Why do donut hole families

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Complain about being a donut hole family? When there are thousands of colleges that could work between in state options and merit aid at lower tier privates and other oos public’s?l is it bc ivies and top 25 are not options?

I thought it was “hundreds” of options? Now you’re talking thousands? Care to share a list of say, a 100 or so of these options within an 8hr drive? Since there are apparently so many! TIA!

There are 3000 colleges in the United States. Only 25 are in the top 25. THOUSANDS. If you want to make a state college in Arizona or Oregon work for you, you could. That you don’t want to or want to self impose a driving limit of 8 hours, (why not 10 or 12), that’s on you.

Which of these Arizona or Oregon state colleges give significant aid to OOS students? Wasn't that your whole shtick, that there are all these affordable options out there that most of us aren't considering? Most students are not getting into a T25 school so I don't know why you are singularly focused on those anyway.

Distance is reasonable to consider because flying back and forth across the country costs $$.

Both U of Arizona and ASU give significant merit to OOS students,

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Poor people do not have more options. Most truly poor people are not in the college pipeline.

Additionally, if those "donut hole" families lived like the poor people, rented where they rent, shopped where they shop, etc., they'd have tons of options too. Just saying.

+1

I get that some have special circumstances--medical debt or something unforeseen. But most donut hole families that I know made choices to spend elsewhere. New iPhone every year, 2 Starbucks trips per day, eating lunch out daily, eating half of dinners out, taking really nice vacations, new cars every 3-4 years, etc. Yes those are all "small things" in the grand scheme of savings, but that is just what is visible to me---I'm sure there is much more I don't even see. Someone with a mindset like that is choosing to spend on things when they could choose to save.
We knew our kids would get no aid, so we started saving as soon as they were born. We didn't start living a luxury lifestyle until we could afford it. We paid only 50% of what we could easily afford for our first house and lived there for 7 years. Sure we could afford a newer/nicer home, but we did not need it, this house had 4 bedrooms and 2.5 baths so enough space for a young family---it was relatively speaking much nicer than the apartment we came from. So we lived nicely but not luxuriously and saved the extras. We drove cars for 8-10 years and saved to pay cash for the next ones.
We also choose to not have kids until 30, so that allowed us to consciously save the extra salary and live off of basically one. We aggressively paid off all student loans, invested in our retirement. Other than our honeymoon, I was 35 before I took a "fancy vacation", yet we could have easily afforded to do so at 25/26. But that restraint allowed us to front load saving for college and then we could change our lifestyle as desired.

Same here. Our children can go almost anywhere, but only because we got started saving early and let the savings compound. We never made more than $120K either, but we've always banked at least one income. The irony is that we can now afford to live on one modest income and maintain our lifestyle. Plus, since most of our money is tucked away in retirement accounts and our house is paid off, our EFC is pretty low.

I always think about our situation when people on this board talk about not getting married until you are much older. It's a choice, but you don't get to set your family up nearly as well as if you partnered up earlier in life. However, there is nothing wrong with state schools and lower ranked colleges either.

Exactly. It's all about choices. And of course, nothing wrong with any college. Pick what works for your family, pick what's affordable. But if you choose to have kids before you have paid off your own college debt, it will be harder to save for college and that choice will impact your kid's college choices, just a simple fact of life. Life is about choices, and you get to live with the consequences of your choices as a responsible adult

+1. Also it is very important to choose a spouse wisely- who has a good job, good health, no student debt of their own, and is faithful and responsible. Make good choices and you will have good results.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Poor people do not have more options. Most truly poor people are not in the college pipeline.

Additionally, if those "donut hole" families lived like the poor people, rented where they rent, shopped where they shop, etc., they'd have tons of options too. Just saying.

