Covid permanently harms immune system, repeat infections increase damage

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one has bothered to respond whether it was a-okay for the PP to ask if another PP was on the spectrum because they weren't having any problems communicating with masks or noticing some huge difference. Guess that was fine with you all, of course.

re my family's mask wearing, they are pretty outspoken and have definite opinions on mask wearing for public safety, so yeah, I know where they stand.

I don't think most people eschewing masks are experiencing such anxiety over it that they need to not wear them out of mental health concerns. Many people are just choosing not to wear them because they're tired of them and it's easier for them not to. This is true despite more and more information coming out that even mild cases of covid can cause long lasting harm to the immunity system (as the study that originated this thread shows). People are dropping basic safety measures out of convenience or politics or whatever. If those are your choices, you're certainly allowed to make them, and you can mock me all you want for taking basic, rational precautions for my family and doing what we can not to catch and spread a debilitating, life-threatening disease. Our family has done what we can. Good luck with yours.

Truth. We are doing all we can to prevent getting Covid too, I cannot understand those who don't, but we will come out ahead in the long game, our kids will not have cognitive delays from multiple covid infections and we won't be disabled in the nursing home from them. I can't believe how many people are apparently ok with this.

But you do know that you're just delaying the inevitable. Covid is not going away, it will continue to circulate and have seasonal surges, like other common viruses.

Of course you and your family can do whatever you feel necessary, but I don't think I'd set myself and my kids up to think that a mild case of covid next January, and one the following year, and so on, is going to lead to cognitive delays.

DP. I think many places are moving in the right direction about cleaning the air - France, Belgium, California. The situation isn't static, and for our family, the long we delay infection, the more time for advanced vaccines and solid air quality improvements to happen.

This Italian study just came out today:

Conclusions: Our study demonstrated for the first time the persistence of LV myocardial deformation abnormalities in previously healthy children with an asymptomatic or mildly symptomatic (WHO stages 0 or 1) COVID-19 course after an average follow-up of 148 ± 68 days. A more significant involvement was found in children affected during the second wave. These findings imply that subclinical LV dysfunction may also be a typical characteristic of COVID-19 infection in children and are concerning given the predictive value of LV longitudinal strain in the general population.

And then when you actually read the study…

Global longitudinal strain (post-COVID-19: −20.5 ± 2.9%; CTRL: −21.8 ± 1.7%; p < 0.001) was significantly reduced in children belonging to the post-COVID-19 group compared to controls, although still within the normal range (Figure 1A).



Thirty-seven post-COVID-19 children reached a follow-up of >240 days since the acute onset of the disease, with a mean GLS of −20.1 ± 2.8%. Overall, 28 children were examined at a follow-up of 180–240 days with a mean GLS of −20.6 ± 4.4%, and the remaining 92 children were seen before 180 days of follow-up, with a GLS of −20.7 ± 2.4%. No significant differences were seen among those three follow-up groups (p = NS) (Figure 3A).

The three follow up groups are not the controls, which isn't good news from my perspective if we are talking about significant reductions in LV longitudinal strain. We need more research on this.

We will always "need more research". There will always be uncertainty.

Yes, but there are enough red flags for some of us that living like it’s 2019 with isn’t wise. My MIL had heart failure that started with LV issues. I would never want any significant reductions for my child, even if still in normal range, in cardiac matters. Hopefully omicron does not cause the same reductions, since that is when most kids got infected.

That's because you believe pandemic restrictions have no real harms. And maybe they don't for you, I don't know.

We've had COVID twice, once from a daycare outbreak and once from an asymptomatic HCW family member we were staying with. Wearing masks outside the home would not have prevented either infection. We also have a young child.who can't mask properly (she was "masking" when she got COVID) who really needs all the social exposure she can get, whose behavior changes dramatically when she wears mask improperly. So some of us have other considerations (which will be dismissed as "making it about mental health" by some of you). So no, an observational study about non clinically significant changes is not going to change my behavior. You do you, I'll do me, you'll judge and feel superior and I'll ignore your self-righteous ass.

Mature response. I definitely think pandemic restrictions have costs, and I was a different poster responding as noted above. I don’t think anybody should be forced to mask right now, but I do it because of the precautionary principle. I don’t think I’m better than people who don’t mask. I think it would be healthy if you took a step back and separated out people being self-righteous about masks versus possible long-term issues with children and Covid. I don’t think anyone of us wants harm on children, and politicizing the issue so as to downplay possible research isn’t helpful either.

I mean you're basically telling people to be afraid when their children are unmasked around others. That's horrible for young children, I'm sorry. There are other health priorities for children besides COVID.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one has bothered to respond whether it was a-okay for the PP to ask if another PP was on the spectrum because they weren't having any problems communicating with masks or noticing some huge difference. Guess that was fine with you all, of course.

re my family's mask wearing, they are pretty outspoken and have definite opinions on mask wearing for public safety, so yeah, I know where they stand.

