The college admissions scandal bell tolls for thee, Harvard

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those who keep saying his son would have been admitted anyway, you should look at the statistics for Asian students who are accepted and rejected by Harvard. Having close to a 4.0 gpa and near-perfect SATs might guarantee acceptance for some ethnicities, but not for Asians.

*1000. I know of an Asian TJ grad with perfect gpa (4.0 unweighted which is extremely tough at TJ and probably top 1% and around 4.6 weighted), 2,390 SAT, Presidential Scholar nominee, NM Scholar, ton of leadership positions, lot of volunteering, extensive research, prestigious internship over the summer, TV show appearance, scholastic writing award, chemistry Olympiad finals, etc. etc. and was rejected by Harvard due to no legacy, no connection, no donation, seeking financial aid (not full pay) etc. Completely rigged.

Wait a minute. How do you know it was due to that?

Because there were other grads who gained admissions (with significantly lower stats openly talking about their "connections" whether it was parents knowing the "right" people or people at Harvard etc.) with few URMs getting admitted as well. Basically, being an Asian American applicant with no hooks and seeking FA is the worst situation and it will be virtually impossible to gain admission even with better credentials than most admitted students.

+1 I have seen Asian students with far better stats, extracurriculars and leadership positions get rejected from schools that weaker white peers have gotten into.

Whites often act as if they are the most ethical group but they are really crooked inside. The college admission for the top 25+ schools have become so corrupted and out of control (by whites who are in charge of admissions office, athletic programs, psychologists who readily "sell" LD diagnosis, professional SAT takers, professional essay writers for money, creating "Z" list, making "legal bribes" for admission etc.)

We need to eliminate, legacy, special treatment of athletes, preference for donors, discrimination for financial aid applicants in admissions, racial discrimination in admissions (AA), all of them.

Whites are crooked? That sounds like a racist stereotype to me. And yet you'd give your left nut to get your kid into one of these colleges run by crooked white people

Now you understand a little of what its like to be a URM

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This "top school" notion is BS. Do you honestly think that all of the successful people in the US went to only those schools? Or that everyone from those schools is successful?

You are a part of the problem.

Regardless of whether a given school plays a role in eventual "success" is secondary. The primary issue is that these top schools are colluding and setting a quota (unwritten/unspoken) on Asian Americans' admissions and in the process discriminating against a minority racial group (that lacks any political clout) based on their race which is clearly unlawful and unconstitutional.

Well that's a legal conclusion I doubt you're qualified to make. And I predict the holistic admissions process will survive judicial scrutiny.

Discrimination by public colleges and private colleges receiving federal research/financial aid funds on the basis of race is not allowed under the current statutes and the Constitution unless you want to argue that Asians are not discriminated in the admissions process on the basis of race which would be laughable.

Every private college can select it's students however they want as long as they follow the law. Current law allows race as a factor. Harvard can
define "merit" as they see fit. Their vision of merit does not heavily weight SAT scores (a good thing). Colleges can compare students from the same HS,
which is probably a big disadvantage for TJ kids. They are not looking for "grinders" but for students who will become leaders and ambassadors in their field. Strong URM's can be particularly influential as role models for the future.

Are you saying TJ kids are "grinders" and not potential leaders or role models?

Harvard may use race as one of the many factors but that is not what is currently happening. Harvard is using race as a determining factor.

Harvard can try to game all they want and try to wiggle out of their discriminatory practices all they want but they are discriminating on the basis of race lot more than"oh the Asian kid and the Black kid both have roughly equal stats/accomplishments so let's go with the Black kid."

There would not be an outcry if this was the case but sadly this is not the case. It's more like, the Asian kid has demonstrated more leadership potential, has better recommendation letters, better essays, higher gpa, higher sat score, received impressive awards and created a non-profit to help disadvantaged kids learn but let's go with a Black kid because we have to meet 15% incoming black students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This "top school" notion is BS. Do you honestly think that all of the successful people in the US went to only those schools? Or that everyone from those schools is successful?

You are a part of the problem.

Regardless of whether a given school plays a role in eventual "success" is secondary. The primary issue is that these top schools are colluding and setting a quota (unwritten/unspoken) on Asian Americans' admissions and in the process discriminating against a minority racial group (that lacks any political clout) based on their race which is clearly unlawful and unconstitutional.

Well that's a legal conclusion I doubt you're qualified to make. And I predict the holistic admissions process will survive judicial scrutiny.