+1

I get that some have special circumstances--medical debt or something unforeseen. But most donut hole families that I know made choices to spend elsewhere. New iPhone every year, 2 Starbucks trips per day, eating lunch out daily, eating half of dinners out, taking really nice vacations, new cars every 3-4 years, etc. Yes those are all "small things" in the grand scheme of savings, but that is just what is visible to me---I'm sure there is much more I don't even see. Someone with a mindset like that is choosing to spend on things when they could choose to save.
We knew our kids would get no aid, so we started saving as soon as they were born. We didn't start living a luxury lifestyle until we could afford it. We paid only 50% of what we could easily afford for our first house and lived there for 7 years. Sure we could afford a newer/nicer home, but we did not need it, this house had 4 bedrooms and 2.5 baths so enough space for a young family---it was relatively speaking much nicer than the apartment we came from. So we lived nicely but not luxuriously and saved the extras. We drove cars for 8-10 years and saved to pay cash for the next ones.
We also choose to not have kids until 30, so that allowed us to consciously save the extra salary and live off of basically one. We aggressively paid off all student loans, invested in our retirement. Other than our honeymoon, I was 35 before I took a "fancy vacation", yet we could have easily afforded to do so at 25/26. But that restraint allowed us to front load saving for college and then we could change our lifestyle as desired.

Same here. Our children can go almost anywhere, but only because we got started saving early and let the savings compound. We never made more than $120K either, but we've always banked at least one income. The irony is that we can now afford to live on one modest income and maintain our lifestyle. Plus, since most of our money is tucked away in retirement accounts and our house is paid off, our EFC is pretty low.

I always think about our situation when people on this board talk about not getting married until you are much older. It's a choice, but you don't get to set your family up nearly as well as if you partnered up earlier in life. However, there is nothing wrong with state schools and lower ranked colleges either.

Exactly. It's all about choices. And of course, nothing wrong with any college. Pick what works for your family, pick what's affordable. But if you choose to have kids before you have paid off your own college debt, it will be harder to save for college and that choice will impact your kid's college choices, just a simple fact of life. Life is about choices, and you get to live with the consequences of your choices as a responsible adult

And it just may be that if you can't pay off your own loans while you are in child-bearing age, perhaps kids are not the best decision. There's nothing wrong with that either! We can't afford everything we want.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Complain about being a donut hole family? When there are thousands of colleges that could work between in state options and merit aid at lower tier privates and other oos public’s?l is it bc ivies and top 25 are not options?

Its because their kids don't get judged on their ability but on their parental assets and can't attend schools they are eligible for or want to attend. Unless parents are willing to sacrifice their hard earned savings and risk retirement , kids often can't afford anything but community college or some regional state campus with merit.

A true donut hole family should be able to afford $20-30K/year with savings and cashflow. That's well more than CC. Plenty of choices if you just try rather than complaining "we can't afford anything"

You still don't get it. Imagine a brilliant STEM student who already got into Stanford or MIT. But they end up going to a much lower ranked school ONLY because their family is too "rich" for FA and too poor to pay full ride. There's something wrong with that picture.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that picture. What exactly is the problem? This is adulting. We all have to make choices in regards to what we can afford and what we cannot.

Nobody is entitled to a discount for a crazy expensive education.

Isn't it just supply and demand? There isn't an increasing supply of prestigious schools, but there is increasing demand, not just from population growth, but also foreign students. I don't see elite schools getting any less expensive in the relevant future. I assume it will cost ~ $500,000 for my 4 yo to attend my alma matter.

Nobody is saying they are entitled we are just pointing out the system is broke.

It doesn’t make sense if the mom quits her job a child will have better college opportunities .

Just like it’s insane that a child can get FA if her mom doesn’t marry but the minute she married the new h’s income makes it impossible for her to get FA.

A child can be a junior rising in college and have to leave college because mom got married.

+1.

Also, there's something broken about a system where each generation has to pay higher and higher costs for a college education, while simultaneously having to save more for retirement because we are living longer, there are fewer employer pension programs, and medical costs keep rising too. My parents grew up at a time where working summers, and maybe part-time during the school year, would pay for that year of college. Now you really have to be perfect- there isn't room for you yourself making a poor decision to take out loans at 18, that will carry over well into your adulthood and affect your ability to buy a house and save for your own kids. There isn't room for an unexpected expenses that will drain your savings. Heaven forbid you take a vacation. All must be sacrificed to afford college now, and apparently as a society now we've decided that's A-OK.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Poor people do not have more options. Most truly poor people are not in the college pipeline.

