Another Black Eye for Penn

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I really hope UPenn will have to pay out in the millions to Mackenzie...and more importantly, I hope they are forced to formally apologize. Sharmeful.

I agree. Especially because of all of the information they shared with her mother.

[Anonymous]

Mother definitely found this site.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the mom's boyfriend:
https://stlsportspage.com/2022/01/17/henry-lovelace-owner-of-wild-horse-fitness-passes-away/

Interesting choice for a respected doctor. Anyhow, this is the man she trusted over her daughter. And called the police on in a separate event. This article says he was hard on his clients. He did train with Mackenzie. Do you all believe he was 100% appropriate with her? Does the mom claim the forcible touching did not happen? If so, I missed that.

I’m no fan of tattoos but how can you read that and not come away that he seems like a good man with a decades-long career and two adult kids and even an ex wife who speak very highly of him? Sounds like you have personal biases and motives in play here.

A good man who the mom and other women called the cops on? That’s an obituary not a real bio. I seriously wonder if the mom has hired a pr firm to destroy her daughter for half these posts. Even if your daughter had made all this up wouldn’t you just cut her off after you fought for your innocence? Instead the mom goes to great efforts to sabotage her daughter’s new life. Seems like classic abuser/controller behavior. It comes down to who do you believe, the mom or the daughter. The mom’s behavior is like a psychopath. The daughter probably has issues too but doesn’t deserve a mom like that.

Agreed. It is passing strange that unattached strangers would be so emotionally invested in this story that they would go to such lengths to disparage the daughter on an anonymous message board, and profess to be so emotionally invested in the matter.

Hey, lady, I'm just a DCUM poster, and have been here on and off for 7 years. Ask Jeff, if you want to know. Do you need a link to Website Feedback?

But I was a truly, for-real poor kid who had to scramble to go to higher ed. This young woman's story stinks to high heaven. I don't mind saying so.

[Anonymous]

Agree with a few PPs that right out of the gate there seem to be posters (maybe just one) desperate to play the Wizard of Oz ("pay no attention to the man behind the curtain") and shut down discussion of this tragic, dispiriting story. Deal with it losers...it's in the New Yorker. It's out there. And there won't be any retractions.

[Anonymous]

So, Mackenzie Fierceton supporters, what was up with that claim she needed to be given extra money to take care of her disabled sister?

Explanation?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the mom's boyfriend:
https://stlsportspage.com/2022/01/17/henry-lovelace-owner-of-wild-horse-fitness-passes-away/

Interesting choice for a respected doctor. Anyhow, this is the man she trusted over her daughter. And called the police on in a separate event. This article says he was hard on his clients. He did train with Mackenzie. Do you all believe he was 100% appropriate with her? Does the mom claim the forcible touching did not happen? If so, I missed that.

I’m no fan of tattoos but how can you read that and not come away that he seems like a good man with a decades-long career and two adult kids and even an ex wife who speak very highly of him? Sounds like you have personal biases and motives in play here.

A good man who the mom and other women called the cops on? That’s an obituary not a real bio. I seriously wonder if the mom has hired a pr firm to destroy her daughter for half these posts. Even if your daughter had made all this up wouldn’t you just cut her off after you fought for your innocence? Instead the mom goes to great efforts to sabotage her daughter’s new life. Seems like classic abuser/controller behavior. It comes down to who do you believe, the mom or the daughter. The mom’s behavior is like a psychopath. The daughter probably has issues too but doesn’t deserve a mom like that.

Agreed. It is passing strange that unattached strangers would be so emotionally invested in this story that they would go to such lengths to disparage the daughter on an anonymous message board, and profess to be so emotionally invested in the matter.

Hey, lady, I'm just a DCUM poster, and have been here on and off for 7 years. Ask Jeff, if you want to know. Do you need a link to Website Feedback?

But I was a truly, for-real poor kid who had to scramble to go to higher ed. This young woman's story stinks to high heaven. I don't mind saying so.

Do you have a Masters or PhD in psychology or social work? Expert in the range of psychological effects of trauma and parental abuse in children? Medical degree to explain the need for ICU hospitalization?