Discrimination by public colleges and private colleges receiving federal research/financial aid funds on the basis of race is not allowed under the current statutes and the Constitution unless you want to argue that Asians are not discriminated in the admissions process on the basis of race which would be laughable.

Every private college can select it's students however they want as long as they follow the law. Current law allows race as a factor. Harvard can
define "merit" as they see fit. Their vision of merit does not heavily weight SAT scores (a good thing). Colleges can compare students from the same HS,
which is probably a big disadvantage for TJ kids. They are not looking for "grinders" but for students who will become leaders and ambassadors in their field. Strong URM's can be particularly influential as role models for the future.

Are you saying TJ kids are "grinders" and not potential leaders or role models?

Harvard may use race as one of the many factors but that is not what is currently happening. Harvard is using race as a determining factor.

Harvard can try to game all they want and try to wiggle out of their discriminatory practices all they want but they are discriminating on the basis of race lot more than"oh the Asian kid and the Black kid both have roughly equal stats/accomplishments so let's go with the Black kid."

There would not be an outcry if this was the case but sadly this is not the case. It's more like, the Asian kid has demonstrated more leadership potential, has better recommendation letters, better essays, higher gpa, higher sat score, received impressive awards and created a non-profit to help disadvantaged kids learn but let's go with a Black kid because we have to meet 15% incoming black students.

Actually, it's more like 'let's go with the white kid'.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This "top school" notion is BS. Do you honestly think that all of the successful people in the US went to only those schools? Or that everyone from those schools is successful?

You are a part of the problem.

Regardless of whether a given school plays a role in eventual "success" is secondary. The primary issue is that these top schools are colluding and setting a quota (unwritten/unspoken) on Asian Americans' admissions and in the process discriminating against a minority racial group (that lacks any political clout) based on their race which is clearly unlawful and unconstitutional.

Well that's a legal conclusion I doubt you're qualified to make. And I predict the holistic admissions process will survive judicial scrutiny.

Discrimination by public colleges and private colleges receiving federal research/financial aid funds on the basis of race is not allowed under the current statutes and the Constitution unless you want to argue that Asians are not discriminated in the admissions process on the basis of race which would be laughable.

Every private college can select it's students however they want as long as they follow the law. Current law allows race as a factor. Harvard can
define "merit" as they see fit. Their vision of merit does not heavily weight SAT scores (a good thing). Colleges can compare students from the same HS,
which is probably a big disadvantage for TJ kids. They are not looking for "grinders" but for students who will become leaders and ambassadors in their field. Strong URM's can be particularly influential as role models for the future.

Looks like you are stereotyping against Asian Americans or typical TJ grad who will be Asian. Do you want to be an equal opportunity stereotyper and stereotype against blacks as well? Let's see if you are willing even ALLOWED to do that. Demonstrated my point about discrimination against Asians in this country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This "top school" notion is BS. Do you honestly think that all of the successful people in the US went to only those schools? Or that everyone from those schools is successful?

You are a part of the problem.

Regardless of whether a given school plays a role in eventual "success" is secondary. The primary issue is that these top schools are colluding and setting a quota (unwritten/unspoken) on Asian Americans' admissions and in the process discriminating against a minority racial group (that lacks any political clout) based on their race which is clearly unlawful and unconstitutional.

Well that's a legal conclusion I doubt you're qualified to make. And I predict the holistic admissions process will survive judicial scrutiny.

Discrimination by public colleges and private colleges receiving federal research/financial aid funds on the basis of race is not allowed under the current statutes and the Constitution unless you want to argue that Asians are not discriminated in the admissions process on the basis of race which would be laughable.

Every private college can select it's students however they want as long as they follow the law. Current law allows race as a factor. Harvard can
define "merit" as they see fit. Their vision of merit does not heavily weight SAT scores (a good thing). Colleges can compare students from the same HS,
which is probably a big disadvantage for TJ kids. They are not looking for "grinders" but for students who will become leaders and ambassadors in their field. Strong URM's can be particularly influential as role models for the future.

Are you saying TJ kids are "grinders" and not potential leaders or role models?

Harvard may use race as one of the many factors but that is not what is currently happening. Harvard is using race as a determining factor.

Harvard can try to game all they want and try to wiggle out of their discriminatory practices all they want but they are discriminating on the basis of race lot more than"oh the Asian kid and the Black kid both have roughly equal stats/accomplishments so let's go with the Black kid."