Additionally, if those "donut hole" families lived like the poor people, rented where they rent, shopped where they shop, etc., they'd have tons of options too. Just saying.

+1

I get that some have special circumstances--medical debt or something unforeseen. But most donut hole families that I know made choices to spend elsewhere. New iPhone every year, 2 Starbucks trips per day, eating lunch out daily, eating half of dinners out, taking really nice vacations, new cars every 3-4 years, etc. Yes those are all "small things" in the grand scheme of savings, but that is just what is visible to me---I'm sure there is much more I don't even see. Someone with a mindset like that is choosing to spend on things when they could choose to save.
We knew our kids would get no aid, so we started saving as soon as they were born. We didn't start living a luxury lifestyle until we could afford it. We paid only 50% of what we could easily afford for our first house and lived there for 7 years. Sure we could afford a newer/nicer home, but we did not need it, this house had 4 bedrooms and 2.5 baths so enough space for a young family---it was relatively speaking much nicer than the apartment we came from. So we lived nicely but not luxuriously and saved the extras. We drove cars for 8-10 years and saved to pay cash for the next ones.
We also choose to not have kids until 30, so that allowed us to consciously save the extra salary and live off of basically one. We aggressively paid off all student loans, invested in our retirement. Other than our honeymoon, I was 35 before I took a "fancy vacation", yet we could have easily afforded to do so at 25/26. But that restraint allowed us to front load saving for college and then we could change our lifestyle as desired.

Same here. Our children can go almost anywhere, but only because we got started saving early and let the savings compound. We never made more than $120K either, but we've always banked at least one income. The irony is that we can now afford to live on one modest income and maintain our lifestyle. Plus, since most of our money is tucked away in retirement accounts and our house is paid off, our EFC is pretty low.

I always think about our situation when people on this board talk about not getting married until you are much older. It's a choice, but you don't get to set your family up nearly as well as if you partnered up earlier in life. However, there is nothing wrong with state schools and lower ranked colleges either.

Exactly. It's all about choices. And of course, nothing wrong with any college. Pick what works for your family, pick what's affordable. But if you choose to have kids before you have paid off your own college debt, it will be harder to save for college and that choice will impact your kid's college choices, just a simple fact of life. Life is about choices, and you get to live with the consequences of your choices as a responsible adult

+1. Also it is very important to choose a spouse wisely- who has a good job, good health, no student debt of their own, and is faithful and responsible. Make good choices and you will have good results.

Yes, great advice, and don't forget your DC may meet their future spouse at that cut rate U, amirite?

[Anonymous]

Colleges should be free for AlL students of all parental income levels. Parents aren't the one getting educated, students are. Once they get employed, they should give college a reasonable small amount of tuition reimbursement divided over small monthly payments for 10 years. If they get unemployed, payments should halt and resume after the get re-employed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Poor people do not have more options. Most truly poor people are not in the college pipeline.

Additionally, if those "donut hole" families lived like the poor people, rented where they rent, shopped where they shop, etc., they'd have tons of options too. Just saying.

+1

I get that some have special circumstances--medical debt or something unforeseen. But most donut hole families that I know made choices to spend elsewhere. New iPhone every year, 2 Starbucks trips per day, eating lunch out daily, eating half of dinners out, taking really nice vacations, new cars every 3-4 years, etc. Yes those are all "small things" in the grand scheme of savings, but that is just what is visible to me---I'm sure there is much more I don't even see. Someone with a mindset like that is choosing to spend on things when they could choose to save.
We knew our kids would get no aid, so we started saving as soon as they were born. We didn't start living a luxury lifestyle until we could afford it. We paid only 50% of what we could easily afford for our first house and lived there for 7 years. Sure we could afford a newer/nicer home, but we did not need it, this house had 4 bedrooms and 2.5 baths so enough space for a young family---it was relatively speaking much nicer than the apartment we came from. So we lived nicely but not luxuriously and saved the extras. We drove cars for 8-10 years and saved to pay cash for the next ones.
We also choose to not have kids until 30, so that allowed us to consciously save the extra salary and live off of basically one. We aggressively paid off all student loans, invested in our retirement. Other than our honeymoon, I was 35 before I took a "fancy vacation", yet we could have easily afforded to do so at 25/26. But that restraint allowed us to front load saving for college and then we could change our lifestyle as desired.

