Damar Hamlin

[Anonymous]

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Blunt force trauma to the chest, caused cardiac arrest?

It's not clear what caused it. The play looked pretty normal. There have been at least a dozen plays the last two weeks that I thought looked dangerous, usually someone falling on their neck or rolling over their head.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Apparently, only Goodell can call game off and he needs to do so immediately. It must be a prerequisite that to qualify to be football commissioner, you must be an unfeeling dolt.

He did. Settle down.

It took him an hour. The first thing the NFL did was order the teams to warm up and resume play 5 minutes after the ambulance left the field. The only reason they didn't is that both head coaches spoke and agreed to instead leave the field. They made that decision independent of Goodell and the league. They are humans and made choices based on their own feelings to what had happened and out of care for Hamlin and all their players who watched what happened with them.

That it took Goodell and the league over an hour to reach the same conclusion is disturbing but unsurprising. These people care more about the impact on sports gambling than the impact on these players who just watched a friend and teammate collapse and stop breathing right in front of them. Ghouls.

You say this like it’s unthinkable for Goodell and the League to consider the business aspect of things.

It’s sad that Hamlin collapsed, and we all pray for his full recovery. Roger Goodell does, Jerry Jones does, Skip Bayless does, and everyone does.

But on the other side is:
—the massive income from broadcast, streaming, and gate attendance for this game;
—the huge impact on the playoffs from playing this game vs canceling it;
—the enormous damage to the NFL as a reliable betting product if this game is not played forthwith.

If this game doesn’t get played, the Bengals and Bills effectively get a second bye week right at the end of the season. Fact is, all people have a monetary value to their lives. That’s why life insurance contracts are bought and then resold. I can assure you the money associated with this game overwhelms the value of any one player. It’s just economics.

The game should have continued while everyone is in the stadium. To preserve the competitive integrity of the playoffs, this game must be restarted by noon Tuesday. Any later will irreparably distort the playoffs. That’s unacceptable as the NFL is just too big to fail.

The Chiefs move into the 1 seed if the Bengals beat Buffalo, with Bengals close behind.
They could just call the game at 7-3 Bengals.

This is week 17, but in previous seasons before 2020 there would have been no week 18 game.

[Anonymous]

His Go Fund Me charity is getting higher by the hour and will be able to do so much good for others!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I feel like I’m becoming one of those boomers in the progressive commercials, but whenever I’m in an airport or public building and see an aed, I always think to myself - ok, that’s where it is in case I have to run and get it. Our house is 2 houses away from a park that has an aed, and every time I see it, I think about what if I had to run to get it. I also drive an electric vehicle, but I still carry around my weego, in case someone needs a jump. Progressive should call me for ad ideas.

But would you know how to use it?

There are instructions on every AED machine. They are very easy to use. Most have voice instructions too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

This is such good news. Obviously a long way to go but, with the initial updates, I was really worried that things might get worse instead of better.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Blunt force trauma to the chest, caused cardiac arrest?

It's not clear what caused it. The play looked pretty normal. There have been at least a dozen plays the last two weeks that I thought looked dangerous, usually someone falling on their neck or rolling over their head.

The hit looks shoulder pad to chest, rather than helmet to chest. More likely his chest made violent contact with the helmet of opposing player as they fell to the ground during the tackle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This is such good news. Obviously a long way to go but, with the initial updates, I was really worried that things might get worse instead of better.

His uncle was so composed and calm despite his sleep deprivation and taxing ordeal. But there was really nothing in his words that made me feel better about the outcome. In fact, the lack of quick progress is not a good sign. It was reported that he was ventilated in a prone position which is concerning for acute lung injury, which is always a worrisome sign. Ugh. The lung injury could be secondary to cpr, but in any case, it means that this is more complicated that I was hoping.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This is such good news. Obviously a long way to go but, with the initial updates, I was really worried that things might get worse instead of better.

His uncle was so composed and calm despite his sleep deprivation and taxing ordeal. But there was really nothing in his words that made me feel better about the outcome. In fact, the lack of quick progress is not a good sign. It was reported that he was ventilated in a prone position which is concerning for acute lung injury, which is always a worrisome sign. Ugh. The lung injury could be secondary to cpr, but in any case, it means that this is more complicated that I was hoping.

Actually several medical professionals have come out and said the prone position is not unusual, it takes some of the pressure off the lungs, so they aren’t working against gravity. Part of the healing process. They seemed more concerned about the the need to resuscitate a second time at the hospital.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
There are instructions on every AED machine. They are very easy to use. Most have voice instructions too.

