“They won’t go to kindergarten in diapers!”…well, actually, they are.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have one kid with a motor disability and another with chronic constipation. I am certainly empathetic to parents but it is so ridiculous that this trend is increasing - kids with “special needs” and medical problems have always existed, and there are more treatment options, awareness, and support than ever before. It doesn’t explain why these problems are getting worse - the most likely explanation has to be parenting and changing social norms

+1 I have a child with a mild-moderate developmental disability -and he and his SN friends were ALL trained by 5. It was hard for some of us. I mean, these are kids where it’s questionable whether they’ll get a high school diploma due to cognition and behavior issues. Obviously there are physical impairments, extremely low tone, etc that affects these outcomes, but barring that I admit I’m having difficulty understanding this. As a parent of a SN child, my actual concern would be that this is actually abusing IDEA which comes back to harm SN kids and the principle of inclusion.

+100. Autism means you work really hard on the ADLs to maximize your child’s ability to be in the world and learn. Potty training is one of the key ADLs.

We have no idea what the issue is with the kids in the OP. We have no idea if there is a "trend" at all. We don't know if it's ASD, or something else. One thing I am sure of is that those parents are not sitting around thinking "phew, now we don't have to bother with potty training!"

+1000

These are parents who informed the school if the issue in May and made the effort to get a 504. Meaning they are putting quite a bit of time and effort into ensuring their kids will have access to school even if the potty training piece doesn't come by August.

Do any of these judgmental posters have any idea of how hard it is to tell a school "hi our 5 year old is not potty trained and will need an accommodations"? Knowing the judgment you will get even if you have a documented medical issue or a diagnosis? It sucks. People assume you are a failure and you FEEL like a failure. But you have to do it, set aside your ego, and make sure your kid gets what they need.

The ignorance and empathy failure in this thread is unreal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who will change them? Nurse?

No. The Nurse or Health Aide will take care of the children coming in for illness and/medications.

Former health aide in VA: changing diapers is not allowed and requires special licensing. We are unable to assist with potty accidents and are no longer allowed to store extra clothes in the health offices.

NP here. Who changes the diaper then? I do not believe this should be a job that falls to teachers. But also, I have sympathy for these kids/families because no one, just no one, wants to keep paying for huge pull ups and chasing around a 5 y/o with a dirty diaper. And they must be consulting with a doctor for the 504 plan (I doubt anyone is calling up a telehealth doc for this).

So assuming the teacher doesn’t have to change the diaper, I don’t really see how a child having a diaper under their clothes in case of an accident disrupts anything (in fact a diaper seems better than sending a kid to school to have an accident).

Hopefully the kid can manage to wipe themself and put on a new one by that age. If not, the nurse could call the parents to pick them up or change them same as any health issue like spiking a fever. OP didn’t mention she has been instructed to change the child’s diaper (unless I missed that in an earlier post).

This thread is filled with a lot of nastiness toward children who are likely struggling.

Elementary teachers legally can't change diapers most places and if the school is not certified as a daycare facility, neither can the nurse. So the 504 plans in these situations probably exist specifically to set up communication between the school and parents so they can be contacted if their child WITH A MEDICALLY DIAGNOSED CONSTIPATION ISSUE has an accident at school.

This scenario is GOOD for teachers, it means they'll have a plan in place so if the child has this medical issue, everyone will know how to handle and disruption will be minimal.

Thinking this means the teacher will be changing diapers, or that the fact that the parents obtained a 504, is a problem is pure ignorance. The parents are taking care of the issue for you and just alerting you to a medical concern. That's it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m deeply concerned that the kindergarten teacher who started this thread does not understand that the three children wearing diapers that she’s talking about do, in fact, have special needs of some kind. If they are getting 504 plans, they have medical or mental health diagnoses of some kind. It’s troubling that the teacher doesn’t understand that.

Why do you assume they have special needs? Some parents just don’t want to be bothered. You’ll see it more and more.

You need documentation of a disability to get a 504 plan.

You need to post things that you actually know about. Your statement is blatantly wrong. My kid can get a 504 for having a broken leg. That’s is not a disability and no documentation needs to be provided.

But the do need a diagnosis!! In your case, the diagnosis is a broken leg.

It’s not remotely the same hurdle as getting an IEP. Some random teledoc or urgent care person could write you what you need for a 504. It’s just not remotely comparable. If the kid is truly SN, they will have an IEP.

