s/o New understanding of Harry & Meghan

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think M and H were jealous they didn’t receive the household budget that W&K did. He mentions it several times in the book - how much nicer Will’s house and furnishings are. But I don’t think it bothered Harry until Meghan came along.

Come on, if a parent treat 2 kids differently, do you expect they not be upset?

In that family? It’s pretty standard for the heir. They were given Frogmore and the honor a royal tour. Which they then acted like was a huge imposition.

Frogmore, the house that requires a full gut job and renovation. The costs in which Harry and Meghan paid, and they still don’t get the use of.

In contrast, look at the huge house Princess Anne was given when she got married, same for Edward and Andrew. None of these people were heirs but the Queen gave them huge properties when they got married. Giving Harry Frogmore was an intentional slight for choosing a biracial wife. If she had been white, he would have been given a nicer home.

The comparison isn't Harry to Anne, it's Harry to his other cousins. What did Beatrice, Eugenie, Peter, Zara, etc get from the queen when they got married? Anne is a child of the monarch, the rest are all grandchildren. I don't think any of them got sweeping estates.

I think that Peter and Zara have houses on Anne’s estate. I also think that Anne owns Gatcombe Park outright, so presumably Peter and Zara are in a position to inherit it.

I get making the comparison of Harry to his cousins, but keep in mind too, that Harry was a full time working Royal, and his wife Meghan was expected to be as well — unlike Harry’s cousins and their spouses. While his cousins had opportunities to create their own careers and income, Harry and Meghan were expected to represent the crown for life. Given the enormous and presumably life-long restrictions that went along with that, it stands out—to me, at least — that Harry and Meghan were treated quite differently from the other working royals, starting with their housing.

I hope that they were repaid all that they spent to renovate Frogmore Cottage.

Well, now compare Charles to his siblings. Is it Even Steven? This is Harry's world, how did he not anticipate how this would go? And I wound't say "quite differently" they all live with their parents or in much less desirable housing than what Harry had.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Regarding Meghan's expectations upon marrying into the BRF and moving to the UK, I think she thought she was clear-eyed about it because the process of dating Harry, and the security concerns and privacy issues associated with dating him, plus the hoops she had to jump through to get engaged, and she made it through that. I think she thought it would get easier after that, and was surprised when it got worse.

I also think regarding racism, I think Meghan had experienced it in the US (in Hollywood it's part and parcel) but in the US, being beautiful and well-educated goes a looooong way to sort of forcing people to treat you equally. On top of that, she became famous and successful in a field where few people make it. So she was used to being rewarded for hard work and efforts to fit in, even if she also encountered racism.

In the UK and the rest of Europe, there is a LOT more of the brand of racism that you used to see in the US (and still do in certain places) where blackness is viewed as inherently inferior. Any amount of blackness ("one drop" racism). I think that was honestly shocking to Meghan, and deeply hurtful after growing up in California and working in Hollywood, where those attitudes are just not like that anymore. There is a still a tendency to exoticize all women of color, and black people (including biracial people) are still not given the same leeway in making mistakes or being flawed that white people are. But you can be black or biracial in California and not experience daily, offensive, racism that makes it clear people simply do not believe you deserve (or will ever deserve) to be in the same place as a white person. But that kind of racism is alive and well in Europe, unfortunately.

I’m applauding your extremely well thought out post!

One thing that has long stood out to me is that Meghan’s first meeting with Harry’s extended family was the event where Princess Michael chose to flauntingly wear her “blackamoor “ brooch. That type of racist effrontery would have been both impossible to anticipate and difficult for even the most clear-eyed person — not yet a member of the family— to anticipate.

[Anonymous]

I'm on another forum, and on a thread about Kate/photoshop pic there is one person who continually just posts anti H+M stuff. Calling them (us? the public?) hypocrites because meghan lightens her skin or something. Like it's this persons JOB to turn every mildly negative conversation about BRF/W+K into an attack on H+M. So bizarre.

