Blake Lively- Jason Baldoni and NYT - False Light claims

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Anonymous wrote:I don't know why he asked about the weight. If you have a back injury, a few pounds either way isn't going to change lifting someone up. He knew she was post partum and they could estimate her weight from looking at her.

I think he asked more due to his body dysmorphia and issues and wanting to know her exact weight.

Agree with this. He definitely wasn't trying to "fat shame" her. However, I think this is a good example of where he is tone deaf and handles things poorly, and hit backfires HUGELY because Lively is highly reactive.

Asking the trainer what Lively's weight was... that was just stupid. Like unacceptably stupid. Again, I don't think he was trying to harass her or shame her or anything. I just think he was being an idiot and not getting what a radioactive violation of her privacy that would be especially with her just coming back from having a baby and clearly being in a sensitive place regarding her weight.

The stuff about him recommending a "weight loss specialist" is silly and I don't agree with her at all that that's what he was doing. But I also thin it all links back to him doing this dumb thing and asking her trainer for her weight.

He and Heath both do stuff like this throughout the production -- just idiotic transgressions that I truly don't believe were intentionally harassing but even just taken in isolation, I'm like "what? who does that?" Telling a mother of four what is normal during childbirth? Walking in on a woman who is topless in a trailer (even if you think she might be "cool" with it, this is just a dumb thing to do and someone with more sense would be like "oh excuse me I'll wait outside")? Talking about porn and asking lots of questions about porn (yes, even in the context of the movie -- this is a hot button topic and especially when you are talking to someone you know offends easily)?

If there was a cause of action that was "accidental harassment via stupidity and lack of self-awareness," I think this two would be guilty of it.

It really bothers me when people object to Jamie and Justin talking about the childbirth scene with Blake because she’s had four babies. Literally, the director‘s job is to lay out a vision for what he wants the childbirth scene to be in this movie. who gives a flying F if Blake has had 10 babies, he’s not coaching Blake through labor, he is trying to lay out a vision for a scene in his movie.

I am sure many actresses have had sex scenes in a movie that were not like the way they have sex in real life. They have gotten married in movies and shot wedding scenes that were not like their wedding in real life. And they have given birth in movie scenes in ways that were not like the way they gave birth in real life.

She is getting paid to act out a childbirth scene and he is the director of a movie. It was completely appropriate for them to have that discussion.

Sure he’s the director, but manspaining to a woman who has given birth four times that all women give birth naked in a tub because that’s how his wife did it — and that all women climax at the same time as their man during sex because that’s what his wife does — seems pretty tone deaf to me. If Justin needed this story to be that specific and oblivious to the big name actress (I know! But compared to Baldoni, Lively is the bigger name and box office draw here) he had actually cast, he should have cast his own wife as Lily instead.

This weird insistence on “this is how women experience this” is off putting. Some directors are brilliant and can get away with mistreating or being rude to the talent, but Baldoni was not in that space and in fact held himself out as someone who would be a partner not a dictator. So his insistence that “women be like this” comes off badly. It speaks to what some people in the thread have said that his feminism seemed performative because he would say one thing but then act differently.

+1 and will add:

Baldoni and Wayfarer made a huge deal about wanting to tell this particular story through "the female gaze." And Baldoni and Heath both have built professional reputations on the idea that they are men who *listen* to the women in their lives, who put aside toxic masculinity in order to be allies and partners. That is the context of this movie.

And then Baldoni and Heath told a woman who has given birth to four children that it is not "normal" to wear a hospital gown during birth (I have given birth and I wore a hospital gown) and that it is "weird" not to want to watch someone else's birth video.

You can't have it both ways. You can't claim to want to make a movie that tells the story from a female perspective and then dismiss female perspectives when they challenge some of the creative choices you are making in that movie. And further, from an employment perspective, you can't get an actress to sign onto a movie by explicitly telling her she'll be a collaborator in making the movie and that you are interested in and open to her ideas and input, and then shame her when she attempts to collaborate and share her ideas.

Or you can, but it doesn't make you a "male feminist" and it doesn't make you a good guy.

Did JB and Heath in fact, tell BL that women don’t wear gowns during childbirth? Is that verified? If so, that is so obviously wrong and disgusting on their part. However it doesn’t equal SH. I would have just disagreed with them and schooled these men that women do wear gowns or whatever they want during childbirth and if they want a totally naked actress pretending to give birth I am not the right actress for this porn film.

Lively alleged it in her complaint and Baldoni's lawsuit doesn't address it at all. So not "verified" but also not contradicted.

And I mean, I think what you describe is pretty much what Lively did, which is why she was not fully nude in the scene. And for standing up for herself and refusing to do unscripted nudity, she was hit with a PR campaign calling her hard to work with and accused of trying to "take over" the movie. Hmmm.

In fact she was fully dressed.

Yep.

I just rewatched this scene on YouTube and I wouldn’t describe her as fully dressed. She was not naked in a tub though. But she’s wearing a hospital gown that’s partly open at the top, her belly is exposed, and she is shot to appear naked from the waist down though you only see legs, torso, and stomach. The way it is shot she must have on one of those nude underwear things because the fake doctor is right up in her personal area. I would describe this as partially nude but ymmv.

Her belly was covered with a pregnancy suit. You do realize that she wasn’t pregnant, right? Jesus.

Sure, so her “belly” is not “her belly.” Pretty sure her naked legs are still hers, and that there is very little between the doctor and her personal area. I would never in one million years call this “fully dressed” but maybe you and Jesus would see this differently.

She is being paid mega bucks to wear a pregnancy suit and willingly pretend to be pregnant in a film, what part was BL confused about?

+1. And a film in which the childbirth scene is the pivotal part of the entire movie. It wasn’t like it was a minor element! It’s the entire plot!

Doesn’t mean she has to do it naked in a tub. Sorry not sorry.

This is why you have no credibility. She didn’t film it naked in a tub.

But that’s how Baldoni wanted to do it (with a fake belly but exposed breasts) and that’s what she objected to. That by itself isn’t sexual harassment but you can also prove SH by a pattern of behavior, which is what Lively is alleging in her complaint — not just one single incident of assault which is what some people experience.

It’s not sexual harassment to discuss how to film a childbirth scene and for the director to have an opinion on it when it is a pivotal scene in the plot.

Again, according to Baldoni's own timeline, Jamey Heath showed Lively the video of his wife's nude childbirth the day AFTER they shot the birth scene.

He was not showing to to her in order to demonstrate, as a producer, how they wanted Lively to act or appear in the birth scene, because it had already been shot.

ok? So they were still talking about the scene they just filmed? It takes a massive filtering of the facts via a framework intent on interpreting everything as an insult to reach the conclusion that discussing the scene was sexual harassment.

What professional reason did Heath have for trying to show the video to Lively if she'd already shot the birth scene?

What other appropriate reason would someone have for showing a video in which they and their wife appear nude? I've been working for 30+ years including in creative, nontraditional workplaces, and I've never shown anyway photos or video of myself or my spouse nude. It has simply never come up and I would assume doing so would not be appropriate in a work context.

Were you in a creative field SPECIFICALLY DEPICTING CHILDBIRTH??

the Lively allegations surrounding the birth scene were some of the dumbest ones.

Again: the childbirth scene had already been shot. So why was he showing this video to Lively?

well Lively’s interpretations are clearly distorted so it’s hard to say what exactly happened. My guess would be they were discussing the scene they just shot, and the subject was still a topic of discussion and analysis. It seems totally normal to me. what seems abnormal is the accusation that he was somehow intentionally abusing Lively by showing her “porn” in the form of his child’s birth video.

But they had not "just shot" it.

May 22nd: Birth scene filmed
May 23rd morning: Multiple scenes involving the actors wearing "onesies" filmed
May 23rd lunch break: Heath shows Lively the video of his wife giving birth nude
May 23rd evening: Dancing scene for montage filmed

Why would he be discussing the birth scene at that point? There is nothing they could do to change it, and they'd already moved on to other scenes. Was he trying to convince Lively to reshoot the birth scene with less clothes? Why wasn't he focused on the scenes from that morning or the upcoming montage scenes? Would Lively be focused on those scenes, as an actress looking to be in character? It actually seems very unprofessional to be revisiting an argument from the day before in the middle of a day in which Lively is shooting multiple scenes from various parts of the movie.

Perhaps rhey were unhappy with the film from the initial shot and felt it looked fake.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't know why he asked about the weight. If you have a back injury, a few pounds either way isn't going to change lifting someone up. He knew she was post partum and they could estimate her weight from looking at her.

I think he asked more due to his body dysmorphia and issues and wanting to know her exact weight.

Agree with this. He definitely wasn't trying to "fat shame" her. However, I think this is a good example of where he is tone deaf and handles things poorly, and hit backfires HUGELY because Lively is highly reactive.

Asking the trainer what Lively's weight was... that was just stupid. Like unacceptably stupid. Again, I don't think he was trying to harass her or shame her or anything. I just think he was being an idiot and not getting what a radioactive violation of her privacy that would be especially with her just coming back from having a baby and clearly being in a sensitive place regarding her weight.

The stuff about him recommending a "weight loss specialist" is silly and I don't agree with her at all that that's what he was doing. But I also thin it all links back to him doing this dumb thing and asking her trainer for her weight.

He and Heath both do stuff like this throughout the production -- just idiotic transgressions that I truly don't believe were intentionally harassing but even just taken in isolation, I'm like "what? who does that?" Telling a mother of four what is normal during childbirth? Walking in on a woman who is topless in a trailer (even if you think she might be "cool" with it, this is just a dumb thing to do and someone with more sense would be like "oh excuse me I'll wait outside")? Talking about porn and asking lots of questions about porn (yes, even in the context of the movie -- this is a hot button topic and especially when you are talking to someone you know offends easily)?

If there was a cause of action that was "accidental harassment via stupidity and lack of self-awareness," I think this two would be guilty of it.

