Do the recommendations re: BCC boundary study come out today?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with much of what the overutilization poster is saying, but agree that the discussion here has gone off the rails. I understand why RCF supports Option 7, I understand why it had appeal for the superintendent -- but I still think it was the wrong choice. And I think it's creating a backlash within the communities that have largely supported the unique arrangements for RHPS.

But our kids, our neighborhoods, deserve equitable treatment by the County. If the Superintendent doesn't want to bus RCF to achieve diversity, then he is going to face significantly greater opposition to busing our K-2 kids for that reason.

Maybe that's not accidental. I've heard people wondering about the prospect for reverting to neighborhood schools; NCC was just expanded and as of next year it will shrink by losing the 6th grade to the new middle school. Maybe the plan all along is to shift CCES & NCC back to K-5 as with every other Bethesda elementary school?

I'm just curious, what would be the FARMS/URM percentage at RHES if there was no bussing? I'm under the impression that the disparity would be far greater than what we are seeing with either of the two middle schools so would like to know if this is a valid comparison.

You're probably right. The by going from Option 1 to Option 7, the FARMS rate goes up from 9.7% to 15.4% at B-CC MS #2, and drops from 11.3% to 5.1% at Westland.

[Anonymous]

To be truly fair they should end busing for CCES and NCC if proximity is the only consideration. End busing at NCC and CCES and use Connecticut Ave as your separation line. Done!

[Anonymous]

Of course the people who are most unhappy are the most vocal. I am going to stay out of this thread because it's way over the top as far as I am concerned and representative of a few people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Of course the people who are most unhappy are the most vocal. I am going to stay out of this thread because it's way over the top as far as I am concerned and representative of a few people.

The comments emotional on both sides. Behind them are some good points on both sides. It's a shame there isn't going to be more public dialog on the views in addition to the board meetings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I agree with much of what the overutilization poster is saying, but agree that the discussion here has gone off the rails. I understand why RCF supports Option 7, I understand why it had appeal for the superintendent -- but I still think it was the wrong choice. And I think it's creating a backlash within the communities that have largely supported the unique arrangements for RHPS.

But our kids, our neighborhoods, deserve equitable treatment by the County. If the Superintendent doesn't want to bus RCF to achieve diversity, then he is going to face significantly greater opposition to busing our K-2 kids for that reason.

Maybe that's not accidental. I've heard people wondering about the prospect for reverting to neighborhood schools; NCC was just expanded and as of next year it will shrink by losing the 6th grade to the new middle school. Maybe the plan all along is to shift CCES & NCC back to K-5 as with every other Bethesda elementary school?

I'm just curious, what would be the FARMS/URM percentage at RHES if there was no bussing? I'm under the impression that the disparity would be far greater than what we are seeing with either of the two middle schools so would like to know if this is a valid comparison.

You're probably right. The by going from Option 1 to Option 7, the FARMS rate goes up from 9.7% to 15.4% at B-CC MS #2, and drops from 11.3% to 5.1% at Westland.

I'm not sure if you understood my question... Using the data you provided 15.4% is the highest FARMS we see at a school from either middle school option.

If RHES did not have kids from CCES and NCC what would be the percentage of FARMS at RHES?

[Anonymous]

I'm not sure if you understood my question... Using the data you provided 15.4% is the highest FARMS we see at a school from either middle school option.

If RHES did not have kids from CCES and NCC what would be the percentage of FARMS at RHES?

Not the PP, but your question doesn't make sense. CCES & NCC are grades 3-6; RHES houses grades preK-2. So, if RHES did not draw from the CCES and NCC areas, it would have ZERO kids.

The RHES "area" was a made up fiction (currently this boundary does not apply to any school) to permit consideration of splitting off the Rosemary Hills neighborhood and potentially having the Rosemary Hills kids attend a different school than their CCES or NCC classmates.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

I'm not sure if you understood my question... Using the data you provided 15.4% is the highest FARMS we see at a school from either middle school option.

If RHES did not have kids from CCES and NCC what would be the percentage of FARMS at RHES?

