Violence in Kindergarten- Sligo Creek Elementary

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

It is more kids coming from super permissive homes where there is no discipline just screens whenever the student demands it, no structure, and the kid who is often smart and strong willed soon realizes he or she can do whatever they want and the parent won't intervene. So the parent walks on eggshells or gives in to all the kid's demands because they don't want to see the kid tantrum. So the kid comes to school and realizes no one can touch them or do anything to them. The teacher tells the parent the student is misbehaving and there are NO consequences at home. There are also no rewards that are effective because the student gets whatever they want at home.

Teacher here. This is more likely the case. I have a student who is nearly as tall as I am and she's 6 yrs old. The only way her mom can get her to school (according to her mom) is to let her walk with her (the student's) phone. When mom gets her to the front door, she walks inside with her until she lines up with her class and then her mom tries to quickly pull the phone away and hightail it out of there. Needless to say, it's like WW3 every morning. My colleague and I end up blocking the door with our bodies to prevent her from running out the door after her mom. We've had meetings about this (and her other awful behaviors) but the real problem is mom's inability to say no. This child has tantrums like a 2 yr old multiple times per day. They last for at least 15 minutes and the entire class comes to a halt because she is screaming the entire time. This child doesn't have special needs. Her mother just doesn't want to parent so all of us get to deal with that. There are 3-4 of these kids in every grade.

Somehow I doubt you've done a neuropsych assessment.

It's in the works. Everything moves slowly in public school.

Then how can you say the child doesn't have special needs?

Also, schools don't do neuropsych assessments. What they do is much more limited.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

It is more kids coming from super permissive homes where there is no discipline just screens whenever the student demands it, no structure, and the kid who is often smart and strong willed soon realizes he or she can do whatever they want and the parent won't intervene. So the parent walks on eggshells or gives in to all the kid's demands because they don't want to see the kid tantrum. So the kid comes to school and realizes no one can touch them or do anything to them. The teacher tells the parent the student is misbehaving and there are NO consequences at home. There are also no rewards that are effective because the student gets whatever they want at home.

Teacher here. This is more likely the case. I have a student who is nearly as tall as I am and she's 6 yrs old. The only way her mom can get her to school (according to her mom) is to let her walk with her (the student's) phone. When mom gets her to the front door, she walks inside with her until she lines up with her class and then her mom tries to quickly pull the phone away and hightail it out of there. Needless to say, it's like WW3 every morning. My colleague and I end up blocking the door with our bodies to prevent her from running out the door after her mom. We've had meetings about this (and her other awful behaviors) but the real problem is mom's inability to say no. This child has tantrums like a 2 yr old multiple times per day. They last for at least 15 minutes and the entire class comes to a halt because she is screaming the entire time. This child doesn't have special needs. Her mother just doesn't want to parent so all of us get to deal with that. There are 3-4 of these kids in every grade.

How can you be so sure that her parents' decisions to give in to her demands are the cause of her behavior, rather than a result of being overwhelmed by behaviors caused by other issues? I'm not saying they're good parenting decisions, but stressed parents often make bad decisions and that kid does not sound neurotypical to me...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the person who was injured yesterday and has staples in her head is a paraeducator, not a classroom teacher.

Then she wasn't doing her job, assuming she was in room to help with that student.

If, of course, any part of this story is true at all.

What in the f?

Why would you assume she was in the room as a 1:1 to that student?

Why would you assume that someone doing their job as a 1:1 aide can’t be harmed by a kid?

Are we all living on the same planet where a 6 year old shot a teacher last year or were you at your home base on Mars for that?

Why? Because MCPS's standard for getting a 1:1 is far less than what has been described in this thread.

And an adult that is paying attention should be more than capable of preventing a 6 year old from obtaining and throwing an apparently heavy object. Again, if this story is actually a true story, which seems less and less likely.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You think it is so easy that you stand next to the child and say -no, please stop, go back to your seat - and the out of control child automatically follows your directions?

That’s not how it works -you are trying to block getting bitten, kicked and hit at the same time to you are trying to prevent other kids from being attacked. You can’t physically restrain the out of control child like you could your own son or daughter. You really can’t touch the out of control child either. How do you prevent the child from obtaining heavy objects when the room is literally full of heavy objects. So the kid picks up a chair and you grab the chair, then get kicked in the shins at the same time and try not to fall over or get kicked again or stomped on. Meanwhile the kid rushes away from you and grabs a stapler and chucks it. Or a water bottle or heavy book. Or a pencil and tries to poke another kid.

It’s ridiculous you think it is so easy and keep denying teachers and staff members are being seriously assaulted all over the country by elementary aged students.