I always believed that the BRF planted stories about H+M and have been manipulating the press behind the scenes. It's even more clear now.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think M and H were jealous they didn’t receive the household budget that W&K did. He mentions it several times in the book - how much nicer Will’s house and furnishings are. But I don’t think it bothered Harry until Meghan came along.

Come on, if a parent treat 2 kids differently, do you expect they not be upset?

In that family? It’s pretty standard for the heir. They were given Frogmore and the honor a royal tour. Which they then acted like was a huge imposition.

Frogmore, the house that requires a full gut job and renovation. The costs in which Harry and Meghan paid, and they still don’t get the use of.

In contrast, look at the huge house Princess Anne was given when she got married, same for Edward and Andrew. None of these people were heirs but the Queen gave them huge properties when they got married. Giving Harry Frogmore was an intentional slight for choosing a biracial wife. If she had been white, he would have been given a nicer home.

The comparison isn't Harry to Anne, it's Harry to his other cousins. What did Beatrice, Eugenie, Peter, Zara, etc get from the queen when they got married? Anne is a child of the monarch, the rest are all grandchildren. I don't think any of them got sweeping estates.

I think that Peter and Zara have houses on Anne’s estate. I also think that Anne owns Gatcombe Park outright, so presumably Peter and Zara are in a position to inherit it.

I get making the comparison of Harry to his cousins, but keep in mind too, that Harry was a full time working Royal, and his wife Meghan was expected to be as well — unlike Harry’s cousins and their spouses. While his cousins had opportunities to create their own careers and income, Harry and Meghan were expected to represent the crown for life. Given the enormous and presumably life-long restrictions that went along with that, it stands out—to me, at least — that Harry and Meghan were treated quite differently from the other working royals, starting with their housing.

I hope that they were repaid all that they spent to renovate Frogmore Cottage.

Well, now compare Charles to his siblings. Is it Even Steven? This is Harry's world, how did he not anticipate how this would go? And I wound't say "quite differently" they all live with their parents or in much less desirable housing than what Harry had.

No, it wasn’t even, and I doubt that Harry expected that it would be, given that William would be expected to have access to properties as the eventual Prince of Wales and future King. He probably did anticipate that when he married he would get the sort of housing that other full time working royals in his family were given when they married. Why would he imagine that he’d be treated differently?

As to the next bit, please elaborate. Harry had temporary use of a tiny cottage at Kensington palace (which at different points William and other families also used). And a ramshackle group of houses scheduled for renovations, which he and Meghan renovated back into a single family home. If you’re going to talk about the “much less desirable housing” of his cousins, it would help a lot if you could be more specific — especially when “live with their parents” can mean having an enormous house on the grounds of an even more enormous estate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think M and H were jealous they didn’t receive the household budget that W&K did. He mentions it several times in the book - how much nicer Will’s house and furnishings are. But I don’t think it bothered Harry until Meghan came along.

Come on, if a parent treat 2 kids differently, do you expect they not be upset?

In that family? It’s pretty standard for the heir. They were given Frogmore and the honor a royal tour. Which they then acted like was a huge imposition.

Frogmore, the house that requires a full gut job and renovation. The costs in which Harry and Meghan paid, and they still don’t get the use of.

In contrast, look at the huge house Princess Anne was given when she got married, same for Edward and Andrew. None of these people were heirs but the Queen gave them huge properties when they got married. Giving Harry Frogmore was an intentional slight for choosing a biracial wife. If she had been white, he would have been given a nicer home.

The comparison isn't Harry to Anne, it's Harry to his other cousins. What did Beatrice, Eugenie, Peter, Zara, etc get from the queen when they got married? Anne is a child of the monarch, the rest are all grandchildren. I don't think any of them got sweeping estates.

I think that Peter and Zara have houses on Anne’s estate. I also think that Anne owns Gatcombe Park outright, so presumably Peter and Zara are in a position to inherit it.

I get making the comparison of Harry to his cousins, but keep in mind too, that Harry was a full time working Royal, and his wife Meghan was expected to be as well — unlike Harry’s cousins and their spouses. While his cousins had opportunities to create their own careers and income, Harry and Meghan were expected to represent the crown for life. Given the enormous and presumably life-long restrictions that went along with that, it stands out—to me, at least — that Harry and Meghan were treated quite differently from the other working royals, starting with their housing.

