“They won’t go to kindergarten in diapers!”…well, actually, they are.

[Anonymous]

Another thought/question:

Do a lot of kids today use iPads while they are sitting on the toilet?

I wonder if that is contributing to toilet issues?

I know as an adult, I've read that it's healthiest to sit, do your business, and go, without sitting there forever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:My siblings and I were raised in traditional cloth diapers before the advent of disposable ones. All potty-trained before age 2, according to my mom.

WTF is the issue here?

In my experience as a special Ed teacher, constipation issues seem to be common in kids with autism. There are also other factors that may make toilet training hard for kids with ASD (loud flushing, reluctance to use public bathrooms). Many more students with autism are mainstreamed now because they have average to above average intelligence and can be successful in the mainstream classroom. The schools need more staff to make this all doable.

No they don’t. Autism is not actually a reason not to work to potty train by five.

No one said kids with autism shouldn't potty train before 5. They (a special ed teacher, so someone who would know) said that toilet training can be harder for ASD kids. Meaning it could take longer. An ASD kid might start kindergarten in diapers despite working on toile training for years prior.

My kid trained at 4 after years of working on it. And among the obstacles were a seeming inability to know when peeing was urgent, a rigid refusal to interrupt an activity to use the toilet, and intense fear of using a regular toilet (as well as fear of flushing, fear of wiping, and definitely fear of using any toilet outside our house). Also severely picky eating that can cause digestive issues.

Guess what diagnosis my kid got at 6?

And you made an effort and trained your kid at 4.

And my kid has a milder form of autism and the sensory issues were easier for me to overcome than some of the traits of more complex ASD cases when it came to toilet training. Most people don't realize my kid has ASD when they meet her and our K teacher was skeptical about the diagnosis because she has no academic challenges and she uses advanced verbal skills to mask social challenges and negative behaviors. The belief that all kids with ASD who aren't toilet trained by four had parents who just failed to "power through" is BS.

The point is that when we were struggling with toilet training, no one gave us any grace or considered our child light have been tougher to train. I blamed myself a lot and bought into the idea that it was my fault. It was only after diagnosis, the summer between K and 1st, that I realized that the phobic behaviors and rigidity we had encountered were more than just a "threenager" or normal toddler resistance.

and yet you DID potty train before K.

Yes but the a child with a less mild presentation of autism might be harder to potty train and therefore it might take longer. That's the point. Not every child is the same. My child trained at 4 and plenty of people thought this was evidence of "laziness" or other failure on my part even though I was working very hard to potty train my child. Turns out she has a neurological issue that made it harder, even though her presentation is very mild and at the time we though she was just "strong willed" or that we had done Oh Crap wrong.

I know many kids with ASD who have more severe presentations and could easily see them getting to kindergarten without being fully potty trained. Also one thing that can happen with ASD kids is that transitions are extra hard and you are more likely to see a regression in something like potty training due to the stress of starting a new school or a new classroom environment. My own kid had a lot of pee accidents in K despite having been toilet trained for a year because the stress of the higher behavioral and academic expectations in the K classroom triggered some of her ASD behaviors including becoming non-communicative or refusing to interrupt an activity to use the bathroom. So I would also assume this would be more likely in a child with a more severe ASD presentation, and you might choose to start K in diapers to ease that transition if they'd only recently trained.

Some of you are just convinced that the only reason a child would not be toilet trained by K is lazy parenting and are ready to ignore all evidence that SN parents tend to be among the least lazy parents because they cannot afford to be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m a K teacher and we just had our grouping meeting with the principal where we place kids into classes for next year.

There are 3 children coming in diapers…and they do not have special needs. Parents are getting 504 for constipation and diapering their kids.

So all those sayings year after year, “don’t rush! They’ll do it on their own time! No one goes to K in diapers!”…actually, they do now.

You say they don't have special needs - but then say they're eligible for 504. Ergo, they do have a medical condition. Do you honestly think this is what the parents *want*??

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Another thought/question:
[/b]
Do a lot of kids today use iPads while they are sitting on the toilet?[b]

I wonder if that is contributing to toilet issues?