PSA in the middle of this thread. It is so easy to get certified in CPR. The Red Cross even has an online course now. Obviously it's not as good as actually practicing on a dummy in a live class, but it's better than nothing. Consider this a new year's resolution to take 2hrs out of your time fto get trained.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Apparently, only Goodell can call game off and he needs to do so immediately. It must be a prerequisite that to qualify to be football commissioner, you must be an unfeeling dolt.

He did. Settle down.

It took him an hour. The first thing the NFL did was order the teams to warm up and resume play 5 minutes after the ambulance left the field. The only reason they didn't is that both head coaches spoke and agreed to instead leave the field. They made that decision independent of Goodell and the league. They are humans and made choices based on their own feelings to what had happened and out of care for Hamlin and all their players who watched what happened with them.

That it took Goodell and the league over an hour to reach the same conclusion is disturbing but unsurprising. These people care more about the impact on sports gambling than the impact on these players who just watched a friend and teammate collapse and stop breathing right in front of them. Ghouls.

You say this like it’s unthinkable for Goodell and the League to consider the business aspect of things.

It’s sad that Hamlin collapsed, and we all pray for his full recovery. Roger Goodell does, Jerry Jones does, Skip Bayless does, and everyone does.

But on the other side is:
—the massive income from broadcast, streaming, and gate attendance for this game;
—the huge impact on the playoffs from playing this game vs canceling it;
—the enormous damage to the NFL as a reliable betting product if this game is not played forthwith.

If this game doesn’t get played, the Bengals and Bills effectively get a second bye week right at the end of the season. Fact is, all people have a monetary value to their lives. That’s why life insurance contracts are bought and then resold. I can assure you the money associated with this game overwhelms the value of any one player. It’s just economics.

The game should have continued while everyone is in the stadium. To preserve the competitive integrity of the playoffs, this game must be restarted by noon Tuesday. Any later will irreparably distort the playoffs. That’s unacceptable as the NFL is just too big to fail.

This is so wrong. This was their teammate. Players were crying on the field. That's such a traumatic experience. Lives are more important than football.

Given the trauma I think both teams would be fine to have this marked as a tie. Even a loss for both of them. That's easier because they're both in the playoffs. Luckily we wouldn't have to find out what players, coaches, owners, and fans would think if either one was fighting to make the playoffs.

This is not a bad idea. This was a very pivotal game in terms of playoffs and football (which absolutely does not matter in light of what is happening with Hamlin) but I just cannot see any way to play it that doesn't feel... ghoulish. Maybe if he makes a full recovery all of a sudden, but I'm still having trouble imagining it.

Thinking first and foremost about Hamlin and his family (I cannot stop thinking about his mom, who had to watch that from the stands and then came down to ride with him to the hospital, I've just been holding her in my heart since last night). But I also just think these players and coaches need tenderness right now. This is their job and I guess you have to find a way to get back to it, but I really hope that as these decisions are made, people prioritize the mental health of those involved. I just really hope no one is put in a situation where they have to do something that could cause more trauma or grief just to keep their jobs. The NFL rarely shows itself to have a heart, but the individual people involved can still make good choices that remember these are people who deserve understanding and compassion right now.

+1
Like if this happened to us at work, we'd all likely take a day or two or so off, just to regroup. This is "just a job."
I admire the coach of the Bengals. It seems that he was the original instigator of "let's just both refuse to play and get off this field" idea. Just to give the coach of the Bills some room with his team. I say that only because he crossed the field to approach the Bengals coach.

Cincy native and Bengals fan here- Taylor is a good guy. A friend of mine was at the game and said everyone was horrified at what happened and he didn't really hear any disagreements in the crowd that the game should be suspended.

Prayers to Hamlin and his family and agree with the PP that this has to be tough for all the players and coaches who witnessed this. Gotta be a horrible feeling for Tee Higgins too as he was the last player to have physical contact with Hamlin.

I was also impressed by the way Zac Taylor handled himself, and the Cinci fans were incredible as well. I don't know much about Taylor, but he has my utmost respect. Sean McDermott is also widely respected as a good human being. Thank goodness these two men were on the field to lead the players (and all of those watching) through this tragedy.

Agreed. Thank goodness this didn't happen in Philadelphia.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Is there any chance he is brain dead? Is it expected that vital signs are normal but a patient is still in critical condition?

Yes, I believe not having an update on his condition is because they are assessing his brain damage. They performed CPR for 10 minutes. That's a lot of time for the brain to not have oxygen or to have low oxygen. And he had the best medical response you could ever imagine when something like this happens.

Disagree. The chance of him being brain dead is very low. He may have some recovery to do from hypoxia, but it shouldn't be severe.

