Will basis move their waitlist this week or are they done?

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:It's just so weird what people say about BASIS. Like if anyone's below grade level in the whole school (after 5th anyway), then there isn't and can't possibly be "rigor" for anyone? What a weird thing to think and say.

No school can be everything for everyone. If a kid at Basis is below grade level, one of three things can happen:
A. The kid will continue struggling and failing classes. The kid will likely have to attend student hours every day, and they still won't be able to hack it. After the kid figures out that they're not going to be able to pass, then the kid starts disrupting everyone else. Eventually, the kid fails out of the program. In math, especially, the kid was stuck getting pushed ahead into classes that they didn't understand, and failed to gain proper foundations. This is usually what happens when kids who are close to failing do the summer packets/retests and manage to move to the next grade. It would be an even bigger disaster if they socially promoted the kids who can't even manage to pass after all of that.

B. The kid gets extensive tutoring and attends student hours every day, and somehow turns things around. This is very rare.

C. Basis has to water down the program to accommodate the kids who can't handle the rigor.

A is cruel. B is exceedingly rare. C would ruin Basis for all of the kids who need the rigor.

I'm unclear why accommodations for a few kids would "ruin it" for everyone. Can BASIS teachers not handle it? BASIS offers a great many different classes at different levels so what's one or two more?

The bolded is incorrect. From 5th-8th grade, there is only one instructional level for the entire grade, with the exception of a very few kids who are bumped up for math. Lower level classes are not offered. In the high school level, there are very limited opportunities for different levels. All Basis 7th graders take the same level of English, History, and science classes. Almost all of them are taking Algebra I, with a few kids taking Algebra II or pre-calc. In 9th grade, all kids are taking 2nd year of their foreign language, AP Government, Honors English, some honors science. All kids must at least be in pre-calc. I don't know why you had the idea that Basis offered different classes at different levels, and thus could accommodate remedial classes. They do not do so.

I meant in high school they have different classes.

It's odd to me to offer so little differentiation and still claim "rigor". How is it rigorous for the kids who are already above grade level?

Also, the idea that having any students below grade level ruin "rigor" for everyone else is odd. I think any student can be held to high expectations of working hard and progressing, even if they begin below grade level. And I don't see why in-room differentiation is so hard for BASIS teachers that they can't do it at all. Lots of schools manage to do it.

They really don't have different levels in high school. All classes are at Honors/AP levels. Kids have some latitude on how many APs to take, but they can't take any regular level classes.

It isn't perfectly rigorous for the gifted kids, but it's better than they're going to get elsewhere in public schools. Some kids can push ahead in math a year or two at Basis. It's great that they don't attempt much in room differentiation. In room differentiation doesn't work well anywhere, and the schools who claim to do it really just ignore the bright kids and focus on the slow ones. The teachers are also expected to teach like 4 different classes wrapped into one, and that doesn't work well for anyone. People like you always seem to want to screw over the bright motivated kids.

I honestly don't care whether Basis is impressive relative to its demographics. I care about whether it's a good fit for my kids. Honestly speaking, my kids would pass the standardized tests at any public school. At most of them, they'd be bored out of their minds and not really learning much of anything. At Basis, they're at least somewhat challenged and happy. There's a long list of people who want to attend Basis. There are many people who are happy there. The kids are learning at high levels. People who aren't a good fit for Basis have numerous other free options. I'm not seeing the problem here.

On the contrary, my kids are bright and motivated, which is why BASIS' lack of differentiation is so unappealing. And the meh performance relative to demographics indicates to me that the teaching is nothing special.

I don't want to screw over any kids, which is why I think it's cruel to put students to the choice of an embarrassing and developmentally inappropriate retention policy or else going to a probably much worse school. Sorry you don't care about that, but I do. I don't believe for a second that nobody else could have "rigor" if some kids were below grade level, and it speaks very poorly of BASIS that the aren't up to the challenge of managing this.

Seriously, no one cares what you think or believe.

Enjoy your kids’ crappy school and go post someplace else about how it is so great serving at-risk and low-performing kids.

[Anonymous]

What's funny about these performative equity folks is that they purport to speak for black and low-SES students but give zero consideration to the black and low-SES students who are provided a first class education at BASIS. These people don't care about equity or black kids or low SES families, they care about a dumb talk track and scoring SJW points.

[Anonymous]

Performance relative to demographics is a useless metric when you're using low bar tests like state tests. Essentially, you're looking at pass rates among groups of kids who were likely to pass when they first walked into the classroom. You're also equating a higher SES kid who barely passes grade level subjects with a kid who would easily crush the tests from 2-3 grade levels higher.