I know as an adult, I've read that it's healthiest to sit, do your business, and go, without sitting there forever.

WTAF. No they don’t take an iPad to the bathroom. That’s disgusting

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:Who will change them? Nurse?

No. The Nurse or Health Aide will take care of the children coming in for illness and/medications.

Former health aide in VA: changing diapers is not allowed and requires special licensing. We are unable to assist with potty accidents and are no longer allowed to store extra clothes in the health offices.

What is the reasoning behind banning extra clothing?

Dp. My kid in FCPS has extra clothes at school for accidents. Maybe they’re not kept in the heath office but extra clothing is not banned.

When my kid was in 3rd grade, someone else spilled their drink all over her shirt. She was loaned a sweatshirt from the health room. I washed it and returned it. Wondering why that’s not allowed anymore.

In LCPS this is how it’s done. We keep stuff from the lost and found that isn’t claimed by the end of the year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another thought/question:
[/b]
Do a lot of kids today use iPads while they are sitting on the toilet?[b]

I wonder if that is contributing to toilet issues?

I know as an adult, I've read that it's healthiest to sit, do your business, and go, without sitting there forever.

WTAF. No they don’t take an iPad to the bathroom. That’s disgusting

I certainly hope not but if they are, I hope they are disinfecting after. Gross.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another thought/question:
[/b]
Do a lot of kids today use iPads while they are sitting on the toilet?[b]

I wonder if that is contributing to toilet issues?

I know as an adult, I've read that it's healthiest to sit, do your business, and go, without sitting there forever.

WTAF. No they don’t take an iPad to the bathroom. That’s disgusting

Not nearly as disgusting as taking them to the dinner table!

[Anonymous]

No teacher or teacher's aide should have to change a disport on a 4 year old + child. This is just disgusting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No teacher or teacher's aide should have to change a disport on a 4 year old + child. This is just disgusting.

They don't have to and actually are not allowed to but thanks for not bothering to read the thread and deciding to post anyway, you've really contributed to the discourse here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I 100% guarantee you that if this is a public school, the teachers are not being asked to change diapers and in fact are not permitted to do so. Which, if OP is actually a teacher, she would know. I could see potentially a private school having the right licensing to do diapering if they have a preschool program that that starts young, though most private elementaries will not bother with this.

Literally what OP is complaining about is the mere existence of kindergarteners in diapers, as though this by itself indicates some kind of breakdown in society. OP acknowledges the parents in this situation have obtained 504s and the the diapers are for a medical issues (constipation).

IF this is a trend (and there is zero indication in this thread that it is, I am not even convinced OP actually works at a school and is not just a troll trying to stir up some pearl clutching over late potty training), it is related to constipation in kids. Not "lazy parents who refuse to potty train." A lazy parent who refuses to potty train is not alerting the school to the issue four months in advance, or getting a diagnosis of constipation from a physician that would enable a 504. There is a lot more awareness of constipation in kids now and more efforts to actually treat the issues rather than ignore it. It's entirely likely that the reason these kids are in diapers is because they are currently being treated for constipation, are on a daily laxative dose, and their doctors/parents are not confident that the constipation will be resolved before they start K so are using diapers specifically to AVOID the children having poop accidents or leaks at school.

But apparently some of you think that children with medical issues should simply be kept home and are not entitled to an education? Okay, good luck with that, the law says otherwise.

How would she know? I teach kindergarten and I don’t know. My own kid has a bathroom accident in pre-k as and I was called to clean him up.

Well, first, if you are a kindergarten teacher you should be aware that it is likely not legal for you to change a students' diaper. You're welcome for this basic information about your job.

But also, if your own experience as a parent was that you were called to take care of a bathroom accident for a pre-k child, then why would you think the expectation for you as a kindergarten teacher would be to change one of your students. Shouldn't you be able to put two and two together and realize "oh, if one of my students had a bathroom accident, I probably just need to contact their parents to come handle just as my own child's pre-k teacher did"? Like where is the disconnect here.

As a kindergarten teacher, have you ever been expected to clean up a poop accident or do any more than facilitate a child changing into another set of clothes (likely provided by the parents) in the event of a pee accident?