They don't have an update because there isn't one. His vitals are stable. They will let him rest in heavy sedation while they do tests. They probably won't even try to lower his sedation until 48 hours of brain rest. So we are looking at Wednesday morning.

He was down for a long time. He will be lucky to survive and if he does, he will be lucky if he experienced only mild hypoxia. It only takes a few minutes before the brain starts to react to loss of oxygen.

If by “down” you mean period without adequate oxygenation of his brain, it’s hard to tell from what I have read. I thought I read that he was cardioverted on the field, but the last nyt article I read didn’t mention being shocked, only that he received cpr for 9-10 min. That could sound as if he needed cpr for 9-10 min because he didn’t have an organized heart rhythm, but it’s also possible that he got cpr after he was cardioverted. You are supposed to resume cpr even after a successful shock, so best case scenario is that he got cpr while they were attaching the aed, got shocked back to sinus (normal) rhythm , and then cpr was resumed as recommended. If that was the case, then he was “down” for only a few minutes, which is much better than 9-10 min. I really hope that the best case scenario is true. Impossible to assume anything right now.

I think that is what happened. He was hooked up to oxygen before being put in the ambulance on the field, and I don't think they would have done that unless he'd already been shocked and had cpr. Also, even if the on-field medics didn't have an aed (which I really think they do, and would have administered as soon as they checked his pulse if they could get one), there is definitely an aed in the ambulance, which was on the field within a few minutes. And again, they would not put him on oxygen for transport until AFTER administering the aed.

As awful as all of this is, it would have been very hard for him to get any better medical care and treatment, and that matters. I hope it was enough.

I thought I read that nfl protocol is to have an aed with the trainers, ready to go. The ambulance would have had a standard defibrillator, one that the user controls. The aed is great, but emts and medical professionals trained in acls (advanced cardiac life support) are able to run a code and decide all the things that the aed automates - shock strength, which rhythm to shock etc. They also push meds depending on the situation. It’s faster for a professional to read the rhythm and shock without waiting for the aed. In the old days, we were taught “abc’s” - airway, breathing and circulation, but these days it’s more like “cab” - circulation comes first. That is why they say don’t bother with rescue breaths but do vigorous chest compressions and don’t stop to check a pulse or for breathing, just do those compressions. I haven’t watched a medical drama in a long time, but I wonder if they have changed it on tv. Most people’s knowledge of cpr and defibrillation comes from tv/movies (fortunately!)

The trainers need to have AEDs and a spine board with them for all games and practices.

[Anonymous]

In case anyone wonders why not showing footage of him on the field is important, the uncle talked about how Damar’s 7 year old brother was watching on tv with the family and couldn’t stop screaming.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:In case anyone wonders why not showing footage of him on the field is important, the uncle talked about how Damar’s 7 year old brother was watching on tv with the family and couldn’t stop screaming.

Part of the reason they don't want people looking at the footage is that it was a pretty routine play. Hardly the stuff of "Jacked Up" or the like. That's what scares people.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

This is such good news. Obviously a long way to go but, with the initial updates, I was really worried that things might get worse instead of better.

His uncle was so composed and calm despite his sleep deprivation and taxing ordeal. But there was really nothing in his words that made me feel better about the outcome. In fact, the lack of quick progress is not a good sign. It was reported that he was ventilated in a prone position which is concerning for acute lung injury, which is always a worrisome sign. Ugh. The lung injury could be secondary to cpr, but in any case, it means that this is more complicated that I was hoping.

Actually several medical professionals have come out and said the prone position is not unusual, it takes some of the pressure off the lungs, so they aren’t working against gravity. Part of the healing process. They seemed more concerned about the the need to resuscitate a second time at the hospital.

I’m a physician and the proning is concerning. It means there is lung damage that the team is trying to reverse. Hopefully it is from primarily from cpr or resuscitation efforts (trauma from cpr, massive fluid boluses) and not cardiac dysfunction. Proning is done for patients with ards, acute respiratory distress syndrome, and in general, it’s a poor prognostic indicator, though his youth and general health is definitely on his side. His team would feel much better if he didn’t have ards. Second cardioversion is also concerning - if this was commotio cordis, the heart muscle is not damaged in the initial insult, so the second bout of what I assume was an arrhythmia means there was something else that caused it. Everyone is saying it’s likely commotio cordis, but his team will make sure there is nothing else going on. It could be that he has a genetic predisposition to arrhythmia, a structural defect, long qt, etc. I’m not sure how much the nfl screens players. In Italy, a player died on the soccer field from a cardiac arrest and they now have super stringent screening for professional soccer players.