Spanish Immersion Community Table Session

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

This isn’t that. Moving Immersion to WMS actually helps keep more students in their neighborhood schools rather than moving them out for an option program (look at the adjusted Kenmore boundary). It’s an entirely different situation, and sadly it is not unique to Arlington. Desegregation was the right thing to do, it was the wrong approach, and it’s far more complicated than just a schools issue. But in a world in which a duplex can be stopped with just a threat of a lawsuit citing a covenant on a deed from almost 100 years ago, it’s not going to be unwound while I live and breath.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

This isn’t that. Moving Immersion to WMS actually helps keep more students in their neighborhood schools rather than moving them out for an option program (look at the adjusted Kenmore boundary). It’s an entirely different situation, and sadly it is not unique to Arlington. Desegregation was the right thing to do, it was the wrong approach, and it’s far more complicated than just a schools issue. But in a world in which a duplex can be stopped with just a threat of a lawsuit citing a covenant on a deed from almost 100 years ago, it’s not going to be unwound while I live and breath.

Kids in neighborhood schools aren't any more deserving then kids in choice schools. The move is hard on all students. It will be hard for kids to move out of Gunston. It will be hard for kids to move out of their neighborhood school. We have some kids in immersion now that will be going through their third school move when the program moves from Gunston (when certain neighborhoods were rezone from Claremont to Key, when Key moved buildings and now when Immersion leaves Gunston). That has all been hard.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

This isn’t that. Moving Immersion to WMS actually helps keep more students in their neighborhood schools rather than moving them out for an option program (look at the adjusted Kenmore boundary). It’s an entirely different situation, and sadly it is not unique to Arlington. Desegregation was the right thing to do, it was the wrong approach, and it’s far more complicated than just a schools issue. But in a world in which a duplex can be stopped with just a threat of a lawsuit citing a covenant on a deed from almost 100 years ago, it’s not going to be unwound while I live and breath.

Kids in neighborhood schools aren't any more deserving then kids in choice schools. The move is hard on all students. It will be hard for kids to move out of Gunston. It will be hard for kids to move out of their neighborhood school. We have some kids in immersion now that will be going through their third school move when the program moves from Gunston (when certain neighborhoods were rezone from Claremont to Key, when Key moved buildings and now when Immersion leaves Gunston). That has all been hard.

It’s not a matter of more or less deserving. It’s a matter of choice. Families who have enrolled their children in option schools or programs are aware of trade-offs, such as being far from home (whether that’s a little or a lot far, not going to school with neighbors, being on teams and activities that are not neighborhood-based). Families who have not opted for theses trade-offs should be considered in a different light because they have not signed up for these trade-offs. Also, they don’t have a fall-back if it’s not working out. Families in option programs and schools can always leave and return to the neighborhood school. There is no alternative for families and kids who are at the neighborhood school. See the difference? Lastly, the number of children affected matters. There are so many more kids in neighborhood schools than option programs and schools. The sheer volume alone means their needs take priority. Do we make a decision based on what’s best/most convenient for 300 students, many of whom are not racial or ethnic minorities or economically disadvantaged, or for the 4,000 students, many of whom are racial or ethnic minorities AND economically disadvantaged?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

This isn’t that. Moving Immersion to WMS actually helps keep more students in their neighborhood schools rather than moving them out for an option program (look at the adjusted Kenmore boundary). It’s an entirely different situation, and sadly it is not unique to Arlington. Desegregation was the right thing to do, it was the wrong approach, and it’s far more complicated than just a schools issue. But in a world in which a duplex can be stopped with just a threat of a lawsuit citing a covenant on a deed from almost 100 years ago, it’s not going to be unwound while I live and breath.

Neighborhood schools are defined by where APS puts the boundaries. Adjusting the boundaries for S Arlington population growth doesn't mean students aren't going to their neighborhood schools.

Immersion isn't driving the boundary change. Population growth is. APS is talking about moving immersion to reduce the number of boundary changes due to population growth. The immersion program isn't the cause of the problem. It's getting pulled into a problem it didn't create.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

This isn’t that. Moving Immersion to WMS actually helps keep more students in their neighborhood schools rather than moving them out for an option program (look at the adjusted Kenmore boundary). It’s an entirely different situation, and sadly it is not unique to Arlington. Desegregation was the right thing to do, it was the wrong approach, and it’s far more complicated than just a schools issue. But in a world in which a duplex can be stopped with just a threat of a lawsuit citing a covenant on a deed from almost 100 years ago, it’s not going to be unwound while I live and breath.

