Abortion messaging needs to change

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Here's the thing with abortion as a "lifestyle choice". Things happen.

Birth control fails.

Sometimes the circumstances after we get pregnant change and it is no longer a good option to have a baby, ie: the father leaves, job loss, etc.

Also, we are humans, mistakes happen, and there are some women who just do not have the capacity to raise a child.

Either way, as a Christian, the Bible tells us, "Judge not, that ye be not judged."

Abortion laws should not be determined based on who should have one and who shouldn't. It makes every women go through some sort of test as to whether or not she should be allowed to have an abortion. This is already a devastating situation for women to walk into an abortion clinic or hospital, and to have that extra layer of trauma is just cruel. Just let women live their lives.

Yep, which is why I have repeatedly said that abortion should be legal, safe, and rare.

You seem to be in favor of lifestyle abortions. Im not, but I respect your right to make your own choice. Which is why the law should allow for each of us to make our own choice.

But the democrats don’t want abortion to be rare, and they oppose the Hyde amendment so they want you to pay for it.

You’re misinformed and deliberately obtuse. And this is why people are getting indignant with you OP. It’s almost as if you’re concern trolling.

Democrats dropped the rare wording and have continually sought to drop the Hyde amendment but such attempts were thwarted. Where exactly do you get your news from? Try widening your media outlets to keep updated.

Here’s Vox on the pressure to drop the “rare” wording

https://www.vox.com/2019/10/18/20917406/abortion-safe-legal-and-rare-tulsi-gabbard

Here’s NPR on just one of Biden’s attempts to drop Hyde

https://www.npr.org/2021/05/31/1001881788/bidens-budget-proposal-reverses-a-decades-long-ban-on-abortion-funding

From your article:
“During the lead up to the 2020 Democratic presidential primary, Biden reversed his longtime position on Hyde, joining other Deocratic hopefuls in saying he would work to overturn it.

“If I believe healthcare is a right, as I do, I can no longer support an amendment that makes that right dependent on someone’s zip code,” Biden said in June 2019.”

My god, the horror. The horror.

As to your 2019 article: “But over the years, abortion rights advocates have pushed back against the phrase. “Safe, legal, and rare” implies that getting an abortion is something that “you should be apologetic for,” reproductive justice activist Renee Bracey Sherman told Vox. “It places the blame on the person who’s had an abortion, as if they just did something wrong to need one, rather than addressing the systemic issue as to why someone might not be able to have access to consistent health care or contraception.””

Nah, better just to make sure health care is dependent on where in the United States of America a woman lives and we should probably start shaming women for abortion more, too.

Was this some sort of attempt to backtrack from accusing me of being misinformed? If so, it fails. I told you democrats have pulled away from the “rare” wording and I also said they have pushed to do away with Hyde, and provided the receipts.

With Democrats in charge, abortion has gotten more and more rare due to increased health insurance coverage and mandating that health insurance covers contraception.

[Anonymous]

Any anyway, if killing a special needs child because the family can’t cope is not ok, is it ok to kill a baby? And if it’s not ok to kill a newborn baby, why is it ok to kill a fetus?

And if you are ok with killing a special needs fetus at 38 weeks, are you also ok with killing healthy fetuses at 38 weeks?

I am not ok with either.
I am also not ok that collectively speaking we do not give humanity to fetuses who are found to have defects or disabilities. I can certainly understand and have compassion for families that would choose to end such pregnancies, but that does not make it right. We need to do better to support those families raising special needs families. We might better do so if more of us could actually see them.

And if you tell me that I can’t possibly understand the plight of these families, I will tell you that I do, because I was in such a family. I saw my brother being born, and then I saw him diagnosed with a fatal heart defect days later. We were extremely poor, my parents couldn’t afford a hospital birth let alone the bills that came later after the diagnosis. We took my brother home to receive palliative care and he died a few days later. It was hard for all of us, and horrible for my mom. But not one of us can imagine that it would have been less horrible for her to abort.
We treasured our few days with my brother.

I gave birth to healthy children but have families around us where this was not so. I cannot imagine those children not being here, or being less valuable. Remember that any person could become disabled at any time in their life. That does not diminish their humanity.

