Plane crash DCA?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:➡️ January 20: FAA director fired
➡️ January 21: Air Traffic Controller hiring frozen
➡️ January 22: Aviation Safety Advisory Committee disbanded
➡️ January 28: Buyout/retirement demand sent to existing employees
➡️ January 29: First American mid-air collision in 16 years

Making America Great Again!

So they sabotaged it? I doubt that very much. I have a higher opinion of FAA employees than you do.

Not sabotage. Stress.

Remember that one of Trump’s people said their goal was to “traumatize federal employees.”

Was this actually an ATC error? I thought it was mainly the helicopter error.

No one knows yet.

To me, it does look like some element of ATC error. It clearly was not communicating to both the helicopter and the airplane that they were headed straight for each other and need to take action.

That’s not true, the tower clearly advised the helicopter about the traffic, which plane it was and where it was going. Then they confirm visual separation. Then they actually do see it and tell the helicopter to go behind the plane. I don’t think there’s any way from what we could hear that the tower would anticipate the helicopter flying into the plane, but obviously we have limited info. But the tower does contact the helicopter before the crash.

It’s also amazing how he stayed so calm and redirected the other planes, especially that American pilot who was kind of a d$& about it.

But clearly the helicopter didn’t understand which plane the ATC had identified and that is part of the problem. We don’t know all of what was said, but it’s the ATCs job to make sure all the planes headed into the runway are aware of each other, on correct course and don’t collide, and that didn’t happen.

“PAT25, traffic just south of the Woodrow Bridge, a CRJ, it’s 1200 feet setting up for runway 33.”

Sounds pretty unambiguous to me.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=CiOybe-NJHk

“Setting up for runway 33” implies a plane is swinging out (dog tailing) to the east a bit to align with runway 33 (oh, where is that? Oh I see), and then will land.

That's exactly what the plane did. Exactly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My BIL works for Southwest and they are known to have a super Trumpy culture amongst pilots, I wonder what they are thinking these days with all of his nonsense.

Most of my fellow pilots lean right. Some far right. Many of them have been spouting the DEI nonsense in aviation for years. I guarantee you all of them will lay this on the tower controllers and the controllers union for making it difficult for the govt to hire/fire controllers. As someone who is more center of the road there is more than a small amount of truth to this.

I've posted this earlier but there is an ongoing class action lawsuit precisely bc the ATC created a biographical questionnaire that screened out white men in favor of women and poc. As far I know its no longer being used and I don't think DEI has anything to do with this particular incident, but it did happen and qualified white men--who had already spent ten of thousands of dollars of their own money to got to ATC school-- were turned away based on that questionnaire alone. It's Brigida v DoT and it's been making it's way through the courts for like 10 years now...there's another system that could use an overhaul.

ATC also dropped the college aviation degree prerequisite the last 10 years. We had friends with college loans to do that program, they graduated and then poof, didn’t matter!

And yet we still don't have enough ATC...so what is your point? ATC isn't to blame for this accident and DEI isn't to blame either. SO why are you posting about your friends?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:There are numerous BH pilots saying it was the primary job of the white guy sitting in the back to make sure the area around the BH was clear. I also read that it often is 2 in back although 3 can be done. But doesn’t make sense in this airspace.

Yeah and?

What does the back crew guy do with the PIC, with one hand on cyclical, other hand on collective, and her feet on the rotors, juts up 150 ft off course and veers into middle of river suddenly right when a commercial jet descends there?

Btw this easily could have happened at runway 1 thirty seconds more down river.

This is exactly what will happen with MAGA. They’ll ignore the experts and pull $hit out of their ass to make up some narrative that of course she was a DEI hire, despite absolutely no evidence of it. The men who are alive and knew her won’t speak up on her behalf because there’s a hatred for women in the military as of 1/20/25.

Just the ones that kill 70 people in mid air.

So you’ve already tried her with all the military evidence you have, and found that not only is she guilty, but a “killer?!” Are you already trashing the two white men who did nothing to stop a helicopter that was too high, and off course in line with DCA’s runway?

As soon as you read that last sentence, is your mind now scrambling to make up more damning reasons to blame this accident solely on the actions of a single person, outside of any higher ups who gave orders, or any other culpable parties because she has to be a DEI hire for the very reason she dared to be a woman in the military?

She was in charge it’s mostly her fault.

A male voice said the aircraft was in sight and he was looking at the wrong aircraft.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are numerous BH pilots saying it was the primary job of the white guy sitting in the back to make sure the area around the BH was clear. I also read that it often is 2 in back although 3 can be done. But doesn’t make sense in this airspace.