Very creative. But again, we're talking about a kindergartener. An adult assigned to a child should be able to prevent that child from obtaining and throwing an object like a water bottle. And a good paraeducator would be able to guide the child to calming strategies before a situation escalates to that level. That's literally the job.

Since it’s so easy you try it.

I didn't say it was easy-- I said it was the job. Unfortunately, MCPS does a terrible job training paraeducators, and makes minimal efforts to appropriately pair paraeducators with students based on their skills and needs.

Why are you so determined to underplay this, or blame the victims? I'm flummoxed about your motivations here.

I'm not underplaying it. But the fault here rests with MCPS not providing appropriate supports in the classroom, not with the 6-year-old child that some have been demonizing.

No, the fault lies in that MCPS has not provided the appropriate placement for the child. Gen Ed is not the appropriate placement for a child that injured staff to the point of needing stitches. Merely providing an aide is not enough either. A self contained, fully staffed special education classroom for those with disabilities is the appropriate placement.

You can't reasonably jump to that conclusion without knowing more about the child's needs, and what strategies have succeeded or failed. Many of the risks are the same between the gen-ed and self-contained environments, ans many the same supports and services can be employed in both.

Thank you so much for being a voice of reason. And for everybody who is fantasizing about getting the kid kicked out of school. Unfortunately, it is often a very long process to give a child and IEP and determine if a self-contained classroom is the best setting for them. It's not just throw a water bottle and wake up in the rubber room as many parents seem to be fantasizing about on this thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the person who was injured yesterday and has staples in her head is a paraeducator, not a classroom teacher.

Then she wasn't doing her job, assuming she was in room to help with that student.

If, of course, any part of this story is true at all.

What in the f?

Why would you assume she was in the room as a 1:1 to that student?

Why would you assume that someone doing their job as a 1:1 aide can’t be harmed by a kid?

Are we all living on the same planet where a 6 year old shot a teacher last year or were you at your home base on Mars for that?

Why? Because MCPS's standard for getting a 1:1 is far less than what has been described in this thread.

And an adult that is paying attention should be more than capable of preventing a 6 year old from obtaining and throwing an apparently heavy object. Again, if this story is actually a true story, which seems less and less likely.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You think it is so easy that you stand next to the child and say -no, please stop, go back to your seat - and the out of control child automatically follows your directions?

That’s not how it works -you are trying to block getting bitten, kicked and hit at the same time to you are trying to prevent other kids from being attacked. You can’t physically restrain the out of control child like you could your own son or daughter. You really can’t touch the out of control child either. How do you prevent the child from obtaining heavy objects when the room is literally full of heavy objects. So the kid picks up a chair and you grab the chair, then get kicked in the shins at the same time and try not to fall over or get kicked again or stomped on. Meanwhile the kid rushes away from you and grabs a stapler and chucks it. Or a water bottle or heavy book. Or a pencil and tries to poke another kid.

It’s ridiculous you think it is so easy and keep denying teachers and staff members are being seriously assaulted all over the country by elementary aged students.

Very creative. But again, we're talking about a kindergartener. An adult assigned to a child should be able to prevent that child from obtaining and throwing an object like a water bottle. And a good paraeducator would be able to guide the child to calming strategies before a situation escalates to that level. That's literally the job.

Since it’s so easy you try it.

I didn't say it was easy-- I said it was the job. Unfortunately, MCPS does a terrible job training paraeducators, and makes minimal efforts to appropriately pair paraeducators with students based on their skills and needs.

Why are you so determined to underplay this, or blame the victims? I'm flummoxed about your motivations here.

I'm not underplaying it. But the fault here rests with MCPS not providing appropriate supports in the classroom, not with the 6-year-old child that some have been demonizing.

No, the fault lies in that MCPS has not provided the appropriate placement for the child. Gen Ed is not the appropriate placement for a child that injured staff to the point of needing stitches. Merely providing an aide is not enough either. A self contained, fully staffed special education classroom for those with disabilities is the appropriate placement.

You can't reasonably jump to that conclusion without knowing more about the child's needs, and what strategies have succeeded or failed. Many of the risks are the same between the gen-ed and self-contained environments, ans many the same supports and services can be employed in both.

Thank you so much for being a voice of reason. And for everybody who is fantasizing about getting the kid kicked out of school. Unfortunately, it is often a very long process to give a child and IEP and determine if a self-contained classroom is the best setting for them. It's not just throw a water bottle and wake up in the rubber room as many parents seem to be fantasizing about on this thread.

How many have to be hospitalized first? What’s the quota? You make it seem that all it was was a water bottle? But you have a teacher that quit entirely and a para-educator with staples after a hospital visit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the person who was injured yesterday and has staples in her head is a paraeducator, not a classroom teacher.

Then she wasn't doing her job, assuming she was in room to help with that student.

