Montgomery for All Missing Middle presentation

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

DP. No.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

In absolute terms? Yes, so has the price of eggs. In absolute terms everything has gone up. In real terms? Not so much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

In absolute terms? Yes, so has the price of eggs. In absolute terms everything has gone up. In real terms? Not so much.

Inflation adjusted median household income is declining. So yes the county is getting poorer. In 2008 inflation adjusted HHI was $127,700 and in 2022 it was $118,020.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

In absolute terms? Yes, so has the price of eggs. In absolute terms everything has gone up. In real terms? Not so much.

Inflation adjusted median household income is declining. So yes the county is getting poorer. In 2008 inflation adjusted HHI was $127,700 and in 2022 it was $118,020.

Not sure where you are getting those numbers. From this source, the inflation adjusted median income in MoCo has consistently gone up since 2017 and was at $126,840 in 2022.
https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/montgomery-county-md-median-household-income/
https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/topic/montgomery-county-md-income/


In contrast, the median household income in the United States fell from &76,330 in 2021 to $74,580 in 2022 , a 2.3 percent decline.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

And Fairfax County is killing Montgomery County. While Fairfax grew wealthier over the last few decades, Montgomery stalled, thanks to he politicians.

https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/fairfax-county-va-median-household-income/

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

In absolute terms? Yes, so has the price of eggs. In absolute terms everything has gone up. In real terms? Not so much.

Inflation adjusted median household income is declining. So yes the county is getting poorer. In 2008 inflation adjusted HHI was $127,700 and in 2022 it was $118,020.

Not sure where you are getting those numbers. From this source, the inflation adjusted median income in MoCo has consistently gone up since 2017 and was at $126,840 in 2022.
https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/montgomery-county-md-median-household-income/
https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/topic/montgomery-county-md-income/


In contrast, the median household income in the United States fell from &76,330 in 2021 to $74,580 in 2022 , a 2.3 percent decline.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

In absolute terms? Yes, so has the price of eggs. In absolute terms everything has gone up. In real terms? Not so much.

Inflation adjusted median household income is declining. So yes the county is getting poorer. In 2008 inflation adjusted HHI was $127,700 and in 2022 it was $118,020.

And Fairfax is blowing away Montgomery County.

https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/fairfax-county-va-median-household-income/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

In absolute terms? Yes, so has the price of eggs. In absolute terms everything has gone up. In real terms? Not so much.

Inflation adjusted median household income is declining. So yes the county is getting poorer. In 2008 inflation adjusted HHI was $127,700 and in 2022 it was $118,020.

And Fairfax is blowing away Montgomery County.

https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/fairfax-county-va-median-household-income/

The median household income in Fairfax went up $2,578 in the ten years of your link. And it DECREASED in 2021.
In contrast, the median household income in MoCo went up $854 in those same ten years, with an INCREASE in 2021.

Not sure how you define "blowing away."

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

In absolute terms? Yes, so has the price of eggs. In absolute terms everything has gone up. In real terms? Not so much.

Inflation adjusted median household income is declining. So yes the county is getting poorer. In 2008 inflation adjusted HHI was $127,700 and in 2022 it was $118,020.

And Fairfax is blowing away Montgomery County.

https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/fairfax-county-va-median-household-income/

The median household income in Fairfax went up $2,578 in the ten years of your link. And it DECREASED in 2021.
In contrast, the median household income in MoCo went up $854 in those same ten years, with an INCREASE in 2021.

Not sure how you define "blowing away."

Fairfax and Montgomery were comparable decades ago, wih roughly equivalent income levels. No longer.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

In absolute terms? Yes, so has the price of eggs. In absolute terms everything has gone up. In real terms? Not so much.

Inflation adjusted median household income is declining. So yes the county is getting poorer. In 2008 inflation adjusted HHI was $127,700 and in 2022 it was $118,020.

And Fairfax is blowing away Montgomery County.

https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/fairfax-county-va-median-household-income/

The median household income in Fairfax went up $2,578 in the ten years of your link. And it DECREASED in 2021.
In contrast, the median household income in MoCo went up $854 in those same ten years, with an INCREASE in 2021.