[Anonymous]

None of thi# matters national ban is coming
14 th amendment is where they are ho8ng Hawleys shit lying crappy wife will hav3 the case in front of scouts

Mike Flynn is planning a holy war
Ivan is now expecting a job in the Trump administration of special enforcement ie hanging reporters and pelosi and Biden etc

You think I’m wrong ?

Listen when the6 speak

Kevin Roberts heritage foundation is speaking
Loudly

Buckle up ladies you are about to lose everything including your right to vote the6 are going to change how we use the constitution

Constitutional convention yep it’s a thing and they are going to do it watch Maga Mike will be president ugh

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Any anyway, if killing a special needs child because the family can’t cope is not ok, is it ok to kill a baby? And if it’s not ok to kill a newborn baby, why is it ok to kill a fetus?

And if you are ok with killing a special needs fetus at 38 weeks, are you also ok with killing healthy fetuses at 38 weeks?

I am not ok with either.
I am also not ok that collectively speaking we do not give humanity to fetuses who are found to have defects or disabilities. I can certainly understand and have compassion for families that would choose to end such pregnancies, but that does not make it right. We need to do better to support those families raising special needs families. We might better do so if more of us could actually see them.

And if you tell me that I can’t possibly understand the plight of these families, I will tell you that I do, because I was in such a family. I saw my brother being born, and then I saw him diagnosed with a fatal heart defect days later. We were extremely poor, my parents couldn’t afford a hospital birth let alone the bills that came later after the diagnosis. We took my brother home to receive palliative care and he died a few days later. It was hard for all of us, and horrible for my mom. But not one of us can imagine that it would have been less horrible for her to abort.
We treasured our few days with my brother.

I gave birth to healthy children but have families around us where this was not so. I cannot imagine those children not being here, or being less valuable. Remember that any person could become disabled at any time in their life. That does not diminish their humanity.

You’re a real crap person. 38 weeks? That doesn’t happen. And also, forcing other humans to risk their life, health, and fertility to carry a baby full term just to watch it die is unfathomable. That’s not your choice to make, and your condescension that they don’t value those much loved and wanted children just because they cannot, for their own reasons whatever they are, carry a dying child to term, is just so cruel. Your scenario is not today’s reality, where a woman discovers a terrible diagnosis of incompatibility with life much earlier than 38 weeks and the untreatable conditions (heart problems are luckily much more treatable now, even in utero) are just that. Risking possible financial ruin, stress on a marriage, health and fertility being risked with each additional day of pregnancy, for a baby that will not live and might suffer for the brief time they do live. It shouldn’t be up to anyone else, not me, not you, not the state, when that’s the situation.

I’m glad your mother found comfort in your sibling’s brief life. But your story is just that, a story and not relevant to another woman’s life and choices.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:OP, DCUM can’t see the point you are making because you said you were a Christian and then they all went blind with rage.

I think you’re right about that. Apparently’ they think freedom of religion applies to everyone except Christians.

Freedom of religion also means that I am free from the influence of YOUR religion as well. Jewish law states that life does not begin at conception, it begins at birth. Why should Christianity overrule Judaism?

Again, Christians can have freedom of religion- they don't have to get abortions. Your religion does NOT get to dictate what others do.

Yep, and that’s exact why the fourth sentence of my original post says that I am not asking anyone to agree with me. That is why I have repeatedly said that I think abortion should be legal for all because we all have such varying views.

Nope. Each state can decide for themselves if they want to have abortion restrictions and at one point. It’s not for some New Yorker to decide what the voters of Alabama want to do about abortion. Don’t like it? Move.

Nope. What I choose to do with my body and uterus is a fundamental right. You can't "states rights" away fundamental rights. See slavery.

You say that, but the law disagrees with you. Sorry!

The law changes. Sorry! Women will get their rights back

The law can absolutely change! There are mechanisms for this. At the federal level, you can push for a constitutional amendment. Good luck getting the states you need for that. And then there’s the state level. By all means, convince the people in deep red states that they should have elective abortions through the third trimester.

The good news is that there aren’t “elective” third trimester (that’s 27 weeks for those ignorant about pregnancy) abortions. So no one needs to go around convincing anyone of that.