If, of course, any part of this story is true at all.

What in the f?

Why would you assume she was in the room as a 1:1 to that student?

Why would you assume that someone doing their job as a 1:1 aide can’t be harmed by a kid?

Are we all living on the same planet where a 6 year old shot a teacher last year or were you at your home base on Mars for that?

Why? Because MCPS's standard for getting a 1:1 is far less than what has been described in this thread.

And an adult that is paying attention should be more than capable of preventing a 6 year old from obtaining and throwing an apparently heavy object. Again, if this story is actually a true story, which seems less and less likely.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You think it is so easy that you stand next to the child and say -no, please stop, go back to your seat - and the out of control child automatically follows your directions?

That’s not how it works -you are trying to block getting bitten, kicked and hit at the same time to you are trying to prevent other kids from being attacked. You can’t physically restrain the out of control child like you could your own son or daughter. You really can’t touch the out of control child either. How do you prevent the child from obtaining heavy objects when the room is literally full of heavy objects. So the kid picks up a chair and you grab the chair, then get kicked in the shins at the same time and try not to fall over or get kicked again or stomped on. Meanwhile the kid rushes away from you and grabs a stapler and chucks it. Or a water bottle or heavy book. Or a pencil and tries to poke another kid.

It’s ridiculous you think it is so easy and keep denying teachers and staff members are being seriously assaulted all over the country by elementary aged students.

Very creative. But again, we're talking about a kindergartener. An adult assigned to a child should be able to prevent that child from obtaining and throwing an object like a water bottle. And a good paraeducator would be able to guide the child to calming strategies before a situation escalates to that level. That's literally the job.

Since it’s so easy you try it.

I didn't say it was easy-- I said it was the job. Unfortunately, MCPS does a terrible job training paraeducators, and makes minimal efforts to appropriately pair paraeducators with students based on their skills and needs.

Why are you so determined to underplay this, or blame the victims? I'm flummoxed about your motivations here.

I'm not underplaying it. But the fault here rests with MCPS not providing appropriate supports in the classroom, not with the 6-year-old child that some have been demonizing.

No, the fault lies in that MCPS has not provided the appropriate placement for the child. Gen Ed is not the appropriate placement for a child that injured staff to the point of needing stitches. Merely providing an aide is not enough either. A self contained, fully staffed special education classroom for those with disabilities is the appropriate placement.

You can't reasonably jump to that conclusion without knowing more about the child's needs, and what strategies have succeeded or failed. Many of the risks are the same between the gen-ed and self-contained environments, ans many the same supports and services can be employed in both.

Thank you so much for being a voice of reason. And for everybody who is fantasizing about getting the kid kicked out of school. Unfortunately, it is often a very long process to give a child and IEP and determine if a self-contained classroom is the best setting for them. It's not just throw a water bottle and wake up in the rubber room as many parents seem to be fantasizing about on this thread.

How many have to be hospitalized first? What’s the quota? You make it seem that all it was was a water bottle? But you have a teacher that quit entirely and a para-educator with staples after a hospital visit.

No one is claiming there isn't a problem. Regardless of whether the situation described in this thread is true or not, there is certainly a systemic problem within MCPS where kids with special needs are not receiving the supports they need. That absolutely needs to be addressed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the person who was injured yesterday and has staples in her head is a paraeducator, not a classroom teacher.

Then she wasn't doing her job, assuming she was in room to help with that student.

If, of course, any part of this story is true at all.

What in the f?

Why would you assume she was in the room as a 1:1 to that student?

Why would you assume that someone doing their job as a 1:1 aide can’t be harmed by a kid?

Are we all living on the same planet where a 6 year old shot a teacher last year or were you at your home base on Mars for that?

Why? Because MCPS's standard for getting a 1:1 is far less than what has been described in this thread.

And an adult that is paying attention should be more than capable of preventing a 6 year old from obtaining and throwing an apparently heavy object. Again, if this story is actually a true story, which seems less and less likely.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You think it is so easy that you stand next to the child and say -no, please stop, go back to your seat - and the out of control child automatically follows your directions?

That’s not how it works -you are trying to block getting bitten, kicked and hit at the same time to you are trying to prevent other kids from being attacked. You can’t physically restrain the out of control child like you could your own son or daughter. You really can’t touch the out of control child either. How do you prevent the child from obtaining heavy objects when the room is literally full of heavy objects. So the kid picks up a chair and you grab the chair, then get kicked in the shins at the same time and try not to fall over or get kicked again or stomped on. Meanwhile the kid rushes away from you and grabs a stapler and chucks it. Or a water bottle or heavy book. Or a pencil and tries to poke another kid.

It’s ridiculous you think it is so easy and keep denying teachers and staff members are being seriously assaulted all over the country by elementary aged students.