Yeah and?

What does the back crew guy do with the PIC, with one hand on cyclical, other hand on collective, and her feet on the rotors, juts up 150 ft off course and veers into middle of river suddenly right when a commercial jet descends there?

Btw this easily could have happened at runway 1 thirty seconds more down river.

This is exactly what will happen with MAGA. They’ll ignore the experts and pull $hit out of their ass to make up some narrative that of course she was a DEI hire, despite absolutely no evidence of it. The men who are alive and knew her won’t speak up on her behalf because there’s a hatred for women in the military as of 1/20/25.

Just the ones that kill 70 people in mid air.

So you’ve already tried her with all the military evidence you have, and found that not only is she guilty, but a “killer?!” Are you already trashing the two white men who did nothing to stop a helicopter that was too high, and off course in line with DCA’s runway?

As soon as you read that last sentence, is your mind now scrambling to make up more damning reasons to blame this accident solely on the actions of a single person, outside of any higher ups who gave orders, or any other culpable parties because she has to be a DEI hire for the very reason she dared to be a woman in the military?

She was in charge it’s mostly her fault.

Then what do you need her name for? To curse it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m so confused re DEI. Probably the ATC and the pilots were white? Had anyone said differently?

No one has the profiles of the pilots, atc or anyone released yet.

Now I'm scared about what happens if anyone at ATC is revealed to be non-white or a woman (including any supervisor on duty) and the president is ready to pin the entire tragedy in them for being a "DEI hire." No effort to actually find out what procedural mistake caused this tragic event, they'll just blame the black guy or the Hispanic woman in the vicinity.

JD Vance just explained that lots of qualified people have been applying for jobs as ATCs for years but getting rejected because they were white. WTF? You can't make this stuff up.

Yeah. You’re only allowed to make a mistake if you are white and male. Then it’s a “tragic accident,” but for anyone else, they “must have been unqualified.”

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Per CNN right now the BH was flying 100 feet above maximum altitude and was also off course.

ngl, a 100 foot difference in elevation in a fast moving helicopter at night will not be noticed by the pilots. Easy to subtly drift 100 feet higher.

Their eyes are not glued to the gauges, they are looking out the window trying to see airplane and other objects. If they were wearing nightvision goggles, then there's even a bigger chance they are not glued to the instruments since their peripheral vision is compromised by the goggles.

Oh please.

Your job is a military helicopter pilot of a spy helo and extraction helo. You had better know what damn altitude you are flying and hiding out at.

“‘Oh sorry guys, we got bin Laden and then I forgot to fly low and got shot down by a 80 year old Russian bazooka. Over and out.’”

You sound like my spouse who never knows how fast she’s actually going until someone else tells her to slow down or she’s pulled over.

It’s not like they are flying in an urban area or near other airports. Flying around the desert NBD.

Black Hawks regularly fly through urban areas and near other air traffic. Do you not realize there are cities in Afghanistan, Iraq, and near many US military bases?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wonder what happened to those passengers who were next to land behind the CRJ, I guess they quickly had to reroute, or did they just land as planned? Must have been terrifying for them also.

All the planes behind were diverted. If you track AA3130, they went to BWI. Others went to Dulles, and others turned back to their origination airport.

The people on board AA3130 would have witnessed this tragedy. I can only imagine what went through their minds.

I don’t think they could see it. Passengers reported not knowing why they were being rerouted until texting with relatives or reaching their destination.

If I saw it, I’d keep it to myself so as not to start a panic on board. I would not want to be with 60-250 panicking people in such a small space.

A passenger on that flight stated they didn’t see it but the pilot suddenly ascended which caught everyone by surprised and they were diverted to BWI.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd also love to know the name of any VIP who was flown over initially, requiring the return helicopter flight.

If this is ever released, I’ll be shocked.

My prediction: We will never find out who the vip was.

Probably one of Trump’s children.

Or some equally frivolous trip. Part of the investigation should be listing every approved trip, and was there an increase with the new admin. If it was happening in past admins, shame them, too, but make it stop. Every helicopter puts lives at risk. Time to sit in traffic with everyone else heading to the office.

The trip details are less important. They should have had control of that helicopter. This is a grave helicopter operation error. This was a flight in clear weather, no hostile fire, clear instruction and communication from ATC and they still crashed straight into a passenger jet flying a known and communicated route.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Per CNN right now the BH was flying 100 feet above maximum altitude and was also off course.

ngl, a 100 foot difference in elevation in a fast moving helicopter at night will not be noticed by the pilots. Easy to subtly drift 100 feet higher.

