Upper elementary at a Title 1 school
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Anonymous
OP here. Absolutely not. People leave even though they claim to be happy because of middle school concerns and fear of demographics in upper grades. Middle school is the biggest rub in getting retention in upper grades in a lot of these schools. This thread discusses most of the schools I think of when thinking about "solid but ignored." Another is Marie Reed which is next to impossible to get into OOB with solid scores for the population, but doesn't have a "desirable" middle school. https://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/997857.page#20746542 They're similar to how Bancroft and Shepherd (and probably a bunch of Capitol Hill schools) were 5-10 years ago, but don't have the Wilson feed that those two schools maintain. I don't know the answer to that, but I can't blame parents that leave for a more established middle and high school pathway. As I said on page 1, we'll be out of the area by middle school, so that's not a concern for us personally, but it does impact attrition in the upper grades (except at Marie Reed apparently?). |
Anonymous
Our charter last year any family who wanted hybrid in our 1st grade got it and it was 4 full days a week. Anyone who makes blanket statements of DCPS and charters have legit credibility |
Anonymous
Agreed. It varied so much between DCPS schools and individual charters. It also seems irrelevant at this point since it seems unlikely a new wave will hit before the child vaccine is approved. |
Anonymous
| Not irrelevant to us. I no longer trust DC charters to collectively blaze ahead with teaching and learning even as DCPS families are crushed en masse by bureaucratic inertia and teachers union prerogatives in the face of a crisis threatening the provision of educational services city wide. Covid has taught us that charter leaders and faculties may, or may not bother to rise to the occasion to serve kids when DCPS does a poor job of it. |
Anonymous
Well, I've kind of lost track of your point. But it does seem that Marie Reed has less 5th graders than it has 4th graders so it probably has a typical attrition pattern. And I don't know why you would say it's "ignored"-- it had 162 English dominant applicants for PK3 this year. It doesn't come up a lot on this board because it's a smaller school so few current parents, and makes few lottery offers so not very many people ask here for decisionmaking help. But not coming up very often on DCUM can be a mark of quality 
Can you try to wrap your head around the idea that people *are* happy with the elementary school, but still leave for another middle school? They're not just claiming to be happy, they really are happy with it. Or maybe they're lying to you because they think you'll be judgey, I dunno. Also, people move their oldest child to middle school upon graduation and they sometimes want to move younger children there too if they can, or to something better for their new commute. For example if someone went to Capital City or Inspired Teaching for 6th, they might move the whole family. Sometimes people leave even though they really, truly, are happy with the school as an elementary. |
Anonymous
Oh I completely agree, but this is literally the risk you took when you chose a charter over DCPS. I don't think many of us that prefer DCPS despite the bureaucracy was surprised that some charters did better and others dropped the ball completely. I think it was enlightening that many, though not all, charter parents didn't actually realize this and assumed that their charter would do better because it was a charter. There are some great charters out there, but everyone should take a "trust but verify" approach to any claim a school is making. |
Anonymous
Typo don’t have not have |
Anonymous
OP here. That's exactly my point. If I had just said "they're happy" someone would reply and say "they're not really, they're secretly lotterying and lying to your face." I mean, PP said "If it really is a good school, giving it a try should make people *more* likely to stay, right?" PPs were skeptical that there really are any "solid" schools that aren't actually a "hot mess." My point is that there are plenty, but people leave them anyways for reasons other than the school being a hot mess. Like I said, the biggest one is middle school, but I also hear anticipatory concerns about academics and/or demographics in upper grades. And you're right, Marie Reed is like Bancroft or Shepherd despite it not having the Wilson feed. I put that in the wrong paragraph accidentally. There are schools in DCPS that people avoided a few years ago (Marie Reed, Bancroft, Shepherd, Capitol Hill elementaries) that I think are pretty comparable to a number of DCPS schools currently (Whittier, West, Takoma, Powell, Bruce Monroe, Langley, etc.). I'm not saying every one of those schools will turn into the next Shepherd, I'm just saying that just because they have OOB seats now doesn't mean that they're not solid schools with stable administrators, teachers, and academics. |
Anonymous
| OP again. And I think this year is as good as any to prove that families aren't really secretly lotterying and lying about it. Charters are clearing waitlists and going way farther than in previous years. The fact that these "solid but ignored" schools didn't see a mass exodus to HRCS means that families weren't actually quietly lotterying for those schools every year. |
Anonymous
| OP, what people on the Hill did was try to engage in improving their middle school. It's a long, long, long, long story. And the history of Deal and Hardy goes way back too. But really, that's the path forward. Feeder elementary parents trying to support their middle school and advocate for better support from DCPS. Have you thought about getting involved? You might find it really rewarding. |
Anonymous
OP again. Oh I know, I have friends that went to Deal 20+ years ago and can tell you how it's changed. Our family is moving out of the area in about 5 years, but I totally agree and hear a lot of parent talk about this at our school. It's tricky because Wells and MacFarland dual language program are both new and a lot of parents of younger kids speak very optimistically about the on-paper offerings. I'm not green enough to think that these parents will send their kids to those schools en masse, but it will be interesting to see whether a cohort do. We won't be here to see it, but I don't think it's impossible and would end up even being good for those charter families' property values! |
Anonymous
In my experience it's a very, very, very slow and gradual process. But I think you just need to accept that some people care a lot about getting settled in a feeder pattern and some people are more willing to figure things out later or just don't care. |
Anonymous
Do you mean those DCPS parents' property values? |
Anonymous
No! I mean everyone's property values. Even those parents that sent their kids to charters and stayed in the neighborhood while the rest of us put in the work to make neighborhood schools better/more popular. And not even "us" since I know we won't actually be around when push comes to shove (meaning middle school). |
Anonymous
Then why are you posting about this??? You are literally part of the problem you purport to care about. And I don't know what your reason is for leaving DC in 5 years, but it's obnoxious to accuse parents who are NOT leaving in 5 years of racism because they are not staying at an IB school or feeder pattern that you yourself have no intention of staying for. I think if you have one kid in PK or K in DCPS (or a charter) you need to learn to make your choices and then STFU about everyone else's. I just don't think you have the perspective necessary to understand that there is a lot of diversity of situations. Yes, there are definitely some white people who go to charters because they just don't want their kids around a bunch of black kids. Of course that happens. There are also people with kids with IEPs who choose DCPS specifically because they are skeptical charters will serve them well. There are people who choose charters because of language immersion, and sometimes it's just a desire for their kid to be dual lingual, and sometimes it's trying to ensure your child speaks the language your parents speak. There are people who choose charters because they are actually more convenient to their commutes than their IB school. There are people who succumb to peer pressure to leave their IB because family or peers keep telling them it isn't good enough. And there are other people who leave because of actual bad experiences after several years in the school, who simply decide to give it a go somewhere else. It is so, so easy when you've done one or two lotteries and have experienced nothing but the (generally pretty universal solid) PK program at a DCPS to think you have the whole school system sorted out and you know what everyone needs and you understand everyone's motivations. You don't. And it's particularly annoying to do this when you don't even have a long term investment in the district, when the question of middle school and high school (which is CENTRAL to this entire conversation, as should be clear by now) and are just idly speculating. |