this? Weird.

At our MCSL team for "A" meets, the coaches pick the lineups. It is always the top swimmers in those events, except for when you have swimmers are that have top 3 times in 4 events (MCSL has a 3 event max). Then it is a matter of trying to figure out how best to maximize points. For example in fly if the times for your 3 top swimmers are 27,28,29, and the other team has 24,23,24, then it's probably not worth burning that 27 swimmer in fly if they are better at their other events vs the other team. This only becomes a problem when you have a couple of exceptional swimmers in an age group and there's not a deep bench behind them. And yes, this can "hurt" that 27 fly swimmer IF they're on an improvement track and want to make individual all stars because there's only 6 meets possible (5A + divisionals) and you just "burned" one of them.

This is another area where I find MCSL to be so much more transparent than NVSL. Because an MCSL swimmer can swim 3/4 strokes plus the IM at A meets it is a lot harder to “game” someone out of points to help boost a coach’s favorite teammate.

Sounds like a lot more fun for the swimmers too, more opprtunities to compete and improve. Oh well. NVSL is going to stay in the dark ages.

Sounds like fewer kids swimming A meets and more kids getting discouraged and quitting

More opportunities for NVSL swimmers to get A meets/divisional slots than MCSL swimmers.

DP. How do you figure? If there is IM, that’s a whole extra event to fill. Kids can swim up to three events, and there are five events. Sounds fun to me. I think they have more relays too.

In mcsl a swimmer can do 4 events for divisionals. For our pool they generally took the two fastest all around kids for each age group who each did 4 events and then two others who only did one event each.

In NVSL, it's a maximum of 2 so you need at least 5 kids per age group.

DP again. This is really interesting. If MCSL limited the number of divisional swims a swimmer could do to 2, like NVSL, I think I’d prefer their organization. Not that I’m starting my own swim league or anything but there are areas of NOVA that might want to take notes.

MCSLs rules make it much harder to game the system as described by some of the NVSL posters. MCSL regular season has 2 heats, 6 swimmers each, of freestyle in each age group so that is where people further down the ladder get a chance to swim at an A meet. Since each swimmer can also only swim 3 of the strokes (not including IM), it also still gives an opportunity for kids further down the ladder in the specialty strokes. This is a selfish point, but as the parent of a club swimmer it was nice not to have to slog through the 4 hour B meets given all the time we spend at club meets, plus the Saturday A meets, plus double practices, plus social events.

Sounds pretty nice!