Very creative. But again, we're talking about a kindergartener. An adult assigned to a child should be able to prevent that child from obtaining and throwing an object like a water bottle. And a good paraeducator would be able to guide the child to calming strategies before a situation escalates to that level. That's literally the job.

You never answered the question how the adult prevents the child from obtaining an object. You can't restrain the child in any way, so don't include that in your answer. Teachers have been seriously injured by kindergarten and first grade students. you magically think someone getting paid $18 an hour is a kindergarten whisperer who is going to calm the student down when no one else can? You have very obviously never seen a raging out of control student and/or you are an administrator who does an awful job or parent who thinks your child can do no wrong.

This is the type of gaslighting from administrators and parents of out of control kids that make special education teachers and general education teachers quit
Administrators who tell teachers-
if you only build a relationship with the kid, he or she wouldn't have bashed you in the head with a water bottle, so the 8 staples in your head is basically your fault.
Oh it's just a kindergarten student, they don't kick that hard or bite that deeply.
What did you do to make the student so upset? You should let him have whatever he wants.
Why aren't you calming the student down, you should be able to do that before the student escalates
Why aren't you providing the student with rewards (of course they are never provided by the school, the teacher has to spend his or her own money)?

Really?

You grab it before they do. Or take it away from them before they throw it.

It's time for you to retire.

NP. Surely you're aware that there are ~25 kids in these classrooms. There's no way a teacher is grabbing something away if she's across the room. Are you always this obtuse? I suggest you spend some time volunteering in the classroom to see what the realities are.

Oh, and as teachers retire, there isn't a fresh crop to replace them. Think about that for a minute.

It sounds like this child has a 1:1. Did you miss that part of the thread?

No, it does not sound like this child has a 1:1. It sounds like there was an aide present in the classroom and she got hurt. There is one who floats in K at SCES; she’s not 1:1 with a specific student.

The main thing it sounds like is that you really have no idea how bad the staffing situation is.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

It is more kids coming from super permissive homes where there is no discipline just screens whenever the student demands it, no structure, and the kid who is often smart and strong willed soon realizes he or she can do whatever they want and the parent won't intervene. So the parent walks on eggshells or gives in to all the kid's demands because they don't want to see the kid tantrum. So the kid comes to school and realizes no one can touch them or do anything to them. The teacher tells the parent the student is misbehaving and there are NO consequences at home. There are also no rewards that are effective because the student gets whatever they want at home.

Teacher here. This is more likely the case. I have a student who is nearly as tall as I am and she's 6 yrs old. The only way her mom can get her to school (according to her mom) is to let her walk with her (the student's) phone. When mom gets her to the front door, she walks inside with her until she lines up with her class and then her mom tries to quickly pull the phone away and hightail it out of there. Needless to say, it's like WW3 every morning. My colleague and I end up blocking the door with our bodies to prevent her from running out the door after her mom. We've had meetings about this (and her other awful behaviors) but the real problem is mom's inability to say no. This child has tantrums like a 2 yr old multiple times per day. They last for at least 15 minutes and the entire class comes to a halt because she is screaming the entire time. This child doesn't have special needs. Her mother just doesn't want to parent so all of us get to deal with that. There are 3-4 of these kids in every grade.

Somehow I doubt you've done a neuropsych assessment.

It's in the works. Everything moves slowly in public school.

Then how can you say the child doesn't have special needs?

Also, schools don't do neuropsych assessments. What they do is much more limited.

Her parents are having one outside of school. Her mom said the issues started when she would throw tantrums at age 1 or 2. Her dad worked nights and slept all day so mom would give in to the tantrums to keep her quiet so he could sleep. Years later, she’s still throwing tantrums.

Instead of being removed from the classroom, I have to evacuate the classroom to the hallway. Needless to say, not much teaching is going on there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

It is more kids coming from super permissive homes where there is no discipline just screens whenever the student demands it, no structure, and the kid who is often smart and strong willed soon realizes he or she can do whatever they want and the parent won't intervene. So the parent walks on eggshells or gives in to all the kid's demands because they don't want to see the kid tantrum. So the kid comes to school and realizes no one can touch them or do anything to them. The teacher tells the parent the student is misbehaving and there are NO consequences at home. There are also no rewards that are effective because the student gets whatever they want at home.

Teacher here. This is more likely the case. I have a student who is nearly as tall as I am and she's 6 yrs old. The only way her mom can get her to school (according to her mom) is to let her walk with her (the student's) phone. When mom gets her to the front door, she walks inside with her until she lines up with her class and then her mom tries to quickly pull the phone away and hightail it out of there. Needless to say, it's like WW3 every morning. My colleague and I end up blocking the door with our bodies to prevent her from running out the door after her mom. We've had meetings about this (and her other awful behaviors) but the real problem is mom's inability to say no. This child has tantrums like a 2 yr old multiple times per day. They last for at least 15 minutes and the entire class comes to a halt because she is screaming the entire time. This child doesn't have special needs. Her mother just doesn't want to parent so all of us get to deal with that. There are 3-4 of these kids in every grade.