But don’t you worry. At some point after some republicans’ daughters or wives have died because of abortion bans then the pendulum will swing back. One can only hope n

Elective abortion in the third trimester are rare but they do happen. Published medical studies on the reasons show it can be due to delays in seeking abortion care, finances, issues with the man in question but yes they do happen.

Third trimester elective abortions? Like hell those happen.

The medical literature is out there. Here is one example.

Perspect Sex Reprod Health. 2022 Jun; 54(2): 38–45. Published online 2022 Apr 10. doi: 10.1363/psrh.12190

“Veronica, a 21‐year‐old Latina woman in the South, also did not realize she was pregnant until she was in the third trimester of pregnancy. Veronica was dating someone new and wanted to get tested for sexually transmitted infections before commencing a sexual relationship with this man. The clinic also ran a pregnancy test, which was positive. Veronica was shocked. She explained that she had no recognizable pregnancy symptoms and had been having a regular period: “It seemed to me like regular periods because it lasted the same amount of time that they would usually last […] and I never got morning sickness. I wasn't lethargic.” Veronica was immediately clear that she did not want to continue the pregnancy and took the first available abortion appointment at the clinic. When Veronica presented for her abortion appointment, the ultrasound worker determined that she was 25 weeks pregnant. Veronica needed an abortion in the third trimester because the fact that she was pregnant was new information to her when she was already 25 weeks pregnant.“

Now put the link to the website where you found that, forced birther.

Can you read? It’s in my post.

No, the link to the website where you found it. I should let you know that I already know where you got it, I just want you to out yourself.

It’s not my job to do the clicking for you. The literature citation was provided.

What literature is “Perspect Sex Reprod Health”? It’s nothing at all, at least not that way, and I sense you have no idea how to find it had the National Right to Life org not spoon fed it to you. Had you actually read the document in Perspectives on Sexual and Reproductive Health you might realize that the author found all of 28 women who had abortions starting at 24 weeks (which is the second trimester and not third) and the author found “two pathways to needing a third-trimester abortion: new information, wherein the respondent learned new information about the pregnancy—such as of an observed serious fetal health issue or that she was pregnant—that made the pregnancy not (or no longer) one she wanted to continue; and barriers to abortion, wherein the respondent was in the third trimester by the time she was able to surmount the obstacles to abortion she faced, including cost, finding a provider, and stigmatization. These two pathways were not wholly distinct and sometimes overlapped.” Furthermore, six of the women had had their abortion more than a year prior.

I could go into more, but you’re a victim of forced birther propaganda.

I’m sorry you aren’t familiar with medical literature but the citation was cited and no it wasn’t “spoon fed” to me by some right to life org. I’m glad you took the time to read the article (there are others) but disappointed at your (weak) attempt to slander me simply for educating you with receipts. It’s literally a cut and paste from the article so not sure what you think you are proving with more citations from it.

The way you spun it, you’d think women were out there in the thousands changing their minds, every day, weeks before birth. You didn’t uncover a single example of a woman who decided to get a truly “I decided I don’t want this pregnancy I’ve been carrying for eight months” elective abortion. Why? Because it doesn’t happen.

And it’s not a weak attempt at slander. You got that garbage fed straight to you from Life News. You might swallow that hook line and sinker, but thinking people do not.

DP, but late abortions of healthy fetuses does happen. It is extremely rare, and not at all representative of what the vast majority of abortions consist of. I don’t think anyone here is claiming there is a significant number of women who just willy nilly decide to have an abortion after carrying for 8 months. But I don’t think that finding out you’re pregnant at 25 weeks and aborting because you want to pursue a new relationship is all that much different.

And does it matter how often it is happening? I doubt this is common, but it does happen. And if it’s morally ok, why would it matter how often it happens? Why would you need to insist it never happens?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Any anyway, if killing a special needs child because the family can’t cope is not ok, is it ok to kill a baby? And if it’s not ok to kill a newborn baby, why is it ok to kill a fetus?

And if you are ok with killing a special needs fetus at 38 weeks, are you also ok with killing healthy fetuses at 38 weeks?

I am not ok with either.
I am also not ok that collectively speaking we do not give humanity to fetuses who are found to have defects or disabilities. I can certainly understand and have compassion for families that would choose to end such pregnancies, but that does not make it right. We need to do better to support those families raising special needs families. We might better do so if more of us could actually see them.