Their eyes are not glued to the gauges, they are looking out the window trying to see airplane and other objects. If they were wearing nightvision goggles, then there's even a bigger chance they are not glued to the instruments since their peripheral vision is compromised by the goggles.

Oh please.

Your job is a military helicopter pilot of a spy helo and extraction helo. You had better know what damn altitude you are flying and hiding out at.

“‘Oh sorry guys, we got bin Laden and then I forgot to fly low and got shot down by a 80 year old Russian bazooka. Over and out.’”

You sound like my spouse who never knows how fast she’s actually going until someone else tells her to slow down or she’s pulled over.

It’s not like they are flying in an urban area or near other airports. Flying around the desert NBD.

Black Hawks regularly fly through urban areas and near other air traffic. Do you not realize there are cities in Afghanistan, Iraq, and near many US military bases?

We’re all saying the same thing: it’s your job to know and control your altitude.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'd also love to know the name of any VIP who was flown over initially, requiring the return helicopter flight.

If this is ever released, I’ll be shocked.

My prediction: We will never find out who the vip was.

Probably one of Trump’s children.

Or some equally frivolous trip. Part of the investigation should be listing every approved trip, and was there an increase with the new admin. If it was happening in past admins, shame them, too, but make it stop. Every helicopter puts lives at risk. Time to sit in traffic with everyone else heading to the office.

The trip details are less important. They should have had control of that helicopter. This is a grave helicopter operation error. This was a flight in clear weather, no hostile fire, clear instruction and communication from ATC and they still crashed straight into a passenger jet flying a known and communicated route.

This whole situation makes me vomit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are numerous BH pilots saying it was the primary job of the white guy sitting in the back to make sure the area around the BH was clear. I also read that it often is 2 in back although 3 can be done. But doesn’t make sense in this airspace.

Yeah and?

What does the back crew guy do with the PIC, with one hand on cyclical, other hand on collective, and her feet on the rotors, juts up 150 ft off course and veers into middle of river suddenly right when a commercial jet descends there?

Btw this easily could have happened at runway 1 thirty seconds more down river.

This is exactly what will happen with MAGA. They’ll ignore the experts and pull $hit out of their ass to make up some narrative that of course she was a DEI hire, despite absolutely no evidence of it. The men who are alive and knew her won’t speak up on her behalf because there’s a hatred for women in the military as of 1/20/25.

Just the ones that kill 70 people in mid air.

So you’ve already tried her with all the military evidence you have, and found that not only is she guilty, but a “killer?!” Are you already trashing the two white men who did nothing to stop a helicopter that was too high, and off course in line with DCA’s runway?

As soon as you read that last sentence, is your mind now scrambling to make up more damning reasons to blame this accident solely on the actions of a single person, outside of any higher ups who gave orders, or any other culpable parties because she has to be a DEI hire for the very reason she dared to be a woman in the military?

She was in charge it’s mostly her fault.

A male voice said the aircraft was in sight and he was looking at the wrong aircraft.

Sounds like she was the pilot flying, he was the instructor and the one who called out that the traffic was in sight and requested visual sep. Instructors bear just as much responsibility, if not more, as the pilot flying. Makes me wonder where PP would assign the blame if the male and female pilots were reversed - I'm sure in that case they'd find some fault with the instructor.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wonder what happened to those passengers who were next to land behind the CRJ, I guess they quickly had to reroute, or did they just land as planned? Must have been terrifying for them also.

All the planes behind were diverted. If you track AA3130, they went to BWI. Others went to Dulles, and others turned back to their origination airport.

The people on board AA3130 would have witnessed this tragedy. I can only imagine what went through their minds.

I don’t think they could see it. Passengers reported not knowing why they were being rerouted until texting with relatives or reaching their destination.

If I saw it, I’d keep it to myself so as not to start a panic on board. I would not want to be with 60-250 panicking people in such a small space.

A passenger on that flight stated they didn’t see it but the pilot suddenly ascended which caught everyone by surprised and they were diverted to BWI.

I’ve had this happen a couple times over the years landing at DCA - the plane suddenly accelerates during landing and pulls up again to make another approach. It’s unnerving to say the least, it hasn’t happened to me at any other airport and I’ve spoken to others over the years who have experienced it as well.

I do think DCA is a pretty dangerous airport, compared to most others. Not that it’s “dangerous” per se, but relative to other airports.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are numerous BH pilots saying it was the primary job of the white guy sitting in the back to make sure the area around the BH was clear. I also read that it often is 2 in back although 3 can be done. But doesn’t make sense in this airspace.

Yeah and?

