Kavanaugh vote postponed. Judiciary Committee hearing on Sexual Assault complain Monday.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

She has presented a pretty convincing narrative which includes naming people present who were actually his friends at the time. Plus, no one would make up a rape story and add an extra witness, who is friends with the alleged assailant, to the room.

I’m sorry you are having difficulty accepting this, but people are believing him to be guilty because that is what the known facts support.

LOL!

She's named one person--who has been public with the fact that he has had a drinking problem. Convenient choice.
She has given different accounts of exactly how many people were there.
She doesn't know whose house it was.
She doesn't know where the house was.
She doesn't know when it was--not the date, she doesn't even remember which year it was. Most high school kids would know whether they were a freshman, sophomore, etc.
She doesn't remember how she got home.
She told no one at the time.(Kind of unbelievable. I had a bad experience and I immediately told my roommate and other friends. Young women generally would share something like this. She was not raped, so there would be no "humiliation." )

Why did the Dems wait so long to share this? This is unfolding as planned.

I believe you're correct.

Oh please, these assertions have already been rebutted several times in this thread.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This means the republicans are very confident about Kavanaugh't denial.

They may know the woman is lying.

Or they’re hoping against hope no more victims emerge.

There’s already chatter about additional people.

Links? Sources? Didn't think so.

There certainly have been many rumors today. Wait and see. Quite a few posters here yesterday were insisting Professor Ford would not go public.

To bad she didn't go public years ago, when there could have been a full investigation, either implicating him or clearing his name.

Indeed, well too bad people slander and drag accusers through the mud, slut shame them, ask about what they were wearing and whether they were drinking, suggest they had it coming or deserved it, suggest they encouraged it, suggest they just wanted sex and then changed their minds afterward, to name a few. Once that changes maybe more will come forward at the time of their attacks.

Well, certainly, victims - or alleged victims - would be more believable if they would report assault immediately rather than waiting decades and expecting to be believed without any corroborating evidence. I've been teaching my daughter that if she is ever assaulted, she *must* report it immediately if we hope to get justice. Waiting only makes it that much less credible within the justice system. Sorry you don't like hearing the truth.

Are you also teaching her that you will be sympathetic to her attacker and concerned about the repercussions of any reporting on him. Because, as you point out, it may just ruin the poor boy’s reputation.

See, there's this thing that goes hand-in-hand with timely reporting of assault. It's called proof. You know, a way of verifiying that an incident actually occurred. It's something that could be very useful if women would just avail themselves of it instead of keeping it to themselves for decades and then deciding to unburden themselves.

Not sure what proof you think existed then that doesn’t now. Sexual assault allegations are almost always he said/she said cases which is why so many women are reluctant to bring them. They know there are people like you predisposed to believing the male.

NP. I'm a woman and predisposed to believe a person with some actual information. If you can't even remember the year, I'm going to be suspicious if you remembered anything correctly at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

She has presented a pretty convincing narrative which includes naming people present who were actually his friends at the time. Plus, no one would make up a rape story and add an extra witness, who is friends with the alleged assailant, to the room.

I’m sorry you are having difficulty accepting this, but people are believing him to be guilty because that is what the known facts support.

LOL!

She's named one person--who has been public with the fact that he has had a drinking problem. Convenient choice.
She has given different accounts of exactly how many people were there.
She doesn't know whose house it was.
She doesn't know where the house was.
She doesn't know when it was--not the date, she doesn't even remember which year it was. Most high school kids would know whether they were a freshman, sophomore, etc.
She doesn't remember how she got home.
She told no one at the time.(Kind of unbelievable. I had a bad experience and I immediately told my roommate and other friends. Young women generally would share something like this. She was not raped, so there would be no "humiliation." )

Why did the Dems wait so long to share this? This is unfolding as planned.

I believe you're correct.

Oh please, these assertions have already been rebutted several times in this thread.

With perhaps, maybe and I think. NOT with any truth.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She didn't even tell his name to the therapist.

This story just does not ring true.

Would you believe it if there were pics? No, I didn't think so. Because you think women are dirt.

