Just got yelled at for leaving my kid alone in in the car while I went to the pharmacy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your car got carjacked…… !!!!

How many kids are getting carjacked? In what reality is this a likely outcome?

It's not a likely outcome -- it's not even an unlikely outcome. But people will see one news story about a car with a kid in it being carjacked and assume that this is a thing that is going to happen. They don't pay attention to things like where that carjacking happened or other circumstances nor do they consider the likelihood of this happening on any given day. The truth is that you are more likely to be in a fatal car accident on any day than your car is to be carjacked. But do people stop driving places with their kids in the car. Of course not.

Recently I saw a news story of a terrible tragedy where a bounce house at a minor league baseball game was blown down onto the field and a small child was killed. Absolutely gut wrenching. Literally the next week we were at an event with a bounce house. I had a moment of considering not letting my kid use the bounce house and then I reasoned that this bounce house was not up on a raised platform like the one at the ball game. I looked to see if the bounce house was staked into the ground. I hung out near the bounce house while my kid was in it. But I still let her get in it.

You can't just wrap your kids in bubble wrap until they are 18. You have to learn how to calculate risk and how to mitigate risk. And also what risks are ok -- my kid could get hurt bouncing in a bounce house or riding her bike or goofing off with friends but living a full and meaningful life carries inherent risk so I have to accept that.

The risk to OP's kid was practically nil. An incredibly low risk of a criminal approaching at just that moment and stealing her car. A similarly low risk of someone trying to abduct her kid. A higher risk of a bystander harassing her son or her out of a misguided effort to protect him (which is what happened).

On the other hand the risk of never leaving a kid in a car alone is that they will grow thinking they are incapable of being left alone for any length of time. They will lack skills of resilience and self-reliance. They will no trust themselves and may feel anxious when older when they are expected to do things on their own.

If the only way you can think to teach your children resilience is to leave them alone in a car, you have much bigger problems. Not leaving a kid alone in a car will do nothing to harm them or their sense of self-reliance. What nonsense.

The car is one example but it's a good one. You absolutely have to leave your kids alone sometimes in order to help them learn what it is to be alone and not have a parent within arms reach at all times. Like when do you leave your kid alone in the car then. When do you leave them home alone. You have to start giving your kid increasing levels of independence because you don't want to wind up with a kid who is 12 or 13 who is afraid to every be alone without an adult or a 17 or 19 year old who is scared to see a doctor on their own or drive a car alone.

Your kids don't just one day announce "I am a fully formed adult with good judgment -- you may now trust me to be on my own." It has to be a process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your car got carjacked…… !!!!

How many kids are getting carjacked? In what reality is this a likely outcome?

It's not a likely outcome -- it's not even an unlikely outcome. But people will see one news story about a car with a kid in it being carjacked and assume that this is a thing that is going to happen. They don't pay attention to things like where that carjacking happened or other circumstances nor do they consider the likelihood of this happening on any given day. The truth is that you are more likely to be in a fatal car accident on any day than your car is to be carjacked. But do people stop driving places with their kids in the car. Of course not.

Recently I saw a news story of a terrible tragedy where a bounce house at a minor league baseball game was blown down onto the field and a small child was killed. Absolutely gut wrenching. Literally the next week we were at an event with a bounce house. I had a moment of considering not letting my kid use the bounce house and then I reasoned that this bounce house was not up on a raised platform like the one at the ball game. I looked to see if the bounce house was staked into the ground. I hung out near the bounce house while my kid was in it. But I still let her get in it.

You can't just wrap your kids in bubble wrap until they are 18. You have to learn how to calculate risk and how to mitigate risk. And also what risks are ok -- my kid could get hurt bouncing in a bounce house or riding her bike or goofing off with friends but living a full and meaningful life carries inherent risk so I have to accept that.

The risk to OP's kid was practically nil. An incredibly low risk of a criminal approaching at just that moment and stealing her car. A similarly low risk of someone trying to abduct her kid. A higher risk of a bystander harassing her son or her out of a misguided effort to protect him (which is what happened).

On the other hand the risk of never leaving a kid in a car alone is that they will grow thinking they are incapable of being left alone for any length of time. They will lack skills of resilience and self-reliance. They will no trust themselves and may feel anxious when older when they are expected to do things on their own.

