Teacher might quit

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Many of you seem to be unfamiliar with IDEA, the Individuals with disabilities education act. If you are unfamiliar with educational law and policy you have no business pretending you know how to fix the system. Some people are so desperate for tax payers to fund their child’s private education and it is so transparent.

IDEA is the biggest scam ever to be perpetuated by federal law. Pass a comprehensive law to benefit the most vulnerable among us that will require significant resources and manpower, and then steadfastly refuse to fund all but the bare minimum at the federal level. And then blame localities when there are not enough resources to enact the provisions of the law.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Some people seem to think special education is a place you are sent to avoid troubling all the “normal kids”. It is not. Special education is an escalating series of supports designed to minimize the impact of a student’s disability on their ability to access the grade level curriculum. Every student is entitled to this, including those who are disruptive. Removing a student from their least restrictive environment requires lots of documentation and evidence that the school implemented different interventions without success. This includes the support of a 1:1 in the classroom.

The issue is that it has become too difficult to move a child out of the classroom when they are disrupting other kids learning. It is not acceptable that a child is allowed to remain in a classroom where other kids need to be removed for their own safety on a regular basis. It is not acceptable that a child is allowed to remain in a classroom where other kids leaning is ignored because the child is melting down. That environment is not good for the child in question or the other kids in the classroom.

I don't want to see kids warehoused and just pushed through school. I think kids should have the best chance to access an education but I don't think that should come at the cost of interfering with other kids ability to learn as well. And you cannot tell me that the kid who is melting down or damaging property on a regular basis is getting their needs met in that environment. The pendulum has swung too far in the other direction.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And yet we still have the reality that teachers and other school staff are leaving in droves. This means students who are still in public schools, whether their parents want them there or not, whether their parents wish vouchers were going to happen or not, will keep losing out. Just like patients in hospitals are losing out due to a severe nursing shortage, which is becoming worse, because dumb ass people won't get vaccinated, won't vaccinate their children, refuse to wear masks and generally let their own stupidity wreak havoc on other people like they don't have a care in the world.

I know that most people feel like the needs of their own children come before our collective responsibility to the greater social good. I personally don't hold that worldview. But you do you. I guess as long as your family gets what it believes it is entitled to, that's all that matters.

How exactly have you personally put the greater social good above the needs of your own children? This is empty virtue signaling at the highest degree. Of course talk is cheap in reality you’ve done absolutely nothing, but feel entitled to shame other parents. As if you should just send your kid to a school where 20% of kids achieve grade level proficiency, otherwise you’re selfish.

Oh, the greater social good, it’s funny how it lines up with the political agenda and talking points of the party you sympathize with! Nobody is checking if the greater social good is actually greater bs, we just have to take your word for it. How about the greater social good is the sum of goods of all individuals and we let them decide on their own what that is.

Yes, I sent my own children to a low income, low performing K-8 and high school. They both are in college on full ride scholarships. One had an SAT of 1550 and the other 1580. Low performing schools do not harm smart, hard working students. I also put the greater social good above my own needs. I teach in one of those schools instead of all the other offers I had in public schools in wealthy areas. I also spend a few thousand dollars out of my own pocket to ensure other people's children get what they need in my classroom, including tutoring any student of mine who wants it over the summer for free. What are you doing to ensure our society succeeds?

Welcome to the internet, where everyone is Mother Theresa, and their children are geniuses. When you say “Low performing schools do not harm smart, hard working students” are you implying that the vast majority of the rest of the students are lazy and dumb, unlike your kids? There are many studies that show low performing schools harm good students, you are 100% bs-ing. How could they not if you’re trying to teach pre algebra and half the students haven’t mastered even fractions yet? On top of that you deal with chronic absentees, behavioral issues, sometimes violence, but do not despair, you just need to work hard. Praise lord for your free summer tutoring, never heard of that in real life where teachers charge $100/h, but I’m glad I found that one selfless teacher in this thread. Your fake claims are embarrassing. Even more embarrassing is you belief that volunteering for a cause or donating some money means you are putting the society’s needs above your own. God, you sound so annoyingly pretentious! Guess what, many people volunteer and donate, you’re not that special.

Okay troll, now I know you are a troll. Buh-bye.