The only reason this kid doesn't have special needs is because their parents haven't gotten an evaluation. I am thinking you're a troll. There is no way a teacher would think this behavior is normal and only due to discipline issues at home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

It is more kids coming from super permissive homes where there is no discipline just screens whenever the student demands it, no structure, and the kid who is often smart and strong willed soon realizes he or she can do whatever they want and the parent won't intervene. So the parent walks on eggshells or gives in to all the kid's demands because they don't want to see the kid tantrum. So the kid comes to school and realizes no one can touch them or do anything to them. The teacher tells the parent the student is misbehaving and there are NO consequences at home. There are also no rewards that are effective because the student gets whatever they want at home.

Teacher here. This is more likely the case. I have a student who is nearly as tall as I am and she's 6 yrs old. The only way her mom can get her to school (according to her mom) is to let her walk with her (the student's) phone. When mom gets her to the front door, she walks inside with her until she lines up with her class and then her mom tries to quickly pull the phone away and hightail it out of there. Needless to say, it's like WW3 every morning. My colleague and I end up blocking the door with our bodies to prevent her from running out the door after her mom. We've had meetings about this (and her other awful behaviors) but the real problem is mom's inability to say no. This child has tantrums like a 2 yr old multiple times per day. They last for at least 15 minutes and the entire class comes to a halt because she is screaming the entire time. This child doesn't have special needs. Her mother just doesn't want to parent so all of us get to deal with that. There are 3-4 of these kids in every grade.

Somehow I doubt you've done a neuropsych assessment.

It's in the works. Everything moves slowly in public school.

Then how can you say the child doesn't have special needs?

Also, schools don't do neuropsych assessments. What they do is much more limited.

Her parents are having one outside of school. Her mom said the issues started when she would throw tantrums at age 1 or 2. Her dad worked nights and slept all day so mom would give in to the tantrums to keep her quiet so he could sleep. Years later, she’s still throwing tantrums.

Instead of being removed from the classroom, I have to evacuate the classroom to the hallway. Needless to say, not much teaching is going on there.

This is the standard. When there is danger, the potential actual victims are the ones removed. Also, don’t dangle your modifiers!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the person who was injured yesterday and has staples in her head is a paraeducator, not a classroom teacher.

Then she wasn't doing her job, assuming she was in room to help with that student.

If, of course, any part of this story is true at all.

What in the f?

Why would you assume she was in the room as a 1:1 to that student?

Why would you assume that someone doing their job as a 1:1 aide can’t be harmed by a kid?

Are we all living on the same planet where a 6 year old shot a teacher last year or were you at your home base on Mars for that?

Why? Because MCPS's standard for getting a 1:1 is far less than what has been described in this thread.

And an adult that is paying attention should be more than capable of preventing a 6 year old from obtaining and throwing an apparently heavy object. Again, if this story is actually a true story, which seems less and less likely.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You think it is so easy that you stand next to the child and say -no, please stop, go back to your seat - and the out of control child automatically follows your directions?

That’s not how it works -you are trying to block getting bitten, kicked and hit at the same time to you are trying to prevent other kids from being attacked. You can’t physically restrain the out of control child like you could your own son or daughter. You really can’t touch the out of control child either. How do you prevent the child from obtaining heavy objects when the room is literally full of heavy objects. So the kid picks up a chair and you grab the chair, then get kicked in the shins at the same time and try not to fall over or get kicked again or stomped on. Meanwhile the kid rushes away from you and grabs a stapler and chucks it. Or a water bottle or heavy book. Or a pencil and tries to poke another kid.

It’s ridiculous you think it is so easy and keep denying teachers and staff members are being seriously assaulted all over the country by elementary aged students.

Very creative. But again, we're talking about a kindergartener. An adult assigned to a child should be able to prevent that child from obtaining and throwing an object like a water bottle. And a good paraeducator would be able to guide the child to calming strategies before a situation escalates to that level. That's literally the job.

You never answered the question how the adult prevents the child from obtaining an object. You can't restrain the child in any way, so don't include that in your answer. Teachers have been seriously injured by kindergarten and first grade students. you magically think someone getting paid $18 an hour is a kindergarten whisperer who is going to calm the student down when no one else can? You have very obviously never seen a raging out of control student and/or you are an administrator who does an awful job or parent who thinks your child can do no wrong.