Kids in neighborhood schools aren't any more deserving then kids in choice schools. The move is hard on all students. It will be hard for kids to move out of Gunston. It will be hard for kids to move out of their neighborhood school. We have some kids in immersion now that will be going through their third school move when the program moves from Gunston (when certain neighborhoods were rezone from Claremont to Key, when Key moved buildings and now when Immersion leaves Gunston). That has all been hard.

It’s not a matter of more or less deserving. It’s a matter of choice. Families who have enrolled their children in option schools or programs are aware of trade-offs, such as being far from home (whether that’s a little or a lot far, not going to school with neighbors, being on teams and activities that are not neighborhood-based). Families who have not opted for theses trade-offs should be considered in a different light because they have not signed up for these trade-offs. Also, they don’t have a fall-back if it’s not working out. Families in option programs and schools can always leave and return to the neighborhood school. There is no alternative for families and kids who are at the neighborhood school. See the difference? Lastly, the number of children affected matters. There are so many more kids in neighborhood schools than option programs and schools. The sheer volume alone means their needs take priority. Do we make a decision based on what’s best/most convenient for 300 students, many of whom are not racial or ethnic minorities or economically disadvantaged, or for the 4,000 students, many of whom are racial or ethnic minorities AND economically disadvantaged?

So much of this is flat out wrong. It doesn't pass the red face test. Your numbers and premise are all faulty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

This isn’t that. Moving Immersion to WMS actually helps keep more students in their neighborhood schools rather than moving them out for an option program (look at the adjusted Kenmore boundary). It’s an entirely different situation, and sadly it is not unique to Arlington. Desegregation was the right thing to do, it was the wrong approach, and it’s far more complicated than just a schools issue. But in a world in which a duplex can be stopped with just a threat of a lawsuit citing a covenant on a deed from almost 100 years ago, it’s not going to be unwound while I live and breath.

Kids in neighborhood schools aren't any more deserving then kids in choice schools. The move is hard on all students. It will be hard for kids to move out of Gunston. It will be hard for kids to move out of their neighborhood school. We have some kids in immersion now that will be going through their third school move when the program moves from Gunston (when certain neighborhoods were rezone from Claremont to Key, when Key moved buildings and now when Immersion leaves Gunston). That has all been hard.

It’s not a matter of more or less deserving. It’s a matter of choice. Families who have enrolled their children in option schools or programs are aware of trade-offs, such as being far from home (whether that’s a little or a lot far, not going to school with neighbors, being on teams and activities that are not neighborhood-based). Families who have not opted for theses trade-offs should be considered in a different light because they have not signed up for these trade-offs. Also, they don’t have a fall-back if it’s not working out. Families in option programs and schools can always leave and return to the neighborhood school. There is no alternative for families and kids who are at the neighborhood school. See the difference? Lastly, the number of children affected matters. There are so many more kids in neighborhood schools than option programs and schools. The sheer volume alone means their needs take priority. Do we make a decision based on what’s best/most convenient for 300 students, many of whom are not racial or ethnic minorities or economically disadvantaged, or for the 4,000 students, many of whom are racial or ethnic minorities AND economically disadvantaged?

When people choose to live somewhere in Arlington they should know that there is always a risk that school boundaries could move. There's no guarantee you won't be redistricted. You choose to live here knowing that risk. See how that works? This redistricting is because of population growth. It isn't the responsibility of any one cohort of students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

This isn’t that. Moving Immersion to WMS actually helps keep more students in their neighborhood schools rather than moving them out for an option program (look at the adjusted Kenmore boundary). It’s an entirely different situation, and sadly it is not unique to Arlington. Desegregation was the right thing to do, it was the wrong approach, and it’s far more complicated than just a schools issue. But in a world in which a duplex can be stopped with just a threat of a lawsuit citing a covenant on a deed from almost 100 years ago, it’s not going to be unwound while I live and breath.

Neighborhood schools are defined by where APS puts the boundaries. Adjusting the boundaries for S Arlington population growth doesn't mean students aren't going to their neighborhood schools.

Immersion isn't driving the boundary change. Population growth is. APS is talking about moving immersion to reduce the number of boundary changes due to population growth. The immersion program isn't the cause of the problem. It's getting pulled into a problem it didn't create.

Right and the boundary changes are STILL happening no matter where immersion moves or even if it moves at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

Well, I guess we could just let them all walk across town instead.
Seriously - waiting for desegregation to naturally occur in all neighborhoods across the County is futile. And in the meantime, the educational disparities continue. That just keeps the loop of desegregation going.