Also why you're so eager to confirm a man hell-bent on repealing women's reproductive rights.

DP. You sound truly unhinged. If I told you your husband did something similar to me when I was 15 and he was 17, would you believe me? Without any evidence at all, just my word against his? Didn't think so.

Here's the thing. You assume that others are just as blindly partisan as you, and act accordingly. Well, some of us are not.

Here's the thing. I'm a moderate - or an independent, take your pick. I actually don't care if Kavanaugh is confirmed or not. What I *do* care about are people being accused of something without any evidence to back up the accusation. I do care about innocent men being accused of assault without any proof - just one person's accusation. I have no idea if Kavanaugh is innocent or guilty - and neither do you. I just want to make sure that people can't be indicted based on one person's word, and nothing else. Otherwise, be prepared to one day be accused of something and have absolutely no recourse, even if the accusation is false.

DP. I agree with this but will add, perhaps inarticulately, that what makes situations like this harder is that the situation is different to different people. Ford may truly believe whatever happened (if anything) was "sexual assault" or "attempted rape." Someone else may have thought it was a drunk grope in the dark. Yes, I know that means that men and boys should always ask permission and follow the rules and be respectful. But human, physical, hormonally charged, interactions (that often involve alcohol) aren't so black and white.

I'm the PP and I agree with what you're saying.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This means the republicans are very confident about Kavanaugh't denial.

They may know the woman is lying.

Or that the public pressure/GOP-Dem pressure behind closed doors is more than it seems.

Or that they don't give a shit and know that no matter what comes out in any hearing, Kavanaugh will be confirmed.

I don't think that's right. If that was the case they would have pushed through the vote. This took them by surprise. I think some combination of Sasse, Corker, Flake, Murkowski and Collins threatened defection without a hearing and all red state Democrats said no yes without a hearing.

They're counting on her not being credible because this is really stupid if they have any intention of confirming K. A public testimony of this assault will only make it more difficult to confirm him. Watching a woman publicly verbally describe an assault will be worse than reading it.

I think they picked Monday because they think that's enough time to dig up dirt but honestly the Republicans are stupid. If they wanted to seal this up before midterms they should have either forced a vote this week or cut K loose and go for another nominee.

Republicans CAN’T cut K loose. Trump nominated him. Only Trump can pull the nomination. And TRump always, always, always, always fights back no matter what. They have to vote him down (pissed Trump base) or vote him forward (pissed women). It is lose-lose. Mitch McTurtle didn’t want K to begin with. Right now, he would do anything in his power to make him go away.

I think that there are quite a few R Senators who hope more women come forward and this nomination becomes untenable. Because they are cowards and don’t want to have to vote.

PP, you do not even have the most basic idea how government works. No one can make Trump withdraw Kavanaugh, but no one can make the Senate give him a vote.

McConnell wants, more than anything, to keep the Senate in Republican hands. If he senses that confirming Kavanaugh in the face of these allegations will turn off voters, he will simply not schedule a vote.

Without a vote, Kavanaugh would withdraw himself in order to regain some semblance of normal life.

Kavanaugh will never again have any semblance of a normal life; nor will his family. This allegation - whether true or false - has instantly turned him into a pariah.

Many high profile types recently ousted by MeToo allegations are slowly creeping back into the spotlight. Even if Kavanaugh doesn’t get confirmed, he will likely retain his current position, feel a little local heat, then be back to normal.

Sorry, but if this accusation is false, he will never again be "back to normal." I imagine his daughters are already being mocked and bullied, by having a "rapist" as a dad - as I'm sure many parents in this area are telling their kids. He's a marked man. At this point, doesn't matter if he did it or not - most of you have already decided he's guilty. It's sickening.

She has presented a pretty convincing narrative which includes naming people present who were actually his friends at the time. Plus, no one would make up a rape story and add an extra witness, who is friends with the alleged assailant, to the room.

I’m sorry you are having difficulty accepting this, but people are believing him to be guilty because that is what the known facts support.