Not sure how you define "blowing away."

It was 3x better than Moco..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

In absolute terms? Yes, so has the price of eggs. In absolute terms everything has gone up. In real terms? Not so much.

Inflation adjusted median household income is declining. So yes the county is getting poorer. In 2008 inflation adjusted HHI was $127,700 and in 2022 it was $118,020.

And Fairfax is blowing away Montgomery County.

https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/fairfax-county-va-median-household-income/

The median household income in Fairfax went up $2,578 in the ten years of your link. And it DECREASED in 2021.
In contrast, the median household income in MoCo went up $854 in those same ten years, with an INCREASE in 2021.

Not sure how you define "blowing away."

It was 3x better than Moco..

So an extra $100 a month? Big whoop.

Now net worth I can definitely imagine a difference with as home values have definitely appreciated more in Fairfax Co over MoCo. But that can change over time. MoCo prices could go higher as a percentage.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

In absolute terms? Yes, so has the price of eggs. In absolute terms everything has gone up. In real terms? Not so much.

Inflation adjusted median household income is declining. So yes the county is getting poorer. In 2008 inflation adjusted HHI was $127,700 and in 2022 it was $118,020.

And Fairfax is blowing away Montgomery County.

https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/fairfax-county-va-median-household-income/

The median household income in Fairfax went up $2,578 in the ten years of your link. And it DECREASED in 2021.
In contrast, the median household income in MoCo went up $854 in those same ten years, with an INCREASE in 2021.

Not sure how you define "blowing away."

It was 3x better than Moco..

So an extra $100 a month? Big whoop.

Now net worth I can definitely imagine a difference with as home values have definitely appreciated more in Fairfax Co over MoCo. But that can change over time. MoCo prices could go higher as a percentage.

The reason why home prices have increased more in Fairfax is because Fairfax is attracting more upper income taxpayers. Very simple. More people who can pay. Absent a change in political attitudes, that will not change in MoCo.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't understand why why density everywhere is a goal? People are fleeing this region! Population is not increasing.

I'm sorry, but you are factually wrong. The population of the county has increased and is projected to continue increasing. Here is just two sources:

https://montgomeryplanning.org/blog-design/2023/07/steady-growth-projected-for-montgomery-county-over-the-next-30-years/
https://usafacts.org/data/topics/people-society/population-and-demographics/our-changing-population/state/maryland/county/montgomery-county/#:~:text=Source%3A-,How%20has%20Montgomery%20County's%20population%20changed%20over%20the%20years%3F,when%20the%20population%20dropped%200.5%25.

Now, you may be referring to a few anecdotes of people in your own socioeconomic class that may have moved. If that is the case, you may consider how you define "people."

On a per capita basis the county is getting poorer and will continue to do so. It seems to be one of the county’s goals.

Is that more accurate?

No, it is not.

Per capita income is going up.

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MHIMD24031A052NCEN
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/PCPI24031

In absolute terms? Yes, so has the price of eggs. In absolute terms everything has gone up. In real terms? Not so much.

Inflation adjusted median household income is declining. So yes the county is getting poorer. In 2008 inflation adjusted HHI was $127,700 and in 2022 it was $118,020.

And Fairfax is blowing away Montgomery County.

https://www.neilsberg.com/insights/fairfax-county-va-median-household-income/

The median household income in Fairfax went up $2,578 in the ten years of your link. And it DECREASED in 2021.
In contrast, the median household income in MoCo went up $854 in those same ten years, with an INCREASE in 2021.

Not sure how you define "blowing away."

It was 3x better than Moco..

So an extra $100 a month? Big whoop.

Now net worth I can definitely imagine a difference with as home values have definitely appreciated more in Fairfax Co over MoCo. But that can change over time. MoCo prices could go higher as a percentage.

The reason why home prices have increased more in Fairfax is because Fairfax is attracting more upper income taxpayers. Very simple. More people who can pay. Absent a change in political attitudes, that will not change in MoCo.

This answer makes the distinction very clear. We could have policy that is geared on making MoCo an enclave for the upper class. Or we could have policy that makes MoCo an affordable and accessible place for a range of classes.

Voters have elected officials who support the latter.