As I said, it is passing strange that you and others would be so emotionally invested in disparaging this young woman, particularly if you lack any relevant professional expertise, as I expect is the case.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So, Mackenzie Fierceton supporters, what was up with that claim she needed to be given extra money to take care of her disabled sister?

Explanation?

I think she was abused and traumatized and may have exaggerated her good deeds on her college application. I don’t think it’s common practice to withhold degrees from kids for their janky non profits they portray as a bigger deal than they are and I think it’s likely that’s essentially what happened here-Mackenzie felt responsible/intended to help her sister. She was a teenager and a bit melodramatic (and also in an incredibly chaotic snd distressing home situation.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the mom's boyfriend:
https://stlsportspage.com/2022/01/17/henry-lovelace-owner-of-wild-horse-fitness-passes-away/

Interesting choice for a respected doctor. Anyhow, this is the man she trusted over her daughter. And called the police on in a separate event. This article says he was hard on his clients. He did train with Mackenzie. Do you all believe he was 100% appropriate with her? Does the mom claim the forcible touching did not happen? If so, I missed that.

I’m no fan of tattoos but how can you read that and not come away that he seems like a good man with a decades-long career and two adult kids and even an ex wife who speak very highly of him? Sounds like you have personal biases and motives in play here.

A good man who the mom and other women called the cops on? That’s an obituary not a real bio. I seriously wonder if the mom has hired a pr firm to destroy her daughter for half these posts. Even if your daughter had made all this up wouldn’t you just cut her off after you fought for your innocence? Instead the mom goes to great efforts to sabotage her daughter’s new life. Seems like classic abuser/controller behavior. It comes down to who do you believe, the mom or the daughter. The mom’s behavior is like a psychopath. The daughter probably has issues too but doesn’t deserve a mom like that.

Agreed. It is passing strange that unattached strangers would be so emotionally invested in this story that they would go to such lengths to disparage the daughter on an anonymous message board, and profess to be so emotionally invested in the matter.

Hey, lady, I'm just a DCUM poster, and have been here on and off for 7 years. Ask Jeff, if you want to know. Do you need a link to Website Feedback?

But I was a truly, for-real poor kid who had to scramble to go to higher ed. This young woman's story stinks to high heaven. I don't mind saying so.

Do you have a Masters or PhD in psychology or social work? Expert in the range of psychological effects of trauma and parental abuse in children? Medical degree to explain the need for ICU hospitalization?

As I said, it is passing strange that you and others would be so emotionally invested in disparaging this young woman, particularly if you lack any relevant professional expertise, as I expect is the case.

Yes, actually.

Passing strange? I had it really hard. I slept in a car to make it through finals. All I had were loans, small scholarships, and several cobbled-together part-time jobs to get my degree.

It would be passing strange if I didn't cast the fisheye at this makeshift story. It's insulting to people who really were doing their best despite overwhelming circumstances, and -- most importantly -- did NOT lie or grift to get through.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the mom's boyfriend:
https://stlsportspage.com/2022/01/17/henry-lovelace-owner-of-wild-horse-fitness-passes-away/

Interesting choice for a respected doctor. Anyhow, this is the man she trusted over her daughter. And called the police on in a separate event. This article says he was hard on his clients. He did train with Mackenzie. Do you all believe he was 100% appropriate with her? Does the mom claim the forcible touching did not happen? If so, I missed that.

I’m no fan of tattoos but how can you read that and not come away that he seems like a good man with a decades-long career and two adult kids and even an ex wife who speak very highly of him? Sounds like you have personal biases and motives in play here.

A good man who the mom and other women called the cops on? That’s an obituary not a real bio. I seriously wonder if the mom has hired a pr firm to destroy her daughter for half these posts. Even if your daughter had made all this up wouldn’t you just cut her off after you fought for your innocence? Instead the mom goes to great efforts to sabotage her daughter’s new life. Seems like classic abuser/controller behavior. It comes down to who do you believe, the mom or the daughter. The mom’s behavior is like a psychopath. The daughter probably has issues too but doesn’t deserve a mom like that.

Agreed. It is passing strange that unattached strangers would be so emotionally invested in this story that they would go to such lengths to disparage the daughter on an anonymous message board, and profess to be so emotionally invested in the matter.