My DS was in a private preschool and I teach in a public school. Apples and oranges.

We keep wipes at school in case of accidents. I highly doubt we could call a parent and expect them to come in to clean up an accident in public school. Many of my parents don’t answer the phone during the day or even have working phone numbers so I doubt they’d come in anyway.

Just did a quick Google search and it looks like kindergarten teachers and paras in MD (or a designee) have the joint responsibility of toileting kids but it doesn’t go into details. It also says kids cannot be excluded from school if they cannot use the toilet independently.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:I’m deeply concerned that the kindergarten teacher who started this thread does not understand that the three children wearing diapers that she’s talking about do, in fact, have special needs of some kind. If they are getting 504 plans, they have medical or mental health diagnoses of some kind. It’s troubling that the teacher doesn’t understand that.

Why do you assume they have special needs? Some parents just don’t want to be bothered. You’ll see it more and more.

You need documentation of a disability to get a 504 plan.

You need to post things that you actually know about. Your statement is blatantly wrong. My kid can get a 504 for having a broken leg. That’s is not a disability and no documentation needs to be provided.

But the do need a diagnosis!! In your case, the diagnosis is a broken leg.

It’s not remotely the same hurdle as getting an IEP. Some random teledoc or urgent care person could write you what you need for a 504. It’s just not remotely comparable. If the kid is truly SN, they will have an IEP.

My child was diagnosed with ASD, ADHD and anxiety by the end of elementary school (with full neuropsych exam). We hired a consultant for the IEP process. Child still didn’t get an IEP. Child in high school now. Made another attempt at getting an IEP. Special Ed representative tried to discourage us at Child Find meeting from even having child undergo evaluations, saying child wouldn’t qualify. We pushed for school to do evaluations and child ultimately qualified. Even having documented disabilities doesn’t automatically get you an IEP. If these kids haven’t even started kindergarten yet, their parents haven’t had the time to jump through a lot of hoops and they may not have an extra $5k for private evaluation.

+1 my 5 yo has ASD. Thankfully DC did not have major issues with potty training.

Was only diagnosed with ASD after attending a $3k intensive therapy program for another issue which
led to a recommendation for a $5k private eval to get the diagnosis. None of the providers take insurance. And child will not be getting IEP
in K (we tried and also consulted advocate who said it wasn't going to happen).

The persistent claim on DCUM that all kids with disabilities are able to get IEPs in time for K or their disabilities are not real is offensive and a testament to the willful ignorance about disabilities and special ed among supposedly educated people.

SN mom here. If you child has focus or behavioral issues that keeps them from accessing the curriculum in K they will get an IEP. If your child is doing fine learning to read & write, doing circle time, lining up for recess, not hitting anyone or hiding under tables, they won’t get an IEP. In the DCUM crowd there are SN and there are “SN.”

Yes, unfortunately many "SN" moms that post on DCUM are just here to bash other parents and never got the message that not all disabilities are visible to you. Just because a child isn't bothering teachers or disrupting class does not mean they are not struggling.

If your child is keeping up academically and behaviorally they don’t qualify for an IEP. End of story.

Okay?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I 100% guarantee you that if this is a public school, the teachers are not being asked to change diapers and in fact are not permitted to do so. Which, if OP is actually a teacher, she would know. I could see potentially a private school having the right licensing to do diapering if they have a preschool program that that starts young, though most private elementaries will not bother with this.

Literally what OP is complaining about is the mere existence of kindergarteners in diapers, as though this by itself indicates some kind of breakdown in society. OP acknowledges the parents in this situation have obtained 504s and the the diapers are for a medical issues (constipation).

IF this is a trend (and there is zero indication in this thread that it is, I am not even convinced OP actually works at a school and is not just a troll trying to stir up some pearl clutching over late potty training), it is related to constipation in kids. Not "lazy parents who refuse to potty train." A lazy parent who refuses to potty train is not alerting the school to the issue four months in advance, or getting a diagnosis of constipation from a physician that would enable a 504. There is a lot more awareness of constipation in kids now and more efforts to actually treat the issues rather than ignore it. It's entirely likely that the reason these kids are in diapers is because they are currently being treated for constipation, are on a daily laxative dose, and their doctors/parents are not confident that the constipation will be resolved before they start K so are using diapers specifically to AVOID the children having poop accidents or leaks at school.