Same here. Our children can go almost anywhere, but only because we got started saving early and let the savings compound. We never made more than $120K either, but we've always banked at least one income. The irony is that we can now afford to live on one modest income and maintain our lifestyle. Plus, since most of our money is tucked away in retirement accounts and our house is paid off, our EFC is pretty low.

I always think about our situation when people on this board talk about not getting married until you are much older. It's a choice, but you don't get to set your family up nearly as well as if you partnered up earlier in life. However, there is nothing wrong with state schools and lower ranked colleges either.

Exactly. It's all about choices. And of course, nothing wrong with any college. Pick what works for your family, pick what's affordable. But if you choose to have kids before you have paid off your own college debt, it will be harder to save for college and that choice will impact your kid's college choices, just a simple fact of life. Life is about choices, and you get to live with the consequences of your choices as a responsible adult

Right, and if you don't have many or any choices, you are irresponsible. The fact that college costs have far outpaced inflation for decades - increasing by almost 144% in two decades - isn't relevant.

Right?

[Anonymous]

This way everyone will pay same amount, no freebies no sticker payers, everyone paying similar fixed and subsidized amount. Equality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Poor people do not have more options. Most truly poor people are not in the college pipeline.

Additionally, if those "donut hole" families lived like the poor people, rented where they rent, shopped where they shop, etc., they'd have tons of options too. Just saying.

+1

I get that some have special circumstances--medical debt or something unforeseen. But most donut hole families that I know made choices to spend elsewhere. New iPhone every year, 2 Starbucks trips per day, eating lunch out daily, eating half of dinners out, taking really nice vacations, new cars every 3-4 years, etc. Yes those are all "small things" in the grand scheme of savings, but that is just what is visible to me---I'm sure there is much more I don't even see. Someone with a mindset like that is choosing to spend on things when they could choose to save.
We knew our kids would get no aid, so we started saving as soon as they were born. We didn't start living a luxury lifestyle until we could afford it. We paid only 50% of what we could easily afford for our first house and lived there for 7 years. Sure we could afford a newer/nicer home, but we did not need it, this house had 4 bedrooms and 2.5 baths so enough space for a young family---it was relatively speaking much nicer than the apartment we came from. So we lived nicely but not luxuriously and saved the extras. We drove cars for 8-10 years and saved to pay cash for the next ones.
We also choose to not have kids until 30, so that allowed us to consciously save the extra salary and live off of basically one. We aggressively paid off all student loans, invested in our retirement. Other than our honeymoon, I was 35 before I took a "fancy vacation", yet we could have easily afforded to do so at 25/26. But that restraint allowed us to front load saving for college and then we could change our lifestyle as desired.

Same here. Our children can go almost anywhere, but only because we got started saving early and let the savings compound. We never made more than $120K either, but we've always banked at least one income. The irony is that we can now afford to live on one modest income and maintain our lifestyle. Plus, since most of our money is tucked away in retirement accounts and our house is paid off, our EFC is pretty low.

I always think about our situation when people on this board talk about not getting married until you are much older. It's a choice, but you don't get to set your family up nearly as well as if you partnered up earlier in life. However, there is nothing wrong with state schools and lower ranked colleges either.

Exactly. It's all about choices. And of course, nothing wrong with any college. Pick what works for your family, pick what's affordable. But if you choose to have kids before you have paid off your own college debt, it will be harder to save for college and that choice will impact your kid's college choices, just a simple fact of life. Life is about choices, and you get to live with the consequences of your choices as a responsible adult

+1. Also it is very important to choose a spouse wisely- who has a good job, good health, no student debt of their own, and is faithful and responsible. Make good choices and you will have good results.

Lol! You’re insane

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Poor people do not have more options. Most truly poor people are not in the college pipeline.

Additionally, if those "donut hole" families lived like the poor people, rented where they rent, shopped where they shop, etc., they'd have tons of options too. Just saying.