Hey, lady, I'm just a DCUM poster, and have been here on and off for 7 years. Ask Jeff, if you want to know. Do you need a link to Website Feedback?

But I was a truly, for-real poor kid who had to scramble to go to higher ed. This young woman's story stinks to high heaven. I don't mind saying so.

Do you have a Masters or PhD in psychology or social work? Expert in the range of psychological effects of trauma and parental abuse in children? Medical degree to explain the need for ICU hospitalization?

As I said, it is passing strange that you and others would be so emotionally invested in disparaging this young woman, particularly if you lack any relevant professional expertise, as I expect is the case.

Yes, actually.

Passing strange? I had it really hard. I slept in a car to make it through finals. All I had were loans, small scholarships, and several cobbled-together part-time jobs to get my degree.

It would be passing strange if I didn't cast the fisheye at this makeshift story. It's insulting to people who really were doing their best despite overwhelming circumstances, and -- most importantly -- did NOT lie or grift to get through.

We get it. The chip on your shoulder is bigger than anyone else's and you are incapable of empathy for anyone who doesn't match your story of hardship.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The prosecutor's damning assessment and cousin Colleen's account don't fit the narrative.

Quick, throw up a smokescreen! If you go on the attack, then they are on the defense. Post, like, five or six times in a row and -- well, you got it down, now.

Just don't mention anything about that lie on the application, though -- the one where she is supposedly providing for a disabled sister and needs more money. Maybe they will forget about it.

This. It's very common for trial lawyers to do this - set up a story in advance of settlement or a trial to make the defendant look bad. It's called "Trying the Case in the Media" and it's done all the time. Interestingly,t he Oxford Blues said today in an interview with her that she had an agreement with the New Yorker that she wouldn't talk to any other publication until the New Yorker piece came out. That tells she may have sold the story. In any event, a story like this is aimed to put pressure on Penn to settle - or if they don't settle - to taint the jury. Very common.

I do hope it goes to trial. The stuff behind the smokescreens comes out at trial.

I highly doubt Penn isn't absolutely certain they have their ducks in a row. As for Fierceton? Trying the case in the media is one thing -- speaking under oath in court is another. It would be interesting.

Reminds me of the 2015 Netflix documentary "Making a Murderer" where millions of gullible saps were bamboozled simply by a couple of charming Ivy League lawyers throwing random smokescreens and pure b.s. at the wall to make two obvious murderers seem innocent and an entire Wisconsin community conspired against them. Obviously in court the outcome was a different story and they were guilty as sin and will rot behind bars where they belong. Just like here, we're to believe the medical doctor mom, mom's boyfriend, county prosecutor, judges, Penn administrators, Penn lawyer, Penn financial aid dept, Rhodes, on and on all randomly conspired against this spoiled young woman. This whole thing and her web of deception makes me laugh out loud it's so outlandish. She apparently has a knack for scoping out easy marks but that dog don't hunt with me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The point about Questbridge reaffirming that her application was legit is really significant. They are the closest thing to a neutral third party in this, and they’re siding with Mackenzie over Penn.

When the prosecutor (and judges?) re-affirmed her mother was innocent and it was the biggest mistake of his career, is that "really significant" or are only the dubious unverified affirmations from nonprofits which go in her favor significant? Please advise.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the mom's boyfriend:
https://stlsportspage.com/2022/01/17/henry-lovelace-owner-of-wild-horse-fitness-passes-away/

Interesting choice for a respected doctor. Anyhow, this is the man she trusted over her daughter. And called the police on in a separate event. This article says he was hard on his clients. He did train with Mackenzie. Do you all believe he was 100% appropriate with her? Does the mom claim the forcible touching did not happen? If so, I missed that.

I’m no fan of tattoos but how can you read that and not come away that he seems like a good man with a decades-long career and two adult kids and even an ex wife who speak very highly of him? Sounds like you have personal biases and motives in play here.

A good man who the mom and other women called the cops on? That’s an obituary not a real bio. I seriously wonder if the mom has hired a pr firm to destroy her daughter for half these posts. Even if your daughter had made all this up wouldn’t you just cut her off after you fought for your innocence? Instead the mom goes to great efforts to sabotage her daughter’s new life. Seems like classic abuser/controller behavior. It comes down to who do you believe, the mom or the daughter. The mom’s behavior is like a psychopath. The daughter probably has issues too but doesn’t deserve a mom like that.