My child was diagnosed with ASD, ADHD and anxiety by the end of elementary school (with full neuropsych exam). We hired a consultant for the IEP process. Child still didn’t get an IEP. Child in high school now. Made another attempt at getting an IEP. Special Ed representative tried to discourage us at Child Find meeting from even having child undergo evaluations, saying child wouldn’t qualify. We pushed for school to do evaluations and child ultimately qualified. Even having documented disabilities doesn’t automatically get you an IEP. If these kids haven’t even started kindergarten yet, their parents haven’t had the time to jump through a lot of hoops and they may not have an extra $5k for private evaluation.

+1 my 5 yo has ASD. Thankfully DC did not have major issues with potty training.

Was only diagnosed with ASD after attending a $3k intensive therapy program for another issue which
led to a recommendation for a $5k private eval to get the diagnosis. None of the providers take insurance. And child will not be getting IEP
in K (we tried and also consulted advocate who said it wasn't going to happen).

The persistent claim on DCUM that all kids with disabilities are able to get IEPs in time for K or their disabilities are not real is offensive and a testament to the willful ignorance about disabilities and special ed among supposedly educated people.

SN mom here. If you child has focus or behavioral issues that keeps them from accessing the curriculum in K they will get an IEP. If your child is doing fine learning to read & write, doing circle time, lining up for recess, not hitting anyone or hiding under tables, they won’t get an IEP. In the DCUM crowd there are SN and there are “SN.”

These kids aren’t in Kindergarten yet, so no one knows how they will do. They might or might not get an IEP in K.

We had a child in our family who started public school with a 504. He had a life limiting auto-inflammatory condition and had at that point spent almost a year of his life in PICU. Toilet training was complicated because of all the time when he couldn’t get out of bed to make it to the bathroom, and because of fatigue and pain.

But he could do the things you list, sitting still (moving was the problem) and reading, so his disability was considered to not be educationally relevant.

Medical disabilities are real disabilities. Kids with them deserve as much support as kids with ASD do.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have one kid with a motor disability and another with chronic constipation. I am certainly empathetic to parents but it is so ridiculous that this trend is increasing - kids with “special needs” and medical problems have always existed, and there are more treatment options, awareness, and support than ever before. It doesn’t explain why these problems are getting worse - the most likely explanation has to be parenting and changing social norms

+1 I have a child with a mild-moderate developmental disability -and he and his SN friends were ALL trained by 5. It was hard for some of us. I mean, these are kids where it’s questionable whether they’ll get a high school diploma due to cognition and behavior issues. Obviously there are physical impairments, extremely low tone, etc that affects these outcomes, but barring that I admit I’m having difficulty understanding this. As a parent of a SN child, my actual concern would be that this is actually abusing IDEA which comes back to harm SN kids and the principle of inclusion.

+100. Autism means you work really hard on the ADLs to maximize your child’s ability to be in the world and learn. Potty training is one of the key ADLs.

We have no idea what the issue is with the kids in the OP. We have no idea if there is a "trend" at all. We don't know if it's ASD, or something else. One thing I am sure of is that those parents are not sitting around thinking "phew, now we don't have to bother with potty training!"

+1000

These are parents who informed the school if the issue in May and made the effort to get a 504. Meaning they are putting quite a bit of time and effort into ensuring their kids will have access to school even if the potty training piece doesn't come by August.

Do any of these judgmental posters have any idea of how hard it is to tell a school "hi our 5 year old is not potty trained and will need an accommodations"? Knowing the judgment you will get even if you have a documented medical issue or a diagnosis? It sucks. People assume you are a failure and you FEEL like a failure. But you have to do it, set aside your ego, and make sure your kid gets what they need.

The ignorance and empathy failure in this thread is unreal.

Yes, I understand your frustration. I am still not in support of asking teachers or administrators to change your child's diaper.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have one kid with a motor disability and another with chronic constipation. I am certainly empathetic to parents but it is so ridiculous that this trend is increasing - kids with “special needs” and medical problems have always existed, and there are more treatment options, awareness, and support than ever before. It doesn’t explain why these problems are getting worse - the most likely explanation has to be parenting and changing social norms

+1 I have a child with a mild-moderate developmental disability -and he and his SN friends were ALL trained by 5. It was hard for some of us. I mean, these are kids where it’s questionable whether they’ll get a high school diploma due to cognition and behavior issues. Obviously there are physical impairments, extremely low tone, etc that affects these outcomes, but barring that I admit I’m having difficulty understanding this. As a parent of a SN child, my actual concern would be that this is actually abusing IDEA which comes back to harm SN kids and the principle of inclusion.

+100. Autism means you work really hard on the ADLs to maximize your child’s ability to be in the world and learn. Potty training is one of the key ADLs.