+1

I get that some have special circumstances--medical debt or something unforeseen. But most donut hole families that I know made choices to spend elsewhere. New iPhone every year, 2 Starbucks trips per day, eating lunch out daily, eating half of dinners out, taking really nice vacations, new cars every 3-4 years, etc. Yes those are all "small things" in the grand scheme of savings, but that is just what is visible to me---I'm sure there is much more I don't even see. Someone with a mindset like that is choosing to spend on things when they could choose to save.
We knew our kids would get no aid, so we started saving as soon as they were born. We didn't start living a luxury lifestyle until we could afford it. We paid only 50% of what we could easily afford for our first house and lived there for 7 years. Sure we could afford a newer/nicer home, but we did not need it, this house had 4 bedrooms and 2.5 baths so enough space for a young family---it was relatively speaking much nicer than the apartment we came from. So we lived nicely but not luxuriously and saved the extras. We drove cars for 8-10 years and saved to pay cash for the next ones.
We also choose to not have kids until 30, so that allowed us to consciously save the extra salary and live off of basically one. We aggressively paid off all student loans, invested in our retirement. Other than our honeymoon, I was 35 before I took a "fancy vacation", yet we could have easily afforded to do so at 25/26. But that restraint allowed us to front load saving for college and then we could change our lifestyle as desired.

Same here. Our children can go almost anywhere, but only because we got started saving early and let the savings compound. We never made more than $120K either, but we've always banked at least one income. The irony is that we can now afford to live on one modest income and maintain our lifestyle. Plus, since most of our money is tucked away in retirement accounts and our house is paid off, our EFC is pretty low.

I always think about our situation when people on this board talk about not getting married until you are much older. It's a choice, but you don't get to set your family up nearly as well as if you partnered up earlier in life. However, there is nothing wrong with state schools and lower ranked colleges either.

Exactly. It's all about choices. And of course, nothing wrong with any college. Pick what works for your family, pick what's affordable. But if you choose to have kids before you have paid off your own college debt, it will be harder to save for college and that choice will impact your kid's college choices, just a simple fact of life. Life is about choices, and you get to live with the consequences of your choices as a responsible adult

+1. Also it is very important to choose a spouse wisely- who has a good job, good health, no student debt of their own, and is faithful and responsible. Make good choices and you will have good results.

Yes, and make sure that your spouse stays in good health, never gets sick, never gets laid off or fired.

Make sure that your parents never need help, that the housing market stays stable, that you buy a house at a reasonable cost and at a low interest rate.

Also make sure that your maternity leave is paid and that your kids don't have any special needs.

Make these good choices and you will be all set.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Complain about being a donut hole family? When there are thousands of colleges that could work between in state options and merit aid at lower tier privates and other oos public’s?l is it bc ivies and top 25 are not options?

Its because their kids don't get judged on their ability but on their parental assets and can't attend schools they are eligible for or want to attend. Unless parents are willing to sacrifice their hard earned savings and risk retirement , kids often can't afford anything but community college or some regional state campus with merit.

A true donut hole family should be able to afford $20-30K/year with savings and cashflow. That's well more than CC. Plenty of choices if you just try rather than complaining "we can't afford anything"

You still don't get it. Imagine a brilliant STEM student who already got into Stanford or MIT. But they end up going to a much lower ranked school ONLY because their family is too "rich" for FA and too poor to pay full ride. There's something wrong with that picture.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that picture. What exactly is the problem? This is adulting. We all have to make choices in regards to what we can afford and what we cannot.

Nobody is entitled to a discount for a crazy expensive education.

Nobody is saying they are entitled we are just pointing out the system is broke.

It doesn’t make sense if the mom quits her job a child will have better college opportunities .

Just like it’s insane that a child can get FA if her mom doesn’t marry but the minute she married the new h’s income makes it impossible for her to get FA.

A child can be a junior rising in college and have to leave college because mom got married.

+1.

