Syracuse University issues financial warning as admissions slump: We’re in the red

[Anonymous]

If you read up on what Nancy Cantor did during her time at Syracuse you'll see why they are struggling today.

I know this is Wikipedia, but it gives you the general picture:

"Cantor received criticism for an overall deterioration in the university's academic standing as a research center resulting in a decline in admissions standards, with its acceptance rate climbing from mid-50 to more than 60 percent.[7][9] Certain faculty members took issue with what was seen as "authoritarian rule".[7][10] Syracuse history professor David H. Bennett commented, “My fear is that the university is moving away from selective to inclusive."[11]

That began the slide in the mid-2000's. Now with selective colleges separating themselves even more from the non-selective have nots, it has really struggled.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Fwiw, tons of kids from nyc suburbs go to Syracuse, have the best 4 years, and are very successful afterward. It’s a very common scenario! And it’s not just Newhouse. The education is good, the experience is good, they don’t mind the weather. I’m trying to think of what a similar private school 3 hours from the dc area would be. But yeah it’s the price. Some of those families can easily pay but the ones who can’t have cheaper state school options.

There are very few schools who are positioned like Syracuse-- mid-sized enrollment, moderately selective, longstanding top tier programs (Newhouse, Falk, Maxwell), large deeply loyal alumni base, winning athletic tradition, national brand, and strong school spirit. What are the comparable schools? SMU? There are a host of schools that come close but are more selective-Villanova, USC, BC, and Miami. Syracuse has a strong niche. There is no death spiral here

Yes, it's expensive but for a student who wants smaller class sizes and a relatively more intimate environment it may be worth the money.

I wrote the post you’re responding to and I totally agree with you. I really like Syracuse. My daughter applied and would have been happy there. She would not have been happy at most state schools. It’s a good fit for lots of kids!

State schools suck. I guess they're ok if you're broke. But they have decaying infrastructure, overcrowded everything, insufficient housing, huge classes, difficulty registering for classes, classes taught by TAs, and worst of all, you're surrounded by plebs. Syracuse offers a much superior experience to those who can afford it.

which state schools? Alabama and Clemson are beautiful. I was ready to sign up!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Sayonaracuse.

[Anonymous]

Wealthy town . Observation SEC schools are a huge magnet for kids not in the top 25% of high school class. Those kids have absolutely nil interest in going to Syracuse. Spend a football weekend at Bama, UGa, UFlorida or Texas. Contrast that with football at SU and the Dome.

[Anonymous]

Does general consensus indicate that higher achieving students who might have chosen Syracuse 30 years ago are going elsewhere, having better options? Less strong students are going south to SEC colleges or similarly selective private colleges like SMU, Tulane, Miami, etc? So Syracuse is losing out on the first set pretty badly and even on the second set?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People keep blaming the “demographic cliff” for enrollment declines, but schools in the SEC and other popular schools have had enrollment increases.

The schools that are being hurt are the too expensive for what they’re worth, like Elon and Syracuse.

People talk "on average". The enrollment decline will eventually happen at these SEC schools as well. It's related to the actual number of college eligible people. That number is declining due to trending lower fertility rates. It's not fiction it's fact. Newsflash people have been have fewer kids.

The Southern states have growing populations and economies and popularity. As real estate is all about location, location, location, so are colleges. Just as the population decline isn't likely to affect Harvard, population declines aren't uniform nationally. And in this day and age of mobility, people are also self-segregating to a greater degree than in the past.

What's not really being commented because people are afraid to mention it is that southern SEC schools have also become popular nationally for offering a pragmatic and relaxed college experience that shies away from ideologies. Many students who'd have happily gone to northern universities and LACs in the 1990s are now going to the SECs, especially the boys. I live in an affluent Maryland suburb and the change is notable. The sons and daughters of people who went to the NESCAC, people who consider themselves moderate to conservative, are increasingly going south over northern schools. One of my interns last year went to Alabama and he's from Connecticut and I asked what made him go south and he echoed the same thing I heard from others, low key (aka no politics) fun time. And he's a great guy.

There are suburbs and exurbs in the NE that have a lot in common socially and culturally with the ones in the South. Makes sense there are kids in them that would find Southern schools appealing. But the ones that get into NESCAC schools aren’t going south unless the schools are GT, Duke, Rice and Vanderbilt, maybe UT.

Emory? UF? Tulane?. Emory is all long Island kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People keep blaming the “demographic cliff” for enrollment declines, but schools in the SEC and other popular schools have had enrollment increases.

The schools that are being hurt are the too expensive for what they’re worth, like Elon and Syracuse.

People talk "on average". The enrollment decline will eventually happen at these SEC schools as well. It's related to the actual number of college eligible people. That number is declining due to trending lower fertility rates. It's not fiction it's fact. Newsflash people have been have fewer kids.

The Southern states have growing populations and economies and popularity. As real estate is all about location, location, location, so are colleges. Just as the population decline isn't likely to affect Harvard, population declines aren't uniform nationally. And in this day and age of mobility, people are also self-segregating to a greater degree than in the past.