[Anonymous]

On a related note, my grade level colleague just put in her notice for the year. Her kids are in a different school district and they've had to quarantine now 3 times. She and her husband decided it is just too difficult for her to keep taking off to be with them (he can't). So she's put in her notice as of last Friday. Her class will have a rotating set of subs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many of you seem to be unfamiliar with IDEA, the Individuals with disabilities education act. If you are unfamiliar with educational law and policy you have no business pretending you know how to fix the system. Some people are so desperate for tax payers to fund their child’s private education and it is so transparent.

IDEA is the biggest scam ever to be perpetuated by federal law. Pass a comprehensive law to benefit the most vulnerable among us that will require significant resources and manpower, and then steadfastly refuse to fund all but the bare minimum at the federal level. And then blame localities when there are not enough resources to enact the provisions of the law.

Bingo. An absolutely impossible unfunded mandate. Stop yelling at individual teachers and local school districts and start yelling at Congress and Education Department.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many of you seem to be unfamiliar with IDEA, the Individuals with disabilities education act. If you are unfamiliar with educational law and policy you have no business pretending you know how to fix the system. Some people are so desperate for tax payers to fund their child’s private education and it is so transparent.

IDEA is the biggest scam ever to be perpetuated by federal law. Pass a comprehensive law to benefit the most vulnerable among us that will require significant resources and manpower, and then steadfastly refuse to fund all but the bare minimum at the federal level. And then blame localities when there are not enough resources to enact the provisions of the law.

Not to mention that it screws 90% of kids by ensuring that at least a couple of entire years of their education will be wasted since their classes contain kids that just can’t function in a mainstream setting - no matter the supports! - without negatively affecting the rest of the class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:And yet we still have the reality that teachers and other school staff are leaving in droves. This means students who are still in public schools, whether their parents want them there or not, whether their parents wish vouchers were going to happen or not, will keep losing out. Just like patients in hospitals are losing out due to a severe nursing shortage, which is becoming worse, because dumb ass people won't get vaccinated, won't vaccinate their children, refuse to wear masks and generally let their own stupidity wreak havoc on other people like they don't have a care in the world.

I know that most people feel like the needs of their own children come before our collective responsibility to the greater social good. I personally don't hold that worldview. But you do you. I guess as long as your family gets what it believes it is entitled to, that's all that matters.

How exactly have you personally put the greater social good above the needs of your own children? This is empty virtue signaling at the highest degree. Of course talk is cheap in reality you’ve done absolutely nothing, but feel entitled to shame other parents. As if you should just send your kid to a school where 20% of kids achieve grade level proficiency, otherwise you’re selfish.

Oh, the greater social good, it’s funny how it lines up with the political agenda and talking points of the party you sympathize with! Nobody is checking if the greater social good is actually greater bs, we just have to take your word for it. How about the greater social good is the sum of goods of all individuals and we let them decide on their own what that is.

Yes, I sent my own children to a low income, low performing K-8 and high school. They both are in college on full ride scholarships. One had an SAT of 1550 and the other 1580. Low performing schools do not harm smart, hard working students. I also put the greater social good above my own needs. I teach in one of those schools instead of all the other offers I had in public schools in wealthy areas. I also spend a few thousand dollars out of my own pocket to ensure other people's children get what they need in my classroom, including tutoring any student of mine who wants it over the summer for free. What are you doing to ensure our society succeeds?

Welcome to the internet, where everyone is Mother Theresa, and their children are geniuses. When you say “Low performing schools do not harm smart, hard working students” are you implying that the vast majority of the rest of the students are lazy and dumb, unlike your kids? There are many studies that show low performing schools harm good students, you are 100% bs-ing. How could they not if you’re trying to teach pre algebra and half the students haven’t mastered even fractions yet? On top of that you deal with chronic absentees, behavioral issues, sometimes violence, but do not despair, you just need to work hard. Praise lord for your free summer tutoring, never heard of that in real life where teachers charge $100/h, but I’m glad I found that one selfless teacher in this thread. Your fake claims are embarrassing. Even more embarrassing is you belief that volunteering for a cause or donating some money means you are putting the society’s needs above your own. God, you sound so annoyingly pretentious! Guess what, many people volunteer and donate, you’re not that special.

