Violence in Kindergarten- Sligo Creek Elementary

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I truly cannot understand the patent defense of violent children- disabled or not- throughout this thread.

As a special education teacher I can promise you, the ‘everyone in gen Ed’ model is not only failing students, it’s creating real and lifelong trauma. To the student and their peers.

What a gross oversimplification to think that putting those kids in a more restrictive program is comparable to prison or that if only their needs were met, or mental health provided- that this would get better.

It won’t. Real harm is happening. and all these keyboard warriors who have never taught, or been on a crisis team, should spend less time typing and more time volunteering at their kids schools. Or better yet- go volunteer at a title I school, where families can’t afford an advocate and so students don’t even have a chance at receiving appropriate services and supports.

New to the thread
Your last sentence is key. Don’t send your kids to title 1 if you can avoid it.
Ask me how I know.

DP. The FARMS rate at SCES is extremely low. We’re at a title 1 and nothing like this has happened this year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And the person who was injured yesterday and has staples in her head is a paraeducator, not a classroom teacher.

Then she wasn't doing her job, assuming she was in room to help with that student.

If, of course, any part of this story is true at all.

What in the f?

Why would you assume she was in the room as a 1:1 to that student?

Why would you assume that someone doing their job as a 1:1 aide can’t be harmed by a kid?

Are we all living on the same planet where a 6 year old shot a teacher last year or were you at your home base on Mars for that?

Why? Because MCPS's standard for getting a 1:1 is far less than what has been described in this thread.

And an adult that is paying attention should be more than capable of preventing a 6 year old from obtaining and throwing an apparently heavy object. Again, if this story is actually a true story, which seems less and less likely.

You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. You think it is so easy that you stand next to the child and say -no, please stop, go back to your seat - and the out of control child automatically follows your directions?

That’s not how it works -you are trying to block getting bitten, kicked and hit at the same time to you are trying to prevent other kids from being attacked. You can’t physically restrain the out of control child like you could your own son or daughter. You really can’t touch the out of control child either. How do you prevent the child from obtaining heavy objects when the room is literally full of heavy objects. So the kid picks up a chair and you grab the chair, then get kicked in the shins at the same time and try not to fall over or get kicked again or stomped on. Meanwhile the kid rushes away from you and grabs a stapler and chucks it. Or a water bottle or heavy book. Or a pencil and tries to poke another kid.

It’s ridiculous you think it is so easy and keep denying teachers and staff members are being seriously assaulted all over the country by elementary aged students.

Very creative. But again, we're talking about a kindergartener. An adult assigned to a child should be able to prevent that child from obtaining and throwing an object like a water bottle. And a good paraeducator would be able to guide the child to calming strategies before a situation escalates to that level. That's literally the job.

You never answered the question how the adult prevents the child from obtaining an object. You can't restrain the child in any way, so don't include that in your answer. Teachers have been seriously injured by kindergarten and first grade students. you magically think someone getting paid $18 an hour is a kindergarten whisperer who is going to calm the student down when no one else can? You have very obviously never seen a raging out of control student and/or you are an administrator who does an awful job or parent who thinks your child can do no wrong.

This is the type of gaslighting from administrators and parents of out of control kids that make special education teachers and general education teachers quit
Administrators who tell teachers-
if you only build a relationship with the kid, he or she wouldn't have bashed you in the head with a water bottle, so the 8 staples in your head is basically your fault.
Oh it's just a kindergarten student, they don't kick that hard or bite that deeply.
What did you do to make the student so upset? You should let him have whatever he wants.
Why aren't you calming the student down, you should be able to do that before the student escalates
Why aren't you providing the student with rewards (of course they are never provided by the school, the teacher has to spend his or her own money)?

Really?

You grab it before they do. Or take it away from them before they throw it.

It's time for you to retire.

NP. Surely you're aware that there are ~25 kids in these classrooms. There's no way a teacher is grabbing something away if she's across the room. Are you always this obtuse? I suggest you spend some time volunteering in the classroom to see what the realities are.

Oh, and as teachers retire, there isn't a fresh crop to replace them. Think about that for a minute.

It sounds like this child has a 1:1. Did you miss that part of the thread?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow OP, I had no idea this was happening. I was hoping my child would get a spot in their French immersion, but now I'm not so sure.

Unfortunately, this can happen at any MCPS ES. Current conditions have led to an uptick in violence in our schools and nobody in a leadership position wants to fix the issues or implement solid discipline (because of equity issues).

What exactly are those "current conditions" ?

The current belief that integrating disturbed, disruptive, and violent children with non-disruptive, well behaved children will magically improve outcomes.

Silly laws protecting kids with disabilities. Why don't we just send them straight to prison?

Well, that’s a dumb statement. Of course people want to protect children with disabilities, but they also want to protect the other 98% of the children who might be in harms way. Keeping a violent child in general education is a disservice to both that child and the other children in the classroom.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow OP, I had no idea this was happening. I was hoping my child would get a spot in their French immersion, but now I'm not so sure.