Not the PP, but your question doesn't make sense. CCES & NCC are grades 3-6; RHES houses grades preK-2. So, if RHES did not draw from the CCES and NCC areas, it would have ZERO kids.

The RHES "area" was a made up fiction (currently this boundary does not apply to any school) to permit consideration of splitting off the Rosemary Hills neighborhood and potentially having the Rosemary Hills kids attend a different school than their CCES or NCC classmates.

Sure but presumably if they made all three schools K-5 you would have a population of kids from the eastern part of the cluster who only attended RHES. The zone just east of RCF. There was even talk of taking this section of the cluster alone and bussing to Westland. So my question is what is the percentage of FARMS kids in this cluster and compare that to what we see at either middles school. So is it fair to compare what I'm assuming to be a huge percentage of FARMS where RHES is located with 15% of FARMS at BCC MS#2.

[Anonymous]

If RHES did not have kids from CCES and NCC what would be the percentage of FARMS at RHES?

I don't know if we, as the general public, would have access to that information. From living here for 11 years, I know that the neighborhood surrounding Rosemary Hills has supposedly shifted to more white urban professionals. I highly doubt that would have happened if it was still primarily a high FARMS rate school.

I can tell you that NCC and CCES would have little to no FARMS without desegregation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm not sure if you understood my question... Using the data you provided 15.4% is the highest FARMS we see at a school from either middle school option.

If RHES did not have kids from CCES and NCC what would be the percentage of FARMS at RHES?

Not the PP, but your question doesn't make sense. CCES & NCC are grades 3-6; RHES houses grades preK-2. So, if RHES did not draw from the CCES and NCC areas, it would have ZERO kids.

The RHES "area" was a made up fiction (currently this boundary does not apply to any school) to permit consideration of splitting off the Rosemary Hills neighborhood and potentially having the Rosemary Hills kids attend a different school than their CCES or NCC classmates.

Sure but presumably if they made all three schools K-5 you would have a population of kids from the eastern part of the cluster who only attended RHES. The zone just east of RCF. There was even talk of taking this section of the cluster alone and bussing to Westland. So my question is what is the percentage of FARMS kids in this cluster and compare that to what we see at either middles school. So is it fair to compare what I'm assuming to be a huge percentage of FARMS where RHES is located with 15% of FARMS at BCC MS#2.

I'm the PP who gave you the answer that misunderstood your question. I still don't know if I understand it, but, if you go here, you can get the data on individual schools:http://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/schools/.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm not sure if you understood my question... Using the data you provided 15.4% is the highest FARMS we see at a school from either middle school option.

If RHES did not have kids from CCES and NCC what would be the percentage of FARMS at RHES?

Not the PP, but your question doesn't make sense. CCES & NCC are grades 3-6; RHES houses grades preK-2. So, if RHES did not draw from the CCES and NCC areas, it would have ZERO kids.

The RHES "area" was a made up fiction (currently this boundary does not apply to any school) to permit consideration of splitting off the Rosemary Hills neighborhood and potentially having the Rosemary Hills kids attend a different school than their CCES or NCC classmates.

Asked another way how do we know that the busing to and from CCES/NCC is solving an issue of disparity in FARMS if there are no numbers to back it up?

Sure but presumably if they made all three schools K-5 you would have a population of kids from the eastern part of the cluster who only attended RHES. The zone just east of RCF. There was even talk of taking this section of the cluster alone and bussing to Westland. So my question is what is the percentage of FARMS kids in this cluster and compare that to what we see at either middles school. So is it fair to compare what I'm assuming to be a huge percentage of FARMS where RHES is located with 15% of FARMS at BCC MS#2.

I'm the PP who gave you the answer that misunderstood your question. I still don't know if I understand it, but, if you go here, you can get the data on individual schools:http://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/schools/.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

I'm not sure if you understood my question... Using the data you provided 15.4% is the highest FARMS we see at a school from either middle school option.

If RHES did not have kids from CCES and NCC what would be the percentage of FARMS at RHES?