It really bothers me when people object to Jamie and Justin talking about the childbirth scene with Blake because she’s had four babies. Literally, the director‘s job is to lay out a vision for what he wants the childbirth scene to be in this movie. who gives a flying F if Blake has had 10 babies, he’s not coaching Blake through labor, he is trying to lay out a vision for a scene in his movie.

I am sure many actresses have had sex scenes in a movie that were not like the way they have sex in real life. They have gotten married in movies and shot wedding scenes that were not like their wedding in real life. And they have given birth in movie scenes in ways that were not like the way they gave birth in real life.

She is getting paid to act out a childbirth scene and he is the director of a movie. It was completely appropriate for them to have that discussion.

Sure he’s the director, but manspaining to a woman who has given birth four times that all women give birth naked in a tub because that’s how his wife did it — and that all women climax at the same time as their man during sex because that’s what his wife does — seems pretty tone deaf to me. If Justin needed this story to be that specific and oblivious to the big name actress (I know! But compared to Baldoni, Lively is the bigger name and box office draw here) he had actually cast, he should have cast his own wife as Lily instead.

This weird insistence on “this is how women experience this” is off putting. Some directors are brilliant and can get away with mistreating or being rude to the talent, but Baldoni was not in that space and in fact held himself out as someone who would be a partner not a dictator. So his insistence that “women be like this” comes off badly. It speaks to what some people in the thread have said that his feminism seemed performative because he would say one thing but then act differently.

+1 and will add:

Baldoni and Wayfarer made a huge deal about wanting to tell this particular story through "the female gaze." And Baldoni and Heath both have built professional reputations on the idea that they are men who *listen* to the women in their lives, who put aside toxic masculinity in order to be allies and partners. That is the context of this movie.

And then Baldoni and Heath told a woman who has given birth to four children that it is not "normal" to wear a hospital gown during birth (I have given birth and I wore a hospital gown) and that it is "weird" not to want to watch someone else's birth video.

You can't have it both ways. You can't claim to want to make a movie that tells the story from a female perspective and then dismiss female perspectives when they challenge some of the creative choices you are making in that movie. And further, from an employment perspective, you can't get an actress to sign onto a movie by explicitly telling her she'll be a collaborator in making the movie and that you are interested in and open to her ideas and input, and then shame her when she attempts to collaborate and share her ideas.

Or you can, but it doesn't make you a "male feminist" and it doesn't make you a good guy.

Actually, you can have it both ways because you’re the director and producer of the movies. No one saying he isn’t fake and isn’t doing fake feminism, but he has a right to lay out the scene that he wants to lay out and Blake needs to do it cause that’s what she’s getting paid a lot of money for. Ridiculous to call it anything else.

I don’t think that’s how it works when you have signed up for the movie without signing up to do a lot of nudity, and then the director suddenly wants a bunch of additional nudity that you didn’t agree to. I’d expect that would need to be negotiated, and not just accomplished by fiat from the director or by saying “but that’s how my wife did it.”

That is a different argument. If they didn’t agree to nudity and they were arguing about that that is a separate issue.

It was the mansplaining that was bothering me. Nobody was telling her how childbirth works. They were trying to communicate how they wanted to do the scene. And just like with every scene in this movie, she didn’t want to do it, presumably just because she wants to have full power, and wasn’t going to agree to any ideas that they had. Which is funny given that it has been made clear she has never has even read the book. But either way they weren’t explaining childbirth to her. They were telling her how they wanted to do the scene.

It’s fine if she didn’t agree, but you don’t get to call it mansplaining.

+100
This exactly.
Heath was attempting to show the video of his wife giving birth in what he obviously felt was a good example of a beautiful and tasteful experience THaT THEY WANTED TO DO FOR THAT SCENE!

No one is disputing that BL knows how the whole birthing process works….for HER!
But in a movie where she is supposed to be portraying a fictional character, the director should get to have a say in how the character portrays that scene. If he just relies on BL to simulate her own experience, she could be screaming profanities and throwing things—for all we know!—and by showing her an actual example of what he wanted the scene to look like.
No mansplaining.

It is not mansplaining but it’s an extremely narrow and ignorant view of childbirth. Was his wife in a hospital setting giving birth with everything hanging out? BL birth scene was in a hospital setting correct?

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Anonymous wrote:I don't know why he asked about the weight. If you have a back injury, a few pounds either way isn't going to change lifting someone up. He knew she was post partum and they could estimate her weight from looking at her.

I think he asked more due to his body dysmorphia and issues and wanting to know her exact weight.

Agree with this. He definitely wasn't trying to "fat shame" her. However, I think this is a good example of where he is tone deaf and handles things poorly, and hit backfires HUGELY because Lively is highly reactive.

Asking the trainer what Lively's weight was... that was just stupid. Like unacceptably stupid. Again, I don't think he was trying to harass her or shame her or anything. I just think he was being an idiot and not getting what a radioactive violation of her privacy that would be especially with her just coming back from having a baby and clearly being in a sensitive place regarding her weight.

The stuff about him recommending a "weight loss specialist" is silly and I don't agree with her at all that that's what he was doing. But I also thin it all links back to him doing this dumb thing and asking her trainer for her weight.

He and Heath both do stuff like this throughout the production -- just idiotic transgressions that I truly don't believe were intentionally harassing but even just taken in isolation, I'm like "what? who does that?" Telling a mother of four what is normal during childbirth? Walking in on a woman who is topless in a trailer (even if you think she might be "cool" with it, this is just a dumb thing to do and someone with more sense would be like "oh excuse me I'll wait outside")? Talking about porn and asking lots of questions about porn (yes, even in the context of the movie -- this is a hot button topic and especially when you are talking to someone you know offends easily)?

If there was a cause of action that was "accidental harassment via stupidity and lack of self-awareness," I think this two would be guilty of it.

It really bothers me when people object to Jamie and Justin talking about the childbirth scene with Blake because she’s had four babies. Literally, the director‘s job is to lay out a vision for what he wants the childbirth scene to be in this movie. who gives a flying F if Blake has had 10 babies, he’s not coaching Blake through labor, he is trying to lay out a vision for a scene in his movie.

I am sure many actresses have had sex scenes in a movie that were not like the way they have sex in real life. They have gotten married in movies and shot wedding scenes that were not like their wedding in real life. And they have given birth in movie scenes in ways that were not like the way they gave birth in real life.

She is getting paid to act out a childbirth scene and he is the director of a movie. It was completely appropriate for them to have that discussion.

Sure he’s the director, but manspaining to a woman who has given birth four times that all women give birth naked in a tub because that’s how his wife did it — and that all women climax at the same time as their man during sex because that’s what his wife does — seems pretty tone deaf to me. If Justin needed this story to be that specific and oblivious to the big name actress (I know! But compared to Baldoni, Lively is the bigger name and box office draw here) he had actually cast, he should have cast his own wife as Lily instead.

This weird insistence on “this is how women experience this” is off putting. Some directors are brilliant and can get away with mistreating or being rude to the talent, but Baldoni was not in that space and in fact held himself out as someone who would be a partner not a dictator. So his insistence that “women be like this” comes off badly. It speaks to what some people in the thread have said that his feminism seemed performative because he would say one thing but then act differently.

+1 and will add:

Baldoni and Wayfarer made a huge deal about wanting to tell this particular story through "the female gaze." And Baldoni and Heath both have built professional reputations on the idea that they are men who *listen* to the women in their lives, who put aside toxic masculinity in order to be allies and partners. That is the context of this movie.

And then Baldoni and Heath told a woman who has given birth to four children that it is not "normal" to wear a hospital gown during birth (I have given birth and I wore a hospital gown) and that it is "weird" not to want to watch someone else's birth video.

You can't have it both ways. You can't claim to want to make a movie that tells the story from a female perspective and then dismiss female perspectives when they challenge some of the creative choices you are making in that movie. And further, from an employment perspective, you can't get an actress to sign onto a movie by explicitly telling her she'll be a collaborator in making the movie and that you are interested in and open to her ideas and input, and then shame her when she attempts to collaborate and share her ideas.

Or you can, but it doesn't make you a "male feminist" and it doesn't make you a good guy.

Did JB and Heath in fact, tell BL that women don’t wear gowns during childbirth? Is that verified? If so, that is so obviously wrong and disgusting on their part. However it doesn’t equal SH. I would have just disagreed with them and schooled these men that women do wear gowns or whatever they want during childbirth and if they want a totally naked actress pretending to give birth I am not the right actress for this porn film.

Lively alleged it in her complaint and Baldoni's lawsuit doesn't address it at all. So not "verified" but also not contradicted.

And I mean, I think what you describe is pretty much what Lively did, which is why she was not fully nude in the scene. And for standing up for herself and refusing to do unscripted nudity, she was hit with a PR campaign calling her hard to work with and accused of trying to "take over" the movie. Hmmm.

In fact she was fully dressed.

Yep.

I just rewatched this scene on YouTube and I wouldn’t describe her as fully dressed. She was not naked in a tub though. But she’s wearing a hospital gown that’s partly open at the top, her belly is exposed, and she is shot to appear naked from the waist down though you only see legs, torso, and stomach. The way it is shot she must have on one of those nude underwear things because the fake doctor is right up in her personal area. I would describe this as partially nude but ymmv.

Her belly was covered with a pregnancy suit. You do realize that she wasn’t pregnant, right? Jesus.

Sure, so her “belly” is not “her belly.” Pretty sure her naked legs are still hers, and that there is very little between the doctor and her personal area. I would never in one million years call this “fully dressed” but maybe you and Jesus would see this differently.

She is being paid mega bucks to wear a pregnancy suit and willingly pretend to be pregnant in a film, what part was BL confused about?

+1. And a film in which the childbirth scene is the pivotal part of the entire movie. It wasn’t like it was a minor element! It’s the entire plot!

Doesn’t mean she has to do it naked in a tub. Sorry not sorry.

This is why you have no credibility. She didn’t film it naked in a tub.

But that’s how Baldoni wanted to do it (with a fake belly but exposed breasts) and that’s what she objected to. That by itself isn’t sexual harassment but you can also prove SH by a pattern of behavior, which is what Lively is alleging in her complaint — not just one single incident of assault which is what some people experience.