Unfortunately, this can happen at any MCPS ES. Current conditions have led to an uptick in violence in our schools and nobody in a leadership position wants to fix the issues or implement solid discipline (because of equity issues).

What exactly are those "current conditions" ?

The current belief that integrating disturbed, disruptive, and violent children with non-disruptive, well behaved children will magically improve outcomes.

Silly laws protecting kids with disabilities. Why don't we just send them straight to prison?

Well, that’s a dumb statement. Of course people want to protect children with disabilities, but they also want to protect the other 98% of the children who might be in harms way. Keeping a violent child in general education is a disservice to both that child and the other children in the classroom.

You're obviously not familiar with the self-contained programs. They still go without the necessary supports and services, but you don't see that because your kids are in a different room.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow OP, I had no idea this was happening. I was hoping my child would get a spot in their French immersion, but now I'm not so sure.

Unfortunately, this can happen at any MCPS ES. Current conditions have led to an uptick in violence in our schools and nobody in a leadership position wants to fix the issues or implement solid discipline (because of equity issues).

What exactly are those "current conditions" ?

The current belief that integrating disturbed, disruptive, and violent children with non-disruptive, well behaved children will magically improve outcomes.

Silly laws protecting kids with disabilities. Why don't we just send them straight to prison?

Well, that’s a dumb statement. Of course people want to protect children with disabilities, but they also want to protect the other 98% of the children who might be in harms way. Keeping a violent child in general education is a disservice to both that child and the other children in the classroom.

You're obviously not familiar with the self-contained programs. They still go without the necessary supports and services, but you don't see that because your kids are in a different room.

So why are you complaining? If it is no different for your child at least it is an improvement for the kids in a different room.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow OP, I had no idea this was happening. I was hoping my child would get a spot in their French immersion, but now I'm not so sure.

Unfortunately, this can happen at any MCPS ES. Current conditions have led to an uptick in violence in our schools and nobody in a leadership position wants to fix the issues or implement solid discipline (because of equity issues).

What exactly are those "current conditions" ?

The current belief that integrating disturbed, disruptive, and violent children with non-disruptive, well behaved children will magically improve outcomes.

Silly laws protecting kids with disabilities. Why don't we just send them straight to prison?

Well, that’s a dumb statement. Of course people want to protect children with disabilities, but they also want to protect the other 98% of the children who might be in harms way. Keeping a violent child in general education is a disservice to both that child and the other children in the classroom.

You're obviously not familiar with the self-contained programs. They still go without the necessary supports and services, but you don't see that because your kids are in a different room.

So why are you complaining? If it is no different for your child at least it is an improvement for the kids in a different room.

It's often quite worse. Which is exactly what you'd expect anytime you try to go down the "separate but equal" path.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow OP, I had no idea this was happening. I was hoping my child would get a spot in their French immersion, but now I'm not so sure.

Unfortunately, this can happen at any MCPS ES. Current conditions have led to an uptick in violence in our schools and nobody in a leadership position wants to fix the issues or implement solid discipline (because of equity issues).

What exactly are those "current conditions" ?

The current belief that integrating disturbed, disruptive, and violent children with non-disruptive, well behaved children will magically improve outcomes.

Silly laws protecting kids with disabilities. Why don't we just send them straight to prison?

Well, that’s a dumb statement. Of course people want to protect children with disabilities, but they also want to protect the other 98% of the children who might be in harms way. Keeping a violent child in general education is a disservice to both that child and the other children in the classroom.

You're obviously not familiar with the self-contained programs. They still go without the necessary supports and services, but you don't see that because your kids are in a different room.

So why are you complaining? If it is no different for your child at least it is an improvement for the kids in a different room.

It's often quite worse. Which is exactly what you'd expect anytime you try to go down the "separate but equal" path.

Then fight to improve self-contained programs. Don't fight to keep your kid in a gen-ed classroom where they obviously don't belong and are ruining the education for the other 98% of the kids.

[Anonymous]

It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

[Anonymous]

Most SPED kids are more likely to be assaulted then to assault. Violent kids don't need to go to restricted environments, VIOLENT KIDS DO.

[Anonymous]

*Special needs kids don't need to go to self contained-- VIOLENT kids do

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow OP, I had no idea this was happening. I was hoping my child would get a spot in their French immersion, but now I'm not so sure.

Unfortunately, this can happen at any MCPS ES. Current conditions have led to an uptick in violence in our schools and nobody in a leadership position wants to fix the issues or implement solid discipline (because of equity issues).

What exactly are those "current conditions" ?

The current belief that integrating disturbed, disruptive, and violent children with non-disruptive, well behaved children will magically improve outcomes.

Silly laws protecting kids with disabilities. Why don't we just send them straight to prison?

Well, that’s a dumb statement. Of course people want to protect children with disabilities, but they also want to protect the other 98% of the children who might be in harms way. Keeping a violent child in general education is a disservice to both that child and the other children in the classroom.

You're obviously not familiar with the self-contained programs. They still go without the necessary supports and services, but you don't see that because your kids are in a different room.

So why are you complaining? If it is no different for your child at least it is an improvement for the kids in a different room.