And if you tell me that I can’t possibly understand the plight of these families, I will tell you that I do, because I was in such a family. I saw my brother being born, and then I saw him diagnosed with a fatal heart defect days later. We were extremely poor, my parents couldn’t afford a hospital birth let alone the bills that came later after the diagnosis. We took my brother home to receive palliative care and he died a few days later. It was hard for all of us, and horrible for my mom. But not one of us can imagine that it would have been less horrible for her to abort.
We treasured our few days with my brother.

I gave birth to healthy children but have families around us where this was not so. I cannot imagine those children not being here, or being less valuable. Remember that any person could become disabled at any time in their life. That does not diminish their humanity.

You’re a real crap person. 38 weeks? That doesn’t happen. And also, forcing other humans to risk their life, health, and fertility to carry a baby full term just to watch it die is unfathomable. That’s not your choice to make, and your condescension that they don’t value those much loved and wanted children just because they cannot, for their own reasons whatever they are, carry a dying child to term, is just so cruel. Your scenario is not today’s reality, where a woman discovers a terrible diagnosis of incompatibility with life much earlier than 38 weeks and the untreatable conditions (heart problems are luckily much more treatable now, even in utero) are just that. Risking possible financial ruin, stress on a marriage, health and fertility being risked with each additional day of pregnancy, for a baby that will not live and might suffer for the brief time they do live. It shouldn’t be up to anyone else, not me, not you, not the state, when that’s the situation.

I’m glad your mother found comfort in your sibling’s brief life. But your story is just that, a story and not relevant to another woman’s life and choices.

It’s euthanasia.
I don’t support euthanasia.
I believe on a deep level that we should not take human lives, ever. We cannot always save them. Sometimes we can only provide pain relief and palliative care. We should also respect life by not prolonging it with invasive treatments. But we should not be actively taking lives.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Any anyway, if killing a special needs child because the family can’t cope is not ok, is it ok to kill a baby? And if it’s not ok to kill a newborn baby, why is it ok to kill a fetus?

And if you are ok with killing a special needs fetus at 38 weeks, are you also ok with killing healthy fetuses at 38 weeks?

I am not ok with either.
I am also not ok that collectively speaking we do not give humanity to fetuses who are found to have defects or disabilities. I can certainly understand and have compassion for families that would choose to end such pregnancies, but that does not make it right. We need to do better to support those families raising special needs families. We might better do so if more of us could actually see them.

And if you tell me that I can’t possibly understand the plight of these families, I will tell you that I do, because I was in such a family. I saw my brother being born, and then I saw him diagnosed with a fatal heart defect days later. We were extremely poor, my parents couldn’t afford a hospital birth let alone the bills that came later after the diagnosis. We took my brother home to receive palliative care and he died a few days later. It was hard for all of us, and horrible for my mom. But not one of us can imagine that it would have been less horrible for her to abort.
We treasured our few days with my brother.

I gave birth to healthy children but have families around us where this was not so. I cannot imagine those children not being here, or being less valuable. Remember that any person could become disabled at any time in their life. That does not diminish their humanity.

You’re a real crap person. 38 weeks? That doesn’t happen. And also, forcing other humans to risk their life, health, and fertility to carry a baby full term just to watch it die is unfathomable. That’s not your choice to make, and your condescension that they don’t value those much loved and wanted children just because they cannot, for their own reasons whatever they are, carry a dying child to term, is just so cruel. Your scenario is not today’s reality, where a woman discovers a terrible diagnosis of incompatibility with life much earlier than 38 weeks and the untreatable conditions (heart problems are luckily much more treatable now, even in utero) are just that. Risking possible financial ruin, stress on a marriage, health and fertility being risked with each additional day of pregnancy, for a baby that will not live and might suffer for the brief time they do live. It shouldn’t be up to anyone else, not me, not you, not the state, when that’s the situation.

I’m glad your mother found comfort in your sibling’s brief life. But your story is just that, a story and not relevant to another woman’s life and choices.