We have no idea what the issue is with the kids in the OP. We have no idea if there is a "trend" at all. We don't know if it's ASD, or something else. One thing I am sure of is that those parents are not sitting around thinking "phew, now we don't have to bother with potty training!"

+1000

These are parents who informed the school if the issue in May and made the effort to get a 504. Meaning they are putting quite a bit of time and effort into ensuring their kids will have access to school even if the potty training piece doesn't come by August.

Do any of these judgmental posters have any idea of how hard it is to tell a school "hi our 5 year old is not potty trained and will need an accommodations"? Knowing the judgment you will get even if you have a documented medical issue or a diagnosis? It sucks. People assume you are a failure and you FEEL like a failure. But you have to do it, set aside your ego, and make sure your kid gets what they need.

The ignorance and empathy failure in this thread is unreal.

Yes, I understand your frustration. I am still not in support of asking teachers or administrators to change your child's diaper.

OP didn't share what, if anything, is being asked of the teachers in these 504 plans.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have one kid with a motor disability and another with chronic constipation. I am certainly empathetic to parents but it is so ridiculous that this trend is increasing - kids with “special needs” and medical problems have always existed, and there are more treatment options, awareness, and support than ever before. It doesn’t explain why these problems are getting worse - the most likely explanation has to be parenting and changing social norms

+1 I have a child with a mild-moderate developmental disability -and he and his SN friends were ALL trained by 5. It was hard for some of us. I mean, these are kids where it’s questionable whether they’ll get a high school diploma due to cognition and behavior issues. Obviously there are physical impairments, extremely low tone, etc that affects these outcomes, but barring that I admit I’m having difficulty understanding this. As a parent of a SN child, my actual concern would be that this is actually abusing IDEA which comes back to harm SN kids and the principle of inclusion.

+100. Autism means you work really hard on the ADLs to maximize your child’s ability to be in the world and learn. Potty training is one of the key ADLs.

We have no idea what the issue is with the kids in the OP. We have no idea if there is a "trend" at all. We don't know if it's ASD, or something else. One thing I am sure of is that those parents are not sitting around thinking "phew, now we don't have to bother with potty training!"

+1000

These are parents who informed the school if the issue in May and made the effort to get a 504. Meaning they are putting quite a bit of time and effort into ensuring their kids will have access to school even if the potty training piece doesn't come by August.

Do any of these judgmental posters have any idea of how hard it is to tell a school "hi our 5 year old is not potty trained and will need an accommodations"? Knowing the judgment you will get even if you have a documented medical issue or a diagnosis? It sucks. People assume you are a failure and you FEEL like a failure. But you have to do it, set aside your ego, and make sure your kid gets what they need.

The ignorance and empathy failure in this thread is unreal.

We do have empathy. For the teachers and aides (and frankly, other students) who are already dealing with far too much.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have one kid with a motor disability and another with chronic constipation. I am certainly empathetic to parents but it is so ridiculous that this trend is increasing - kids with “special needs” and medical problems have always existed, and there are more treatment options, awareness, and support than ever before. It doesn’t explain why these problems are getting worse - the most likely explanation has to be parenting and changing social norms

+1 I have a child with a mild-moderate developmental disability -and he and his SN friends were ALL trained by 5. It was hard for some of us. I mean, these are kids where it’s questionable whether they’ll get a high school diploma due to cognition and behavior issues. Obviously there are physical impairments, extremely low tone, etc that affects these outcomes, but barring that I admit I’m having difficulty understanding this. As a parent of a SN child, my actual concern would be that this is actually abusing IDEA which comes back to harm SN kids and the principle of inclusion.

+100. Autism means you work really hard on the ADLs to maximize your child’s ability to be in the world and learn. Potty training is one of the key ADLs.

We have no idea what the issue is with the kids in the OP. We have no idea if there is a "trend" at all. We don't know if it's ASD, or something else. One thing I am sure of is that those parents are not sitting around thinking "phew, now we don't have to bother with potty training!"

+1000

These are parents who informed the school if the issue in May and made the effort to get a 504. Meaning they are putting quite a bit of time and effort into ensuring their kids will have access to school even if the potty training piece doesn't come by August.

Do any of these judgmental posters have any idea of how hard it is to tell a school "hi our 5 year old is not potty trained and will need an accommodations"? Knowing the judgment you will get even if you have a documented medical issue or a diagnosis? It sucks. People assume you are a failure and you FEEL like a failure. But you have to do it, set aside your ego, and make sure your kid gets what they need.

The ignorance and empathy failure in this thread is unreal.