There would not be an outcry if this was the case but sadly this is not the case. It's more like, the Asian kid has demonstrated more leadership potential, has better recommendation letters, better essays, higher gpa, higher sat score, received impressive awards and created a non-profit to help disadvantaged kids learn but let's go with a Black kid because we have to meet 15% incoming black students.

Actually, it's more like 'let's go with the white kid'.

Yep. It more like lets go with the connected, rich white kids that we see as a future leader, Like George Bush or Jared Kushner...

In response to the post above,, you are correct Asian Stem kids from TJ are not seen as future leaders by many people or schools. Unfairly they are seen as future scientist, doctors, engineers and so on. They are not seen as future politicians, writers, and creative types. White kids and black kids are... obviously no one know what any kid is going to grow up and become. But all the TJ talking about Stem and SATs only makes it harder for the TJ kids to get recommendations that have the magic ingredient to get in from their schools, interviewers and the app readers. One thing I do know screaming about how you excel at the wrong criteria for a school or a job rarely gets you an offer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This "top school" notion is BS. Do you honestly think that all of the successful people in the US went to only those schools? Or that everyone from those schools is successful?

You are a part of the problem.

Regardless of whether a given school plays a role in eventual "success" is secondary. The primary issue is that these top schools are colluding and setting a quota (unwritten/unspoken) on Asian Americans' admissions and in the process discriminating against a minority racial group (that lacks any political clout) based on their race which is clearly unlawful and unconstitutional.

Well that's a legal conclusion I doubt you're qualified to make. And I predict the holistic admissions process will survive judicial scrutiny.

Discrimination by public colleges and private colleges receiving federal research/financial aid funds on the basis of race is not allowed under the current statutes and the Constitution unless you want to argue that Asians are not discriminated in the admissions process on the basis of race which would be laughable.

Every private college can select it's students however they want as long as they follow the law. Current law allows race as a factor. Harvard can
define "merit" as they see fit. Their vision of merit does not heavily weight SAT scores (a good thing). Colleges can compare students from the same HS,
which is probably a big disadvantage for TJ kids. They are not looking for "grinders" but for students who will become leaders and ambassadors in their field. Strong URM's can be particularly influential as role models for the future.

Are you saying TJ kids are "grinders" and not potential leaders or role models?

Harvard may use race as one of the many factors but that is not what is currently happening. Harvard is using race as a determining factor.

Harvard can try to game all they want and try to wiggle out of their discriminatory practices all they want but they are discriminating on the basis of race lot more than"oh the Asian kid and the Black kid both have roughly equal stats/accomplishments so let's go with the Black kid."

There would not be an outcry if this was the case but sadly this is not the case. It's more like, the Asian kid has demonstrated more leadership potential, has better recommendation letters, better essays, higher gpa, higher sat score, received impressive awards and created a non-profit to help disadvantaged kids learn but let's go with a Black kid because we have to meet 15% incoming black students.

Actually, it's more like 'let's go with the white kid'.

Yep. It more like lets go with the connected, rich white kids that we see as a future leader, Like George Bush or Jared Kushner...

In response to the post above,, you are correct Asian Stem kids from TJ are not seen as future leaders by many people or schools. Unfairly they are seen as future scientist, doctors, engineers and so on. They are not seen as future politicians, writers, and creative types. White kids and black kids are... obviously no one know what any kid is going to grow up and become. But all the TJ talking about Stem and SATs only makes it harder for the TJ kids to get recommendations that have the magic ingredient to get in from their schools, interviewers and the app readers. One thing I do know screaming about how you excel at the wrong criteria for a school or a job rarely gets you an offer.

You put up George Bush and Jared Kushner as a leader we should aspire to be? Seriously? Andrew Yang is leaps and bounds better than both Bush and/or Kushner and the candidate with the most innovative ideas to deal with problems faced by our country instead of just being concerned about getting reelected and receiving money from corporations/PAC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those who keep saying his son would have been admitted anyway, you should look at the statistics for Asian students who are accepted and rejected by Harvard. Having close to a 4.0 gpa and near-perfect SATs might guarantee acceptance for some ethnicities, but not for Asians.