Okay troll, now I know you are a troll. Buh-bye.

Be honest and we’re good.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many of you seem to be unfamiliar with IDEA, the Individuals with disabilities education act. If you are unfamiliar with educational law and policy you have no business pretending you know how to fix the system. Some people are so desperate for tax payers to fund their child’s private education and it is so transparent.

IDEA is the biggest scam ever to be perpetuated by federal law. Pass a comprehensive law to benefit the most vulnerable among us that will require significant resources and manpower, and then steadfastly refuse to fund all but the bare minimum at the federal level. And then blame localities when there are not enough resources to enact the provisions of the law.

Not to mention that it screws 90% of kids by ensuring that at least a couple of entire years of their education will be wasted since their classes contain kids that just can’t function in a mainstream setting - no matter the supports! - without negatively affecting the rest of the class.

Everyone (mostly) agrees it’s a broken system. What is the solution?

A. More money. We’re 5th in the world on a per student basis, but it can’t hurt.
B. Reform from the inside. Superintendents and politicians will implement a great education system that puts student needs first.
C. Option for parents to educate their kids in any school they want
D. It’s great as it is, go to private if you don’t like it.

[Anonymous]

Has the teacher quit OP?

[Anonymous]

Everyone agrees the problem is the stress that struggling students - either behavior or academic, but usually they are the same student - put on the teachers and the system as a whole. Every teacher in a title I school can tell you that (like me).

But maybe there is no solution because the problem is not education to begin with. The problem is poverty. But instead of addressing the real problem, we pretend somehow problems that are brought into the schools BY poverty are somehow created in the schools, and that therefore the schools can fix them.

We can't. Schools don't cause the problem, and they can't be the solution. Address poverty, and we'll be fine. But that would be a lot harder than scapegoating teachers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many of you seem to be unfamiliar with IDEA, the Individuals with disabilities education act. If you are unfamiliar with educational law and policy you have no business pretending you know how to fix the system. Some people are so desperate for tax payers to fund their child’s private education and it is so transparent.

IDEA is the biggest scam ever to be perpetuated by federal law. Pass a comprehensive law to benefit the most vulnerable among us that will require significant resources and manpower, and then steadfastly refuse to fund all but the bare minimum at the federal level. And then blame localities when there are not enough resources to enact the provisions of the law.

Not to mention that it screws 90% of kids by ensuring that at least a couple of entire years of their education will be wasted since their classes contain kids that just can’t function in a mainstream setting - no matter the supports! - without negatively affecting the rest of the class.

Everyone (mostly) agrees it’s a broken system. What is the solution?

A. More money. We’re 5th in the world on a per student basis, but it can’t hurt.
B. Reform from the inside. Superintendents and politicians will implement a great education system that puts student needs first.
C. Option for parents to educate their kids in any school they want
D. It’s great as it is, go to private if you don’t like it.

I don’t believe we’re 5th in the world on per student spending. I think it’s number 1. Where are you getting that stat?

And more money doesn’t help. Even if you had a 1:1 aide for every violent or disruptive kid, that doesn’t stop them being violent or disruptive. Nobody can handcuff them to the desks or tape their mouth closed. More money doesn’t help when kids just can’t function in a mainstream environment.

The solution is (E) bringing back special schools for kids with disabilities that prevent them from functioning in a mainstream class without negatively affecting the other kids. And that’s the ONLY solution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many of you seem to be unfamiliar with IDEA, the Individuals with disabilities education act. If you are unfamiliar with educational law and policy you have no business pretending you know how to fix the system. Some people are so desperate for tax payers to fund their child’s private education and it is so transparent.

IDEA is the biggest scam ever to be perpetuated by federal law. Pass a comprehensive law to benefit the most vulnerable among us that will require significant resources and manpower, and then steadfastly refuse to fund all but the bare minimum at the federal level. And then blame localities when there are not enough resources to enact the provisions of the law.

Not to mention that it screws 90% of kids by ensuring that at least a couple of entire years of their education will be wasted since their classes contain kids that just can’t function in a mainstream setting - no matter the supports! - without negatively affecting the rest of the class.