If the only way you can think to teach your children resilience is to leave them alone in a car, you have much bigger problems. Not leaving a kid alone in a car will do nothing to harm them or their sense of self-reliance. What nonsense.

You see this as a one off situation, a kid in a car. Some of us are using this situation as one example of the hyper involved, overly anxious attitude we have generated parenting in this country. It does seep into the kids. If they are never given the freedom to try something on their own without adult supervision, they learn that they shouldn’t take risks.

An infant car seat, designed to protect your child has death and improper use warnings written all over it. This is to protect the company, but it aLso has subtle effects on the parents who do see it (most likely unconsciously) every time they use the seat. Yes is just one more example of the attitude of anxiety and protection parents are indoctrinated into from birth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You can totally leave it running for the AC, leave the key fob with the kid and have them lock the door. Then when you get back, they unlock it for you. 7 is plenty old to do this.

I worry about a car jacker showing up with a gun and demanding that the car be unlocked.

You are worrying about a fantasy that will never happen.

Yeah. You tell ‘em.

Or…

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/two-juveniles-sought-in-car-theft-with-child-inside-in-northwest-dc-police/3172083/

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/4-month-old-girl-found-after-being-taken-in-georgetown-car-theft/3508529/

Those cars were not parked in parking lots with security guards-- they were parked on the street.

The kids in those cases were much younger. In the case of the infant, the carjacker likely did not even realize the baby was in the car for some time.

It's also not clear how long those cars were left idling. In the infant case the mom left the car to go into a perfume store (wtf). Are these cases of people running short errands nearby or are they cases of people using leaving kids in idling cars for 30 or 60 minutes?

The PP is envisioning a situation where a carjacker approaches a locked car with a 7 year old visible in the back seat, and in full view of the security guard and what I'm sure are security cameras outside the pharmacy, points a gun at the child and demands they unlock the car. In the 3-5 minutes the mom was inside the pharmacy.

This will not happen.

So the security guard was babysitting the child? Is that his job?

I actually do think it's his job. It was a few minutes and the mom was right inside. The child is 7, not 2.

The other day I was at the grocery store with my 8 yr old and it started pouring rain while we were in the store. DD was in flipflops (post swim class) and I decided to run and get the car and pick her up at the curb. I left her in the vestibule next to the door. I did consider this a reasonably safe option in part because there was a security guard posted near the door and the area is monitored by cameras.

Am I a derelict parent for leaving an elementary kid alone in public for a few minutes?

It is your primary responsibility as a parent to keep your child safe. You make the guard’s job harder by handing over that job to the guard because you can’t turn off the car while you run into the store. So self-centered.

Again -- in a functional society no one considers a security guard keeping an eye on an older kid in a car for 10 minutes to be "baby-sitting." It's just being a person in society. But the US is not functional around families and children so we have this deranged idea that from birth until like 12 or 13 a parent must have eyes on their child at all times OR be paying a professional child minder to watch their kid. It is nonsensical and is actually BAD for kids in the long run.

The point is that a 7 year old is actually perfectly capable of handling themselves in a car for a few minutes. The security guard is not a baby-sitter (it's not a baby!) but is a layer of social protection against some of the rare and unlikely circumstances people are fretting about -- a carjacking or car accident. Those things are almost definitely not going to happen and the presence of a security guard makes them less likely.

This is how watching kids works in normal societies where kids are viewed as normal and necessary. People in other countries do not freak out when they see an unattended 7 year old in a public space where there are responsible adults present because why would they -- that kid is safe. It is only in the US where we have all been convinced that this is a dangerous situation thanks to the efforts of scare mongers who are mostly trying to rally hatred of working mothers and poor people (if it's illegal to leave any child alone for any length of time for any reason then I guess women have to stay home with kids for 18 years and poor people should not have kids at all right).

It’s not his job. If he’s busy watching the kid then he’s not doing his actual job. What a selfish viewpoint. It’s your job to keep an eye on your own kids and you’re neglecting it. Why aren’t you doing the job youself?

It’s not a job! It’s a child living their life in a public space. It’s perfectly safe.

But I won’t do it. Because of people like you. And it adds to the stress of parenting.