*1000. I know of an Asian TJ grad with perfect gpa (4.0 unweighted which is extremely tough at TJ and probably top 1% and around 4.6 weighted), 2,390 SAT, Presidential Scholar nominee, NM Scholar, ton of leadership positions, lot of volunteering, extensive research, prestigious internship over the summer, TV show appearance, scholastic writing award, chemistry Olympiad finals, etc. etc. and was rejected by Harvard due to no legacy, no connection, no donation, seeking financial aid (not full pay) etc. Completely rigged.

Wait a minute. How do you know it was due to that?

Because there were other grads who gained admissions (with significantly lower stats openly talking about their "connections" whether it was parents knowing the "right" people or people at Harvard etc.) with few URMs getting admitted as well. Basically, being an Asian American applicant with no hooks and seeking FA is the worst situation and it will be virtually impossible to gain admission even with better credentials than most admitted students.

Impossible to know it was due to insufficient connections. The class has 1900 kids. They're hand selected for something the school wants. Your description of the student shows many accomplishments but reeks of being "packaged" for college admissions purposes. Now tell us where this student did get in.

The best response is "packaged"? A typical response if there is no legitimate response. The student was not packaged but worked hard, studied hard and contributed to the school life and the community life while exploring other interests aside from the school.

As did several hundreds if not thousands with similar looking apps.

No. The difference is that the above applicant would have been admitted if the student was URM, legacy, athlete, with "connection", donated money. URMs who graduate in the bottom 1/3 of the TJ (forget being in the top 1%) routinely gets admitted to Ivys no problem.

You mention where they are in class standing as if that is relevant. All the matters is that Harvard thinks they are capable of doing the work. They got into and graduated from TJ, right? So clearly they can handle Harvard, just like most of the kids at TJ. So check that box and move to the next thing. They don't have to take the top ranked kids. You get that, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those who keep saying his son would have been admitted anyway, you should look at the statistics for Asian students who are accepted and rejected by Harvard. Having close to a 4.0 gpa and near-perfect SATs might guarantee acceptance for some ethnicities, but not for Asians.

*1000. I know of an Asian TJ grad with perfect gpa (4.0 unweighted which is extremely tough at TJ and probably top 1% and around 4.6 weighted), 2,390 SAT, Presidential Scholar nominee, NM Scholar, ton of leadership positions, lot of volunteering, extensive research, prestigious internship over the summer, TV show appearance, scholastic writing award, chemistry Olympiad finals, etc. etc. and was rejected by Harvard due to no legacy, no connection, no donation, seeking financial aid (not full pay) etc. Completely rigged.

Wait a minute. How do you know it was due to that?

Because there were other grads who gained admissions (with significantly lower stats openly talking about their "connections" whether it was parents knowing the "right" people or people at Harvard etc.) with few URMs getting admitted as well. Basically, being an Asian American applicant with no hooks and seeking FA is the worst situation and it will be virtually impossible to gain admission even with better credentials than most admitted students.

Impossible to know it was due to insufficient connections. The class has 1900 kids. They're hand selected for something the school wants. Your description of the student shows many accomplishments but reeks of being "packaged" for college admissions purposes. Now tell us where this student did get in.

The best response is "packaged"? A typical response if there is no legitimate response. The student was not packaged but worked hard, studied hard and contributed to the school life and the community life while exploring other interests aside from the school.

As did several hundreds if not thousands with similar looking apps.

No. The difference is that the above applicant would have been admitted if the student was URM, legacy, athlete, with "connection", donated money. URMs who graduate in the bottom 1/3 of the TJ (forget being in the top 1%) routinely gets admitted to Ivys no problem.

You mention where they are in class standing as if that is relevant. All the matters is that Harvard thinks they are capable of doing the work. They got into and graduated from TJ, right? So clearly they can handle Harvard, just like most of the kids at TJ. So check that box and move to the next thing. They don't have to take the top ranked kids. You get that, right?

If so, Harvard should immediately stop taking any federal research money and any other federal money. You get that, right?

[Anonymous]

Does anyone dispute that Harvard is entirely within its rights to admit a super rich student with a C average?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone dispute that Harvard is entirely within its rights to admit a super rich student with a C average?

As long as it is not discriminating in the admissions process on the basis of race.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For those who keep saying his son would have been admitted anyway, you should look at the statistics for Asian students who are accepted and rejected by Harvard. Having close to a 4.0 gpa and near-perfect SATs might guarantee acceptance for some ethnicities, but not for Asians.