And you didn’t answer my question. 38 weeks? Ok or not, and why?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The middle on abortion is so offensive to women. It implies that a bunch of old men who legislate things have to protect women from just getting abortions willy-nilly, because they want to fit back into their bikinis or they want their wine time and change their mind on pregnancy.

Unplanned pregnancies happen, birth control fails, partner, sabotage birth control, rape happens, the whole deal. So there needs to be legal access to abortion. When you Start talking about the middle it starts to get into that some abortions are criminal and that’s when we start getting into the land of miscarrying becomes a crime.

For women later in the pregnancies… the middle Implies that women are changing their mind willy-nilly, and not seeking an abortion because their life their future fertility is in danger or their babies Life is in danger.

Why can’t we women and medical professionals make these decisions?!?! You think you’re being rational but you sound insane and misogynistic.

Op here. Forgive me if I was unclear. I ABSOLUTELY think women should make this decision along with their support network, if they choose. That’s why I am in the legal, safe, and rare camp.

Legal - women and doctors should not need to worry about being arrested for abortion or suspected abortion.

Safe - goes along with legal. Since women are trusted to make this choice, back-alley abortions become unnecessary.

Rare - The need for abortion is minimized through many avenues - access to BC, education, counseling, promote adaption

My issue is with the messaging. I wish democrats would acknowledge that many Americans think abortion should be legal, but it is not always in line with our personal values. So it is off-putting when they oversimplify and imply that I am against women’s rights if I do not believe women should get abortions as a lifestyle choice. I am not asking for legislation to reflect my views. That would be a slippery slope. I am asking to be considered in the messaging.

You are against women's rights though and I don't care if that hurts your feelings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Any anyway, if killing a special needs child because the family can’t cope is not ok, is it ok to kill a baby? And if it’s not ok to kill a newborn baby, why is it ok to kill a fetus?

And if you are ok with killing a special needs fetus at 38 weeks, are you also ok with killing healthy fetuses at 38 weeks?

I am not ok with either.
I am also not ok that collectively speaking we do not give humanity to fetuses who are found to have defects or disabilities. I can certainly understand and have compassion for families that would choose to end such pregnancies, but that does not make it right. We need to do better to support those families raising special needs families. We might better do so if more of us could actually see them.

And if you tell me that I can’t possibly understand the plight of these families, I will tell you that I do, because I was in such a family. I saw my brother being born, and then I saw him diagnosed with a fatal heart defect days later. We were extremely poor, my parents couldn’t afford a hospital birth let alone the bills that came later after the diagnosis. We took my brother home to receive palliative care and he died a few days later. It was hard for all of us, and horrible for my mom. But not one of us can imagine that it would have been less horrible for her to abort.
We treasured our few days with my brother.

I gave birth to healthy children but have families around us where this was not so. I cannot imagine those children not being here, or being less valuable. Remember that any person could become disabled at any time in their life. That does not diminish their humanity.

What I choose is mine of your effing concern.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Any anyway, if killing a special needs child because the family can’t cope is not ok, is it ok to kill a baby? And if it’s not ok to kill a newborn baby, why is it ok to kill a fetus?

And if you are ok with killing a special needs fetus at 38 weeks, are you also ok with killing healthy fetuses at 38 weeks?

I am not ok with either.
I am also not ok that collectively speaking we do not give humanity to fetuses who are found to have defects or disabilities. I can certainly understand and have compassion for families that would choose to end such pregnancies, but that does not make it right. We need to do better to support those families raising special needs families. We might better do so if more of us could actually see them.

And if you tell me that I can’t possibly understand the plight of these families, I will tell you that I do, because I was in such a family. I saw my brother being born, and then I saw him diagnosed with a fatal heart defect days later. We were extremely poor, my parents couldn’t afford a hospital birth let alone the bills that came later after the diagnosis. We took my brother home to receive palliative care and he died a few days later. It was hard for all of us, and horrible for my mom. But not one of us can imagine that it would have been less horrible for her to abort.
We treasured our few days with my brother.

I gave birth to healthy children but have families around us where this was not so. I cannot imagine those children not being here, or being less valuable. Remember that any person could become disabled at any time in their life. That does not diminish their humanity.