Also, there's something broken about a system where each generation has to pay higher and higher costs for a college education, while simultaneously having to save more for retirement because we are living longer, there are fewer employer pension programs, and medical costs keep rising too. My parents grew up at a time where working summers, and maybe part-time during the school year, would pay for that year of college. Now you really have to be perfect- there isn't room for you yourself making a poor decision to take out loans at 18, that will carry over well into your adulthood and affect your ability to buy a house and save for your own kids. There isn't room for an unexpected expenses that will drain your savings. Heaven forbid you take a vacation. All must be sacrificed to afford college now, and apparently as a society now we've decided that's A-OK.

Absolutely this. And I think this is the real dynamic behind the complaints in this thread.

The house of cards is also more and more difficult to sustain between generations, for anyone whose parents aren’t so well-situated that their assistance or inheritance is carrying the kids. Part of our own problem in saving for college has been that I’m still paying off my OWN school loans. (And before anyone says “you should have planned better,” I went into a well-paid career that would have covered them but then caught a disabling illness. Thanks to consolidating at 9% interest, I repaid the amount of principal around year 10 but am still making payments at year 20+.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This way everyone will pay same amount, no freebies no sticker payers, everyone paying similar fixed and subsidized amount. Equality.

Like in other developed countries?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Complain about being a donut hole family? When there are thousands of colleges that could work between in state options and merit aid at lower tier privates and other oos public’s?l is it bc ivies and top 25 are not options?

Its because their kids don't get judged on their ability but on their parental assets and can't attend schools they are eligible for or want to attend. Unless parents are willing to sacrifice their hard earned savings and risk retirement , kids often can't afford anything but community college or some regional state campus with merit.

A true donut hole family should be able to afford $20-30K/year with savings and cashflow. That's well more than CC. Plenty of choices if you just try rather than complaining "we can't afford anything"

You still don't get it. Imagine a brilliant STEM student who already got into Stanford or MIT. But they end up going to a much lower ranked school ONLY because their family is too "rich" for FA and too poor to pay full ride. There's something wrong with that picture.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that picture. What exactly is the problem? This is adulting. We all have to make choices in regards to what we can afford and what we cannot.

Nobody is entitled to a discount for a crazy expensive education.

Nobody is saying they are entitled we are just pointing out the system is broke.

It doesn’t make sense if the mom quits her job a child will have better college opportunities .

Just like it’s insane that a child can get FA if her mom doesn’t marry but the minute she married the new h’s income makes it impossible for her to get FA.

A child can be a junior rising in college and have to leave college because mom got married.

+1.

Also, there's something broken about a system where each generation has to pay higher and higher costs for a college education, while simultaneously having to save more for retirement because we are living longer, there are fewer employer pension programs, and medical costs keep rising too. My parents grew up at a time where working summers, and maybe part-time during the school year, would pay for that year of college. Now you really have to be perfect- there isn't room for you yourself making a poor decision to take out loans at 18, that will carry over well into your adulthood and affect your ability to buy a house and save for your own kids. There isn't room for an unexpected expenses that will drain your savings. Heaven forbid you take a vacation. All must be sacrificed to afford college now, and apparently as a society now we've decided that's A-OK.

Absolutely this. And I think this is the real dynamic behind the complaints in this thread.

The house of cards is also more and more difficult to sustain between generations, for anyone whose parents aren’t so well-situated that their assistance or inheritance is carrying the kids. Part of our own problem in saving for college has been that I’m still paying off my OWN school loans. (And before anyone says “you should have planned better,” I went into a well-paid career that would have covered them but then caught a disabling illness. Thanks to consolidating at 9% interest, I repaid the amount of principal around year 10 but am still making payments at year 20+.)

That was a poor choice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Complain about being a donut hole family? When there are thousands of colleges that could work between in state options and merit aid at lower tier privates and other oos public’s?l is it bc ivies and top 25 are not options?

I thought it was “hundreds” of options? Now you’re talking thousands? Care to share a list of say, a 100 or so of these options within an 8hr drive? Since there are apparently so many! TIA!

There are 3000 colleges in the United States. Only 25 are in the top 25. THOUSANDS. If you want to make a state college in Arizona or Oregon work for you, you could. That you don’t want to or want to self impose a driving limit of 8 hours, (why not 10 or 12), that’s on you.