At Basis, every single 8th grader is at least taking Algebra II. They're also taking high school equivalents of physics, chemistry, and biology. By 8th grade, the kids have learned to write solid essays . By 9th, they're all taking at least one AP class, and most of them are earning passing scores on the AP exam. I doubt your "performance vs. demographics" stats take any of this into account.

My kids have been in classrooms (not at Basis), where they were ignored all day. They still passed the state tests. They also have been in classrooms at Basis, where they've learned a tremendous amount of content all day. They passed the state tests there, too. Since they passed the state tests at both schools, both schools educated them equally well, right?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What's funny about these performative equity folks is that they purport to speak for black and low-SES students but give zero consideration to the black and low-SES students who are provided a first class education at BASIS. These people don't care about equity or black kids or low SES families, they care about a dumb talk track and scoring SJW points.

I agree, but to be fair, I think the PP who is obsessed with the performance relative to demographics measure has early elementary school aged kids. She has a bunch of naive ideas about how things work in middle and high school. I mean, only a parent of elementary schoolers would be going on about how every other school has in-classroom differentiation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What's funny about these performative equity folks is that they purport to speak for black and low-SES students but give zero consideration to the black and low-SES students who are provided a first class education at BASIS. These people don't care about equity or black kids or low SES families, they care about a dumb talk track and scoring SJW points.

I don't think it's inconsistent to say that 1) Basis provides a generally better education than any DC charters or DCPS schools (which I agree with, which is why I send my kids there), and 2) the share of lower SES students, Black students, and Hispanic students at the school is way lower than in the DC public school pool, suggesting that the school could improve its outreach and retention of those groups, so that more of those kids could access that "first class education". I don't expect the Basis population to exactly represent the overall DC population, given the inequitable K-4 preparation, but it certainly could be closer.

[Anonymous]

I think you are right. In-room differentiation works reasonably well at the elementary school level and then really not at all at the middle school level.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:They don't let in anyone after 5th grade. Even siblings

Per the head of school last year, they will offer seats in older grades if and only if the total number of students not returning (seniors plus attrition) exceeds something like 135 students.

I didn’t realize they offer any seats. Isn’t their position the curriculum is so advanced that they can’t backfill seats?

It's that their teachers aren't up to the challenge. Because it's soooo haaaaaard to do what most schools in this country do routinely.

At this point the BASIS Haterade club can't even figure out what they are mad at. Why do you care if BASIS adds 6th 7th 8th or no graders above 5th? This isn't about your kid not getting a slot because you seem angry at BASIS so obviously you wouldn't take it if offered. So what's your deal? Is it jealousy? You and yours spend a LOT of time on DCUM trying to convince parents who are at BASIS that what they know and think about the school doesn't matter. Based on the WL data, BASIS is getting harder to get into over time, not easier, so other than howling at the moon, what's in it for you? Why do you spend more time thinking and caring about BASIS than those who have kids there?

Because I call out BS when I see it. BASIS doesn't backfill because it's hard and they don't want to. That's the real reason. Plenty of schools across the country do it just fine, but not BASIS.

You didn't answer the question. Why are you so invested here? Why do you care where they get their 650 seats from? This angers you why?

Because I think letting one school shirk the harder stuff is bad for the system as a whole, and I think parents should know that BASIS' so-called "success" is founded on taking the easy path when they can get away with it.

Parents whose kids are at the school sent them there to be challenged and get them the heck away from virtue signalers like you who care more about the press release and faux "equity" than a quality education. No on at BASIS or Latin sits around and laments the lack of socially promoted, grade levels behind, disruptive kids in their classes. Give it a break.

I just don't think serving the easiest kids is a mark of quality, but you do you.

You are totally right. BASIS is a terrible school that doesn't provide rigor. Everyone who is there and happy just doesn't understand the school as well as you do. Good point. Thank the lord you are on the case.

I understand that people choose BASIS anyway. And I don't think it's a terrible school. But I do think its stats are not especially impressive in the context of its low at-risk percentage, high-SES student body, and shirking service of students with special needs and new arrivals. It's not that great, but has certain demographic manipulation policies that make it look better compared to schools that are serving different kids. That's not the same thing as quality or good teaching.

But hey why don't you go ahead and explain why the math PARCC scores are so low. And why re-enrollment of African-American students is only 77%. We're all ears.