But apparently some of you think that children with medical issues should simply be kept home and are not entitled to an education? Okay, good luck with that, the law says otherwise.

How would she know? I teach kindergarten and I don’t know. My own kid has a bathroom accident in pre-k as and I was called to clean him up.

Well, first, if you are a kindergarten teacher you should be aware that it is likely not legal for you to change a students' diaper. You're welcome for this basic information about your job.

But also, if your own experience as a parent was that you were called to take care of a bathroom accident for a pre-k child, then why would you think the expectation for you as a kindergarten teacher would be to change one of your students. Shouldn't you be able to put two and two together and realize "oh, if one of my students had a bathroom accident, I probably just need to contact their parents to come handle just as my own child's pre-k teacher did"? Like where is the disconnect here.

As a kindergarten teacher, have you ever been expected to clean up a poop accident or do any more than facilitate a child changing into another set of clothes (likely provided by the parents) in the event of a pee accident?

My DS was in a private preschool and I teach in a public school. Apples and oranges.

We keep wipes at school in case of accidents. I highly doubt we could call a parent and expect them to come in to clean up an accident in public school. Many of my parents don’t answer the phone during the day or even have working phone numbers so I doubt they’d come in anyway.

Just did a quick Google search and it looks like kindergarten teachers and paras in MD (or a designee) have the joint responsibility of toileting kids but it doesn’t go into details. It also says kids cannot be excluded from school if they cannot use the toilet independently.

I know in PG County public schools, teachers can help with occasional pee accidents (cleaning up and changing clothes) but if a student has frequent accidents or is not independent with toileting generally, the school is required to have a meeting with the parents and create a personal care management plan for the child. If you have a 504 for toileting this is part of the process as well.

I don't think you can force a teacher to clean up poop, and I personally have never heard of a teacher having to do this. I think at our school likely either a SN aide would do this or they'd arrange with the parents to come in to do it. MD might not explicitly ban teachers from doing it but I've never, ever heard of it being required, and our school has a lot of kids with SNs and has definitely had kids in general ed in diapers, especially in K and 1st.

[Anonymous]

It just shows that kids start school too early in the US.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It just shows that kids start school too early in the US.

No it shows some parents suck and have absolutely failed their kids.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Who will change them? Nurse?

No. The Nurse or Health Aide will take care of the children coming in for illness and/medications.

Former health aide in VA: changing diapers is not allowed and requires special licensing. We are unable to assist with potty accidents and are no longer allowed to store extra clothes in the health offices.

What is the reasoning behind banning extra clothing?

Dp. My kid in FCPS has extra clothes at school for accidents. Maybe they’re not kept in the heath office but extra clothing is not banned.

When my kid was in 3rd grade, someone else spilled their drink all over her shirt. She was loaned a sweatshirt from the health room. I washed it and returned it. Wondering why that’s not allowed anymore.

In LCPS this is how it’s done. We keep stuff from the lost and found that isn’t claimed by the end of the year.

PP former health aide - should clarify FCPS. Important to note that health rooms is staffed by the county health department and not FCPS. So the nurse and aide are county employees.

No back up/extra clothing was to be stored in the health rooms because potty accidents aren’t in the purview of aide and aren’t a medical necessity- role of health room is only to provide care of sick and injured, provide emergency care and deliver daily, as needed and prescribed meds - oh - and document all care.

Decades ago, you could go to “the nurse” if you had a wardrobe malfunction (she’d give you a safety pin), got gum in your hair (she’d likely get it out with a dollop of peanut butter) or maybe needed a drink of water.

Aides are beholden to their training manual and protocols: if a providers or condition isn’t included in the manual, it truly can’t be done.

Front office hates us for this but if a kid has a potty accident, we send them back to the main office for the extra clothes. I’d allow kid to change in the clinic bathroom.