*1000. I know of an Asian TJ grad with perfect gpa (4.0 unweighted which is extremely tough at TJ and probably top 1% and around 4.6 weighted), 2,390 SAT, Presidential Scholar nominee, NM Scholar, ton of leadership positions, lot of volunteering, extensive research, prestigious internship over the summer, TV show appearance, scholastic writing award, chemistry Olympiad finals, etc. etc. and was rejected by Harvard due to no legacy, no connection, no donation, seeking financial aid (not full pay) etc. Completely rigged.

Wait a minute. How do you know it was due to that?

Because there were other grads who gained admissions (with significantly lower stats openly talking about their "connections" whether it was parents knowing the "right" people or people at Harvard etc.) with few URMs getting admitted as well. Basically, being an Asian American applicant with no hooks and seeking FA is the worst situation and it will be virtually impossible to gain admission even with better credentials than most admitted students.

Impossible to know it was due to insufficient connections. The class has 1900 kids. They're hand selected for something the school wants. Your description of the student shows many accomplishments but reeks of being "packaged" for college admissions purposes. Now tell us where this student did get in.

The best response is "packaged"? A typical response if there is no legitimate response. The student was not packaged but worked hard, studied hard and contributed to the school life and the community life while exploring other interests aside from the school.

As did several hundreds if not thousands with similar looking apps.

No. The difference is that the above applicant would have been admitted if the student was URM, legacy, athlete, with "connection", donated money. URMs who graduate in the bottom 1/3 of the TJ (forget being in the top 1%) routinely gets admitted to Ivys no problem.

You mention where they are in class standing as if that is relevant. All the matters is that Harvard thinks they are capable of doing the work. They got into and graduated from TJ, right? So clearly they can handle Harvard, just like most of the kids at TJ. So check that box and move to the next thing. They don't have to take the top ranked kids. You get that, right?

If so, Harvard should immediately stop taking any federal research money and any other federal money. You get that, right?

No. What if the kid at the bottom of the class is Asian too? Nothing in US law requires any school to rank people based on GPA and SAT. Nothing. They absolutely can admit the kid with the lowest GPA if they want him or her.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This "top school" notion is BS. Do you honestly think that all of the successful people in the US went to only those schools? Or that everyone from those schools is successful?

You are a part of the problem.

Regardless of whether a given school plays a role in eventual "success" is secondary. The primary issue is that these top schools are colluding and setting a quota (unwritten/unspoken) on Asian Americans' admissions and in the process discriminating against a minority racial group (that lacks any political clout) based on their race which is clearly unlawful and unconstitutional.

Well that's a legal conclusion I doubt you're qualified to make. And I predict the holistic admissions process will survive judicial scrutiny.

Discrimination by public colleges and private colleges receiving federal research/financial aid funds on the basis of race is not allowed under the current statutes and the Constitution unless you want to argue that Asians are not discriminated in the admissions process on the basis of race which would be laughable.

Every private college can select it's students however they want as long as they follow the law. Current law allows race as a factor. Harvard can
define "merit" as they see fit. Their vision of merit does not heavily weight SAT scores (a good thing). Colleges can compare students from the same HS,
which is probably a big disadvantage for TJ kids. They are not looking for "grinders" but for students who will become leaders and ambassadors in their field. Strong URM's can be particularly influential as role models for the future.

Looks like you are stereotyping against Asian Americans or typical TJ grad who will be Asian. Do you want to be an equal opportunity stereotyper and stereotype against blacks as well? Let's see if you are willing even ALLOWED to do that. Demonstrated my point about discrimination against Asians in this country.

No one mentioned anything about a typical TJ grad. Most of the TJ grads who get into Harvard are in fact Asian-Americans.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone dispute that Harvard is entirely within its rights to admit a super rich student with a C average?

As long as it is not discriminating in the admissions process on the basis of race.

Exactly. So when 700 Valedictorians don't get in and lower ranked kids do, no should exclaim, "but but, Valedictorian!"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone dispute that Harvard is entirely within its rights to admit a super rich student with a C average?

As long as it is not discriminating in the admissions process on the basis of race.

Exactly. So when 700 Valedictorians don't get in and lower ranked kids do, no should exclaim, "but but, Valedictorian!"

Exactly. An applicant's merit is much more than class rank.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Does anyone dispute that Harvard is entirely within its rights to admit a super rich student with a C average?

Yes, of course they can do that. They can accept anyone they want for any reason they want except for illegal reasons.