This is the type of gaslighting from administrators and parents of out of control kids that make special education teachers and general education teachers quit
Administrators who tell teachers-
if you only build a relationship with the kid, he or she wouldn't have bashed you in the head with a water bottle, so the 8 staples in your head is basically your fault.
Oh it's just a kindergarten student, they don't kick that hard or bite that deeply.
What did you do to make the student so upset? You should let him have whatever he wants.
Why aren't you calming the student down, you should be able to do that before the student escalates
Why aren't you providing the student with rewards (of course they are never provided by the school, the teacher has to spend his or her own money)?

Really?

You grab it before they do. Or take it away from them before they throw it.

It's time for you to retire.

NP. Surely you're aware that there are ~25 kids in these classrooms. There's no way a teacher is grabbing something away if she's across the room. Are you always this obtuse? I suggest you spend some time volunteering in the classroom to see what the realities are.

Oh, and as teachers retire, there isn't a fresh crop to replace them. Think about that for a minute.

It sounds like this child has a 1:1. Did you miss that part of the thread?

No, it does not sound like this child has a 1:1. It sounds like there was an aide present in the classroom and she got hurt. There is one who floats in K at SCES; she’s not 1:1 with a specific student.

The main thing it sounds like is that you really have no idea how bad the staffing situation is.

If that's true, then it is even more outrageous how much this school is failing this student. It's not hard to fill paraeducator positions. They're highly desired positions among child care workers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

It is more kids coming from super permissive homes where there is no discipline just screens whenever the student demands it, no structure, and the kid who is often smart and strong willed soon realizes he or she can do whatever they want and the parent won't intervene. So the parent walks on eggshells or gives in to all the kid's demands because they don't want to see the kid tantrum. So the kid comes to school and realizes no one can touch them or do anything to them. The teacher tells the parent the student is misbehaving and there are NO consequences at home. There are also no rewards that are effective because the student gets whatever they want at home.

Teacher here. This is more likely the case. I have a student who is nearly as tall as I am and she's 6 yrs old. The only way her mom can get her to school (according to her mom) is to let her walk with her (the student's) phone. When mom gets her to the front door, she walks inside with her until she lines up with her class and then her mom tries to quickly pull the phone away and hightail it out of there. Needless to say, it's like WW3 every morning. My colleague and I end up blocking the door with our bodies to prevent her from running out the door after her mom. We've had meetings about this (and her other awful behaviors) but the real problem is mom's inability to say no. This child has tantrums like a 2 yr old multiple times per day. They last for at least 15 minutes and the entire class comes to a halt because she is screaming the entire time. This child doesn't have special needs. Her mother just doesn't want to parent so all of us get to deal with that. There are 3-4 of these kids in every grade.

The only reason this kid doesn't have special needs is because their parents haven't gotten an evaluation. I am thinking you're a troll. There is no way a teacher would think this behavior is normal and only due to discipline issues at home.

Unfortunately there are absolutely teachers within MCPS that are incredibly naive regarding developmental disabilities. They tend to be the older ones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the person who was injured yesterday and has staples in her head is a paraeducator, not a classroom teacher.

Then she wasn't doing her job, assuming she was in room to help with that student.

If, of course, any part of this story is true at all.

What in the f?

Why would you assume she was in the room as a 1:1 to that student?

Why would you assume that someone doing their job as a 1:1 aide can’t be harmed by a kid?

Are we all living on the same planet where a 6 year old shot a teacher last year or were you at your home base on Mars for that?

Why? Because MCPS's standard for getting a 1:1 is far less than what has been described in this thread.

And an adult that is paying attention should be more than capable of preventing a 6 year old from obtaining and throwing an apparently heavy object. Again, if this story is actually a true story, which seems less and less likely.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You think it is so easy that you stand next to the child and say -no, please stop, go back to your seat - and the out of control child automatically follows your directions?

That’s not how it works -you are trying to block getting bitten, kicked and hit at the same time to you are trying to prevent other kids from being attacked. You can’t physically restrain the out of control child like you could your own son or daughter. You really can’t touch the out of control child either. How do you prevent the child from obtaining heavy objects when the room is literally full of heavy objects. So the kid picks up a chair and you grab the chair, then get kicked in the shins at the same time and try not to fall over or get kicked again or stomped on. Meanwhile the kid rushes away from you and grabs a stapler and chucks it. Or a water bottle or heavy book. Or a pencil and tries to poke another kid.

It’s ridiculous you think it is so easy and keep denying teachers and staff members are being seriously assaulted all over the country by elementary aged students.

Very creative. But again, we're talking about a kindergartener. An adult assigned to a child should be able to prevent that child from obtaining and throwing an object like a water bottle. And a good paraeducator would be able to guide the child to calming strategies before a situation escalates to that level. That's literally the job.