The birth rate will continue to decline. The high costs combined with the intense expectations are just unbearable.

I did my part. I had 3 kids. And I made them come with me to run errands and into the store and carried my tantrum prone daughter like a football to drop her older brother off in preschool because we weren’t allowed to leave them in the car. My daughter wanted to stay and play too, so dragging her in for drop off was a nightmare but i had no choice. Everyone gets through it. Luckily my kids are legit old enough to stay at home. I don’t leave them in the car because they will for sure fight. Mostly I just plan my errands for when the kids aren’t with me. Your 7 yr olds aren’t old enough yet but will be soon.

Every time you take a little kid through a busy parking lot you are putting them at greater risk of bodily harm than just leaving them in the car for a few minutes.

Idiots.

Point is, I don’t make the rules. I follow them and don’t ask for exceptions. I personally know a mom who had CPS visit her after leaving her kid in a car to pick up a pizza. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

That’s the American spirit!! Personally I’d rather be arrested than follow stupid rules (which are not based on evidence) that I think are actually detrimental to me raising my kids to be confident, capable adults someday. Bit YMMV.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You can totally leave it running for the AC, leave the key fob with the kid and have them lock the door. Then when you get back, they unlock it for you. 7 is plenty old to do this.

I worry about a car jacker showing up with a gun and demanding that the car be unlocked.

You are worrying about a fantasy that will never happen.

Yeah. You tell ‘em.

Or…

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/two-juveniles-sought-in-car-theft-with-child-inside-in-northwest-dc-police/3172083/

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/4-month-old-girl-found-after-being-taken-in-georgetown-car-theft/3508529/

Those cars were not parked in parking lots with security guards-- they were parked on the street.

The kids in those cases were much younger. In the case of the infant, the carjacker likely did not even realize the baby was in the car for some time.

It's also not clear how long those cars were left idling. In the infant case the mom left the car to go into a perfume store (wtf). Are these cases of people running short errands nearby or are they cases of people using leaving kids in idling cars for 30 or 60 minutes?

The PP is envisioning a situation where a carjacker approaches a locked car with a 7 year old visible in the back seat, and in full view of the security guard and what I'm sure are security cameras outside the pharmacy, points a gun at the child and demands they unlock the car. In the 3-5 minutes the mom was inside the pharmacy.

This will not happen.

So the security guard was babysitting the child? Is that his job?

I actually do think it's his job. It was a few minutes and the mom was right inside. The child is 7, not 2.

The other day I was at the grocery store with my 8 yr old and it started pouring rain while we were in the store. DD was in flipflops (post swim class) and I decided to run and get the car and pick her up at the curb. I left her in the vestibule next to the door. I did consider this a reasonably safe option in part because there was a security guard posted near the door and the area is monitored by cameras.

Am I a derelict parent for leaving an elementary kid alone in public for a few minutes?

It is your primary responsibility as a parent to keep your child safe. You make the guard’s job harder by handing over that job to the guard because you can’t turn off the car while you run into the store. So self-centered.

Again -- in a functional society no one considers a security guard keeping an eye on an older kid in a car for 10 minutes to be "baby-sitting." It's just being a person in society. But the US is not functional around families and children so we have this deranged idea that from birth until like 12 or 13 a parent must have eyes on their child at all times OR be paying a professional child minder to watch their kid. It is nonsensical and is actually BAD for kids in the long run.

The point is that a 7 year old is actually perfectly capable of handling themselves in a car for a few minutes. The security guard is not a baby-sitter (it's not a baby!) but is a layer of social protection against some of the rare and unlikely circumstances people are fretting about -- a carjacking or car accident. Those things are almost definitely not going to happen and the presence of a security guard makes them less likely.

This is how watching kids works in normal societies where kids are viewed as normal and necessary. People in other countries do not freak out when they see an unattended 7 year old in a public space where there are responsible adults present because why would they -- that kid is safe. It is only in the US where we have all been convinced that this is a dangerous situation thanks to the efforts of scare mongers who are mostly trying to rally hatred of working mothers and poor people (if it's illegal to leave any child alone for any length of time for any reason then I guess women have to stay home with kids for 18 years and poor people should not have kids at all right).