Best scores in city at non-test in school. You would prefer...higher?

Yes, given that it is a high-SES school with very few at-risk kids and is constantly patting itself on the back for "rigor". BASIS' push-out policy (which you will deny exists) makes it functionally a test-in school after 5th grade, and a high-income one at that.

Why don't you tell us again why so many kids at BASIS do poorly on the math PARCC.

Are you lying or just misinformed?

Here are 9th grade math proficiency scores after kids have been at Basis (a 100% lottery school) for a few years. They are the highest in DC--even higher than selective schools such as Walls and Banneker. that cherry pick their students.

Basis: 77.36
Banneker: 66.56
Walls: 55.4
Latin: 30.11
DCI: 21.37

Wow, those are great numbers for Basis.

These numbers also carry across for African-Americans as well (after kids have been at Basis for a few years). Basis beats every public school in DC for African-American scores including schools such as Walls and Banneker that get to select their student body. In contrast, Basis is 100% lottery.

Basis is obviously a great choice for any academically motivated student.

Walls not so much, at least for math. And Latin and DCI definitely not so much.

9th grade PARCC proficiency (Black/African-American only):

Basis

ELA >=90%
Math 61.54

Banneker

ELA 86.41
Math 54.37

Walls

ELA 84.21
Math 29.41

Latin

ELA 43.59
Math 5.13

DCI

ELA 42.19
Math 15.38

Hon. Seriously. "After they've been at BASIS for a while"? No. After the lower-performing students have left. Be real.

Walls and Banneker don’t have low performing kids either. They aren’t admitted into those schools in the first place.

Right. The 9th grade population at BASIS is shaped by the 5th grade lottery **but also** by BASIS' policy choices that motivate lower performers to leave. 5th grade at BASIS is not even really pure lottery, it's shaped by sibling preference and parent knowledge of BASIS' policies. By the time kids get to 9th, it's a very different group demographically than it was when those kids entered 5th grade.

You make a lot of groundless assumptions. You clearly don't have a kid at BASIS and no nothing about it.

The fact is that kids leave Basis for lots of different reasons, and they don't backfill. They also don't socially promote.

As a result, BASIS has the best test scores of any public school in DC. That is what the data show.

You want to focus on Black students? Fine. Black students at Basis have the highest test scores of any public school in DC as well.

If you don't like it, GTFU and send your kids to your in-bounds school or some failing charter.

Game over, lady. Thanks for playing.

Not backfilling is why Basis is what it is. There really isn’t a good answer as to why they don’t. Except the numbers, of course.

There is a good answer, and it has been explained numerous times in these Basis threads. They don't backfill, because they aren't allowed by DC laws to give placement tests. They don't want to set kids up for failure, which is what would happen if they admitted kids who weren't going to be able to pass the comps for their grade level. All of the Arizona Basis schools backfill, because they're allowed to give placement tests.

I would hope that you agree that in a school that doesn't socially promote, it would be a bad idea to set kids up for failure. I feel sorry for the kids who would pass any placement tests and do fine in upper grades in Basis, but aren't given the chance due to DC laws. If you're so passionate about backfilling, perhaps you should lobby the DC politicians to change the laws and allow placement tests to be administered for upper grades.

Ah yes, because the anti-promotion policy is an immutable fact over which BASIS has no control whatsoever.

It's amazing the excuses people will accept.

The anti-promotion policy is an immutable fact when you're delivering a rigorous education. If a kid failed 6th grade, but you push that kid into 7th, then the kid will be set up for failure again. Or, they'll cause the class to be watered down, so the other kids can't receive a rigorous education.

There are tons of options for parents who want social promotion and a non-rigorous education. There are very few for advanced kids who need more. Why are you determined to restrict people's school choice by turning Basis into a clone of all of the other DC schools?

I'm not trying to shut down BASIS, I just think it's deliberately obtuse to argue that this isn't a policy choice BASIS is making. And it's a choice that influences their "performance" and their demographics.

I think it's disingenuous and self-serving to compare BASIS with other schools that have Equitable Action Preference, serve more SPED and at-risk kids, and backfill as if they're all the same and BASIS is just better. BASIS' performance is not very good relative to its demographics and its choice to shirk certain more difficult things that other schools willingly do. Those are just the facts of the matter, and they are why my children did not apply for BASIS. Saying "pure lottery" and "best test scores in the city" only shows your ignorance of data and deliberate, self-serving pretense that apples are the same as oranges.