I hope that they were repaid all that they spent to renovate Frogmore Cottage.

Well, now compare Charles to his siblings. Is it Even Steven? This is Harry's world, how did he not anticipate how this would go? And I wound't say "quite differently" they all live with their parents or in much less desirable housing than what Harry had.

No, it wasn’t even, and I doubt that Harry expected that it would be, given that William would be expected to have access to properties as the eventual Prince of Wales and future King. He probably did anticipate that when he married he would get the sort of housing that other full time working royals in his family were given when they married. Why would he imagine that he’d be treated differently?

As to the next bit, please elaborate. Harry had temporary use of a tiny cottage at Kensington palace (which at different points William and other families also used). And a ramshackle group of houses scheduled for renovations, which he and Meghan renovated back into a single family home. If you’re going to talk about the “much less desirable housing” of his cousins, it would help a lot if you could be more specific — especially when “live with their parents” can mean having an enormous house on the grounds of an even more enormous estate.

The other FT working royals were children of the Queen. Harry is not, he was a grandson. He got what other grandchildren got who weren't his brother.

Beatrice bought her own house and Eugenie doesn't even live in the UK. Peter and Zara live on their mother's property and Edward's kids are minors, set to get nothing when they marry.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think M and H were jealous they didn’t receive the household budget that W&K did. He mentions it several times in the book - how much nicer Will’s house and furnishings are. But I don’t think it bothered Harry until Meghan came along.

Come on, if a parent treat 2 kids differently, do you expect they not be upset?

In that family? It’s pretty standard for the heir. They were given Frogmore and the honor a royal tour. Which they then acted like was a huge imposition.

Frogmore, the house that requires a full gut job and renovation. The costs in which Harry and Meghan paid, and they still don’t get the use of.

k

They didn’t have to pay until they left. They were given the house and immediately undertook a £3M renovation that they didn’t have to pay for until they left the Firm. The house remained their British home so they did have use of it. Then they behaved so horribly, biting the hand that fed them that it was revoked.

[Anonymous]

Harry was set to get Clarence House.

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3801756/prince-harry-meghan-markle-royal-residence-clarence-house/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think M and H were jealous they didn’t receive the household budget that W&K did. He mentions it several times in the book - how much nicer Will’s house and furnishings are. But I don’t think it bothered Harry until Meghan came along.

Come on, if a parent treat 2 kids differently, do you expect they not be upset?

In that family? It’s pretty standard for the heir. They were given Frogmore and the honor a royal tour. Which they then acted like was a huge imposition.

Frogmore, the house that requires a full gut job and renovation. The costs in which Harry and Meghan paid, and they still don’t get the use of.

k

They didn’t have to pay until they left. They were given the house and immediately undertook a £3M renovation that they didn’t have to pay for until they left the Firm. The house remained their British home so they did have use of it. Then they behaved so horribly, biting the hand that fed them that it was revoked.

Again, I hope that the costs that they paid for a house that they are not allowed to use are refunded to them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Harry was set to get Clarence House.

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3801756/prince-harry-meghan-markle-royal-residence-clarence-house/

Maybe. While it would be great if that were the case, the Sun, quoting the Mail on Sunday, attributing this to unnamed sources is not as convincing as it could be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harry was set to get Clarence House.

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3801756/prince-harry-meghan-markle-royal-residence-clarence-house/

Maybe. While it would be great if that were the case, the Sun, quoting the Mail on Sunday, attributing this to unnamed sources is not as convincing as it could be.

You are right they were supposed to live in horrible Frogmore forever.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm on another forum, and on a thread about Kate/photoshop pic there is one person who continually just posts anti H+M stuff. Calling them (us? the public?) hypocrites because meghan lightens her skin or something. Like it's this persons JOB to turn every mildly negative conversation about BRF/W+K into an attack on H+M. So bizarre.

I always believed that the BRF planted stories about H+M and have been manipulating the press behind the scenes. It's even more clear now.