It’s not his job. If he’s busy watching the kid then he’s not doing his actual job. What a selfish viewpoint. It’s your job to keep an eye on your own kids and you’re neglecting it. Why aren’t you doing the job youself?

It’s not a job! It’s a child living their life in a public space. It’s perfectly safe.

But I won’t do it. Because of people like you. And it adds to the stress of parenting.

The birth rate will continue to decline. The high costs combined with the intense expectations are just unbearable.

I did my part. I had 3 kids. And I made them come with me to run errands and into the store and carried my tantrum prone daughter like a football to drop her older brother off in preschool because we weren’t allowed to leave them in the car. My daughter wanted to stay and play too, so dragging her in for drop off was a nightmare but i had no choice. Everyone gets through it. Luckily my kids are legit old enough to stay at home. I don’t leave them in the car because they will for sure fight. Mostly I just plan my errands for when the kids aren’t with me. Your 7 yr olds aren’t old enough yet but will be soon.

Every time you take a little kid through a busy parking lot you are putting them at greater risk of bodily harm than just leaving them in the car for a few minutes.

Idiots.

Point is, I don’t make the rules. I follow them and don’t ask for exceptions. I personally know a mom who had CPS visit her after leaving her kid in a car to pick up a pizza. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

That’s the American spirit!! Personally I’d rather be arrested than follow stupid rules (which are not based on evidence) that I think are actually detrimental to me raising my kids to be confident, capable adults someday. Bit YMMV.

You follow stupid rules every day. Been arrested yet?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Yikes, this is all really disheartening. Trust me, I am not a “mommy martyr”, and in general I think that a lot of expectations on parents are way too high. But not leaving a young child (or children) alone in a car seems like a no-brainer. It’s disturbing there are posters bragging about doing this. We get it, you’re an irresponsible parent - why is that something you seem proud of? Is it more hassle to bring the kid in with you? Sure. But oh well, that’s going to happen sometimes.

OP’s kid is 7. That means he’s in 2nd grade. If you can’t leave your 2nd grader alone in car for 10 minutes, it’s either because they have profound special needs, or more likely it means that you are absolutely failing as a parent.

And everyone needs to be real - I’m not looking up the dumb@$$ arbitrary laws of whatever state I happen to be in before I use *my own judgement* to determine what I think my child can handle before I pop into a store for a few minutes.

Some of you really need to grow a spine.

[Anonymous]

Yes, we are all exposed to large and small risks every day and we all need to learn to manage those risks as we get older and become adults so we can live our lives without being paralyzed by fear.

But how often do you skip doing a small thing that will decrease your risk and at the same time, be considerate of others just so you can say you’re out there livin’ life?

Turn off the engine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yikes, this is all really disheartening. Trust me, I am not a “mommy martyr”, and in general I think that a lot of expectations on parents are way too high. But not leaving a young child (or children) alone in a car seems like a no-brainer. It’s disturbing there are posters bragging about doing this. We get it, you’re an irresponsible parent - why is that something you seem proud of? Is it more hassle to bring the kid in with you? Sure. But oh well, that’s going to happen sometimes.

OP’s kid is 7. That means he’s in 2nd grade. If you can’t leave your 2nd grader alone in car for 10 minutes, it’s either because they have profound special needs, or more likely it means that you are absolutely failing as a parent.

And everyone needs to be real - I’m not looking up the dumb@$$ arbitrary laws of whatever state I happen to be in before I use *my own judgement* to determine what I think my child can handle before I pop into a store for a few minutes.

Some of you really need to grow a spine.

Do you leave the engine running? Why?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You can totally leave it running for the AC, leave the key fob with the kid and have them lock the door. Then when you get back, they unlock it for you. 7 is plenty old to do this.

I worry about a car jacker showing up with a gun and demanding that the car be unlocked.

You are worrying about a fantasy that will never happen.

Yeah. You tell ‘em.

Or…

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/two-juveniles-sought-in-car-theft-with-child-inside-in-northwest-dc-police/3172083/

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/4-month-old-girl-found-after-being-taken-in-georgetown-car-theft/3508529/

Those cars were not parked in parking lots with security guards-- they were parked on the street.

The kids in those cases were much younger. In the case of the infant, the carjacker likely did not even realize the baby was in the car for some time.