I keep seeing this from people pretending to be thoughtful and reasonable. You are all either disingenuous or ignorant. EA was first available LAST YEAR so it cannot have shown up on any data. It is also not available in DCPS.

I'm old enough to remember when trolls put in the effort.

What on earth? Here is the list from MySchoolDC of Equitable Access schools. Why don't you put in an effort yourself.


**For SY23-24 Barnard Elementary School, Capitol Hill Montessori, DC Wildflower PCS – The Riverseed School, Dorothy I. Height Elementary School, E.L. Haynes PCS – Elementary School, E.L. Haynes PCS – High School, E.L. Haynes PCS – Middle School, Excel Academy, Garrison Elementary School, H.D. Cooke Elementary School, Inspired Teaching Demonstration PCS, John Lewis Elementary School, Latin American Montessori Bilingual (LAMB), Lee Montessori - Brookland, Lee Montessori - East End, MacArthur High School, Military Road Early Learning Center, Mundo Verde Bilingual PCS - Calle Ocho Campus, Mundo Verde Bilingual PCS - J.F. Cook Campus, School-Within-School, Stevens Early Learning Center, Two Rivers PCS at 4th Street, Two Rivers PCS at Young Elementary School, Two Rivers PCS at Young Middle School, Van Ness Elementary School, Washington Latin PCS – Cooper Campus, Washington Latin PCS – Middle School, Washington Latin PCS – Upper School, and Washington Yu Ying PCS will offer Equitable Access designated seats.

https://www.myschooldc.org/node/49311

??? Your post doesn't contradict the one you're replying to. That list is, for the coming year and, from what I can see, all PCS. I want to joke that you wouldn't hack the parenting at BASIS.

It was available for the previous school year as well. If you go here https://public.tableau.com/app/profile/aaron2446/viz/MSDCSeatsandWaitlistOfferData_draft/MSDCPublicDisplay, set the school year to 22-23, and then look in the drop-down menu of schools you'll see entries for schools that offered it in that year. Including some DCPS schools.

Yes. That is what I said. It was available for one year and not reflected in any available data. Those DCPS schools are only in year 1.

Do better.

It's reflected in the statistics about each school's at-risk preference. Is that not "available data"? And it will be available in the PARCC scores released this fall.

You're the one who said no DCPS schools, you do better.

*at-risk percentage, not preference. Which, at BASIS, is rock bottom low. Because BASIS likes it that way. Much easier to have "rigor" and "success" that way, right?

Are you aware that “at risk” includes children who are ALREADY more than a grade level behind? You think it’s a good idea to backfill a school that is several grade levels ahead of DCPS with students that are already more than a grade level behind DCPS?

Get out of here with your nonsense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's funny about these performative equity folks is that they purport to speak for black and low-SES students but give zero consideration to the black and low-SES students who are provided a first class education at BASIS. These people don't care about equity or black kids or low SES families, they care about a dumb talk track and scoring SJW points.

I don't think it's inconsistent to say that 1) Basis provides a generally better education than any DC charters or DCPS schools (which I agree with, which is why I send my kids there), and 2) the share of lower SES students, Black students, and Hispanic students at the school is way lower than in the DC public school pool, suggesting that the school could improve its outreach and retention of those groups, so that more of those kids could access that "first class education". I don't expect the Basis population to exactly represent the overall DC population, given the inequitable K-4 preparation, but it certainly could be closer.

Having a K-4 Basis primary would help a lot. Kids coming in for 5th grade will likely not be successful if their K-4 education was lacking and if they aren't above grade level when starting. Lower income or URM kids would have a much better chance of being successful at Basis if they're starting out with a strong academic foundation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's funny about these performative equity folks is that they purport to speak for black and low-SES students but give zero consideration to the black and low-SES students who are provided a first class education at BASIS. These people don't care about equity or black kids or low SES families, they care about a dumb talk track and scoring SJW points.

I don't think it's inconsistent to say that 1) Basis provides a generally better education than any DC charters or DCPS schools (which I agree with, which is why I send my kids there), and 2) the share of lower SES students, Black students, and Hispanic students at the school is way lower than in the DC public school pool, suggesting that the school could improve its outreach and retention of those groups, so that more of those kids could access that "first class education". I don't expect the Basis population to exactly represent the overall DC population, given the inequitable K-4 preparation, but it certainly could be closer.