Agreed. It is passing strange that unattached strangers would be so emotionally invested in this story that they would go to such lengths to disparage the daughter on an anonymous message board, and profess to be so emotionally invested in the matter.

Hey, lady, I'm just a DCUM poster, and have been here on and off for 7 years. Ask Jeff, if you want to know. Do you need a link to Website Feedback?

But I was a truly, for-real poor kid who had to scramble to go to higher ed. This young woman's story stinks to high heaven. I don't mind saying so.

Do you have a Masters or PhD in psychology or social work? Expert in the range of psychological effects of trauma and parental abuse in children? Medical degree to explain the need for ICU hospitalization?

As I said, it is passing strange that you and others would be so emotionally invested in disparaging this young woman, particularly if you lack any relevant professional expertise, as I expect is the case.

Yes, actually.

Passing strange? I had it really hard. I slept in a car to make it through finals. All I had were loans, small scholarships, and several cobbled-together part-time jobs to get my degree.

It would be passing strange if I didn't cast the fisheye at this makeshift story. It's insulting to people who really were doing their best despite overwhelming circumstances, and -- most importantly -- did NOT lie or grift to get through.

We get it. The chip on your shoulder is bigger than anyone else's and you are incapable of empathy for anyone who doesn't match your story of hardship.

I don't have a lot of empathy for being a "bit melodramatic" and crafting a whole new narrative to bilk programs out of hundreds of thousands of dollars, no. Sorry about that.

And lest you misinterpret, I'm not the only one making recent posts disparaging her. There's more than one of us, and I suspect several.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the mom's boyfriend:
https://stlsportspage.com/2022/01/17/henry-lovelace-owner-of-wild-horse-fitness-passes-away/

Interesting choice for a respected doctor. Anyhow, this is the man she trusted over her daughter. And called the police on in a separate event. This article says he was hard on his clients. He did train with Mackenzie. Do you all believe he was 100% appropriate with her? Does the mom claim the forcible touching did not happen? If so, I missed that.

I’m no fan of tattoos but how can you read that and not come away that he seems like a good man with a decades-long career and two adult kids and even an ex wife who speak very highly of him? Sounds like you have personal biases and motives in play here.

A good man who the mom and other women called the cops on? That’s an obituary not a real bio. I seriously wonder if the mom has hired a pr firm to destroy her daughter for half these posts. Even if your daughter had made all this up wouldn’t you just cut her off after you fought for your innocence? Instead the mom goes to great efforts to sabotage her daughter’s new life. Seems like classic abuser/controller behavior. It comes down to who do you believe, the mom or the daughter. The mom’s behavior is like a psychopath. The daughter probably has issues too but doesn’t deserve a mom like that.

Agreed. It is passing strange that unattached strangers would be so emotionally invested in this story that they would go to such lengths to disparage the daughter on an anonymous message board, and profess to be so emotionally invested in the matter.

Hey, lady, I'm just a DCUM poster, and have been here on and off for 7 years. Ask Jeff, if you want to know. Do you need a link to Website Feedback?

But I was a truly, for-real poor kid who had to scramble to go to higher ed. This young woman's story stinks to high heaven. I don't mind saying so.

Do you have a Masters or PhD in psychology or social work? Expert in the range of psychological effects of trauma and parental abuse in children? Medical degree to explain the need for ICU hospitalization?

As I said, it is passing strange that you and others would be so emotionally invested in disparaging this young woman, particularly if you lack any relevant professional expertise, as I expect is the case.

Yes, actually.

Passing strange? I had it really hard. I slept in a car to make it through finals. All I had were loans, small scholarships, and several cobbled-together part-time jobs to get my degree.

It would be passing strange if I didn't cast the fisheye at this makeshift story. It's insulting to people who really were doing their best despite overwhelming circumstances, and -- most importantly -- did NOT lie or grift to get through.

Sure, sure. I have not seen any critique of her on this anonymous message board that addresses any aspect of this story from a professionally informed perspective. It's also telling that so many people who know her best stand by her. But you think we should listen to anonymous posters like you instead...