It's also not clear how long those cars were left idling. In the infant case the mom left the car to go into a perfume store (wtf). Are these cases of people running short errands nearby or are they cases of people using leaving kids in idling cars for 30 or 60 minutes?

The PP is envisioning a situation where a carjacker approaches a locked car with a 7 year old visible in the back seat, and in full view of the security guard and what I'm sure are security cameras outside the pharmacy, points a gun at the child and demands they unlock the car. In the 3-5 minutes the mom was inside the pharmacy.

This will not happen.

So the security guard was babysitting the child? Is that his job?

I actually do think it's his job. It was a few minutes and the mom was right inside. The child is 7, not 2.

The other day I was at the grocery store with my 8 yr old and it started pouring rain while we were in the store. DD was in flipflops (post swim class) and I decided to run and get the car and pick her up at the curb. I left her in the vestibule next to the door. I did consider this a reasonably safe option in part because there was a security guard posted near the door and the area is monitored by cameras.

Am I a derelict parent for leaving an elementary kid alone in public for a few minutes?

It is your primary responsibility as a parent to keep your child safe. You make the guard’s job harder by handing over that job to the guard because you can’t turn off the car while you run into the store. So self-centered.

Again -- in a functional society no one considers a security guard keeping an eye on an older kid in a car for 10 minutes to be "baby-sitting." It's just being a person in society. But the US is not functional around families and children so we have this deranged idea that from birth until like 12 or 13 a parent must have eyes on their child at all times OR be paying a professional child minder to watch their kid. It is nonsensical and is actually BAD for kids in the long run.

The point is that a 7 year old is actually perfectly capable of handling themselves in a car for a few minutes. The security guard is not a baby-sitter (it's not a baby!) but is a layer of social protection against some of the rare and unlikely circumstances people are fretting about -- a carjacking or car accident. Those things are almost definitely not going to happen and the presence of a security guard makes them less likely.

This is how watching kids works in normal societies where kids are viewed as normal and necessary. People in other countries do not freak out when they see an unattended 7 year old in a public space where there are responsible adults present because why would they -- that kid is safe. It is only in the US where we have all been convinced that this is a dangerous situation thanks to the efforts of scare mongers who are mostly trying to rally hatred of working mothers and poor people (if it's illegal to leave any child alone for any length of time for any reason then I guess women have to stay home with kids for 18 years and poor people should not have kids at all right).

It’s not his job. If he’s busy watching the kid then he’s not doing his actual job. What a selfish viewpoint. It’s your job to keep an eye on your own kids and you’re neglecting it. Why aren’t you doing the job youself?

It’s not a job! It’s a child living their life in a public space. It’s perfectly safe.

But I won’t do it. Because of people like you. And it adds to the stress of parenting.

The birth rate will continue to decline. The high costs combined with the intense expectations are just unbearable.

I did my part. I had 3 kids. And I made them come with me to run errands and into the store and carried my tantrum prone daughter like a football to drop her older brother off in preschool because we weren’t allowed to leave them in the car. My daughter wanted to stay and play too, so dragging her in for drop off was a nightmare but i had no choice. Everyone gets through it. Luckily my kids are legit old enough to stay at home. I don’t leave them in the car because they will for sure fight. Mostly I just plan my errands for when the kids aren’t with me. Your 7 yr olds aren’t old enough yet but will be soon.

Every time you take a little kid through a busy parking lot you are putting them at greater risk of bodily harm than just leaving them in the car for a few minutes.

Idiots.

Point is, I don’t make the rules. I follow them and don’t ask for exceptions. I personally know a mom who had CPS visit her after leaving her kid in a car to pick up a pizza. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

That’s the American spirit!! Personally I’d rather be arrested than follow stupid rules (which are not based on evidence) that I think are actually detrimental to me raising my kids to be confident, capable adults someday. Bit YMMV.

You follow stupid rules every day. Been arrested yet?

Why would I be arrested for following stupid rules? You’re not very bright.

I do break stupid rules (I don’t know about every day, though). For example, I cross the street wherever the F I want to cross the street. I drink sangria in the state of Virginia before 2008. I even “lived in sin” with my then-boyfriend in the state of Virginia before the law was repealed!!!