Agree and don’t forgot that Harry just won a lawsuit against the Daily Beast. They’ll run nasty untrue stories about him as long as they can for revenge.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think M and H were jealous they didn’t receive the household budget that W&K did. He mentions it several times in the book - how much nicer Will’s house and furnishings are. But I don’t think it bothered Harry until Meghan came along.

Come on, if a parent treat 2 kids differently, do you expect they not be upset?

In that family? It’s pretty standard for the heir. They were given Frogmore and the honor a royal tour. Which they then acted like was a huge imposition.

Frogmore, the house that requires a full gut job and renovation. The costs in which Harry and Meghan paid, and they still don’t get the use of.

In contrast, look at the huge house Princess Anne was given when she got married, same for Edward and Andrew. None of these people were heirs but the Queen gave them huge properties when they got married. Giving Harry Frogmore was an intentional slight for choosing a biracial wife. If she had been white, he would have been given a nicer home.

The comparison isn't Harry to Anne, it's Harry to his other cousins. What did Beatrice, Eugenie, Peter, Zara, etc get from the queen when they got married? Anne is a child of the monarch, the rest are all grandchildren. I don't think any of them got sweeping estates.

I think that Peter and Zara have houses on Anne’s estate. I also think that Anne owns Gatcombe Park outright, so presumably Peter and Zara are in a position to inherit it.

I get making the comparison of Harry to his cousins, but keep in mind too, that Harry was a full time working Royal, and his wife Meghan was expected to be as well — unlike Harry’s cousins and their spouses. While his cousins had opportunities to create their own careers and income, Harry and Meghan were expected to represent the crown for life. Given the enormous and presumably life-long restrictions that went along with that, it stands out—to me, at least — that Harry and Meghan were treated quite differently from the other working royals, starting with their housing.

I hope that they were repaid all that they spent to renovate Frogmore Cottage.

Well, now compare Charles to his siblings. Is it Even Steven? This is Harry's world, how did he not anticipate how this would go? And I wound't say "quite differently" they all live with their parents or in much less desirable housing than what Harry had.

No, it wasn’t even, and I doubt that Harry expected that it would be, given that William would be expected to have access to properties as the eventual Prince of Wales and future King. He probably did anticipate that when he married he would get the sort of housing that other full time working royals in his family were given when they married. Why would he imagine that he’d be treated differently?

As to the next bit, please elaborate. Harry had temporary use of a tiny cottage at Kensington palace (which at different points William and other families also used). And a ramshackle group of houses scheduled for renovations, which he and Meghan renovated back into a single family home. If you’re going to talk about the “much less desirable housing” of his cousins, it would help a lot if you could be more specific — especially when “live with their parents” can mean having an enormous house on the grounds of an even more enormous estate.

The other FT working royals were children of the Queen. Harry is not, he was a grandson. He got what other grandchildren got who weren't his brother.

Beatrice bought her own house and Eugenie doesn't even live in the UK. Peter and Zara live on their mother's property and Edward's kids are minors, set to get nothing when they marry.

They were getting a large apartment at Kensington like William and Kate but they didn't want it. They asked for Windsor but were offered Frogmore.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harry was set to get Clarence House.

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3801756/prince-harry-meghan-markle-royal-residence-clarence-house/

Maybe. While it would be great if that were the case, the Sun, quoting the Mail on Sunday, attributing this to unnamed sources is not as convincing as it could be.

You are right they were supposed to live in horrible Frogmore forever.

Actually the point was that Frog more was supposed to be their cute little newlywed starter home/pied a terre and they would get a bigger place in time.

But they were impatient.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think M and H were jealous they didn’t receive the household budget that W&K did. He mentions it several times in the book - how much nicer Will’s house and furnishings are. But I don’t think it bothered Harry until Meghan came along.

Come on, if a parent treat 2 kids differently, do you expect they not be upset?

In that family? It’s pretty standard for the heir. They were given Frogmore and the honor a royal tour. Which they then acted like was a huge imposition.