So sick of people decrying not going to the same school as the kid next door. So frickin' what? School is for education and opportunity - not the local neighborhood playgroup. Dare to make friends elsewhere!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

This isn’t that. Moving Immersion to WMS actually helps keep more students in their neighborhood schools rather than moving them out for an option program (look at the adjusted Kenmore boundary). It’s an entirely different situation, and sadly it is not unique to Arlington. Desegregation was the right thing to do, it was the wrong approach, and it’s far more complicated than just a schools issue. But in a world in which a duplex can be stopped with just a threat of a lawsuit citing a covenant on a deed from almost 100 years ago, it’s not going to be unwound while I live and breath.

Neighborhood schools are defined by where APS puts the boundaries. Adjusting the boundaries for S Arlington population growth doesn't mean students aren't going to their neighborhood schools.

Immersion isn't driving the boundary change. Population growth is. APS is talking about moving immersion to reduce the number of boundary changes due to population growth. The immersion program isn't the cause of the problem. It's getting pulled into a problem it didn't create.

Right and the boundary changes are STILL happening no matter where immersion moves or even if it moves at all.

Right but they can make less extreme boundary changes by moving Immersion to the least crowded school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

This isn’t that. Moving Immersion to WMS actually helps keep more students in their neighborhood schools rather than moving them out for an option program (look at the adjusted Kenmore boundary). It’s an entirely different situation, and sadly it is not unique to Arlington. Desegregation was the right thing to do, it was the wrong approach, and it’s far more complicated than just a schools issue. But in a world in which a duplex can be stopped with just a threat of a lawsuit citing a covenant on a deed from almost 100 years ago, it’s not going to be unwound while I live and breath.

Kids in neighborhood schools aren't any more deserving then kids in choice schools. The move is hard on all students. It will be hard for kids to move out of Gunston. It will be hard for kids to move out of their neighborhood school. We have some kids in immersion now that will be going through their third school move when the program moves from Gunston (when certain neighborhoods were rezone from Claremont to Key, when Key moved buildings and now when Immersion leaves Gunston). That has all been hard.

It’s not a matter of more or less deserving. It’s a matter of choice. Families who have enrolled their children in option schools or programs are aware of trade-offs, such as being far from home (whether that’s a little or a lot far, not going to school with neighbors, being on teams and activities that are not neighborhood-based). Families who have not opted for theses trade-offs should be considered in a different light because they have not signed up for these trade-offs. Also, they don’t have a fall-back if it’s not working out. Families in option programs and schools can always leave and return to the neighborhood school. There is no alternative for families and kids who are at the neighborhood school. See the difference? Lastly, the number of children affected matters. There are so many more kids in neighborhood schools than option programs and schools. The sheer volume alone means their needs take priority. Do we make a decision based on what’s best/most convenient for 300 students, many of whom are not racial or ethnic minorities or economically disadvantaged, or for the 4,000 students, many of whom are racial or ethnic minorities AND economically disadvantaged?

You're a proponent of haves get more and have nots must always suffer. You're a proponent of second-class schools and less worthy students. There is no other way to see your viewpoint. At best, your argument is based on an conclusion (still immoral, as it is) that, by definition, option schools and their students must never receive anything unless neighborhoods first are unaffected. Disavow it all you want... It's people like you who always emerge from the woodwork whenever anything is proposed for options who say neighborhoods are more deserving...more natural...more the way it ought to be (and get off my lawn!).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

This isn’t that. Moving Immersion to WMS actually helps keep more students in their neighborhood schools rather than moving them out for an option program (look at the adjusted Kenmore boundary). It’s an entirely different situation, and sadly it is not unique to Arlington. Desegregation was the right thing to do, it was the wrong approach, and it’s far more complicated than just a schools issue. But in a world in which a duplex can be stopped with just a threat of a lawsuit citing a covenant on a deed from almost 100 years ago, it’s not going to be unwound while I live and breath.

Neighborhood schools are defined by where APS puts the boundaries. Adjusting the boundaries for S Arlington population growth doesn't mean students aren't going to their neighborhood schools.

Immersion isn't driving the boundary change. Population growth is. APS is talking about moving immersion to reduce the number of boundary changes due to population growth. The immersion program isn't the cause of the problem. It's getting pulled into a problem it didn't create.

Right and the boundary changes are STILL happening no matter where immersion moves or even if it moves at all.