It’s not sexual harassment to discuss how to film a childbirth scene and for the director to have an opinion on it when it is a pivotal scene in the plot.

Again, according to Baldoni's own timeline, Jamey Heath showed Lively the video of his wife's nude childbirth the day AFTER they shot the birth scene.

He was not showing to to her in order to demonstrate, as a producer, how they wanted Lively to act or appear in the birth scene, because it had already been shot.

ok? So they were still talking about the scene they just filmed? It takes a massive filtering of the facts via a framework intent on interpreting everything as an insult to reach the conclusion that discussing the scene was sexual harassment.

Further, if you read Baldoni‘s suit, he clearly stated that they were having a casual conversation, Blake actually responded she’d love to see the video later. It was very friendly and cordial. It was only later when Blake was using this as leverage that she tried to call it p—n and act like it was being forced on her.

Here is the description from Baldoni's timeline:

May 23, 2023: During lunch, as part of a continued creative discussion that Baldoni and Lively were having about the hospital birthing scene, Baldoni asked Heath to show Lively his wife’s post-home-birth video, stating to Heath that Lively had not seen one and was presumably interested in watching. Baldoni himself had seen the video prior and felt it was demonstrative of the spirit of his vision for the birthing scene. Heath agreed to share this deeply personal video and approached Lively with the video in hand. He proceeded to show her one second of it before Lively asked if Heath had permission to share the video, to which Heath confirmed that he did. Lively stated she would like to see the video but asked to watch it after finishing her lunch. Heath did not press the matter and moved on. (NOTE: Lively never did see the video beyond the one-second clip shown to her).

Baldoni "presumes" that Lively would be interested in watching the birth video, he doesn't ask her. Instead, he asks Heath to show it to her and Heath "approaches Lively with the video in hand" and apparently starts playing it before telling her what it is or asking if she wants to see it. She stops him and asks if he has permission from his wife to show it, demonstrating she considers the content of the video highly personal. The then says that she would watch it after lunch but apparently makes no effort to do so.

Dude, she was being polite. She thought it was super weird that Heath would walk up and just start showing her the video, she was concerned about his wife's privacy, and she had never expressed any interest in seeing the video. But she didn't want to say "omg weirdo please stop showing me nude footage of your wife and you while she gives birth, what is wrong with you?" So instead she says "ok, maybe later!" and then never talks about it again because that's what you do when your weird, creepy coworker wants to show you inappropriate videos at work. And then you go talk to HR.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't know why he asked about the weight. If you have a back injury, a few pounds either way isn't going to change lifting someone up. He knew she was post partum and they could estimate her weight from looking at her.

I think he asked more due to his body dysmorphia and issues and wanting to know her exact weight.

Agree with this. He definitely wasn't trying to "fat shame" her. However, I think this is a good example of where he is tone deaf and handles things poorly, and hit backfires HUGELY because Lively is highly reactive.

Asking the trainer what Lively's weight was... that was just stupid. Like unacceptably stupid. Again, I don't think he was trying to harass her or shame her or anything. I just think he was being an idiot and not getting what a radioactive violation of her privacy that would be especially with her just coming back from having a baby and clearly being in a sensitive place regarding her weight.

The stuff about him recommending a "weight loss specialist" is silly and I don't agree with her at all that that's what he was doing. But I also thin it all links back to him doing this dumb thing and asking her trainer for her weight.

He and Heath both do stuff like this throughout the production -- just idiotic transgressions that I truly don't believe were intentionally harassing but even just taken in isolation, I'm like "what? who does that?" Telling a mother of four what is normal during childbirth? Walking in on a woman who is topless in a trailer (even if you think she might be "cool" with it, this is just a dumb thing to do and someone with more sense would be like "oh excuse me I'll wait outside")? Talking about porn and asking lots of questions about porn (yes, even in the context of the movie -- this is a hot button topic and especially when you are talking to someone you know offends easily)?

If there was a cause of action that was "accidental harassment via stupidity and lack of self-awareness," I think this two would be guilty of it.

It really bothers me when people object to Jamie and Justin talking about the childbirth scene with Blake because she’s had four babies. Literally, the director‘s job is to lay out a vision for what he wants the childbirth scene to be in this movie. who gives a flying F if Blake has had 10 babies, he’s not coaching Blake through labor, he is trying to lay out a vision for a scene in his movie.

I am sure many actresses have had sex scenes in a movie that were not like the way they have sex in real life. They have gotten married in movies and shot wedding scenes that were not like their wedding in real life. And they have given birth in movie scenes in ways that were not like the way they gave birth in real life.

She is getting paid to act out a childbirth scene and he is the director of a movie. It was completely appropriate for them to have that discussion.

Sure he’s the director, but manspaining to a woman who has given birth four times that all women give birth naked in a tub because that’s how his wife did it — and that all women climax at the same time as their man during sex because that’s what his wife does — seems pretty tone deaf to me. If Justin needed this story to be that specific and oblivious to the big name actress (I know! But compared to Baldoni, Lively is the bigger name and box office draw here) he had actually cast, he should have cast his own wife as Lily instead.

This weird insistence on “this is how women experience this” is off putting. Some directors are brilliant and can get away with mistreating or being rude to the talent, but Baldoni was not in that space and in fact held himself out as someone who would be a partner not a dictator. So his insistence that “women be like this” comes off badly. It speaks to what some people in the thread have said that his feminism seemed performative because he would say one thing but then act differently.

+1 and will add:

Baldoni and Wayfarer made a huge deal about wanting to tell this particular story through "the female gaze." And Baldoni and Heath both have built professional reputations on the idea that they are men who *listen* to the women in their lives, who put aside toxic masculinity in order to be allies and partners. That is the context of this movie.

And then Baldoni and Heath told a woman who has given birth to four children that it is not "normal" to wear a hospital gown during birth (I have given birth and I wore a hospital gown) and that it is "weird" not to want to watch someone else's birth video.

You can't have it both ways. You can't claim to want to make a movie that tells the story from a female perspective and then dismiss female perspectives when they challenge some of the creative choices you are making in that movie. And further, from an employment perspective, you can't get an actress to sign onto a movie by explicitly telling her she'll be a collaborator in making the movie and that you are interested in and open to her ideas and input, and then shame her when she attempts to collaborate and share her ideas.

Or you can, but it doesn't make you a "male feminist" and it doesn't make you a good guy.

Did JB and Heath in fact, tell BL that women don’t wear gowns during childbirth? Is that verified? If so, that is so obviously wrong and disgusting on their part. However it doesn’t equal SH. I would have just disagreed with them and schooled these men that women do wear gowns or whatever they want during childbirth and if they want a totally naked actress pretending to give birth I am not the right actress for this porn film.

Lively alleged it in her complaint and Baldoni's lawsuit doesn't address it at all. So not "verified" but also not contradicted.

And I mean, I think what you describe is pretty much what Lively did, which is why she was not fully nude in the scene. And for standing up for herself and refusing to do unscripted nudity, she was hit with a PR campaign calling her hard to work with and accused of trying to "take over" the movie. Hmmm.

In fact she was fully dressed.

Yep.

I just rewatched this scene on YouTube and I wouldn’t describe her as fully dressed. She was not naked in a tub though. But she’s wearing a hospital gown that’s partly open at the top, her belly is exposed, and she is shot to appear naked from the waist down though you only see legs, torso, and stomach. The way it is shot she must have on one of those nude underwear things because the fake doctor is right up in her personal area. I would describe this as partially nude but ymmv.

Her belly was covered with a pregnancy suit. You do realize that she wasn’t pregnant, right? Jesus.

Sure, so her “belly” is not “her belly.” Pretty sure her naked legs are still hers, and that there is very little between the doctor and her personal area. I would never in one million years call this “fully dressed” but maybe you and Jesus would see this differently.

She is being paid mega bucks to wear a pregnancy suit and willingly pretend to be pregnant in a film, what part was BL confused about?

+1. And a film in which the childbirth scene is the pivotal part of the entire movie. It wasn’t like it was a minor element! It’s the entire plot!

Doesn’t mean she has to do it naked in a tub. Sorry not sorry.

This is why you have no credibility. She didn’t film it naked in a tub.

But that’s how Baldoni wanted to do it (with a fake belly but exposed breasts) and that’s what she objected to. That by itself isn’t sexual harassment but you can also prove SH by a pattern of behavior, which is what Lively is alleging in her complaint — not just one single incident of assault which is what some people experience.

It’s not sexual harassment to discuss how to film a childbirth scene and for the director to have an opinion on it when it is a pivotal scene in the plot.

I totally agree with you. This was a major part of the movie.

A major part of the movie that had already been shot. Why were they still talking about it? Did they want to go back and shoot it again, this time with her nude?

I mean, BL was well aware of what giving birth looks like as she has 4 kids. This does seem quite perverted and totally unnecessary to show your own wife giving birth nude. BL did not need to see this, no one should be viewing this. It’s gross, unprofessional and bizarre. JB’s wife should be livid. What weirdos. Does this point to SH? Not sure…I am also wondering now, did JB’s wife consent to this personal birth video being shown off as a gold standard of birthing?

It was a video of heath’s wife and she did consent.

[Anonymous]

Honestly, if I were an actress that came into this movie being told I was working with a well known male feminist who had a podcast and everything and then I got strong armed by that same guy trying to make me film extra sex and nudity when I didn’t want to and I was told that the way I had given birth four times was “not normal”, I would find it pretty hard to talk to and work with these people because they would not at all be matching up with who they represented themselves as being.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't know why he asked about the weight. If you have a back injury, a few pounds either way isn't going to change lifting someone up. He knew she was post partum and they could estimate her weight from looking at her.

I think he asked more due to his body dysmorphia and issues and wanting to know her exact weight.

Agree with this. He definitely wasn't trying to "fat shame" her. However, I think this is a good example of where he is tone deaf and handles things poorly, and hit backfires HUGELY because Lively is highly reactive.