You never answered the question how the adult prevents the child from obtaining an object. You can't restrain the child in any way, so don't include that in your answer. Teachers have been seriously injured by kindergarten and first grade students. you magically think someone getting paid $18 an hour is a kindergarten whisperer who is going to calm the student down when no one else can? You have very obviously never seen a raging out of control student and/or you are an administrator who does an awful job or parent who thinks your child can do no wrong.

This is the type of gaslighting from administrators and parents of out of control kids that make special education teachers and general education teachers quit
Administrators who tell teachers-
if you only build a relationship with the kid, he or she wouldn't have bashed you in the head with a water bottle, so the 8 staples in your head is basically your fault.
Oh it's just a kindergarten student, they don't kick that hard or bite that deeply.
What did you do to make the student so upset? You should let him have whatever he wants.
Why aren't you calming the student down, you should be able to do that before the student escalates
Why aren't you providing the student with rewards (of course they are never provided by the school, the teacher has to spend his or her own money)?

Really?

You grab it before they do. Or take it away from them before they throw it.

It's time for you to retire.

NP. Surely you're aware that there are ~25 kids in these classrooms. There's no way a teacher is grabbing something away if she's across the room. Are you always this obtuse? I suggest you spend some time volunteering in the classroom to see what the realities are.

Oh, and as teachers retire, there isn't a fresh crop to replace them. Think about that for a minute.

It sounds like this child has a 1:1. Did you miss that part of the thread?

No, it does not sound like this child has a 1:1. It sounds like there was an aide present in the classroom and she got hurt. There is one who floats in K at SCES; she’s not 1:1 with a specific student.

The main thing it sounds like is that you really have no idea how bad the staffing situation is.

If that's true, then it is even more outrageous how much this school is failing this student. It's not hard to fill paraeducator positions. They're highly desired positions among child care workers.

Seriously? Go on the mcps careers website. They’re trying to fill so many para positions.

[Anonymous]

Denial is thick in this thread.

So many either do not want to believe there is rampant violence in our public schools, or are denying the truth for som nefarious reason.

The first step in correcting a problem is to acknowledge the problem exists.

Because child-victims are involved, we cannot “say their names!” as in other awareness campaigns.

But we can at least watch the video available to us.

Watch this, for example; no - it is not kindergarteners. These are teenagers. But watch it, and stop claiming there is no problem.

We have a problem:

https://old.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/qv8nku/i_found_this_video_earlier/?rdt=46196

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the person who was injured yesterday and has staples in her head is a paraeducator, not a classroom teacher.

Then she wasn't doing her job, assuming she was in room to help with that student.

If, of course, any part of this story is true at all.

What in the f?

Why would you assume she was in the room as a 1:1 to that student?

Why would you assume that someone doing their job as a 1:1 aide can’t be harmed by a kid?

Are we all living on the same planet where a 6 year old shot a teacher last year or were you at your home base on Mars for that?

Why? Because MCPS's standard for getting a 1:1 is far less than what has been described in this thread.

And an adult that is paying attention should be more than capable of preventing a 6 year old from obtaining and throwing an apparently heavy object. Again, if this story is actually a true story, which seems less and less likely.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You think it is so easy that you stand next to the child and say -no, please stop, go back to your seat - and the out of control child automatically follows your directions?

That’s not how it works -you are trying to block getting bitten, kicked and hit at the same time to you are trying to prevent other kids from being attacked. You can’t physically restrain the out of control child like you could your own son or daughter. You really can’t touch the out of control child either. How do you prevent the child from obtaining heavy objects when the room is literally full of heavy objects. So the kid picks up a chair and you grab the chair, then get kicked in the shins at the same time and try not to fall over or get kicked again or stomped on. Meanwhile the kid rushes away from you and grabs a stapler and chucks it. Or a water bottle or heavy book. Or a pencil and tries to poke another kid.

It’s ridiculous you think it is so easy and keep denying teachers and staff members are being seriously assaulted all over the country by elementary aged students.

Very creative. But again, we're talking about a kindergartener. An adult assigned to a child should be able to prevent that child from obtaining and throwing an object like a water bottle. And a good paraeducator would be able to guide the child to calming strategies before a situation escalates to that level. That's literally the job.

You never answered the question how the adult prevents the child from obtaining an object. You can't restrain the child in any way, so don't include that in your answer. Teachers have been seriously injured by kindergarten and first grade students. you magically think someone getting paid $18 an hour is a kindergarten whisperer who is going to calm the student down when no one else can? You have very obviously never seen a raging out of control student and/or you are an administrator who does an awful job or parent who thinks your child can do no wrong.