Right but they can make less extreme boundary changes by moving Immersion to the least crowded school.

The proposal is already to move immersion in order to reduce boundary changes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So much irrational anger towers the immersion program. Boundaries are shifting because of population growth in S Arlington, not because of immersion. The program hasn't changed in size. Student shifts are not because of the immersion program. APS needs to move students north.

If only there was a group of about 300 students that you could move from Gunston to Williamsburg without impacting all of the other boundaries...

So your proposal is to bus Hispanic students all the way across the county so that a few privileged N Arlington students don't have to attend their next closest MS?

Are we really going to pretend that the Immersion population that lives near Gunston, which heavily draws from Claremont, is predominantly disadvantaged? Claremont that is 27% FARMS despite all surrounding schools that are 50%+?

Are you trying to say that Taylor and WMS aren't economically privileged students?

No, I'm saying you're exaggerating the hardship for students who live in Fairlington to go to Williamsburg.

Also, everyone always complains about how North Arlington schools aren't diverse enough. Well, here's your chance to be the change.

I think you're exaggerating the burden for Taylor students to attend WMS. That's where they went before Hamm opened.

So you don’t want more diversity in N Arlington schools?

Are you seriously proposing busing to desegregate N Arlington school?

It’s an option program, not a neighborhood school. Kids in option programs can be bused anywhere there is space. That’s why it’s optional. It’s not forced busing and you sound like an idiot even comparing this to that.

You should brush up on your history. Busing for "optional" magnet schools is no less controversial.

Which history is that? Not sure what you’re referring to.

The history of busing and desegregation in Arlington. I am a new poster but the original option schools in Arlington were designed to force desegregation through busing

You should break out your dictionary and look up “option” and “force”.

Or maybe you should look at the history of busing in Arlington. They created an option school at Drew. Then they forcibly bused the kids out of the neighborhood because they could no longer attend at Drew. In fact, they used to bus kids from opposite sides of the street to different schools do kids were broken up from their neighborhood unit. Not saying that is happening here. JUST saying Arlington has a nasty history of using busing to deal with desegregation. It isn't wrong for folks to be concerned even if you think it is no big deal.

This isn’t that. Moving Immersion to WMS actually helps keep more students in their neighborhood schools rather than moving them out for an option program (look at the adjusted Kenmore boundary). It’s an entirely different situation, and sadly it is not unique to Arlington. Desegregation was the right thing to do, it was the wrong approach, and it’s far more complicated than just a schools issue. But in a world in which a duplex can be stopped with just a threat of a lawsuit citing a covenant on a deed from almost 100 years ago, it’s not going to be unwound while I live and breath.

Kids in neighborhood schools aren't any more deserving then kids in choice schools. The move is hard on all students. It will be hard for kids to move out of Gunston. It will be hard for kids to move out of their neighborhood school. We have some kids in immersion now that will be going through their third school move when the program moves from Gunston (when certain neighborhoods were rezone from Claremont to Key, when Key moved buildings and now when Immersion leaves Gunston). That has all been hard.

It’s not a matter of more or less deserving. It’s a matter of choice. Families who have enrolled their children in option schools or programs are aware of trade-offs, such as being far from home (whether that’s a little or a lot far, not going to school with neighbors, being on teams and activities that are not neighborhood-based). Families who have not opted for theses trade-offs should be considered in a different light because they have not signed up for these trade-offs. Also, they don’t have a fall-back if it’s not working out. Families in option programs and schools can always leave and return to the neighborhood school. There is no alternative for families and kids who are at the neighborhood school. See the difference? Lastly, the number of children affected matters. There are so many more kids in neighborhood schools than option programs and schools. The sheer volume alone means their needs take priority. Do we make a decision based on what’s best/most convenient for 300 students, many of whom are not racial or ethnic minorities or economically disadvantaged, or for the 4,000 students, many of whom are racial or ethnic minorities AND economically disadvantaged?

You're a proponent of haves get more and have nots must always suffer. You're a proponent of second-class schools and less worthy students. There is no other way to see your viewpoint. At best, your argument is based on an conclusion (still immoral, as it is) that, by definition, option schools and their students must never receive anything unless neighborhoods first are unaffected. Disavow it all you want... It's people like you who always emerge from the woodwork whenever anything is proposed for options who say neighborhoods are more deserving...more natural...more the way it ought to be (and get off my lawn!).

Why do the option schools see themselves as some kind of underdog "Have nots" class? Key has a $100K per year PTA budget! It doesn't make sense!