Everyone (mostly) agrees it’s a broken system. What is the solution?

A. More money. We’re 5th in the world on a per student basis, but it can’t hurt.
B. Reform from the inside. Superintendents and politicians will implement a great education system that puts student needs first.
C. Option for parents to educate their kids in any school they want
D. It’s great as it is, go to private if you don’t like it.

I don’t believe we’re 5th in the world on per student spending. I think it’s number 1. Where are you getting that stat?

And more money doesn’t help. Even if you had a 1:1 aide for every violent or disruptive kid, that doesn’t stop them being violent or disruptive. Nobody can handcuff them to the desks or tape their mouth closed. More money doesn’t help when kids just can’t function in a mainstream environment.

The solution is (E) bringing back special schools for kids with disabilities that prevent them from functioning in a mainstream class without negatively affecting the other kids. And that’s the ONLY solution.

We spend less then Luxemburg, Norway, Austria, and Iceland.

I agree with the bolded part, with the caveat that many student with disabilities can function in a regir class just fine. The revisions need to take into account the benefit to all students, not just a marginal improvement for one.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/238733/expenditure-on-education-by-country/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Everyone agrees the problem is the stress that struggling students - either behavior or academic, but usually they are the same student - put on the teachers and the system as a whole. Every teacher in a title I school can tell you that (like me).

But maybe there is no solution because the problem is not education to begin with. The problem is poverty. But instead of addressing the real problem, we pretend somehow problems that are brought into the schools BY poverty are somehow created in the schools, and that therefore the schools can fix them.

We can't. Schools don't cause the problem, and they can't be the solution. Address poverty, and we'll be fine. But that would be a lot harder than scapegoating teachers.

Part of the problem is poverty and lack of resources. But as far as I know, there’s no society at any point in time or anywhere in the world that got rid of poverty. The issue is that kids in those schools can’t wait, a few years spent in a low performing school and their education is ruined. If they get one-two grade behind in English and math, most will play catch up for the rest of the time they are in school, and likely never recover, likely will never be ready for college. We accept this too easily, and we do nothing to remedy their situation.

Teachers don’t have the personal power to change anything, and in general people don’t fault individuals, unless they come to this forum with a bad attitude of “you just want free babysitting”, “go to private if you don’t like it”, “all we are required to do is the bare minimum”.

The “teacher scapegoating” as you call it, is actually dissatisfaction with our educational system, with the teacher union being at the center. Both because the union fought hard to keep schools closed even when evidence suggested otherwise, but also because its involvement in politics (in my view they should stay out of politics) and culture war (e.g. CRT, again they should just stay out of the controversial topics).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I wonder whose idea it was to have integrated classrooms with no support.

I guess the support dwindled over time. Eons ago, I was an EA. (Called paras now?) I worked mainly with one child to manage behavior. I sat right beside him most of the day. I was able to head off any outbursts, and minimize distractions. If he was working well I could go around and help other kids with reading, or whatever they were working on.

Now, that child would be in the classroom with no support.. He would start kicking his feet.. Then drum on his desk. Then start singing. He needed someone to help him focus. Fortunately his physical outbursts were rare. But, that one kid could be quite a distraction and take up a lot of time all on his own.

Teachers need more support, period.

That’s what he would do? I have at least 6 in a class of 26 that do things like that non-stop and none are special needs students.

That was his starting point. It escalated from there. He was 5 1/2 with the maturity of a 3 year old. He was known to throw things, scream, and bite before they hired an EA for him. As I said, this was ages ago. Some might be surprised by the fact that those behaviors haven't always been tolerated. Some of the crap we see now would have had kids removed from the classroom. We were actually allowed to do that.

That kid needs to be removed from the regular class and put in a separate one. We can’t sacrifice the learning of the 25 other students for some doubtful outcome of a troubled student.

Just to show how messed up the schools are at my child’s they hired a mental health counselor, but they don’t have a science teacher.

He didn't need to be removed, he needed in class support.

As in one dedicated teacher to distract the troubled kid so that the rest can do their reading?

Sorry, but with the limited resources schools have, that’s just not a sensible approach.

What would you do? If teachers can't have the level of in class support that is needed, then maybe we need to go back to separate classrooms? Integrated classrooms without support doesn't work. Separate classrooms cause some parents to scream about inequality.