Asking the trainer what Lively's weight was... that was just stupid. Like unacceptably stupid. Again, I don't think he was trying to harass her or shame her or anything. I just think he was being an idiot and not getting what a radioactive violation of her privacy that would be especially with her just coming back from having a baby and clearly being in a sensitive place regarding her weight.

The stuff about him recommending a "weight loss specialist" is silly and I don't agree with her at all that that's what he was doing. But I also thin it all links back to him doing this dumb thing and asking her trainer for her weight.

He and Heath both do stuff like this throughout the production -- just idiotic transgressions that I truly don't believe were intentionally harassing but even just taken in isolation, I'm like "what? who does that?" Telling a mother of four what is normal during childbirth? Walking in on a woman who is topless in a trailer (even if you think she might be "cool" with it, this is just a dumb thing to do and someone with more sense would be like "oh excuse me I'll wait outside")? Talking about porn and asking lots of questions about porn (yes, even in the context of the movie -- this is a hot button topic and especially when you are talking to someone you know offends easily)?

If there was a cause of action that was "accidental harassment via stupidity and lack of self-awareness," I think this two would be guilty of it.

It really bothers me when people object to Jamie and Justin talking about the childbirth scene with Blake because she’s had four babies. Literally, the director‘s job is to lay out a vision for what he wants the childbirth scene to be in this movie. who gives a flying F if Blake has had 10 babies, he’s not coaching Blake through labor, he is trying to lay out a vision for a scene in his movie.

I am sure many actresses have had sex scenes in a movie that were not like the way they have sex in real life. They have gotten married in movies and shot wedding scenes that were not like their wedding in real life. And they have given birth in movie scenes in ways that were not like the way they gave birth in real life.

She is getting paid to act out a childbirth scene and he is the director of a movie. It was completely appropriate for them to have that discussion.

Sure he’s the director, but manspaining to a woman who has given birth four times that all women give birth naked in a tub because that’s how his wife did it — and that all women climax at the same time as their man during sex because that’s what his wife does — seems pretty tone deaf to me. If Justin needed this story to be that specific and oblivious to the big name actress (I know! But compared to Baldoni, Lively is the bigger name and box office draw here) he had actually cast, he should have cast his own wife as Lily instead.

This weird insistence on “this is how women experience this” is off putting. Some directors are brilliant and can get away with mistreating or being rude to the talent, but Baldoni was not in that space and in fact held himself out as someone who would be a partner not a dictator. So his insistence that “women be like this” comes off badly. It speaks to what some people in the thread have said that his feminism seemed performative because he would say one thing but then act differently.

+1 and will add:

Baldoni and Wayfarer made a huge deal about wanting to tell this particular story through "the female gaze." And Baldoni and Heath both have built professional reputations on the idea that they are men who *listen* to the women in their lives, who put aside toxic masculinity in order to be allies and partners. That is the context of this movie.

And then Baldoni and Heath told a woman who has given birth to four children that it is not "normal" to wear a hospital gown during birth (I have given birth and I wore a hospital gown) and that it is "weird" not to want to watch someone else's birth video.

You can't have it both ways. You can't claim to want to make a movie that tells the story from a female perspective and then dismiss female perspectives when they challenge some of the creative choices you are making in that movie. And further, from an employment perspective, you can't get an actress to sign onto a movie by explicitly telling her she'll be a collaborator in making the movie and that you are interested in and open to her ideas and input, and then shame her when she attempts to collaborate and share her ideas.

Or you can, but it doesn't make you a "male feminist" and it doesn't make you a good guy.

Did JB and Heath in fact, tell BL that women don’t wear gowns during childbirth? Is that verified? If so, that is so obviously wrong and disgusting on their part. However it doesn’t equal SH. I would have just disagreed with them and schooled these men that women do wear gowns or whatever they want during childbirth and if they want a totally naked actress pretending to give birth I am not the right actress for this porn film.

Lively alleged it in her complaint and Baldoni's lawsuit doesn't address it at all. So not "verified" but also not contradicted.

And I mean, I think what you describe is pretty much what Lively did, which is why she was not fully nude in the scene. And for standing up for herself and refusing to do unscripted nudity, she was hit with a PR campaign calling her hard to work with and accused of trying to "take over" the movie. Hmmm.

In fact she was fully dressed.

Yep.

I just rewatched this scene on YouTube and I wouldn’t describe her as fully dressed. She was not naked in a tub though. But she’s wearing a hospital gown that’s partly open at the top, her belly is exposed, and she is shot to appear naked from the waist down though you only see legs, torso, and stomach. The way it is shot she must have on one of those nude underwear things because the fake doctor is right up in her personal area. I would describe this as partially nude but ymmv.

Her belly was covered with a pregnancy suit. You do realize that she wasn’t pregnant, right? Jesus.

Sure, so her “belly” is not “her belly.” Pretty sure her naked legs are still hers, and that there is very little between the doctor and her personal area. I would never in one million years call this “fully dressed” but maybe you and Jesus would see this differently.

She is being paid mega bucks to wear a pregnancy suit and willingly pretend to be pregnant in a film, what part was BL confused about?

+1. And a film in which the childbirth scene is the pivotal part of the entire movie. It wasn’t like it was a minor element! It’s the entire plot!

Doesn’t mean she has to do it naked in a tub. Sorry not sorry.

This is why you have no credibility. She didn’t film it naked in a tub.

But that’s how Baldoni wanted to do it (with a fake belly but exposed breasts) and that’s what she objected to. That by itself isn’t sexual harassment but you can also prove SH by a pattern of behavior, which is what Lively is alleging in her complaint — not just one single incident of assault which is what some people experience.

It’s not sexual harassment to discuss how to film a childbirth scene and for the director to have an opinion on it when it is a pivotal scene in the plot.

I totally agree with you. This was a major part of the movie.

A major part of the movie that had already been shot. Why were they still talking about it? Did they want to go back and shoot it again, this time with her nude?

I mean, BL was well aware of what giving birth looks like as she has 4 kids. This does seem quite perverted and totally unnecessary to show your own wife giving birth nude. BL did not need to see this, no one should be viewing this. It’s gross, unprofessional and bizarre. JB’s wife should be livid. What weirdos. Does this point to SH? Not sure…I am also wondering now, did JB’s wife consent to this personal birth video being shown off as a gold standard of birthing?

It was a video of heath’s wife and she did consent.

So, right at that moment when he whipped out his gold standard birthing video, I would have made it very clear that I was more of a childbirth expert than any male involved in this conversation and I really do not want to see his naked wife ever.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't know why he asked about the weight. If you have a back injury, a few pounds either way isn't going to change lifting someone up. He knew she was post partum and they could estimate her weight from looking at her.

I think he asked more due to his body dysmorphia and issues and wanting to know her exact weight.

Agree with this. He definitely wasn't trying to "fat shame" her. However, I think this is a good example of where he is tone deaf and handles things poorly, and hit backfires HUGELY because Lively is highly reactive.

Asking the trainer what Lively's weight was... that was just stupid. Like unacceptably stupid. Again, I don't think he was trying to harass her or shame her or anything. I just think he was being an idiot and not getting what a radioactive violation of her privacy that would be especially with her just coming back from having a baby and clearly being in a sensitive place regarding her weight.

The stuff about him recommending a "weight loss specialist" is silly and I don't agree with her at all that that's what he was doing. But I also thin it all links back to him doing this dumb thing and asking her trainer for her weight.

He and Heath both do stuff like this throughout the production -- just idiotic transgressions that I truly don't believe were intentionally harassing but even just taken in isolation, I'm like "what? who does that?" Telling a mother of four what is normal during childbirth? Walking in on a woman who is topless in a trailer (even if you think she might be "cool" with it, this is just a dumb thing to do and someone with more sense would be like "oh excuse me I'll wait outside")? Talking about porn and asking lots of questions about porn (yes, even in the context of the movie -- this is a hot button topic and especially when you are talking to someone you know offends easily)?

If there was a cause of action that was "accidental harassment via stupidity and lack of self-awareness," I think this two would be guilty of it.

It really bothers me when people object to Jamie and Justin talking about the childbirth scene with Blake because she’s had four babies. Literally, the director‘s job is to lay out a vision for what he wants the childbirth scene to be in this movie. who gives a flying F if Blake has had 10 babies, he’s not coaching Blake through labor, he is trying to lay out a vision for a scene in his movie.

I am sure many actresses have had sex scenes in a movie that were not like the way they have sex in real life. They have gotten married in movies and shot wedding scenes that were not like their wedding in real life. And they have given birth in movie scenes in ways that were not like the way they gave birth in real life.

She is getting paid to act out a childbirth scene and he is the director of a movie. It was completely appropriate for them to have that discussion.

Sure he’s the director, but manspaining to a woman who has given birth four times that all women give birth naked in a tub because that’s how his wife did it — and that all women climax at the same time as their man during sex because that’s what his wife does — seems pretty tone deaf to me. If Justin needed this story to be that specific and oblivious to the big name actress (I know! But compared to Baldoni, Lively is the bigger name and box office draw here) he had actually cast, he should have cast his own wife as Lily instead.

This weird insistence on “this is how women experience this” is off putting. Some directors are brilliant and can get away with mistreating or being rude to the talent, but Baldoni was not in that space and in fact held himself out as someone who would be a partner not a dictator. So his insistence that “women be like this” comes off badly. It speaks to what some people in the thread have said that his feminism seemed performative because he would say one thing but then act differently.

+1 and will add:

Baldoni and Wayfarer made a huge deal about wanting to tell this particular story through "the female gaze." And Baldoni and Heath both have built professional reputations on the idea that they are men who *listen* to the women in their lives, who put aside toxic masculinity in order to be allies and partners. That is the context of this movie.

And then Baldoni and Heath told a woman who has given birth to four children that it is not "normal" to wear a hospital gown during birth (I have given birth and I wore a hospital gown) and that it is "weird" not to want to watch someone else's birth video.