This is the type of gaslighting from administrators and parents of out of control kids that make special education teachers and general education teachers quit
Administrators who tell teachers-
if you only build a relationship with the kid, he or she wouldn't have bashed you in the head with a water bottle, so the 8 staples in your head is basically your fault.
Oh it's just a kindergarten student, they don't kick that hard or bite that deeply.
What did you do to make the student so upset? You should let him have whatever he wants.
Why aren't you calming the student down, you should be able to do that before the student escalates
Why aren't you providing the student with rewards (of course they are never provided by the school, the teacher has to spend his or her own money)?

Really?

You grab it before they do. Or take it away from them before they throw it.

It's time for you to retire.

NP. Surely you're aware that there are ~25 kids in these classrooms. There's no way a teacher is grabbing something away if she's across the room. Are you always this obtuse? I suggest you spend some time volunteering in the classroom to see what the realities are.

Oh, and as teachers retire, there isn't a fresh crop to replace them. Think about that for a minute.

It sounds like this child has a 1:1. Did you miss that part of the thread?

No, it does not sound like this child has a 1:1. It sounds like there was an aide present in the classroom and she got hurt. There is one who floats in K at SCES; she’s not 1:1 with a specific student.

The main thing it sounds like is that you really have no idea how bad the staffing situation is.

If that's true, then it is even more outrageous how much this school is failing this student. It's not hard to fill paraeducator positions. They're highly desired positions among child care workers.

Seriously? Go on the mcps careers website. They’re trying to fill so many para positions.

And I know many people that apply for those positions. HR and principals are incredibly slow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

It is more kids coming from super permissive homes where there is no discipline just screens whenever the student demands it, no structure, and the kid who is often smart and strong willed soon realizes he or she can do whatever they want and the parent won't intervene. So the parent walks on eggshells or gives in to all the kid's demands because they don't want to see the kid tantrum. So the kid comes to school and realizes no one can touch them or do anything to them. The teacher tells the parent the student is misbehaving and there are NO consequences at home. There are also no rewards that are effective because the student gets whatever they want at home.

Teacher here. This is more likely the case. I have a student who is nearly as tall as I am and she's 6 yrs old. The only way her mom can get her to school (according to her mom) is to let her walk with her (the student's) phone. When mom gets her to the front door, she walks inside with her until she lines up with her class and then her mom tries to quickly pull the phone away and hightail it out of there. Needless to say, it's like WW3 every morning. My colleague and I end up blocking the door with our bodies to prevent her from running out the door after her mom. We've had meetings about this (and her other awful behaviors) but the real problem is mom's inability to say no. This child has tantrums like a 2 yr old multiple times per day. They last for at least 15 minutes and the entire class comes to a halt because she is screaming the entire time. This child doesn't have special needs. Her mother just doesn't want to parent so all of us get to deal with that. There are 3-4 of these kids in every grade.

I just spent 7 weeks working in an out of school time program at the YMCA in a Title I schools community.

Hands down, the kids with diagnoses or who were SPED were LESS disruptive and problematic than the kids who simply are not being parented, period.

These are average to above average intellect kids who are running the show in our classrooms and other youth development programs because the new social justice paradigm (I am, by the way, uber liberal and was an antiracist before the term was in any kind of widespread use) is that you don't discipline these kids or kick them out of the program as your progressive accountability structure allows - you just keep abiding and trying to give them positive incentives to conform their behavior to norms.

And in the meantime the vast majority of kids who make good choices are getting bullied and traumatized by witnesses bullying and assaults both physical and verbal on a regular basis - on them, their peers and yes, on their adult instructors.

For some percentage of kids, seeing those things on a regular basis normalizes that kind of behavior and violence and it invites some kids to engage in behaviors they never otherwise would have tried.

It's a disaster, truly. I was planning to go into public school teaching through a program that requires a 2 year commitment to a Title I school district and I've decided - NO THANKS.

It would be different if there was any accountability structure left for kids who make bad choices, but there really isn't. The school district where I was going to teach is one among many nationwide that have been sued for having an in school and out of school suspension program and for using it as designed. While investigation by the federal OCV found there was no intent to racial bias in using the progressive accountability structure, the majority of kids who ended up being in and out of school suspended were BIPOC and so it was no longer okay to use it because apparently we are just going to abide the behavior and that's going to motivate the kids to change and conform to social norms.

Is anyone really surprised that violence is more and more normative in our society?

What really makes me sad is that this is just a recycling of the soft bigotry of low expectations. These social justice warriors in our schools and other youth development program leadership structures think they a striking a blow for antiracism, but to me it looks like they are enabling and encouraging kids into the juvenile justice system and eventually likely the adult justice system, just in a different fashion than the previous school to prison pipeline.

And yes, plenty of the disruptive kids are white, too. We are failing all these kids whose parents already did. We'll pay the price down the road as we always have done.