What does the back crew guy do with the PIC, with one hand on cyclical, other hand on collective, and her feet on the rotors, juts up 150 ft off course and veers into middle of river suddenly right when a commercial jet descends there?

Btw this easily could have happened at runway 1 thirty seconds more down river.

This is exactly what will happen with MAGA. They’ll ignore the experts and pull $hit out of their ass to make up some narrative that of course she was a DEI hire, despite absolutely no evidence of it. The men who are alive and knew her won’t speak up on her behalf because there’s a hatred for women in the military as of 1/20/25.

Just the ones that kill 70 people in mid air.

So you’ve already tried her with all the military evidence you have, and found that not only is she guilty, but a “killer?!” Are you already trashing the two white men who did nothing to stop a helicopter that was too high, and off course in line with DCA’s runway?

As soon as you read that last sentence, is your mind now scrambling to make up more damning reasons to blame this accident solely on the actions of a single person, outside of any higher ups who gave orders, or any other culpable parties because she has to be a DEI hire for the very reason she dared to be a woman in the military?

She was in charge it’s mostly her fault.

A male voice said the aircraft was in sight and he was looking at the wrong aircraft.

Sounds like she was the pilot flying, he was the instructor and the one who called out that the traffic was in sight and requested visual sep. Instructors bear just as much responsibility, if not more, as the pilot flying. Makes me wonder where PP would assign the blame if the male and female pilots were reversed - I'm sure in that case they'd find some fault with the instructor.

This. It was the male's voice on the call. It's evident that there were multiple persons on the BH that failed fatally.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are numerous BH pilots saying it was the primary job of the white guy sitting in the back to make sure the area around the BH was clear. I also read that it often is 2 in back although 3 can be done. But doesn’t make sense in this airspace.

Yeah and?

What does the back crew guy do with the PIC, with one hand on cyclical, other hand on collective, and her feet on the rotors, juts up 150 ft off course and veers into middle of river suddenly right when a commercial jet descends there?

Btw this easily could have happened at runway 1 thirty seconds more down river.

This is exactly what will happen with MAGA. They’ll ignore the experts and pull $hit out of their ass to make up some narrative that of course she was a DEI hire, despite absolutely no evidence of it. The men who are alive and knew her won’t speak up on her behalf because there’s a hatred for women in the military as of 1/20/25.

Just the ones that kill 70 people in mid air.

So you’ve already tried her with all the military evidence you have, and found that not only is she guilty, but a “killer?!” Are you already trashing the two white men who did nothing to stop a helicopter that was too high, and off course in line with DCA’s runway?

As soon as you read that last sentence, is your mind now scrambling to make up more damning reasons to blame this accident solely on the actions of a single person, outside of any higher ups who gave orders, or any other culpable parties because she has to be a DEI hire for the very reason she dared to be a woman in the military?

She was in charge it’s mostly her fault.

Then what do you need her name for? To curse it?

They can keep her name, I want to see her credentials and background.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are numerous BH pilots saying it was the primary job of the white guy sitting in the back to make sure the area around the BH was clear. I also read that it often is 2 in back although 3 can be done. But doesn’t make sense in this airspace.

Yeah and?

What does the back crew guy do with the PIC, with one hand on cyclical, other hand on collective, and her feet on the rotors, juts up 150 ft off course and veers into middle of river suddenly right when a commercial jet descends there?

Btw this easily could have happened at runway 1 thirty seconds more down river.

This is exactly what will happen with MAGA. They’ll ignore the experts and pull $hit out of their ass to make up some narrative that of course she was a DEI hire, despite absolutely no evidence of it. The men who are alive and knew her won’t speak up on her behalf because there’s a hatred for women in the military as of 1/20/25.

Just the ones that kill 70 people in mid air.

So you’ve already tried her with all the military evidence you have, and found that not only is she guilty, but a “killer?!” Are you already trashing the two white men who did nothing to stop a helicopter that was too high, and off course in line with DCA’s runway?

As soon as you read that last sentence, is your mind now scrambling to make up more damning reasons to blame this accident solely on the actions of a single person, outside of any higher ups who gave orders, or any other culpable parties because she has to be a DEI hire for the very reason she dared to be a woman in the military?

She was in charge it’s mostly her fault.

A male voice said the aircraft was in sight and he was looking at the wrong aircraft.

Sounds like she was the pilot flying, he was the instructor and the one who called out that the traffic was in sight and requested visual sep. Instructors bear just as much responsibility, if not more, as the pilot flying. Makes me wonder where PP would assign the blame if the male and female pilots were reversed - I'm sure in that case they'd find some fault with the instructor.

This is certain.