Which of these Arizona or Oregon state colleges give significant aid to OOS students? Wasn't that your whole shtick, that there are all these affordable options out there that most of us aren't considering? Most students are not getting into a T25 school so I don't know why you are singularly focused on those anyway.

Distance is reasonable to consider because flying back and forth across the country costs $$.

Oh for pete's sake, Google is your friend
Here is ASU for a 3.5 GPA, 30 ACT score
Presidents Scholarship $15,500
Your Estimated 1st Year Cost $33,570

Here is U Arizona
Non-Resident Arizona Awards
Distinction Award ($30,000-$32,000) which would bring COA to 5-10K
Excellence Award ($12,500-$20,000) which would bring COA to 12-25K

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Complain about being a donut hole family? When there are thousands of colleges that could work between in state options and merit aid at lower tier privates and other oos public’s?l is it bc ivies and top 25 are not options?

Its because their kids don't get judged on their ability but on their parental assets and can't attend schools they are eligible for or want to attend. Unless parents are willing to sacrifice their hard earned savings and risk retirement , kids often can't afford anything but community college or some regional state campus with merit.

A true donut hole family should be able to afford $20-30K/year with savings and cashflow. That's well more than CC. Plenty of choices if you just try rather than complaining "we can't afford anything"

You still don't get it. Imagine a brilliant STEM student who already got into Stanford or MIT. But they end up going to a much lower ranked school ONLY because their family is too "rich" for FA and too poor to pay full ride. There's something wrong with that picture.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with that picture. What exactly is the problem? This is adulting. We all have to make choices in regards to what we can afford and what we cannot.

Nobody is entitled to a discount for a crazy expensive education.

Nobody is saying they are entitled we are just pointing out the system is broke.

It doesn’t make sense if the mom quits her job a child will have better college opportunities .

Just like it’s insane that a child can get FA if her mom doesn’t marry but the minute she married the new h’s income makes it impossible for her to get FA.

A child can be a junior rising in college and have to leave college because mom got married.

+1.

Also, there's something broken about a system where each generation has to pay higher and higher costs for a college education, while simultaneously having to save more for retirement because we are living longer, there are fewer employer pension programs, and medical costs keep rising too. My parents grew up at a time where working summers, and maybe part-time during the school year, would pay for that year of college. Now you really have to be perfect- there isn't room for you yourself making a poor decision to take out loans at 18, that will carry over well into your adulthood and affect your ability to buy a house and save for your own kids. There isn't room for an unexpected expenses that will drain your savings. Heaven forbid you take a vacation. All must be sacrificed to afford college now, and apparently as a society now we've decided that's A-OK.

Absolutely this. And I think this is the real dynamic behind the complaints in this thread.

The house of cards is also more and more difficult to sustain between generations, for anyone whose parents aren’t so well-situated that their assistance or inheritance is carrying the kids. Part of our own problem in saving for college has been that I’m still paying off my OWN school loans. (And before anyone says “you should have planned better,” I went into a well-paid career that would have covered them but then caught a disabling illness. Thanks to consolidating at 9% interest, I repaid the amount of principal around year 10 but am still making payments at year 20+.)

I think these are extremely reasonable complaints! I think what people take issue with is the fact that they're complaints about being "donut hole" rather than like. Complaints about inflation or the soaring cost of higher education or accessibility of educational opportunities for everyone. People who are poorer than "donut hole" families have some expenses covered (e.g. tuition, maybe housing or books depending on the situation) but being poor adds other costs that "donut hole" families may not have like a weaker grounding in the basics (due to growing up in a poorer school district), lack of cultural references or enriching experiences (no trips to Europe or space camp or tutors for poor kids; they need to work), family to support (parents may not have retirement to risk even if they wanted to). So framing the problem as "my middle class family is suffering while the rich and the poor have it easy" is frustrating because actually no. Your family may be suffering but poor families are also suffering. Let's complain about the predatory nature of college tuition and how much we're jealous of the opportunities rich kids have without acting like being poor is a great life opportunity. Feel free to give away all your money if being poor is so grand.