I didn't merely distract him. I worked with him to do his work, on his level. He had a modified lesson plan that the special ed teacher developed.

Sorry, I still don’t see how it makes sense. The student can’t read at 5th grade level, he has a different lesson plan, and a dedicated teacher is brought in to work with him. Nevertheless he stays in the same class, though it doesn’t seem there’s much interaction with the rest of the students, or any overlap in the curriculum. You get him to read a text at second grade level, and that’s integration and support.

I weep for the kids in that school. The only solution I see is a voucher system, so they at least have a chance to get an education somewhere else.

Disgusting and shameful that you think that having to work alongside people with disabilities is a tragedy. They are entitled to full inclusion. It is not an indication that the government should be giving YOU money that a child with (mild) special needs is allowed to stay in their educational environment. You need to take a long hard look in the mirror.

Aren’t you filled with righteous indignation?
Yes, it is shameful that kids reading three grades ahead are put in the same class with kids barely sounding out words. And it is a tragedy, because this setup will not help either of them, on the contrary it will hurt both. How did you decide that my child’s needs are mild?!! What does that even mean? And you have the nerve to talk about disgusting and shameful. Sped kids are not entitled to any kind of inclusion you personally come up with. We don’t decide they are entitled to a seat in an AP class and have an aid work with them on the side on the basics.
You seem to have your facts wrong, I am giving the government money, not the other way around! Every time I pay my taxes. I want a decent education in return for my child. If the school can’t deliver on it, they should get out of the way, and let another school do it.

You have no idea what you are talking about. Federal education law dictates that the child DOES have the right to full inclusion. Are you completely unfamiliar with IDEA? Why are you talking about something that you don’t understand? Your child does not have the right to a segregated high achieving class. They all have the right to exposure to the grade level curriculum. If you feel that your child would benefit from being sheltered from reality and diversity, you can pay for that privilege.

My child would most definitely benefit from being sheltered from poorly performing schools. I’m going to suggest this: you send your kid to that school where education means “exposure to grade level curriculum”. Where is the accountability if all you need to do is provide exposure?
You are either silly or dishonest here trying to hide behind the federal regulations. The schools are a disaster because feds made us do it. The point about sped is just to illustrate an example of poor choices that result in a school environment that is not conducive to learning. My child has the right to a good learning environment the rich take for granted. If the public school can’t provide it, I should have the option to take that public support to the institution of my choice.

You have a right to an education, nothing more nothing less.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Many of you seem to be unfamiliar with IDEA, the Individuals with disabilities education act. If you are unfamiliar with educational law and policy you have no business pretending you know how to fix the system. Some people are so desperate for tax payers to fund their child’s private education and it is so transparent.

IDEA is the biggest scam ever to be perpetuated by federal law. Pass a comprehensive law to benefit the most vulnerable among us that will require significant resources and manpower, and then steadfastly refuse to fund all but the bare minimum at the federal level. And then blame localities when there are not enough resources to enact the provisions of the law.

Not to mention that it screws 90% of kids by ensuring that at least a couple of entire years of their education will be wasted since their classes contain kids that just can’t function in a mainstream setting - no matter the supports! - without negatively affecting the rest of the class.

Everyone (mostly) agrees it’s a broken system. What is the solution?

A. More money. We’re 5th in the world on a per student basis, but it can’t hurt.
B. Reform from the inside. Superintendents and politicians will implement a great education system that puts student needs first.
C. Option for parents to educate their kids in any school they want
D. It’s great as it is, go to private if you don’t like it.

I don’t believe we’re 5th in the world on per student spending. I think it’s number 1. Where are you getting that stat?

And more money doesn’t help. Even if you had a 1:1 aide for every violent or disruptive kid, that doesn’t stop them being violent or disruptive. Nobody can handcuff them to the desks or tape their mouth closed. More money doesn’t help when kids just can’t function in a mainstream environment.

The solution is (E) bringing back special schools for kids with disabilities that prevent them from functioning in a mainstream class without negatively affecting the other kids. And that’s the ONLY solution.

Well, good luck changing that federal law…it’s never going to happen…because it’s called segregation.