Did she name someone other than Mark Judge as having been there? It's not so much that I'm having "difficulty" believing this; it's much more that NONE of us knows the truth and an otherwise innocent man has no way of defending himself. The accusation is out there and you believe it. In your mind, he's guilty. I truly hope nothing similar ever happens to your loved ones.

According to the Washington Post articles, she identified two other boys who were at the party, but not in the room.

So what? Let's say I wanted to tell people that Joe from my high school attempted to rape me. I could easily identify two of Joe's friends and claim they were there. That doesn't mean it's a truthful statement.

Did you tell a licensed physician about it a decade ago? Did you take a polygraph?

Aside from her and her lawyer's word, do you have proof of this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) misogyny is alive and well in this country and B) victims of sexual assault are incredibly brave to speak out against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this woman and attempted to discredit her is really gross.

OR

Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) feelings of jealousy and hatred of men are alive and well by many on this thread and B) victims of sexual assault accusations (not convictions) are incredibly brave to try to defend themselves against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this man (Kavanaugh) and attempted to discredit and convict him via one woman's accusations of attempted rape and suffocation after 30+ years is really gross.

So in your mind, women (and men) who defend the accuser’s right to be heard and not summarily dismissed and/or savaged and discredited equates to people who are jealous and hate men?

Okie dokie.

NOPE. Not what I said. I'm saying that I don't think the accused should be "savaged and discredited" either. And, yes, there have been a lot of DCUM posts on Kavanaugh threads that describe men--and Kavanaugh, in particular-- in an incredibly vile and negative way.

This may be news to you, but putting aside the sexual assault allegations, Kavanaugh has consistently treated women as second class citizens in his opinions. Most women don’t appreciate that. Shocking, I know.

PP here. A person's reputation, which can vary depending on the political, religious, cultural, etc. perspective of others, shouldn't be the determining factor re turning an accusation into a conviction by public opinion.

He is not getting convicted of anything. His suitability for a lifetime appointment to one of the most important jobs in the country is being determined. Character and perception counts. But even if he is found unworthy, he still has his current prestigious lifetime appointment and his girls' basketball team. Not a bad consolation prize for what could have been a life-changing mistake for him.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) misogyny is alive and well in this country and B) victims of sexual assault are incredibly brave to speak out against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this woman and attempted to discredit her is really gross.

OR

Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) feelings of jealousy and hatred of men are alive and well by many on this thread and B) victims of sexual assault accusations (not convictions) are incredibly brave to try to defend themselves against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this man (Kavanaugh) and attempted to discredit and convict him via one woman's accusations of attempted rape and suffocation after 30+ years is really gross.

So in your mind, women (and men) who defend the accuser’s right to be heard and not summarily dismissed and/or savaged and discredited equates to people who are jealous and hate men?

Okie dokie.

NOPE. Not what I said. I'm saying that I don't think the accused should be "savaged and discredited" either. And, yes, there have been a lot of DCUM posts on Kavanaugh threads that describe men--and Kavanaugh, in particular-- in an incredibly vile and negative way.

This may be news to you, but putting aside the sexual assault allegations, Kavanaugh has consistently treated women as second class citizens in his opinions. Most women don’t appreciate that. Shocking, I know.

PP here. A person's reputation, which can vary depending on the political, religious, cultural, etc. perspective of others, shouldn't be the determining factor re turning an accusation into a conviction by public opinion.

EXACTLY. "I don't like him / his politics, so he MUST be guilty!!" That's what so many of these posters are saying. Totally biased and having nothing to do with the actual allegation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I truly don’t understand the glee some PPs are showing in attacking Dr. Ford. It’s disturbing.

What about the glee some PPs are showing in attacking Judge Kavanaugh? Is that disturbing to you too?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) misogyny is alive and well in this country and B) victims of sexual assault are incredibly brave to speak out against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this woman and attempted to discredit her is really gross.

OR

Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) feelings of jealousy and hatred of men are alive and well by many on this thread and B) victims of sexual assault accusations (not convictions) are incredibly brave to try to defend themselves against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this man (Kavanaugh) and attempted to discredit and convict him via one woman's accusations of attempted rape and suffocation after 30+ years is really gross.