You can't have it both ways. You can't claim to want to make a movie that tells the story from a female perspective and then dismiss female perspectives when they challenge some of the creative choices you are making in that movie. And further, from an employment perspective, you can't get an actress to sign onto a movie by explicitly telling her she'll be a collaborator in making the movie and that you are interested in and open to her ideas and input, and then shame her when she attempts to collaborate and share her ideas.

Or you can, but it doesn't make you a "male feminist" and it doesn't make you a good guy.

Did JB and Heath in fact, tell BL that women don’t wear gowns during childbirth? Is that verified? If so, that is so obviously wrong and disgusting on their part. However it doesn’t equal SH. I would have just disagreed with them and schooled these men that women do wear gowns or whatever they want during childbirth and if they want a totally naked actress pretending to give birth I am not the right actress for this porn film.

Lively alleged it in her complaint and Baldoni's lawsuit doesn't address it at all. So not "verified" but also not contradicted.

And I mean, I think what you describe is pretty much what Lively did, which is why she was not fully nude in the scene. And for standing up for herself and refusing to do unscripted nudity, she was hit with a PR campaign calling her hard to work with and accused of trying to "take over" the movie. Hmmm.

In fact she was fully dressed.

Yep.

I just rewatched this scene on YouTube and I wouldn’t describe her as fully dressed. She was not naked in a tub though. But she’s wearing a hospital gown that’s partly open at the top, her belly is exposed, and she is shot to appear naked from the waist down though you only see legs, torso, and stomach. The way it is shot she must have on one of those nude underwear things because the fake doctor is right up in her personal area. I would describe this as partially nude but ymmv.

Her belly was covered with a pregnancy suit. You do realize that she wasn’t pregnant, right? Jesus.

Sure, so her “belly” is not “her belly.” Pretty sure her naked legs are still hers, and that there is very little between the doctor and her personal area. I would never in one million years call this “fully dressed” but maybe you and Jesus would see this differently.

She is being paid mega bucks to wear a pregnancy suit and willingly pretend to be pregnant in a film, what part was BL confused about?

+1. And a film in which the childbirth scene is the pivotal part of the entire movie. It wasn’t like it was a minor element! It’s the entire plot!

Doesn’t mean she has to do it naked in a tub. Sorry not sorry.

This is why you have no credibility. She didn’t film it naked in a tub.

But that’s how Baldoni wanted to do it (with a fake belly but exposed breasts) and that’s what she objected to. That by itself isn’t sexual harassment but you can also prove SH by a pattern of behavior, which is what Lively is alleging in her complaint — not just one single incident of assault which is what some people experience.

It’s not sexual harassment to discuss how to film a childbirth scene and for the director to have an opinion on it when it is a pivotal scene in the plot.

Again, according to Baldoni's own timeline, Jamey Heath showed Lively the video of his wife's nude childbirth the day AFTER they shot the birth scene.

He was not showing to to her in order to demonstrate, as a producer, how they wanted Lively to act or appear in the birth scene, because it had already been shot.

ok? So they were still talking about the scene they just filmed? It takes a massive filtering of the facts via a framework intent on interpreting everything as an insult to reach the conclusion that discussing the scene was sexual harassment.

What professional reason did Heath have for trying to show the video to Lively if she'd already shot the birth scene?

What other appropriate reason would someone have for showing a video in which they and their wife appear nude? I've been working for 30+ years including in creative, nontraditional workplaces, and I've never shown anyway photos or video of myself or my spouse nude. It has simply never come up and I would assume doing so would not be appropriate in a work context.

But Blake twisted everything as we now know. They were casually talking about the scene as I just mentioned in a previous post and it was cordial and Blake actually showed interest in seeing the video. Leader she completely mis characterizes this.

She has a pattern of doing this. In her initial complaint, it was as if they were constantly asking her to do nude scenes that were out of the script with no intimacy coordinator, only to find out later this absolutely was not true, and she was the one that blew off meetings with the intimacy coordinator. Justin tried to share notes from the meeting with the intimacy coordinator. She completely mischaracterizes this as inappropriate conversations when we now know it was not - he was doing his job.

She continually does this. People bursting into her trailers at all hours while she was naked, only to find out she had invited the head producer into her trailer with three other female employees of hers were there while she was breast-feeding and all of a sudden it’s every man on this set, constantly and uncontrollably trying to get glimpses of a nude Blake lively.

Nope, reread. Baldoni and Heath were talking about it, Lively was not part of that discussion. Then Baldoni tells Heath he should show Lively the video of the birth and Heath approaches Lively and immediately starts showing her the video.

The timeline does this weird trick where it implies that Lively is part of the conversation Baldoni and Heath are having, but she wasn't. It says "During lunch, as part of a continued creative discussion that Baldoni and Lively were having about the hospital birthing scene, Baldoni asked Heath to show Lively his wife’s post-home-birth video..." That makes it sound like Baldoni and Lively were having a conversation, but they weren't. As the rest of the paragraph makes clear, they mean as part of the broader "creative discussion" about the birth scene (meaning the argument over what Lively would wear in the birth scene that has already been shot). Because then with this directive from Baldoni to show Lively the video, Heath then "approaches" here. So she wasn't there.

This is even weirder! Why are Baldoni and Heath sitting around discussion whether or not Lively should watch Heath's wife's birth video? WTF?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Honestly, if I were an actress that came into this movie being told I was working with a well known male feminist who had a podcast and everything and then I got strong armed by that same guy trying to make me film extra sex and nudity when I didn’t want to and I was told that the way I had given birth four times was “not normal”, I would find it pretty hard to talk to and work with these people because they would not at all be matching up with who they represented themselves as being.

She was playing a role, not Blake lively. It’s called acting.

[Anonymous]

No one forced Blake lively to watch any type of video.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't know why he asked about the weight. If you have a back injury, a few pounds either way isn't going to change lifting someone up. He knew she was post partum and they could estimate her weight from looking at her.

I think he asked more due to his body dysmorphia and issues and wanting to know her exact weight.

Agree with this. He definitely wasn't trying to "fat shame" her. However, I think this is a good example of where he is tone deaf and handles things poorly, and hit backfires HUGELY because Lively is highly reactive.

Asking the trainer what Lively's weight was... that was just stupid. Like unacceptably stupid. Again, I don't think he was trying to harass her or shame her or anything. I just think he was being an idiot and not getting what a radioactive violation of her privacy that would be especially with her just coming back from having a baby and clearly being in a sensitive place regarding her weight.

The stuff about him recommending a "weight loss specialist" is silly and I don't agree with her at all that that's what he was doing. But I also thin it all links back to him doing this dumb thing and asking her trainer for her weight.

He and Heath both do stuff like this throughout the production -- just idiotic transgressions that I truly don't believe were intentionally harassing but even just taken in isolation, I'm like "what? who does that?" Telling a mother of four what is normal during childbirth? Walking in on a woman who is topless in a trailer (even if you think she might be "cool" with it, this is just a dumb thing to do and someone with more sense would be like "oh excuse me I'll wait outside")? Talking about porn and asking lots of questions about porn (yes, even in the context of the movie -- this is a hot button topic and especially when you are talking to someone you know offends easily)?

If there was a cause of action that was "accidental harassment via stupidity and lack of self-awareness," I think this two would be guilty of it.

It really bothers me when people object to Jamie and Justin talking about the childbirth scene with Blake because she’s had four babies. Literally, the director‘s job is to lay out a vision for what he wants the childbirth scene to be in this movie. who gives a flying F if Blake has had 10 babies, he’s not coaching Blake through labor, he is trying to lay out a vision for a scene in his movie.

I am sure many actresses have had sex scenes in a movie that were not like the way they have sex in real life. They have gotten married in movies and shot wedding scenes that were not like their wedding in real life. And they have given birth in movie scenes in ways that were not like the way they gave birth in real life.

She is getting paid to act out a childbirth scene and he is the director of a movie. It was completely appropriate for them to have that discussion.

Sure he’s the director, but manspaining to a woman who has given birth four times that all women give birth naked in a tub because that’s how his wife did it — and that all women climax at the same time as their man during sex because that’s what his wife does — seems pretty tone deaf to me. If Justin needed this story to be that specific and oblivious to the big name actress (I know! But compared to Baldoni, Lively is the bigger name and box office draw here) he had actually cast, he should have cast his own wife as Lily instead.

This weird insistence on “this is how women experience this” is off putting. Some directors are brilliant and can get away with mistreating or being rude to the talent, but Baldoni was not in that space and in fact held himself out as someone who would be a partner not a dictator. So his insistence that “women be like this” comes off badly. It speaks to what some people in the thread have said that his feminism seemed performative because he would say one thing but then act differently.

+1 and will add:

Baldoni and Wayfarer made a huge deal about wanting to tell this particular story through "the female gaze." And Baldoni and Heath both have built professional reputations on the idea that they are men who *listen* to the women in their lives, who put aside toxic masculinity in order to be allies and partners. That is the context of this movie.

And then Baldoni and Heath told a woman who has given birth to four children that it is not "normal" to wear a hospital gown during birth (I have given birth and I wore a hospital gown) and that it is "weird" not to want to watch someone else's birth video.

You can't have it both ways. You can't claim to want to make a movie that tells the story from a female perspective and then dismiss female perspectives when they challenge some of the creative choices you are making in that movie. And further, from an employment perspective, you can't get an actress to sign onto a movie by explicitly telling her she'll be a collaborator in making the movie and that you are interested in and open to her ideas and input, and then shame her when she attempts to collaborate and share her ideas.

Or you can, but it doesn't make you a "male feminist" and it doesn't make you a good guy.

Did JB and Heath in fact, tell BL that women don’t wear gowns during childbirth? Is that verified? If so, that is so obviously wrong and disgusting on their part. However it doesn’t equal SH. I would have just disagreed with them and schooled these men that women do wear gowns or whatever they want during childbirth and if they want a totally naked actress pretending to give birth I am not the right actress for this porn film.

Lively alleged it in her complaint and Baldoni's lawsuit doesn't address it at all. So not "verified" but also not contradicted.