What's not really being commented because people are afraid to mention it is that southern SEC schools have also become popular nationally for offering a pragmatic and relaxed college experience that shies away from ideologies. Many students who'd have happily gone to northern universities and LACs in the 1990s are now going to the SECs, especially the boys. I live in an affluent Maryland suburb and the change is notable. The sons and daughters of people who went to the NESCAC, people who consider themselves moderate to conservative, are increasingly going south over northern schools. One of my interns last year went to Alabama and he's from Connecticut and I asked what made him go south and he echoed the same thing I heard from others, low key (aka no politics) fun time. And he's a great guy.

The people moving to those states are ot having kids. It's a fertility issue. Less and less people want children. Yes those states population are increasing now due to migration from other states. But it does not mean that their population will keep growing. Colleges need students. That's how their business work. In the future all states will have less students.

The word you’re looking for is fewer, not less.

[Anonymous]

I don't disagree that Syracuse is having some challenges. However, it will be fine - still plenty of demand, particularly for its specialized programs. And plenty of rich families who would rather spend to go here than mix with the common folk at a state school.

[Anonymous]

It is sad to me that rather than just pointing out difficulties that Syracuse is facing as points of fact, some people seem to get tremendous pleasure in disclosing these and/or insulting Syracuse. Why be so childish and nasty? What did Syracuse do to you? Grow up. So sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is sad to me that rather than just pointing out difficulties that Syracuse is facing as points of fact, some people seem to get tremendous pleasure in disclosing these and/or insulting Syracuse. Why be so childish and nasty? What did Syracuse do to you? Grow up. So sad.

I totally agree but someone being nasty/insulting happens on almost every thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It is sad to me that rather than just pointing out difficulties that Syracuse is facing as points of fact, some people seem to get tremendous pleasure in disclosing these and/or insulting Syracuse. Why be so childish and nasty? What did Syracuse do to you? Grow up. So sad.

There are very few nasty or insulting comments on here, especially given the length of the thread. People are discussing reasons for underenrollment. Thats valid, even if it means accepting that not everything there is perfect.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Not all colleges are being impacted. Some like Tulane, Syracuse, UVM are being hurt. Colleges like Florida, Georgia, SMU, are getting more and more applications. The Boston colleges are doing great and all getting record application. NYU isn't having trouble.

The ones struggling have some pointed deficiency. Syracuse's location doesn't help it, just like Tulane's after Katrina. UVM and Syracuse both suffer from the same isolated hinterland stigma.

Fordham had an 11k applicant increase this year

Fordham's proximity to NYC is the reason why it has surpassed Syracuse.

But not everyone wants to be in closer proximity to NYC.

[Anonymous]

We live in Western NY and have two friends whose kids will be starting at Syracuse in the fall.

Both are smart, sporty, kind, and well-adjusted boys who prioritized having a balanced high school experience (5 APs, not 12) over the grind. They both got into honors + specialized programs at Syracuse along with significant merit money and are looking forward to making the most of the experience! Similar story for a girl we know who will be a junior there next year. Very bright, well-balanced, and kind kid who is getting great merit money and insane support re internships etc.

It’s a big school with all types. I wouldn’t let the macro issues discourage you if the school is a good fit further your kid. Especially if they’re interested in one of the specialized or highly ranked programs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wealthy town . Observation SEC schools are a huge magnet for kids not in the top 25% of high school class. Those kids have absolutely nil interest in going to Syracuse. Spend a football weekend at Bama, UGa, UFlorida or Texas. Contrast that with football at SU and the Dome.

Fiction…..and the numbers prove it. Very few students who could get into a solid NE university are heading south. The relatively few that do would have attended non-selective state schools. I guess Old Miss might be attractive if the alternative is UMass Dartmouth but not for anyone with UMass Amherst as an option.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People keep blaming the “demographic cliff” for enrollment declines, but schools in the SEC and other popular schools have had enrollment increases.

The schools that are being hurt are the too expensive for what they’re worth, like Elon and Syracuse.

People talk "on average". The enrollment decline will eventually happen at these SEC schools as well. It's related to the actual number of college eligible people. That number is declining due to trending lower fertility rates. It's not fiction it's fact. Newsflash people have been have fewer kids.

The Southern states have growing populations and economies and popularity. As real estate is all about location, location, location, so are colleges. Just as the population decline isn't likely to affect Harvard, population declines aren't uniform nationally. And in this day and age of mobility, people are also self-segregating to a greater degree than in the past.

What's not really being commented because people are afraid to mention it is that southern SEC schools have also become popular nationally for offering a pragmatic and relaxed college experience that shies away from ideologies. Many students who'd have happily gone to northern universities and LACs in the 1990s are now going to the SECs, especially the boys. I live in an affluent Maryland suburb and the change is notable. The sons and daughters of people who went to the NESCAC, people who consider themselves moderate to conservative, are increasingly going south over northern schools. One of my interns last year went to Alabama and he's from Connecticut and I asked what made him go south and he echoed the same thing I heard from others, low key (aka no politics) fun time. And he's a great guy.

There are suburbs and exurbs in the NE that have a lot in common socially and culturally with the ones in the South. Makes sense there are kids in them that would find Southern schools appealing. But the ones that get into NESCAC schools aren’t going south unless the schools are GT, Duke, Rice and Vanderbilt, maybe UT.

Emory? UF? Tulane?. Emory is all long Island kids.

Emory is a selective private and not at all one of the schools being mentioned as part of a wave of northern students heading south.