MRA! MRA! MAGA!

How many victims will it take for you to believe, pp?

PP here. I"m female and not a Trump supporter; but I think it's wrong to accuse, condemn, and "convict" anyone of crimes as serious as attempted rape and suffocation (i.e., murder) based on one person's uncorroborated accusation after 30+ years.

Precisely how I feel too. For me, this really doesn't have much to do with Brett Kavanaugh, as I'm neutral when it comes to the subject of his confirmation. It has so much more to do with this one-sided accusation from decades ago. There is nothing fair about this.

Please explain how an accusation Ican be two-sided.

I think you know exactly what I meant, but here ya go - we're only hearing Ford's side. Kavanaugh flatly denies being involved at all. So all we have is her word against his.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Guys. The hyperbole on this thread is absurd. He isn't being "convicted," "indicted," or "stoned to death." At most, he's just not getting a particularly prestigious job. Spare your tears.

At most, his reputation is deliberately being destroyed, and his wife is being humiliated in the process, because liberals don't want him to have a job.

In addition, Democrats are making double-damn sure that Trump has a really hard time finding ANY Supreme Court nominee unless THEY pre-approve, because those candidates will know that liberal Democrats will make stuff up to trash them and destroy them.

Your little word tantrum is cute.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) misogyny is alive and well in this country and B) victims of sexual assault are incredibly brave to speak out against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this woman and attempted to discredit her is really gross.

OR

Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) feelings of jealousy and hatred of men are alive and well by many on this thread and B) victims of sexual assault accusations (not convictions) are incredibly brave to try to defend themselves against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this man (Kavanaugh) and attempted to discredit and convict him via one woman's accusations of attempted rape and suffocation after 30+ years is really gross.

So in your mind, women (and men) who defend the accuser’s right to be heard and not summarily dismissed and/or savaged and discredited equates to people who are jealous and hate men?

Okie dokie.

NOPE. Not what I said. I'm saying that I don't think the accused should be "savaged and discredited" either. And, yes, there have been a lot of DCUM posts on Kavanaugh threads that describe men--and Kavanaugh, in particular-- in an incredibly vile and negative way.

This may be news to you, but putting aside the sexual assault allegations, Kavanaugh has consistently treated women as second class citizens in his opinions. Most women don’t appreciate that. Shocking, I know.

PP here. A person's reputation, which can vary depending on the political, religious, cultural, etc. perspective of others, shouldn't be the determining factor re turning an accusation into a conviction by public opinion.

EXACTLY. "I don't like him / his politics, so he MUST be guilty!!" That's what so many of these posters are saying. Totally biased and having nothing to do with the actual allegation.

No one is saying that at all. It is the conservative posters who are trying to make this political.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:She didn't even tell his name to the therapist.

This story just does not ring true.

Would you believe it if there were pics? No, I didn't think so. Because you think women are dirt.

Also why you're so eager to confirm a man hell-bent on repealing women's reproductive rights.

You saw the Franken photos and still don't believe it.

Because I can see shadows. Can you?

I wonder if the number of victims will exceed your personal threshold for trashing victims, or if 20 could come out including one of the girls he coaches and you guys will still smear them. There really seems to be no bottom.

No one’s saying to string him up. We’re saying investigate it and if he’s guilty, he doesn’t deserve a place on the court.

DP. Actually, that's exactly what you're saying and exactly what you'd do, were it left up to you (which thankfully, it's not). You'd love to see this guy stoned in a public square. It's really unbelievable.

+1 I read some of the comments on this thread and can hardly believe that intelligent, educated women could possibly think that way.

+2

I see sockpuppeting hour has commenced.

I know it must bother you to see people agreeing with one another and disagreeing with you, but since I'm the "+2" poster, I can assure you there was no sockpuppeting going on. Not sure if we could say the same thing for your posts, however.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) misogyny is alive and well in this country and B) victims of sexual assault are incredibly brave to speak out against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this woman and attempted to discredit her is really gross.