We do have empathy. For the teachers and aides (and frankly, other students) who are already dealing with far too much.

Nope, bashing parents is not empathy for teachers. Again, we don't even know what the 504 plan is asking teachers to do. I am guessing if they were asking the teachers to change diapers, OP would have said so.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who will change them? Nurse?

No. The Nurse or Health Aide will take care of the children coming in for illness and/medications.

Former health aide in VA: changing diapers is not allowed and requires special licensing. We are unable to assist with potty accidents and are no longer allowed to store extra clothes in the health offices.

NP here. Who changes the diaper then? I do not believe this should be a job that falls to teachers. But also, I have sympathy for these kids/families because no one, just no one, wants to keep paying for huge pull ups and chasing around a 5 y/o with a dirty diaper. And they must be consulting with a doctor for the 504 plan (I doubt anyone is calling up a telehealth doc for this).

So assuming the teacher doesn’t have to change the diaper, I don’t really see how a child having a diaper under their clothes in case of an accident disrupts anything (in fact a diaper seems better than sending a kid to school to have an accident).

Hopefully the kid can manage to wipe themself and put on a new one by that age. If not, the nurse could call the parents to pick them up or change them same as any health issue like spiking a fever. OP didn’t mention she has been instructed to change the child’s diaper (unless I missed that in an earlier post).

This thread is filled with a lot of nastiness toward children who are likely struggling.

Cleaning up a child with a poopy diaper is a difficult job even for an experienced parent with a cooperative child. It’s not a couple quick wipes and you’re done. That’s only what happens if the kid actually uses the toilet.

Teachers, aides and school nurses did not sign up for this and may not even be parents who have had any experience with it. Adding it to their list of duties is completely unreasonable and will just drive more of them out of our schools.

[Anonymous]

I 100% guarantee you that if this is a public school, the teachers are not being asked to change diapers and in fact are not permitted to do so. Which, if OP is actually a teacher, she would know. I could see potentially a private school having the right licensing to do diapering if they have a preschool program that that starts young, though most private elementaries will not bother with this.

Literally what OP is complaining about is the mere existence of kindergarteners in diapers, as though this by itself indicates some kind of breakdown in society. OP acknowledges the parents in this situation have obtained 504s and the the diapers are for a medical issues (constipation).

IF this is a trend (and there is zero indication in this thread that it is, I am not even convinced OP actually works at a school and is not just a troll trying to stir up some pearl clutching over late potty training), it is related to constipation in kids. Not "lazy parents who refuse to potty train." A lazy parent who refuses to potty train is not alerting the school to the issue four months in advance, or getting a diagnosis of constipation from a physician that would enable a 504. There is a lot more awareness of constipation in kids now and more efforts to actually treat the issues rather than ignore it. It's entirely likely that the reason these kids are in diapers is because they are currently being treated for constipation, are on a daily laxative dose, and their doctors/parents are not confident that the constipation will be resolved before they start K so are using diapers specifically to AVOID the children having poop accidents or leaks at school.

But apparently some of you think that children with medical issues should simply be kept home and are not entitled to an education? Okay, good luck with that, the law says otherwise.

[Anonymous]

^ and it especially won’t be a clean job if you’re talking about diarrhea from constipation and other “medical excuses” that people are coming up with as justification for sending kids to school in diapers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who will change them? Nurse?

No. The Nurse or Health Aide will take care of the children coming in for illness and/medications.

Former health aide in VA: changing diapers is not allowed and requires special licensing. We are unable to assist with potty accidents and are no longer allowed to store extra clothes in the health offices.

NP here. Who changes the diaper then? I do not believe this should be a job that falls to teachers. But also, I have sympathy for these kids/families because no one, just no one, wants to keep paying for huge pull ups and chasing around a 5 y/o with a dirty diaper. And they must be consulting with a doctor for the 504 plan (I doubt anyone is calling up a telehealth doc for this).

So assuming the teacher doesn’t have to change the diaper, I don’t really see how a child having a diaper under their clothes in case of an accident disrupts anything (in fact a diaper seems better than sending a kid to school to have an accident).

Hopefully the kid can manage to wipe themself and put on a new one by that age. If not, the nurse could call the parents to pick them up or change them same as any health issue like spiking a fever. OP didn’t mention she has been instructed to change the child’s diaper (unless I missed that in an earlier post).

This thread is filled with a lot of nastiness toward children who are likely struggling.

Cleaning up a child with a poopy diaper is a difficult job even for an experienced parent with a cooperative child. It’s not a couple quick wipes and you’re done. That’s only what happens if the kid actually uses the toilet.