You’re a real crap person. 38 weeks? That doesn’t happen. And also, forcing other humans to risk their life, health, and fertility to carry a baby full term just to watch it die is unfathomable. That’s not your choice to make, and your condescension that they don’t value those much loved and wanted children just because they cannot, for their own reasons whatever they are, carry a dying child to term, is just so cruel. Your scenario is not today’s reality, where a woman discovers a terrible diagnosis of incompatibility with life much earlier than 38 weeks and the untreatable conditions (heart problems are luckily much more treatable now, even in utero) are just that. Risking possible financial ruin, stress on a marriage, health and fertility being risked with each additional day of pregnancy, for a baby that will not live and might suffer for the brief time they do live. It shouldn’t be up to anyone else, not me, not you, not the state, when that’s the situation.

I’m glad your mother found comfort in your sibling’s brief life. But your story is just that, a story and not relevant to another woman’s life and choices.

It’s euthanasia.
I don’t support euthanasia.
I believe on a deep level that we should not take human lives, ever. We cannot always save them. Sometimes we can only provide pain relief and palliative care. We should also respect life by not prolonging it with invasive treatments. But we should not be actively taking lives.

I bet that you are 100% in favor of the death penalty. What if science evolves to the point where it can be determined that a fetus was another Hitler and would finish his Final Solution not only of Jews but include all women after child bearing age. What if this fetus would murder your entire family?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Any anyway, if killing a special needs child because the family can’t cope is not ok, is it ok to kill a baby? And if it’s not ok to kill a newborn baby, why is it ok to kill a fetus?

And if you are ok with killing a special needs fetus at 38 weeks, are you also ok with killing healthy fetuses at 38 weeks?

I am not ok with either.
I am also not ok that collectively speaking we do not give humanity to fetuses who are found to have defects or disabilities. I can certainly understand and have compassion for families that would choose to end such pregnancies, but that does not make it right. We need to do better to support those families raising special needs families. We might better do so if more of us could actually see them.

And if you tell me that I can’t possibly understand the plight of these families, I will tell you that I do, because I was in such a family. I saw my brother being born, and then I saw him diagnosed with a fatal heart defect days later. We were extremely poor, my parents couldn’t afford a hospital birth let alone the bills that came later after the diagnosis. We took my brother home to receive palliative care and he died a few days later. It was hard for all of us, and horrible for my mom. But not one of us can imagine that it would have been less horrible for her to abort.
We treasured our few days with my brother.

I gave birth to healthy children but have families around us where this was not so. I cannot imagine those children not being here, or being less valuable. Remember that any person could become disabled at any time in their life. That does not diminish their humanity.

If it’s not ok to kill a fetus why is it ok to kill a zygote? You tell us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Any anyway, if killing a special needs child because the family can’t cope is not ok, is it ok to kill a baby? And if it’s not ok to kill a newborn baby, why is it ok to kill a fetus?

And if you are ok with killing a special needs fetus at 38 weeks, are you also ok with killing healthy fetuses at 38 weeks?

I am not ok with either.
I am also not ok that collectively speaking we do not give humanity to fetuses who are found to have defects or disabilities. I can certainly understand and have compassion for families that would choose to end such pregnancies, but that does not make it right. We need to do better to support those families raising special needs families. We might better do so if more of us could actually see them.

And if you tell me that I can’t possibly understand the plight of these families, I will tell you that I do, because I was in such a family. I saw my brother being born, and then I saw him diagnosed with a fatal heart defect days later. We were extremely poor, my parents couldn’t afford a hospital birth let alone the bills that came later after the diagnosis. We took my brother home to receive palliative care and he died a few days later. It was hard for all of us, and horrible for my mom. But not one of us can imagine that it would have been less horrible for her to abort.
We treasured our few days with my brother.

I gave birth to healthy children but have families around us where this was not so. I cannot imagine those children not being here, or being less valuable. Remember that any person could become disabled at any time in their life. That does not diminish their humanity.

You’re a real crap person. 38 weeks? That doesn’t happen. And also, forcing other humans to risk their life, health, and fertility to carry a baby full term just to watch it die is unfathomable. That’s not your choice to make, and your condescension that they don’t value those much loved and wanted children just because they cannot, for their own reasons whatever they are, carry a dying child to term, is just so cruel. Your scenario is not today’s reality, where a woman discovers a terrible diagnosis of incompatibility with life much earlier than 38 weeks and the untreatable conditions (heart problems are luckily much more treatable now, even in utero) are just that. Risking possible financial ruin, stress on a marriage, health and fertility being risked with each additional day of pregnancy, for a baby that will not live and might suffer for the brief time they do live. It shouldn’t be up to anyone else, not me, not you, not the state, when that’s the situation.