It's often quite worse. Which is exactly what you'd expect anytime you try to go down the "separate but equal" path.

Then fight to improve self-contained programs. Don't fight to keep your kid in a gen-ed classroom where they obviously don't belong and are ruining the education for the other 98% of the kids.

This thread, and others like it, demonstrates quite clearly that many people- including MCPS staff- simply want to warehouse children with special needs. With that attitude, of course those programs are going to be resource-starved. If you want kids out of your classroom, then you need to get MCPS to make the alternatives better. Much better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

It is more kids coming from super permissive homes where there is no discipline just screens whenever the student demands it, no structure, and the kid who is often smart and strong willed soon realizes he or she can do whatever they want and the parent won't intervene. So the parent walks on eggshells or gives in to all the kid's demands because they don't want to see the kid tantrum. So the kid comes to school and realizes no one can touch them or do anything to them. The teacher tells the parent the student is misbehaving and there are NO consequences at home. There are also no rewards that are effective because the student gets whatever they want at home.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

It is more kids coming from super permissive homes where there is no discipline just screens whenever the student demands it, no structure, and the kid who is often smart and strong willed soon realizes he or she can do whatever they want and the parent won't intervene. So the parent walks on eggshells or gives in to all the kid's demands because they don't want to see the kid tantrum. So the kid comes to school and realizes no one can touch them or do anything to them. The teacher tells the parent the student is misbehaving and there are NO consequences at home. There are also no rewards that are effective because the student gets whatever they want at home.

Teacher here. This is more likely the case. I have a student who is nearly as tall as I am and she's 6 yrs old. The only way her mom can get her to school (according to her mom) is to let her walk with her (the student's) phone. When mom gets her to the front door, she walks inside with her until she lines up with her class and then her mom tries to quickly pull the phone away and hightail it out of there. Needless to say, it's like WW3 every morning. My colleague and I end up blocking the door with our bodies to prevent her from running out the door after her mom. We've had meetings about this (and her other awful behaviors) but the real problem is mom's inability to say no. This child has tantrums like a 2 yr old multiple times per day. They last for at least 15 minutes and the entire class comes to a halt because she is screaming the entire time. This child doesn't have special needs. Her mother just doesn't want to parent so all of us get to deal with that. There are 3-4 of these kids in every grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

It is more kids coming from super permissive homes where there is no discipline just screens whenever the student demands it, no structure, and the kid who is often smart and strong willed soon realizes he or she can do whatever they want and the parent won't intervene. So the parent walks on eggshells or gives in to all the kid's demands because they don't want to see the kid tantrum. So the kid comes to school and realizes no one can touch them or do anything to them. The teacher tells the parent the student is misbehaving and there are NO consequences at home. There are also no rewards that are effective because the student gets whatever they want at home.

Teacher here. This is more likely the case. I have a student who is nearly as tall as I am and she's 6 yrs old. The only way her mom can get her to school (according to her mom) is to let her walk with her (the student's) phone. When mom gets her to the front door, she walks inside with her until she lines up with her class and then her mom tries to quickly pull the phone away and hightail it out of there. Needless to say, it's like WW3 every morning. My colleague and I end up blocking the door with our bodies to prevent her from running out the door after her mom. We've had meetings about this (and her other awful behaviors) but the real problem is mom's inability to say no. This child has tantrums like a 2 yr old multiple times per day. They last for at least 15 minutes and the entire class comes to a halt because she is screaming the entire time. This child doesn't have special needs. Her mother just doesn't want to parent so all of us get to deal with that. There are 3-4 of these kids in every grade.

Somehow I doubt you've done a neuropsych assessment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not sped it kids coming from violent homes. There are plenty of parents out there who beat their kids

It is more kids coming from super permissive homes where there is no discipline just screens whenever the student demands it, no structure, and the kid who is often smart and strong willed soon realizes he or she can do whatever they want and the parent won't intervene. So the parent walks on eggshells or gives in to all the kid's demands because they don't want to see the kid tantrum. So the kid comes to school and realizes no one can touch them or do anything to them. The teacher tells the parent the student is misbehaving and there are NO consequences at home. There are also no rewards that are effective because the student gets whatever they want at home.

Teacher here. This is more likely the case. I have a student who is nearly as tall as I am and she's 6 yrs old. The only way her mom can get her to school (according to her mom) is to let her walk with her (the student's) phone. When mom gets her to the front door, she walks inside with her until she lines up with her class and then her mom tries to quickly pull the phone away and hightail it out of there. Needless to say, it's like WW3 every morning. My colleague and I end up blocking the door with our bodies to prevent her from running out the door after her mom. We've had meetings about this (and her other awful behaviors) but the real problem is mom's inability to say no. This child has tantrums like a 2 yr old multiple times per day. They last for at least 15 minutes and the entire class comes to a halt because she is screaming the entire time. This child doesn't have special needs. Her mother just doesn't want to parent so all of us get to deal with that. There are 3-4 of these kids in every grade.

Somehow I doubt you've done a neuropsych assessment.

It's in the works. Everything moves slowly in public school.