OR

Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) feelings of jealousy and hatred of men are alive and well by many on this thread and B) victims of sexual assault accusations (not convictions) are incredibly brave to try to defend themselves against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this man (Kavanaugh) and attempted to discredit and convict him via one woman's accusations of attempted rape and suffocation after 30+ years is really gross.

MRA! MRA! MAGA!

How many victims will it take for you to believe, pp?

PP here. I"m female and not a Trump supporter; but I think it's wrong to accuse, condemn, and "convict" anyone of crimes as serious as attempted rape and suffocation (i.e., murder) based on one person's uncorroborated accusation after 30+ years.

Precisely how I feel too. For me, this really doesn't have much to do with Brett Kavanaugh, as I'm neutral when it comes to the subject of his confirmation. It has so much more to do with this one-sided accusation from decades ago. There is nothing fair about this.

Please explain how an accusation Ican be two-sided.

I think you know exactly what I meant, but here ya go - we're only hearing Ford's side. Kavanaugh flatly denies being involved at all. So all we have is her word against his.

The partisan will believe their side is right and the rest of the country will not pay attention. It does not look like the Dems will win the senate. Trump will most likely get another pick.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) misogyny is alive and well in this country and B) victims of sexual assault are incredibly brave to speak out against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this woman and attempted to discredit her is really gross.

OR

Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) feelings of jealousy and hatred of men are alive and well by many on this thread and B) victims of sexual assault accusations (not convictions) are incredibly brave to try to defend themselves against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this man (Kavanaugh) and attempted to discredit and convict him via one woman's accusations of attempted rape and suffocation after 30+ years is really gross.

MRA! MRA! MAGA!

How many victims will it take for you to believe, pp?

PP here. I"m female and not a Trump supporter; but I think it's wrong to accuse, condemn, and "convict" anyone of crimes as serious as attempted rape and suffocation (i.e., murder) based on one person's uncorroborated accusation after 30+ years.

Precisely how I feel too. For me, this really doesn't have much to do with Brett Kavanaugh, as I'm neutral when it comes to the subject of his confirmation. It has so much more to do with this one-sided accusation from decades ago. There is nothing fair about this.

Please explain how an accusation Ican be two-sided.

I think you know exactly what I meant, but here ya go - we're only hearing Ford's side. Kavanaugh flatly denies being involved at all. So all we have is her word against his.

That’s pretty much every sexual assault case ever. And if you know Kavanaugh is denying completely, you know his side. Most Americans are just reaching a different conclusion than you as to credibility.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) misogyny is alive and well in this country and B) victims of sexual assault are incredibly brave to speak out against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this woman and attempted to discredit her is really gross.

OR

Reading through some of these posts and reminded that A) feelings of jealousy and hatred of men are alive and well by many on this thread and B) victims of sexual assault accusations (not convictions) are incredibly brave to try to defend themselves against their attackers. The way some of the PPs have attacked this man (Kavanaugh) and attempted to discredit and convict him via one woman's accusations of attempted rape and suffocation after 30+ years is really gross.

So in your mind, women (and men) who defend the accuser’s right to be heard and not summarily dismissed and/or savaged and discredited equates to people who are jealous and hate men?

Okie dokie.

NOPE. Not what I said. I'm saying that I don't think the accused should be "savaged and discredited" either. And, yes, there have been a lot of DCUM posts on Kavanaugh threads that describe men--and Kavanaugh, in particular-- in an incredibly vile and negative way.

This may be news to you, but putting aside the sexual assault allegations, Kavanaugh has consistently treated women as second class citizens in his opinions. Most women don’t appreciate that. Shocking, I know.

PP here. A person's reputation, which can vary depending on the political, religious, cultural, etc. perspective of others, shouldn't be the determining factor re turning an accusation into a conviction by public opinion.

EXACTLY. "I don't like him / his politics, so he MUST be guilty!!" That's what so many of these posters are saying. Totally biased and having nothing to do with the actual allegation.

No one is saying that at all. It is the conservative posters who are trying to make this political.

Political? Do you happen to remember what Schumer, Feinstein, and others said when he was nominated?