Not the PP, but your question doesn't make sense. CCES & NCC are grades 3-6; RHES houses grades preK-2. So, if RHES did not draw from the CCES and NCC areas, it would have ZERO kids.

The RHES "area" was a made up fiction (currently this boundary does not apply to any school) to permit consideration of splitting off the Rosemary Hills neighborhood and potentially having the Rosemary Hills kids attend a different school than their CCES or NCC classmates.

Sure but presumably if they made all three schools K-5 you would have a population of kids from the eastern part of the cluster who only attended RHES. The zone just east of RCF. There was even talk of taking this section of the cluster alone and bussing to Westland. So my question is what is the percentage of FARMS kids in this cluster and compare that to what we see at either middles school. So is it fair to compare what I'm assuming to be a huge percentage of FARMS where RHES is located with 15% of FARMS at BCC MS#2.

I'm the PP who gave you the answer that misunderstood your question. I still don't know if I understand it, but, if you go here, you can get the data on individual schools:http://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/schools/.

Asked another way how do we know that the busing to and from CCES/NCC is solving an issue of disparity in FARMS if there are no numbers to back it up?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well, will kids from the new Westbard development be going to the Westland middle school? It will be up to capacity soon.
There should be some affordable housing in the new development as well.

For all those people saying they're happy about Bethesda lacking diversity - not everyone agrees with you. It's pathetic, it's not how I want to raise my kids (when we moved here it was a lot more diverse and that's one reason we chose it) and it makes people hate people from Bethesda.
Not only that but it causes the county to discriminate against us from the looks of things. We have no community centers, no new parks, the infrastructure in many areas is severely lacking and many of the schools are jam packed (Ashburton? ). The county puts all of their funds into the less advantaged areas and the quality of life of the non rich Bethesda people (the ones who can't afford country clubs and golf outings...) suffers. We're paying huge property tax bills each year to support infrastructure and a good quality of life for the rest of the county bug never here.

The Westbard development currently is zoned for Wood Acres/Pyle. But, PP, you have hit the nail on the head, and identified the critical point that the PPs in the ensuing 12 pages of this thread completely missed.

There is significant development planned for the Westbard complex, including a lot of apartments and condos. (And regardless of what the Save Westbard loonies think, it will go forward at some point.) MCPS has to plan for that increased capacity. Currently, Westbard is zoned for Wood Acres (which is overcrowded) and Pyle (also overcrowded). But, it is also next door to Westland (which, under Option 7, will be under capacity) and a short walk to Westbrook (which recently had a significant renovation/addition). It seems fairly obvious that MCPS wants to leave some capacity at Westland so they can plunk the new constructions into Westbrook and Westland, eliminating a host of overcrowding complaints from the Wood Acres/Pyle crowd.

The navel gazing in this thread has been entertaining, but also a little disconcerting. MCPS has to look at these issues on a county-wide basis, and the inability of many of the PPs to recognize any decision factors other than those which matter to them really is troubling.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, it is unfair. We live in Kensington, but are zoned for Newport Mills. However, children living in Silver Spring will be able to attend B-CC middle school.

Yes, but aren't some of the Silver Spring kids practically as close? It's all one school district and one county, so no one should have "dibs" on a certain school just because their town shares a name with another town.

/no dog in this fight

No, we can safely walk to the new school but cannot safely walk to Newport Mills without crossing Conn. Ave. We also don't have a lot of sidewalks to walk to Newport Mills, vs. we do to walk to the new school. No one in Kensington is going to the new school that is built in our community. We will have to deal with all the traffic and noise for something that has no benefit to our kids.

The school is within the neighborhood of Rock Creek Hills, which is in Kensington. Many of the kids in the BCC Cluster have a "Kensington" address and will attend the new middle school. Other than the Town of Kensington (which is in the WJ cluster), I don't know of any other "Kensington" addresses that are really within "walking distance" with sidewalks that lead to the new middle school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, it is unfair. We live in Kensington, but are zoned for Newport Mills. However, children living in Silver Spring will be able to attend B-CC middle school.