And I mean, I think what you describe is pretty much what Lively did, which is why she was not fully nude in the scene. And for standing up for herself and refusing to do unscripted nudity, she was hit with a PR campaign calling her hard to work with and accused of trying to "take over" the movie. Hmmm.

In fact she was fully dressed.

Yep.

I just rewatched this scene on YouTube and I wouldn’t describe her as fully dressed. She was not naked in a tub though. But she’s wearing a hospital gown that’s partly open at the top, her belly is exposed, and she is shot to appear naked from the waist down though you only see legs, torso, and stomach. The way it is shot she must have on one of those nude underwear things because the fake doctor is right up in her personal area. I would describe this as partially nude but ymmv.

Her belly was covered with a pregnancy suit. You do realize that she wasn’t pregnant, right? Jesus.

Sure, so her “belly” is not “her belly.” Pretty sure her naked legs are still hers, and that there is very little between the doctor and her personal area. I would never in one million years call this “fully dressed” but maybe you and Jesus would see this differently.

She is being paid mega bucks to wear a pregnancy suit and willingly pretend to be pregnant in a film, what part was BL confused about?

+1. And a film in which the childbirth scene is the pivotal part of the entire movie. It wasn’t like it was a minor element! It’s the entire plot!

Doesn’t mean she has to do it naked in a tub. Sorry not sorry.

This is why you have no credibility. She didn’t film it naked in a tub.

But that’s how Baldoni wanted to do it (with a fake belly but exposed breasts) and that’s what she objected to. That by itself isn’t sexual harassment but you can also prove SH by a pattern of behavior, which is what Lively is alleging in her complaint — not just one single incident of assault which is what some people experience.

It’s not sexual harassment to discuss how to film a childbirth scene and for the director to have an opinion on it when it is a pivotal scene in the plot.

Again, according to Baldoni's own timeline, Jamey Heath showed Lively the video of his wife's nude childbirth the day AFTER they shot the birth scene.

He was not showing to to her in order to demonstrate, as a producer, how they wanted Lively to act or appear in the birth scene, because it had already been shot.

ok? So they were still talking about the scene they just filmed? It takes a massive filtering of the facts via a framework intent on interpreting everything as an insult to reach the conclusion that discussing the scene was sexual harassment.

What professional reason did Heath have for trying to show the video to Lively if she'd already shot the birth scene?

What other appropriate reason would someone have for showing a video in which they and their wife appear nude? I've been working for 30+ years including in creative, nontraditional workplaces, and I've never shown anyway photos or video of myself or my spouse nude. It has simply never come up and I would assume doing so would not be appropriate in a work context.

Were you in a creative field SPECIFICALLY DEPICTING CHILDBIRTH??

the Lively allegations surrounding the birth scene were some of the dumbest ones.

Again: the childbirth scene had already been shot. So why was he showing this video to Lively?

well Lively’s interpretations are clearly distorted so it’s hard to say what exactly happened. My guess would be they were discussing the scene they just shot, and the subject was still a topic of discussion and analysis. It seems totally normal to me. what seems abnormal is the accusation that he was somehow intentionally abusing Lively by showing her “porn” in the form of his child’s birth video.

But they had not "just shot" it.

May 22nd: Birth scene filmed
May 23rd morning: Multiple scenes involving the actors wearing "onesies" filmed
May 23rd lunch break: Heath shows Lively the video of his wife giving birth nude
May 23rd evening: Dancing scene for montage filmed

Why would he be discussing the birth scene at that point? There is nothing they could do to change it, and they'd already moved on to other scenes. Was he trying to convince Lively to reshoot the birth scene with less clothes? Why wasn't he focused on the scenes from that morning or the upcoming montage scenes? Would Lively be focused on those scenes, as an actress looking to be in character? It actually seems very unprofessional to be revisiting an argument from the day before in the middle of a day in which Lively is shooting multiple scenes from various parts of the movie.

Perhaps rhey were unhappy with the film from the initial shot and felt it looked fake.

More than likely.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't know why he asked about the weight. If you have a back injury, a few pounds either way isn't going to change lifting someone up. He knew she was post partum and they could estimate her weight from looking at her.

I think he asked more due to his body dysmorphia and issues and wanting to know her exact weight.

Agree with this. He definitely wasn't trying to "fat shame" her. However, I think this is a good example of where he is tone deaf and handles things poorly, and hit backfires HUGELY because Lively is highly reactive.

Asking the trainer what Lively's weight was... that was just stupid. Like unacceptably stupid. Again, I don't think he was trying to harass her or shame her or anything. I just think he was being an idiot and not getting what a radioactive violation of her privacy that would be especially with her just coming back from having a baby and clearly being in a sensitive place regarding her weight.

The stuff about him recommending a "weight loss specialist" is silly and I don't agree with her at all that that's what he was doing. But I also thin it all links back to him doing this dumb thing and asking her trainer for her weight.

He and Heath both do stuff like this throughout the production -- just idiotic transgressions that I truly don't believe were intentionally harassing but even just taken in isolation, I'm like "what? who does that?" Telling a mother of four what is normal during childbirth? Walking in on a woman who is topless in a trailer (even if you think she might be "cool" with it, this is just a dumb thing to do and someone with more sense would be like "oh excuse me I'll wait outside")? Talking about porn and asking lots of questions about porn (yes, even in the context of the movie -- this is a hot button topic and especially when you are talking to someone you know offends easily)?

If there was a cause of action that was "accidental harassment via stupidity and lack of self-awareness," I think this two would be guilty of it.

It really bothers me when people object to Jamie and Justin talking about the childbirth scene with Blake because she’s had four babies. Literally, the director‘s job is to lay out a vision for what he wants the childbirth scene to be in this movie. who gives a flying F if Blake has had 10 babies, he’s not coaching Blake through labor, he is trying to lay out a vision for a scene in his movie.

I am sure many actresses have had sex scenes in a movie that were not like the way they have sex in real life. They have gotten married in movies and shot wedding scenes that were not like their wedding in real life. And they have given birth in movie scenes in ways that were not like the way they gave birth in real life.

She is getting paid to act out a childbirth scene and he is the director of a movie. It was completely appropriate for them to have that discussion.

Sure he’s the director, but manspaining to a woman who has given birth four times that all women give birth naked in a tub because that’s how his wife did it — and that all women climax at the same time as their man during sex because that’s what his wife does — seems pretty tone deaf to me. If Justin needed this story to be that specific and oblivious to the big name actress (I know! But compared to Baldoni, Lively is the bigger name and box office draw here) he had actually cast, he should have cast his own wife as Lily instead.

This weird insistence on “this is how women experience this” is off putting. Some directors are brilliant and can get away with mistreating or being rude to the talent, but Baldoni was not in that space and in fact held himself out as someone who would be a partner not a dictator. So his insistence that “women be like this” comes off badly. It speaks to what some people in the thread have said that his feminism seemed performative because he would say one thing but then act differently.

+1 and will add:

Baldoni and Wayfarer made a huge deal about wanting to tell this particular story through "the female gaze." And Baldoni and Heath both have built professional reputations on the idea that they are men who *listen* to the women in their lives, who put aside toxic masculinity in order to be allies and partners. That is the context of this movie.

And then Baldoni and Heath told a woman who has given birth to four children that it is not "normal" to wear a hospital gown during birth (I have given birth and I wore a hospital gown) and that it is "weird" not to want to watch someone else's birth video.

You can't have it both ways. You can't claim to want to make a movie that tells the story from a female perspective and then dismiss female perspectives when they challenge some of the creative choices you are making in that movie. And further, from an employment perspective, you can't get an actress to sign onto a movie by explicitly telling her she'll be a collaborator in making the movie and that you are interested in and open to her ideas and input, and then shame her when she attempts to collaborate and share her ideas.

Or you can, but it doesn't make you a "male feminist" and it doesn't make you a good guy.

Did JB and Heath in fact, tell BL that women don’t wear gowns during childbirth? Is that verified? If so, that is so obviously wrong and disgusting on their part. However it doesn’t equal SH. I would have just disagreed with them and schooled these men that women do wear gowns or whatever they want during childbirth and if they want a totally naked actress pretending to give birth I am not the right actress for this porn film.

Lively alleged it in her complaint and Baldoni's lawsuit doesn't address it at all. So not "verified" but also not contradicted.

And I mean, I think what you describe is pretty much what Lively did, which is why she was not fully nude in the scene. And for standing up for herself and refusing to do unscripted nudity, she was hit with a PR campaign calling her hard to work with and accused of trying to "take over" the movie. Hmmm.

In fact she was fully dressed.

Yep.

I just rewatched this scene on YouTube and I wouldn’t describe her as fully dressed. She was not naked in a tub though. But she’s wearing a hospital gown that’s partly open at the top, her belly is exposed, and she is shot to appear naked from the waist down though you only see legs, torso, and stomach. The way it is shot she must have on one of those nude underwear things because the fake doctor is right up in her personal area. I would describe this as partially nude but ymmv.

Her belly was covered with a pregnancy suit. You do realize that she wasn’t pregnant, right? Jesus.

Sure, so her “belly” is not “her belly.” Pretty sure her naked legs are still hers, and that there is very little between the doctor and her personal area. I would never in one million years call this “fully dressed” but maybe you and Jesus would see this differently.

She is being paid mega bucks to wear a pregnancy suit and willingly pretend to be pregnant in a film, what part was BL confused about?

+1. And a film in which the childbirth scene is the pivotal part of the entire movie. It wasn’t like it was a minor element! It’s the entire plot!

Doesn’t mean she has to do it naked in a tub. Sorry not sorry.

This is why you have no credibility. She didn’t film it naked in a tub.

But that’s how Baldoni wanted to do it (with a fake belly but exposed breasts) and that’s what she objected to. That by itself isn’t sexual harassment but you can also prove SH by a pattern of behavior, which is what Lively is alleging in her complaint — not just one single incident of assault which is what some people experience.

It’s not sexual harassment to discuss how to film a childbirth scene and for the director to have an opinion on it when it is a pivotal scene in the plot.