And no, I haven’t been arrested yet.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yikes, this is all really disheartening. Trust me, I am not a “mommy martyr”, and in general I think that a lot of expectations on parents are way too high. But not leaving a young child (or children) alone in a car seems like a no-brainer. It’s disturbing there are posters bragging about doing this. We get it, you’re an irresponsible parent - why is that something you seem proud of? Is it more hassle to bring the kid in with you? Sure. But oh well, that’s going to happen sometimes.

OP’s kid is 7. That means he’s in 2nd grade. If you can’t leave your 2nd grader alone in car for 10 minutes, it’s either because they have profound special needs, or more likely it means that you are absolutely failing as a parent.

And everyone needs to be real - I’m not looking up the dumb@$$ arbitrary laws of whatever state I happen to be in before I use *my own judgement* to determine what I think my child can handle before I pop into a store for a few minutes.

Some of you really need to grow a spine.

Why would anyone leave their 7 year old child alone in a car with the engine running? At least turn the car off and take the keys.

Some really awful parents here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yikes, this is all really disheartening. Trust me, I am not a “mommy martyr”, and in general I think that a lot of expectations on parents are way too high. But not leaving a young child (or children) alone in a car seems like a no-brainer. It’s disturbing there are posters bragging about doing this. We get it, you’re an irresponsible parent - why is that something you seem proud of? Is it more hassle to bring the kid in with you? Sure. But oh well, that’s going to happen sometimes.

OP’s kid is 7. That means he’s in 2nd grade. If you can’t leave your 2nd grader alone in car for 10 minutes, it’s either because they have profound special needs, or more likely it means that you are absolutely failing as a parent.

And everyone needs to be real - I’m not looking up the dumb@$$ arbitrary laws of whatever state I happen to be in before I use *my own judgement* to determine what I think my child can handle before I pop into a store for a few minutes.

Some of you really need to grow a spine.

Do you leave the engine running? Why?

Yeah, if it’s 100 GD degrees outside I might leave the engine running and ALSO lock the doors. My kid isn’t going to try to drive the car. It’s fine.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You can totally leave it running for the AC, leave the key fob with the kid and have them lock the door. Then when you get back, they unlock it for you. 7 is plenty old to do this.

I worry about a car jacker showing up with a gun and demanding that the car be unlocked.

You are worrying about a fantasy that will never happen.

Yeah. You tell ‘em.

Or…

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/two-juveniles-sought-in-car-theft-with-child-inside-in-northwest-dc-police/3172083/

https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/4-month-old-girl-found-after-being-taken-in-georgetown-car-theft/3508529/

Those cars were not parked in parking lots with security guards-- they were parked on the street.

The kids in those cases were much younger. In the case of the infant, the carjacker likely did not even realize the baby was in the car for some time.

It's also not clear how long those cars were left idling. In the infant case the mom left the car to go into a perfume store (wtf). Are these cases of people running short errands nearby or are they cases of people using leaving kids in idling cars for 30 or 60 minutes?

The PP is envisioning a situation where a carjacker approaches a locked car with a 7 year old visible in the back seat, and in full view of the security guard and what I'm sure are security cameras outside the pharmacy, points a gun at the child and demands they unlock the car. In the 3-5 minutes the mom was inside the pharmacy.

This will not happen.

So the security guard was babysitting the child? Is that his job?

I actually do think it's his job. It was a few minutes and the mom was right inside. The child is 7, not 2.

The other day I was at the grocery store with my 8 yr old and it started pouring rain while we were in the store. DD was in flipflops (post swim class) and I decided to run and get the car and pick her up at the curb. I left her in the vestibule next to the door. I did consider this a reasonably safe option in part because there was a security guard posted near the door and the area is monitored by cameras.

Am I a derelict parent for leaving an elementary kid alone in public for a few minutes?

It is your primary responsibility as a parent to keep your child safe. You make the guard’s job harder by handing over that job to the guard because you can’t turn off the car while you run into the store. So self-centered.

Again -- in a functional society no one considers a security guard keeping an eye on an older kid in a car for 10 minutes to be "baby-sitting." It's just being a person in society. But the US is not functional around families and children so we have this deranged idea that from birth until like 12 or 13 a parent must have eyes on their child at all times OR be paying a professional child minder to watch their kid. It is nonsensical and is actually BAD for kids in the long run.