Enrollment at BASIS for 5th grade does not track DC school age demographics long before kids start peeling off. Your argument (and that of the insane person who, I agree, has ES age kids) is that somehow that is BASIS's fault. Why can't we at least consider that parents are making informed choices? Low SES tracks and correlates with AA in DC. That's a demographic fact. AA kids have across the board lower test scores across every grade. Schools in predominantly AA neighborhoods have poorer educational outcomes. Through no fault of BASIS, by the time those kids get to 5th they are well behind grade level and will require significant remediation and family/student intervention in order to do more than just survive. Those families are CHOOSING not to put BASIS on their lottery list. It is an informed choice. Can we please press pause on the white guilt that tells black folks they are making the wrong choices?

The ire directed at BASIS would be better spent on ES that are failing kids long before 5th grade. But that's harder than picking the easy fight with BASIS on a free forum I guess.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I think you are right. In-room differentiation works reasonably well at the elementary school level and then really not at all at the middle school level.

Tell me you don't have a kid who has completed 4th grade or higher without telling me. It doesn't work in upper ES either at schools with any sizable population of kids behind grade level. Advanced kids are warehoused. It "works" to the extent parents supplement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's funny about these performative equity folks is that they purport to speak for black and low-SES students but give zero consideration to the black and low-SES students who are provided a first class education at BASIS. These people don't care about equity or black kids or low SES families, they care about a dumb talk track and scoring SJW points.

I don't think it's inconsistent to say that 1) Basis provides a generally better education than any DC charters or DCPS schools (which I agree with, which is why I send my kids there), and 2) the share of lower SES students, Black students, and Hispanic students at the school is way lower than in the DC public school pool, suggesting that the school could improve its outreach and retention of those groups, so that more of those kids could access that "first class education". I don't expect the Basis population to exactly represent the overall DC population, given the inequitable K-4 preparation, but it certainly could be closer.

Having a K-4 Basis primary would help a lot. Kids coming in for 5th grade will likely not be successful if their K-4 education was lacking and if they aren't above grade level when starting. Lower income or URM kids would have a much better chance of being successful at Basis if they're starting out with a strong academic foundation.

Agree. My hope is that the BASIS expansion will serve as a proof of concept that all kids from all backgrounds who are provided support, nurturing and environments focused on academics above fake equity talking points can succeed.

[Anonymous]

My kid's 5th grade BASIS number didn't move today (top 20), so I assume shop's closed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid's 5th grade BASIS number didn't move today (top 20), so I assume shop's closed.

Yep. I am assuming the same.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My kid's 5th grade BASIS number didn't move today (top 20), so I assume shop's closed.

That would be consistent with years' past. I haven't heard of them offering spots after school begins.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's funny about these performative equity folks is that they purport to speak for black and low-SES students but give zero consideration to the black and low-SES students who are provided a first class education at BASIS. These people don't care about equity or black kids or low SES families, they care about a dumb talk track and scoring SJW points.

I don't think it's inconsistent to say that 1) Basis provides a generally better education than any DC charters or DCPS schools (which I agree with, which is why I send my kids there), and 2) the share of lower SES students, Black students, and Hispanic students at the school is way lower than in the DC public school pool, suggesting that the school could improve its outreach and retention of those groups, so that more of those kids could access that "first class education". I don't expect the Basis population to exactly represent the overall DC population, given the inequitable K-4 preparation, but it certainly could be closer.

Enrollment at BASIS for 5th grade does not track DC school age demographics long before kids start peeling off. Your argument (and that of the insane person who, I agree, has ES age kids) is that somehow that is BASIS's fault. Why can't we at least consider that parents are making informed choices? Low SES tracks and correlates with AA in DC. That's a demographic fact. AA kids have across the board lower test scores across every grade. Schools in predominantly AA neighborhoods have poorer educational outcomes. Through no fault of BASIS, by the time those kids get to 5th they are well behind grade level and will require significant remediation and family/student intervention in order to do more than just survive. Those families are CHOOSING not to put BASIS on their lottery list. It is an informed choice. Can we please press pause on the white guilt that tells black folks they are making the wrong choices?

The ire directed at BASIS would be better spent on ES that are failing kids long before 5th grade. But that's harder than picking the easy fight with BASIS on a free forum I guess.

In some cases it's an informed choice, but I (white, grad school educated) had several conversations with Black families who were intrigued when I told them about Basis but whose kids were in 5th grade already. True, it's just an anecdotal, but I'm sure that part of the reason for the enrollment disparity is that virtually all highly-educated families know about Basis, but fewer less-educated families do. I don't know if Basis could do more to get the word out, but clearly not all parents are making a fully-informed choice.