Teachers, aides and school nurses did not sign up for this and may not even be parents who have had any experience with it. Adding it to their list of duties is completely unreasonable and will just drive more of them out of our schools.

Teachers, aides, and school nurses are not expected to, and in fact are not allowed to, change a child's diaper. There is no indication that the OP or any teacher is being asked to change diapers. This is a made up narrative designed to whip off conflict between teachers and parents of kids with special needs. Those of you playing into it are either trolls or very gullible.

No one is asking teachers to change poopy diapers. No one. The 504 in these cases exists not just to permit the child to wear a diaper to school but to create a procedure for the school to follow if the child needs assistance with a diaper (which they may not, the kids may simply be wearing the diaper as a failsafe just in case they have a poop accident due to underlying medical issues, specifically to avoid the possibility of an unsanitary event in the classroom).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^ and it especially won’t be a clean job if you’re talking about diarrhea from constipation and other “medical excuses” that people are coming up with as justification for sending kids to school in diapers.

"coming up with" = consulting with a doctor about and obtaining a formal diagnosis.

So many of you are eager to believe that lots of parents WANT to send their kids to school in diapers or are willing to go to bizarre lengths to avoid teaching a 5 year old how to use the potty (something that is incredibly useful/convenient to parents, even a parent who might initially avoid/resist potty training).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:^ and it especially won’t be a clean job if you’re talking about diarrhea from constipation and other “medical excuses” that people are coming up with as justification for sending kids to school in diapers.

You need to pick a lane. Either it's something parents made up as a medical excuse, or it's a real thing causing diarrhea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m deeply concerned that the kindergarten teacher who started this thread does not understand that the three children wearing diapers that she’s talking about do, in fact, have special needs of some kind. If they are getting 504 plans, they have medical or mental health diagnoses of some kind. It’s troubling that the teacher doesn’t understand that.

Why do you assume they have special needs? Some parents just don’t want to be bothered. You’ll see it more and more.

You need documentation of a disability to get a 504 plan.

You need to post things that you actually know about. Your statement is blatantly wrong. My kid can get a 504 for having a broken leg. That’s is not a disability and no documentation needs to be provided.

But the do need a diagnosis!! In your case, the diagnosis is a broken leg.

It’s not remotely the same hurdle as getting an IEP. Some random teledoc or urgent care person could write you what you need for a 504. It’s just not remotely comparable. If the kid is truly SN, they will have an IEP.

My child was diagnosed with ASD, ADHD and anxiety by the end of elementary school (with full neuropsych exam). We hired a consultant for the IEP process. Child still didn’t get an IEP. Child in high school now. Made another attempt at getting an IEP. Special Ed representative tried to discourage us at Child Find meeting from even having child undergo evaluations, saying child wouldn’t qualify. We pushed for school to do evaluations and child ultimately qualified. Even having documented disabilities doesn’t automatically get you an IEP. If these kids haven’t even started kindergarten yet, their parents haven’t had the time to jump through a lot of hoops and they may not have an extra $5k for private evaluation.

+1 my 5 yo has ASD. Thankfully DC did not have major issues with potty training.

Was only diagnosed with ASD after attending a $3k intensive therapy program for another issue which
led to a recommendation for a $5k private eval to get the diagnosis. None of the providers take insurance. And child will not be getting IEP
in K (we tried and also consulted advocate who said it wasn't going to happen).

The persistent claim on DCUM that all kids with disabilities are able to get IEPs in time for K or their disabilities are not real is offensive and a testament to the willful ignorance about disabilities and special ed among supposedly educated people.

SN mom here. If you child has focus or behavioral issues that keeps them from accessing the curriculum in K they will get an IEP. If your child is doing fine learning to read & write, doing circle time, lining up for recess, not hitting anyone or hiding under tables, they won’t get an IEP. In the DCUM crowd there are SN and there are “SN.”

My kid had focus problems that prevented her from accessing the curriculum in grades 1-9 and didn’t get an IEP. In 10th grade, she was getting C’s and D’s and we were told she was doing well and wouldn’t qualify. We insisted on the school evaluating her and she finally got an IEP on our 3rd attempt at getting her one. Maybe some kids are just handed IEPs but that was absolutely not our experience.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who will change them? Nurse?

No. The Nurse or Health Aide will take care of the children coming in for illness and/medications.

Former health aide in VA: changing diapers is not allowed and requires special licensing. We are unable to assist with potty accidents and are no longer allowed to store extra clothes in the health offices.

What is the reasoning behind banning extra clothing?