The point is that a 7 year old is actually perfectly capable of handling themselves in a car for a few minutes. The security guard is not a baby-sitter (it's not a baby!) but is a layer of social protection against some of the rare and unlikely circumstances people are fretting about -- a carjacking or car accident. Those things are almost definitely not going to happen and the presence of a security guard makes them less likely.

This is how watching kids works in normal societies where kids are viewed as normal and necessary. People in other countries do not freak out when they see an unattended 7 year old in a public space where there are responsible adults present because why would they -- that kid is safe. It is only in the US where we have all been convinced that this is a dangerous situation thanks to the efforts of scare mongers who are mostly trying to rally hatred of working mothers and poor people (if it's illegal to leave any child alone for any length of time for any reason then I guess women have to stay home with kids for 18 years and poor people should not have kids at all right).

It’s not his job. If he’s busy watching the kid then he’s not doing his actual job. What a selfish viewpoint. It’s your job to keep an eye on your own kids and you’re neglecting it. Why aren’t you doing the job youself?

It’s not a job! It’s a child living their life in a public space. It’s perfectly safe.

But I won’t do it. Because of people like you. And it adds to the stress of parenting.

The birth rate will continue to decline. The high costs combined with the intense expectations are just unbearable.

I did my part. I had 3 kids. And I made them come with me to run errands and into the store and carried my tantrum prone daughter like a football to drop her older brother off in preschool because we weren’t allowed to leave them in the car. My daughter wanted to stay and play too, so dragging her in for drop off was a nightmare but i had no choice. Everyone gets through it. Luckily my kids are legit old enough to stay at home. I don’t leave them in the car because they will for sure fight. Mostly I just plan my errands for when the kids aren’t with me. Your 7 yr olds aren’t old enough yet but will be soon.

Every time you take a little kid through a busy parking lot you are putting them at greater risk of bodily harm than just leaving them in the car for a few minutes.

Idiots.

Point is, I don’t make the rules. I follow them and don’t ask for exceptions. I personally know a mom who had CPS visit her after leaving her kid in a car to pick up a pizza. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

That’s the American spirit!! Personally I’d rather be arrested than follow stupid rules (which are not based on evidence) that I think are actually detrimental to me raising my kids to be confident, capable adults someday. Bit YMMV.

You follow stupid rules every day. Been arrested yet?

Why would I be arrested for following stupid rules? You’re not very bright.

I do break stupid rules (I don’t know about every day, though). For example, I cross the street wherever the F I want to cross the street. I drink sangria in the state of Virginia before 2008. I even “lived in sin” with my then-boyfriend in the state of Virginia before the law was repealed!!!

And no, I haven’t been arrested yet.

Interesting. Jaywalking is now a safe practice necessary for raising capable confident adults? Interesting. I thought you liked evidenced based rules.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If your car got carjacked…… !!!!

Which has happened. A woman left a disabled toddler in the car. Left it running with a key in the car. Someone stole the car with her disabled child in it.

[Anonymous]

Out of curiosity I looked up the rules for DC (where I live) and they don't appear to have rules for cats specifically but the had "advisory guidelines" for CPS that say children under age 10 should not be left unsupervised for any length of time, ever.

And then in the same guidelines they say kids can start caring younger kids at age 11.

So a kid is incapable of caring for themself at all, even for a few minutes, for the first 10 years of life, but on their 11th birthday they are qualified to care for younger kids.

That makes no sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Out of curiosity I looked up the rules for DC (where I live) and they don't appear to have rules for cats specifically but the had "advisory guidelines" for CPS that say children under age 10 should not be left unsupervised for any length of time, ever.

And then in the same guidelines they say kids can start caring younger kids at age 11.

So a kid is incapable of caring for themself at all, even for a few minutes, for the first 10 years of life, but on their 11th birthday they are qualified to care for younger kids.

That makes no sense.

Lol obviously meant rules for cars, not cats!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If your car got carjacked…… !!!!

Which has happened. A woman left a disabled toddler in the car. Left it running with a key in the car. Someone stole the car with her disabled child in it.

OP's child was not disabled

OP's car was locked

What is your point?