Again, according to Baldoni's own timeline, Jamey Heath showed Lively the video of his wife's nude childbirth the day AFTER they shot the birth scene.

He was not showing to to her in order to demonstrate, as a producer, how they wanted Lively to act or appear in the birth scene, because it had already been shot.

ok? So they were still talking about the scene they just filmed? It takes a massive filtering of the facts via a framework intent on interpreting everything as an insult to reach the conclusion that discussing the scene was sexual harassment.

Further, if you read Baldoni‘s suit, he clearly stated that they were having a casual conversation, Blake actually responded she’d love to see the video later. It was very friendly and cordial. It was only later when Blake was using this as leverage that she tried to call it p—n and act like it was being forced on her.

Here is the description from Baldoni's timeline:

May 23, 2023: During lunch, as part of a continued creative discussion that Baldoni and Lively were having about the hospital birthing scene, Baldoni asked Heath to show Lively his wife’s post-home-birth video, stating to Heath that Lively had not seen one and was presumably interested in watching. Baldoni himself had seen the video prior and felt it was demonstrative of the spirit of his vision for the birthing scene. Heath agreed to share this deeply personal video and approached Lively with the video in hand. He proceeded to show her one second of it before Lively asked if Heath had permission to share the video, to which Heath confirmed that he did. Lively stated she would like to see the video but asked to watch it after finishing her lunch. Heath did not press the matter and moved on. (NOTE: Lively never did see the video beyond the one-second clip shown to her).

Baldoni "presumes" that Lively would be interested in watching the birth video, he doesn't ask her. Instead, he asks Heath to show it to her and Heath "approaches Lively with the video in hand" and apparently starts playing it before telling her what it is or asking if she wants to see it. She stops him and asks if he has permission from his wife to show it, demonstrating she considers the content of the video highly personal. The then says that she would watch it after lunch but apparently makes no effort to do so.

Dude, she was being polite. She thought it was super weird that Heath would walk up and just start showing her the video, she was concerned about his wife's privacy, and she had never expressed any interest in seeing the video. But she didn't want to say "omg weirdo please stop showing me nude footage of your wife and you while she gives birth, what is wrong with you?" So instead she says "ok, maybe later!" and then never talks about it again because that's what you do when your weird, creepy coworker wants to show you inappropriate videos at work. And then you go talk to HR.

And to all of this, I say, who cares. None of what you described, and I mean absolutely none of it comes anywhere close to sexual harassment, and we all know this. The public has moved on. No other celebrities since Justin sued the times and put out his side of the story have come forward saying they support Blake. Chelsea Handler made a joke about Blake and Justin at the critics choice awards last night, and the audience was howling. No one thinks this is a serious case of sexual harassment.

Most people would agree Justin is odd and the whole lot of them are insufferable and I’m sure everyone on this thread is very thrilled that they don’t have to work with anybody involved in this, but it is not SH.

Blake and Ryan thought they could extort the hell out of Wayfarer using me too.

[Anonymous]

Just for the record, this is about the 13 th time we have argued about the same exact allegations concerning the birthing scene since JB’s Complaint was filed. There has been no new info disclosed since that time
Can one of the Blake posters explains to me why we are discussing the exact same allegation over and over again when no new info has been released? What do you have to gain? You already know that people are going to bring up that she was in fact clothed and that it’s part of the job of directing to instruct actors how they want the scene to look.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't know why he asked about the weight. If you have a back injury, a few pounds either way isn't going to change lifting someone up. He knew she was post partum and they could estimate her weight from looking at her.

I think he asked more due to his body dysmorphia and issues and wanting to know her exact weight.

Agree with this. He definitely wasn't trying to "fat shame" her. However, I think this is a good example of where he is tone deaf and handles things poorly, and hit backfires HUGELY because Lively is highly reactive.

Asking the trainer what Lively's weight was... that was just stupid. Like unacceptably stupid. Again, I don't think he was trying to harass her or shame her or anything. I just think he was being an idiot and not getting what a radioactive violation of her privacy that would be especially with her just coming back from having a baby and clearly being in a sensitive place regarding her weight.

The stuff about him recommending a "weight loss specialist" is silly and I don't agree with her at all that that's what he was doing. But I also thin it all links back to him doing this dumb thing and asking her trainer for her weight.

He and Heath both do stuff like this throughout the production -- just idiotic transgressions that I truly don't believe were intentionally harassing but even just taken in isolation, I'm like "what? who does that?" Telling a mother of four what is normal during childbirth? Walking in on a woman who is topless in a trailer (even if you think she might be "cool" with it, this is just a dumb thing to do and someone with more sense would be like "oh excuse me I'll wait outside")? Talking about porn and asking lots of questions about porn (yes, even in the context of the movie -- this is a hot button topic and especially when you are talking to someone you know offends easily)?

If there was a cause of action that was "accidental harassment via stupidity and lack of self-awareness," I think this two would be guilty of it.

It really bothers me when people object to Jamie and Justin talking about the childbirth scene with Blake because she’s had four babies. Literally, the director‘s job is to lay out a vision for what he wants the childbirth scene to be in this movie. who gives a flying F if Blake has had 10 babies, he’s not coaching Blake through labor, he is trying to lay out a vision for a scene in his movie.

I am sure many actresses have had sex scenes in a movie that were not like the way they have sex in real life. They have gotten married in movies and shot wedding scenes that were not like their wedding in real life. And they have given birth in movie scenes in ways that were not like the way they gave birth in real life.

She is getting paid to act out a childbirth scene and he is the director of a movie. It was completely appropriate for them to have that discussion.

Sure he’s the director, but manspaining to a woman who has given birth four times that all women give birth naked in a tub because that’s how his wife did it — and that all women climax at the same time as their man during sex because that’s what his wife does — seems pretty tone deaf to me. If Justin needed this story to be that specific and oblivious to the big name actress (I know! But compared to Baldoni, Lively is the bigger name and box office draw here) he had actually cast, he should have cast his own wife as Lily instead.

This weird insistence on “this is how women experience this” is off putting. Some directors are brilliant and can get away with mistreating or being rude to the talent, but Baldoni was not in that space and in fact held himself out as someone who would be a partner not a dictator. So his insistence that “women be like this” comes off badly. It speaks to what some people in the thread have said that his feminism seemed performative because he would say one thing but then act differently.

+1 and will add:

Baldoni and Wayfarer made a huge deal about wanting to tell this particular story through "the female gaze." And Baldoni and Heath both have built professional reputations on the idea that they are men who *listen* to the women in their lives, who put aside toxic masculinity in order to be allies and partners. That is the context of this movie.

And then Baldoni and Heath told a woman who has given birth to four children that it is not "normal" to wear a hospital gown during birth (I have given birth and I wore a hospital gown) and that it is "weird" not to want to watch someone else's birth video.

You can't have it both ways. You can't claim to want to make a movie that tells the story from a female perspective and then dismiss female perspectives when they challenge some of the creative choices you are making in that movie. And further, from an employment perspective, you can't get an actress to sign onto a movie by explicitly telling her she'll be a collaborator in making the movie and that you are interested in and open to her ideas and input, and then shame her when she attempts to collaborate and share her ideas.

Or you can, but it doesn't make you a "male feminist" and it doesn't make you a good guy.

Did JB and Heath in fact, tell BL that women don’t wear gowns during childbirth? Is that verified? If so, that is so obviously wrong and disgusting on their part. However it doesn’t equal SH. I would have just disagreed with them and schooled these men that women do wear gowns or whatever they want during childbirth and if they want a totally naked actress pretending to give birth I am not the right actress for this porn film.

Lively alleged it in her complaint and Baldoni's lawsuit doesn't address it at all. So not "verified" but also not contradicted.

And I mean, I think what you describe is pretty much what Lively did, which is why she was not fully nude in the scene. And for standing up for herself and refusing to do unscripted nudity, she was hit with a PR campaign calling her hard to work with and accused of trying to "take over" the movie. Hmmm.

In fact she was fully dressed.

Yep.

I just rewatched this scene on YouTube and I wouldn’t describe her as fully dressed. She was not naked in a tub though. But she’s wearing a hospital gown that’s partly open at the top, her belly is exposed, and she is shot to appear naked from the waist down though you only see legs, torso, and stomach. The way it is shot she must have on one of those nude underwear things because the fake doctor is right up in her personal area. I would describe this as partially nude but ymmv.

Her belly was covered with a pregnancy suit. You do realize that she wasn’t pregnant, right? Jesus.

Sure, so her “belly” is not “her belly.” Pretty sure her naked legs are still hers, and that there is very little between the doctor and her personal area. I would never in one million years call this “fully dressed” but maybe you and Jesus would see this differently.

She is being paid mega bucks to wear a pregnancy suit and willingly pretend to be pregnant in a film, what part was BL confused about?

+1. And a film in which the childbirth scene is the pivotal part of the entire movie. It wasn’t like it was a minor element! It’s the entire plot!

Doesn’t mean she has to do it naked in a tub. Sorry not sorry.

This is why you have no credibility. She didn’t film it naked in a tub.

But that’s how Baldoni wanted to do it (with a fake belly but exposed breasts) and that’s what she objected to. That by itself isn’t sexual harassment but you can also prove SH by a pattern of behavior, which is what Lively is alleging in her complaint — not just one single incident of assault which is what some people experience.

It’s not sexual harassment to discuss how to film a childbirth scene and for the director to have an opinion on it when it is a pivotal scene in the plot.

Again, according to Baldoni's own timeline, Jamey Heath showed Lively the video of his wife's nude childbirth the day AFTER they shot the birth scene.

He was not showing to to her in order to demonstrate, as a producer, how they wanted Lively to act or appear in the birth scene, because it had already been shot.

ok? So they were still talking about the scene they just filmed? It takes a massive filtering of the facts via a framework intent on interpreting everything as an insult to reach the conclusion that discussing the scene was sexual harassment.