Yes, but aren't some of the Silver Spring kids practically as close? It's all one school district and one county, so no one should have "dibs" on a certain school just because their town shares a name with another town.

/no dog in this fight

No, we can safely walk to the new school but cannot safely walk to Newport Mills without crossing Conn. Ave. We also don't have a lot of sidewalks to walk to Newport Mills, vs. we do to walk to the new school. No one in Kensington is going to the new school that is built in our community. We will have to deal with all the traffic and noise for something that has no benefit to our kids.

The school is within the neighborhood of Rock Creek Hills, which is in Kensington. Many of the kids in the BCC Cluster have a "Kensington" address and will attend the new middle school. Other than the Town of Kensington (which is in the WJ cluster), I don't know of any other "Kensington" addresses that are really within "walking distance" with sidewalks that lead to the new middle school.

Much of Kensington has limited sidewalks. We have asked for them many times and keep getting refused. It was a 5 year battle just to get a street light. We are in walking distance. It would be a longer walk but easily doable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Well, will kids from the new Westbard development be going to the Westland middle school? It will be up to capacity soon.
There should be some affordable housing in the new development as well.

For all those people saying they're happy about Bethesda lacking diversity - not everyone agrees with you. It's pathetic, it's not how I want to raise my kids (when we moved here it was a lot more diverse and that's one reason we chose it) and it makes people hate people from Bethesda.
Not only that but it causes the county to discriminate against us from the looks of things. We have no community centers, no new parks, the infrastructure in many areas is severely lacking and many of the schools are jam packed (Ashburton? ). The county puts all of their funds into the less advantaged areas and the quality of life of the non rich Bethesda people (the ones who can't afford country clubs and golf outings...) suffers. We're paying huge property tax bills each year to support infrastructure and a good quality of life for the rest of the county bug never here.

The Westbard development currently is zoned for Wood Acres/Pyle. But, PP, you have hit the nail on the head, and identified the critical point that the PPs in the ensuing 12 pages of this thread completely missed.

There is significant development planned for the Westbard complex, including a lot of apartments and condos. (And regardless of what the Save Westbard loonies think, it will go forward at some point.) MCPS has to plan for that increased capacity. Currently, Westbard is zoned for Wood Acres (which is overcrowded) and Pyle (also overcrowded). But, it is also next door to Westland (which, under Option 7, will be under capacity) and a short walk to Westbrook (which recently had a significant renovation/addition). It seems fairly obvious that MCPS wants to leave some capacity at Westland so they can plunk the new constructions into Westbrook and Westland, eliminating a host of overcrowding complaints from the Wood Acres/Pyle crowd.

The navel gazing in this thread has been entertaining, but also a little disconcerting. MCPS has to look at these issues on a county-wide basis, and the inability of many of the PPs to recognize any decision factors other than those which matter to them really is troubling.

The Superintendent said there’s “a significant amount of new housing planned in the B-CC Cluster. The Bethesda Downtown Plan and the Lyttonsville Sector Plan … will generate several thousand of mostly of mostly multi-family housing units. Approximately 8,500 new units in the Downtown Bethesda Plan and 3,500 new units in the Lyttonsville Sector Plan are under consideration. In addition, the Chevy Chase Lake Sector Plan … includes approximately 1,400 new units.” The buildout for these plans could take 20-30 years. But, he said the committee still felt they should be considered in the development of boundaries.
I don’t think that you’re general idea is wrong. It’s hard to tell whether MCPS is fixing the Wood Acres/Pyle problem or the increasing students problem. Whatever, I think some OPs here have a point. The Superintendent said B-CC MS#2 will be at 99% capacity in five years (not immediately, like some OPs are saying). It won’t be able to handle new students, and there’s no place to add on to the school they’re building now.
I think the RCF people have a point when they say they shouldn’t be the only ones that have to have no shorter commute. What I don’t understand is why this is a choice between just the options. If MCPS knew that MS#2 would be out of seats, why didn’t they just split some elementary schools between the two schools to make the numbers work and explain that it had to be done to use the two middle schools in a way that allowed them to grow?