Frogmore, the house that requires a full gut job and renovation. The costs in which Harry and Meghan paid, and they still don’t get the use of.

In contrast, look at the huge house Princess Anne was given when she got married, same for Edward and Andrew. None of these people were heirs but the Queen gave them huge properties when they got married. Giving Harry Frogmore was an intentional slight for choosing a biracial wife. If she had been white, he would have been given a nicer home.

The comparison isn't Harry to Anne, it's Harry to his other cousins. What did Beatrice, Eugenie, Peter, Zara, etc get from the queen when they got married? Anne is a child of the monarch, the rest are all grandchildren. I don't think any of them got sweeping estates.

I think that Peter and Zara have houses on Anne’s estate. I also think that Anne owns Gatcombe Park outright, so presumably Peter and Zara are in a position to inherit it.

I get making the comparison of Harry to his cousins, but keep in mind too, that Harry was a full time working Royal, and his wife Meghan was expected to be as well — unlike Harry’s cousins and their spouses. While his cousins had opportunities to create their own careers and income, Harry and Meghan were expected to represent the crown for life. Given the enormous and presumably life-long restrictions that went along with that, it stands out—to me, at least — that Harry and Meghan were treated quite differently from the other working royals, starting with their housing.

I hope that they were repaid all that they spent to renovate Frogmore Cottage.

Well, now compare Charles to his siblings. Is it Even Steven? This is Harry's world, how did he not anticipate how this would go? And I wound't say "quite differently" they all live with their parents or in much less desirable housing than what Harry had.

No, it wasn’t even, and I doubt that Harry expected that it would be, given that William would be expected to have access to properties as the eventual Prince of Wales and future King. He probably did anticipate that when he married he would get the sort of housing that other full time working royals in his family were given when they married. Why would he imagine that he’d be treated differently?

As to the next bit, please elaborate. Harry had temporary use of a tiny cottage at Kensington palace (which at different points William and other families also used). And a ramshackle group of houses scheduled for renovations, which he and Meghan renovated back into a single family home. If you’re going to talk about the “much less desirable housing” of his cousins, it would help a lot if you could be more specific — especially when “live with their parents” can mean having an enormous house on the grounds of an even more enormous estate.

The other FT working royals were children of the Queen. Harry is not, he was a grandson. He got what other grandchildren got who weren't his brother.

Beatrice bought her own house and Eugenie doesn't even live in the UK. Peter and Zara live on their mother's property and Edward's kids are minors, set to get nothing when they marry.

And none of them were working Royals. So Harry was one of two working royals — himself and his brother — in his generation of cousins. If you’re arguing that he both deserves little or nothing in the way of housing because he’s just a grandchild — while he and his wife were ALSO expected to be working royals — unable to pursue careers outside of their royal duties then, ok. I, personally, think that’s unfair, and I think that’s very different from the way generations of British Royals have been treated. So, we disagree.

Also Eugenie spends quite a bit of time in the UK, as well as Portugal. Also, also, yes, Peter and Zara do indeed live on their mother’s property. Check out their housing. They are not stuffed in basements in their mother’s three bedroom townhouse. Anne’s property is massive, with multiple homes and outbuildings. I’m curious about what you know about what Louise and James will get when they marry — but if the level of detail is similar to your comments about Peter and Zara, I’ll look elsewhere if my curiosity increases.

This is old, and, well, it is the Daily Mail, but, as an example of Zara “living on her mother’s property”, Zara’s property was getting an updated conservatory. Not too shabby.


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-5864565/Plans-submitted-extension-lodge-Princess-Annes-Gatcombe-Park-estate.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Harry was set to get Clarence House.

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/3801756/prince-harry-meghan-markle-royal-residence-clarence-house/

Maybe. While it would be great if that were the case, the Sun, quoting the Mail on Sunday, attributing this to unnamed sources is not as convincing as it could be.

You are right they were supposed to live in horrible Frogmore forever.

Actually the point was that Frog more was supposed to be their cute little newlywed starter home/pied a terre and they would get a bigger place in time.

But they were impatient.

“Impatient “ about what, exactly?