I’m glad your mother found comfort in your sibling’s brief life. But your story is just that, a story and not relevant to another woman’s life and choices.

It’s euthanasia.
I don’t support euthanasia.
I believe on a deep level that we should not take human lives, ever. We cannot always save them. Sometimes we can only provide pain relief and palliative care. We should also respect life by not prolonging it with invasive treatments. But we should not be actively taking lives.

I bet that you are 100% in favor of the death penalty. What if science evolves to the point where it can be determined that a fetus was another Hitler and would finish his Final Solution not only of Jews but include all women after child bearing age. What if this fetus would murder your entire family?

Shows how much you know.
I am 100% against the death penalty.
You need to get out of your bubble more. You might be surprised to find that there are people who actually make up their own mind about things and don’t worry about towing whatever line.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Any anyway, if killing a special needs child because the family can’t cope is not ok, is it ok to kill a baby? And if it’s not ok to kill a newborn baby, why is it ok to kill a fetus?

And if you are ok with killing a special needs fetus at 38 weeks, are you also ok with killing healthy fetuses at 38 weeks?

I am not ok with either.
I am also not ok that collectively speaking we do not give humanity to fetuses who are found to have defects or disabilities. I can certainly understand and have compassion for families that would choose to end such pregnancies, but that does not make it right. We need to do better to support those families raising special needs families. We might better do so if more of us could actually see them.

And if you tell me that I can’t possibly understand the plight of these families, I will tell you that I do, because I was in such a family. I saw my brother being born, and then I saw him diagnosed with a fatal heart defect days later. We were extremely poor, my parents couldn’t afford a hospital birth let alone the bills that came later after the diagnosis. We took my brother home to receive palliative care and he died a few days later. It was hard for all of us, and horrible for my mom. But not one of us can imagine that it would have been less horrible for her to abort.
We treasured our few days with my brother.

I gave birth to healthy children but have families around us where this was not so. I cannot imagine those children not being here, or being less valuable. Remember that any person could become disabled at any time in their life. That does not diminish their humanity.

If it’s not ok to kill a fetus why is it ok to kill a zygote? You tell us.

We have to draw a line somewhere.
The line I would draw is when the fetus is capable of living outside the mother.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Any anyway, if killing a special needs child because the family can’t cope is not ok, is it ok to kill a baby? And if it’s not ok to kill a newborn baby, why is it ok to kill a fetus?

And if you are ok with killing a special needs fetus at 38 weeks, are you also ok with killing healthy fetuses at 38 weeks?

I am not ok with either.
I am also not ok that collectively speaking we do not give humanity to fetuses who are found to have defects or disabilities. I can certainly understand and have compassion for families that would choose to end such pregnancies, but that does not make it right. We need to do better to support those families raising special needs families. We might better do so if more of us could actually see them.

And if you tell me that I can’t possibly understand the plight of these families, I will tell you that I do, because I was in such a family. I saw my brother being born, and then I saw him diagnosed with a fatal heart defect days later. We were extremely poor, my parents couldn’t afford a hospital birth let alone the bills that came later after the diagnosis. We took my brother home to receive palliative care and he died a few days later. It was hard for all of us, and horrible for my mom. But not one of us can imagine that it would have been less horrible for her to abort.
We treasured our few days with my brother.

I gave birth to healthy children but have families around us where this was not so. I cannot imagine those children not being here, or being less valuable. Remember that any person could become disabled at any time in their life. That does not diminish their humanity.

What I choose is mine of your effing concern.

Isn’t it? If you saw someone beating their child, would you say that is none of your concern?

[Anonymous]

I am a liberal Christian woman and OP is so off base it is not even funny.

Women needed to be brave and declare their abortions because so many idiot pro lifers thought "they didn't know" anyone who had an abortion.

My body MY CHOICE is exactly what the Dems message should be.