Also, since you claim to have relevant professional expertise, let me ask you something: in your experience, if a girl had suffered the trauma and abuse from her mother that this young woman claims, and if her mother is truly someone who "is just so amazing at getting people to think, feel, and do what she wants,” and "lies better than [McKenzie] can tell the truth" how would you expect that to have impacted the daughter from a developmental standpoint?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The point about Questbridge reaffirming that her application was legit is really significant. They are the closest thing to a neutral third party in this, and they’re siding with Mackenzie over Penn.

When the prosecutor (and judges?) re-affirmed her mother was innocent and it was the biggest mistake of his career, is that "really significant" or are only the dubious unverified affirmations from nonprofits which go in her favor significant? Please advise.

It's only significant in that there are burdens of proof, not guilt or innocence. That's what many folks don't understand. Not guilty is not the same thing as "innocent." And those nonprofits generally have more first-hand, personalized expertise in such matters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is the mom's boyfriend:
https://stlsportspage.com/2022/01/17/henry-lovelace-owner-of-wild-horse-fitness-passes-away/

Interesting choice for a respected doctor. Anyhow, this is the man she trusted over her daughter. And called the police on in a separate event. This article says he was hard on his clients. He did train with Mackenzie. Do you all believe he was 100% appropriate with her? Does the mom claim the forcible touching did not happen? If so, I missed that.

I’m no fan of tattoos but how can you read that and not come away that he seems like a good man with a decades-long career and two adult kids and even an ex wife who speak very highly of him? Sounds like you have personal biases and motives in play here.

A good man who the mom and other women called the cops on? That’s an obituary not a real bio. I seriously wonder if the mom has hired a pr firm to destroy her daughter for half these posts. Even if your daughter had made all this up wouldn’t you just cut her off after you fought for your innocence? Instead the mom goes to great efforts to sabotage her daughter’s new life. Seems like classic abuser/controller behavior. It comes down to who do you believe, the mom or the daughter. The mom’s behavior is like a psychopath. The daughter probably has issues too but doesn’t deserve a mom like that.

Agreed. It is passing strange that unattached strangers would be so emotionally invested in this story that they would go to such lengths to disparage the daughter on an anonymous message board, and profess to be so emotionally invested in the matter.

Hey, lady, I'm just a DCUM poster, and have been here on and off for 7 years. Ask Jeff, if you want to know. Do you need a link to Website Feedback?

But I was a truly, for-real poor kid who had to scramble to go to higher ed. This young woman's story stinks to high heaven. I don't mind saying so.

Do you have a Masters or PhD in psychology or social work? Expert in the range of psychological effects of trauma and parental abuse in children? Medical degree to explain the need for ICU hospitalization?

As I said, it is passing strange that you and others would be so emotionally invested in disparaging this young woman, particularly if you lack any relevant professional expertise, as I expect is the case.

Yes, actually.

Passing strange? I had it really hard. I slept in a car to make it through finals. All I had were loans, small scholarships, and several cobbled-together part-time jobs to get my degree.

It would be passing strange if I didn't cast the fisheye at this makeshift story. It's insulting to people who really were doing their best despite overwhelming circumstances, and -- most importantly -- did NOT lie or grift to get through.

Sure, sure. I have not seen any critique of her on this anonymous message board that addresses any aspect of this story from a professionally informed perspective. It's also telling that so many people who know her best stand by her. But you think we should listen to anonymous posters like you instead...

So you didn't read the 75 page former thread. Okay.

Also, since you claim to have relevant professional expertise, let me ask you something: in your experience, if a girl had suffered the trauma and abuse from her mother that this young woman claims, and if her mother is truly someone who "is just so amazing at getting people to think, feel, and do what she wants,” and "lies better than [McKenzie] can tell the truth" how would you expect that to have impacted the daughter from a developmental standpoint?

I wouldn't be surprised if she came out with a narrative that wasn't consistent with the facts of the matter, convinced herself of falsehoods, presented with pseudoseizures and psych issues that warranted a feeding tube, and doubled down when challenged.

I wouldn't be surprised if she lied about her medical history but was not directly challenged on those lies by her medical professionals. That's how HIPAA works -- she can say what she likes, and they can't contradict even bald-faced lies.

Sorry again. You asked.