Further, if you read Baldoni‘s suit, he clearly stated that they were having a casual conversation, Blake actually responded she’d love to see the video later. It was very friendly and cordial. It was only later when Blake was using this as leverage that she tried to call it p—n and act like it was being forced on her.

Here is the description from Baldoni's timeline:

May 23, 2023: During lunch, as part of a continued creative discussion that Baldoni and Lively were having about the hospital birthing scene, Baldoni asked Heath to show Lively his wife’s post-home-birth video, stating to Heath that Lively had not seen one and was presumably interested in watching. Baldoni himself had seen the video prior and felt it was demonstrative of the spirit of his vision for the birthing scene. Heath agreed to share this deeply personal video and approached Lively with the video in hand. He proceeded to show her one second of it before Lively asked if Heath had permission to share the video, to which Heath confirmed that he did. Lively stated she would like to see the video but asked to watch it after finishing her lunch. Heath did not press the matter and moved on. (NOTE: Lively never did see the video beyond the one-second clip shown to her).

Baldoni "presumes" that Lively would be interested in watching the birth video, he doesn't ask her. Instead, he asks Heath to show it to her and Heath "approaches Lively with the video in hand" and apparently starts playing it before telling her what it is or asking if she wants to see it. She stops him and asks if he has permission from his wife to show it, demonstrating she considers the content of the video highly personal. The then says that she would watch it after lunch but apparently makes no effort to do so.

Dude, she was being polite. She thought it was super weird that Heath would walk up and just start showing her the video, she was concerned about his wife's privacy, and she had never expressed any interest in seeing the video. But she didn't want to say "omg weirdo please stop showing me nude footage of your wife and you while she gives birth, what is wrong with you?" So instead she says "ok, maybe later!" and then never talks about it again because that's what you do when your weird, creepy coworker wants to show you inappropriate videos at work. And then you go talk to HR.

And to all of this, I say, who cares. None of what you described, and I mean absolutely none of it comes anywhere close to sexual harassment, and we all know this. The public has moved on. No other celebrities since Justin sued the times and put out his side of the story have come forward saying they support Blake. Chelsea Handler made a joke about Blake and Justin at the critics choice awards last night, and the audience was howling. No one thinks this is a serious case of sexual harassment.

Most people would agree Justin is odd and the whole lot of them are insufferable and I’m sure everyone on this thread is very thrilled that they don’t have to work with anybody involved in this, but it is not SH.

Blake and Ryan thought they could extort the hell out of Wayfarer using me too.

So did Judd Apato. The whole thing is a joke to Hollywood.

[Anonymous]

Blake demands her name be put on top of Anna Kendrick’s. Unbelievable.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-14382125/amp/anna-kendrick-lowkey-appearance-blake-lively-feud-simple-favor.html

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I don't know why he asked about the weight. If you have a back injury, a few pounds either way isn't going to change lifting someone up. He knew she was post partum and they could estimate her weight from looking at her.

I think he asked more due to his body dysmorphia and issues and wanting to know her exact weight.

Agree with this. He definitely wasn't trying to "fat shame" her. However, I think this is a good example of where he is tone deaf and handles things poorly, and hit backfires HUGELY because Lively is highly reactive.

Asking the trainer what Lively's weight was... that was just stupid. Like unacceptably stupid. Again, I don't think he was trying to harass her or shame her or anything. I just think he was being an idiot and not getting what a radioactive violation of her privacy that would be especially with her just coming back from having a baby and clearly being in a sensitive place regarding her weight.

The stuff about him recommending a "weight loss specialist" is silly and I don't agree with her at all that that's what he was doing. But I also thin it all links back to him doing this dumb thing and asking her trainer for her weight.

He and Heath both do stuff like this throughout the production -- just idiotic transgressions that I truly don't believe were intentionally harassing but even just taken in isolation, I'm like "what? who does that?" Telling a mother of four what is normal during childbirth? Walking in on a woman who is topless in a trailer (even if you think she might be "cool" with it, this is just a dumb thing to do and someone with more sense would be like "oh excuse me I'll wait outside")? Talking about porn and asking lots of questions about porn (yes, even in the context of the movie -- this is a hot button topic and especially when you are talking to someone you know offends easily)?

If there was a cause of action that was "accidental harassment via stupidity and lack of self-awareness," I think this two would be guilty of it.

It really bothers me when people object to Jamie and Justin talking about the childbirth scene with Blake because she’s had four babies. Literally, the director‘s job is to lay out a vision for what he wants the childbirth scene to be in this movie. who gives a flying F if Blake has had 10 babies, he’s not coaching Blake through labor, he is trying to lay out a vision for a scene in his movie.

I am sure many actresses have had sex scenes in a movie that were not like the way they have sex in real life. They have gotten married in movies and shot wedding scenes that were not like their wedding in real life. And they have given birth in movie scenes in ways that were not like the way they gave birth in real life.

She is getting paid to act out a childbirth scene and he is the director of a movie. It was completely appropriate for them to have that discussion.

Sure he’s the director, but manspaining to a woman who has given birth four times that all women give birth naked in a tub because that’s how his wife did it — and that all women climax at the same time as their man during sex because that’s what his wife does — seems pretty tone deaf to me. If Justin needed this story to be that specific and oblivious to the big name actress (I know! But compared to Baldoni, Lively is the bigger name and box office draw here) he had actually cast, he should have cast his own wife as Lily instead.

This weird insistence on “this is how women experience this” is off putting. Some directors are brilliant and can get away with mistreating or being rude to the talent, but Baldoni was not in that space and in fact held himself out as someone who would be a partner not a dictator. So his insistence that “women be like this” comes off badly. It speaks to what some people in the thread have said that his feminism seemed performative because he would say one thing but then act differently.

+1 and will add:

Baldoni and Wayfarer made a huge deal about wanting to tell this particular story through "the female gaze." And Baldoni and Heath both have built professional reputations on the idea that they are men who *listen* to the women in their lives, who put aside toxic masculinity in order to be allies and partners. That is the context of this movie.

And then Baldoni and Heath told a woman who has given birth to four children that it is not "normal" to wear a hospital gown during birth (I have given birth and I wore a hospital gown) and that it is "weird" not to want to watch someone else's birth video.

You can't have it both ways. You can't claim to want to make a movie that tells the story from a female perspective and then dismiss female perspectives when they challenge some of the creative choices you are making in that movie. And further, from an employment perspective, you can't get an actress to sign onto a movie by explicitly telling her she'll be a collaborator in making the movie and that you are interested in and open to her ideas and input, and then shame her when she attempts to collaborate and share her ideas.

Or you can, but it doesn't make you a "male feminist" and it doesn't make you a good guy.

Did JB and Heath in fact, tell BL that women don’t wear gowns during childbirth? Is that verified? If so, that is so obviously wrong and disgusting on their part. However it doesn’t equal SH. I would have just disagreed with them and schooled these men that women do wear gowns or whatever they want during childbirth and if they want a totally naked actress pretending to give birth I am not the right actress for this porn film.

Lively alleged it in her complaint and Baldoni's lawsuit doesn't address it at all. So not "verified" but also not contradicted.

And I mean, I think what you describe is pretty much what Lively did, which is why she was not fully nude in the scene. And for standing up for herself and refusing to do unscripted nudity, she was hit with a PR campaign calling her hard to work with and accused of trying to "take over" the movie. Hmmm.

In fact she was fully dressed.

Yep.

I just rewatched this scene on YouTube and I wouldn’t describe her as fully dressed. She was not naked in a tub though. But she’s wearing a hospital gown that’s partly open at the top, her belly is exposed, and she is shot to appear naked from the waist down though you only see legs, torso, and stomach. The way it is shot she must have on one of those nude underwear things because the fake doctor is right up in her personal area. I would describe this as partially nude but ymmv.

Her belly was covered with a pregnancy suit. You do realize that she wasn’t pregnant, right? Jesus.

Sure, so her “belly” is not “her belly.” Pretty sure her naked legs are still hers, and that there is very little between the doctor and her personal area. I would never in one million years call this “fully dressed” but maybe you and Jesus would see this differently.

She is being paid mega bucks to wear a pregnancy suit and willingly pretend to be pregnant in a film, what part was BL confused about?

+1. And a film in which the childbirth scene is the pivotal part of the entire movie. It wasn’t like it was a minor element! It’s the entire plot!

Doesn’t mean she has to do it naked in a tub. Sorry not sorry.

This is why you have no credibility. She didn’t film it naked in a tub.

But that’s how Baldoni wanted to do it (with a fake belly but exposed breasts) and that’s what she objected to. That by itself isn’t sexual harassment but you can also prove SH by a pattern of behavior, which is what Lively is alleging in her complaint — not just one single incident of assault which is what some people experience.

It’s not sexual harassment to discuss how to film a childbirth scene and for the director to have an opinion on it when it is a pivotal scene in the plot.

I totally agree with you. This was a major part of the movie.

A major part of the movie that had already been shot. Why were they still talking about it? Did they want to go back and shoot it again, this time with her nude?

I mean, BL was well aware of what giving birth looks like as she has 4 kids. This does seem quite perverted and totally unnecessary to show your own wife giving birth nude. BL did not need to see this, no one should be viewing this. It’s gross, unprofessional and bizarre. JB’s wife should be livid. What weirdos. Does this point to SH? Not sure…I am also wondering now, did JB’s wife consent to this personal birth video being shown off as a gold standard of birthing?

It wasn’t JB’s wife, it was Heaths wife in video. Heath confirmed to BL (according to JB/Heath) that he had permission from his wife to show it (maybe she’s proud of it and is body positive and is happy he likes to show the video? Who knows!) but BL still declined to see it so she didn’t actually see anything. (Even if she thinks it is porn, supposedly they didn’t even get far enough in the “pressing play” part of the video to see anything!)

I still think it’s a big bait and switch of BL setting the tone for casual “ball-busting” banter that they mistook for friendship and a green light to just speak and share freely. They weren’t guarding themselves against what her narrow interpretation of SH might be because so much of how she conducted herself included profanities and sexual innuendo that they simply didn’t think any of this was an issue.