I don't think most people eschewing masks are experiencing such anxiety over it that they need to not wear them out of mental health concerns. Many people are just choosing not to wear them because they're tired of them and it's easier for them not to. This is true despite more and more information coming out that even mild cases of covid can cause long lasting harm to the immunity system (as the study that originated this thread shows). People are dropping basic safety measures out of convenience or politics or whatever. If those are your choices, you're certainly allowed to make them, and you can mock me all you want for taking basic, rational precautions for my family and doing what we can not to catch and spread a debilitating, life-threatening disease. Our family has done what we can. Good luck with yours.

Truth. We are doing all we can to prevent getting Covid too, I cannot understand those who don't, but we will come out ahead in the long game, our kids will not have cognitive delays from multiple covid infections and we won't be disabled in the nursing home from them. I can't believe how many people are apparently ok with this.

But you do know that you're just delaying the inevitable. Covid is not going away, it will continue to circulate and have seasonal surges, like other common viruses.

Of course you and your family can do whatever you feel necessary, but I don't think I'd set myself and my kids up to think that a mild case of covid next January, and one the following year, and so on, is going to lead to cognitive delays.

DP. I think many places are moving in the right direction about cleaning the air - France, Belgium, California. The situation isn't static, and for our family, the long we delay infection, the more time for advanced vaccines and solid air quality improvements to happen.

This Italian study just came out today:

Conclusions: Our study demonstrated for the first time the persistence of LV myocardial deformation abnormalities in previously healthy children with an asymptomatic or mildly symptomatic (WHO stages 0 or 1) COVID-19 course after an average follow-up of 148 ± 68 days. A more significant involvement was found in children affected during the second wave. These findings imply that subclinical LV dysfunction may also be a typical characteristic of COVID-19 infection in children and are concerning given the predictive value of LV longitudinal strain in the general population.

And then when you actually read the study…

Global longitudinal strain (post-COVID-19: −20.5 ± 2.9%; CTRL: −21.8 ± 1.7%; p < 0.001) was significantly reduced in children belonging to the post-COVID-19 group compared to controls, although still within the normal range (Figure 1A).



Thirty-seven post-COVID-19 children reached a follow-up of >240 days since the acute onset of the disease, with a mean GLS of −20.1 ± 2.8%. Overall, 28 children were examined at a follow-up of 180–240 days with a mean GLS of −20.6 ± 4.4%, and the remaining 92 children were seen before 180 days of follow-up, with a GLS of −20.7 ± 2.4%. No significant differences were seen among those three follow-up groups (p = NS) (Figure 3A).

The three follow up groups are not the controls, which isn't good news from my perspective if we are talking about significant reductions in LV longitudinal strain. We need more research on this.

We will always "need more research". There will always be uncertainty.

Yes, but there are enough red flags for some of us that living like it’s 2019 with isn’t wise. My MIL had heart failure that started with LV issues. I would never want any significant reductions for my child, even if still in normal range, in cardiac matters. Hopefully omicron does not cause the same reductions, since that is when most kids got infected.

That's because you believe pandemic restrictions have no real harms. And maybe they don't for you, I don't know.

We've had COVID twice, once from a daycare outbreak and once from an asymptomatic HCW family member we were staying with. Wearing masks outside the home would not have prevented either infection. We also have a young child.who can't mask properly (she was "masking" when she got COVID) who really needs all the social exposure she can get, whose behavior changes dramatically when she wears mask improperly. So some of us have other considerations (which will be dismissed as "making it about mental health" by some of you). So no, an observational study about non clinically significant changes is not going to change my behavior. You do you, I'll do me, you'll judge and feel superior and I'll ignore your self-righteous ass.

Mature response. I definitely think pandemic restrictions have costs, and I was a different poster responding as noted above. I don’t think anybody should be forced to mask right now, but I do it because of the precautionary principle. I don’t think I’m better than people who don’t mask. I think it would be healthy if you took a step back and separated out people being self-righteous about masks versus possible long-term issues with children and Covid. I don’t think anyone of us wants harm on children, and politicizing the issue so as to downplay possible research isn’t helpful either.

I mean you're basically telling people to be afraid when their children are unmasked around others. That's horrible for young children, I'm sorry. There are other health priorities for children besides COVID.

No, I’m saying we need more research on these issues and we need better indoor air quality standards and processes. Telling people to be afraid is pointless.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one has bothered to respond whether it was a-okay for the PP to ask if another PP was on the spectrum because they weren't having any problems communicating with masks or noticing some huge difference. Guess that was fine with you all, of course.

re my family's mask wearing, they are pretty outspoken and have definite opinions on mask wearing for public safety, so yeah, I know where they stand.

I don't think most people eschewing masks are experiencing such anxiety over it that they need to not wear them out of mental health concerns. Many people are just choosing not to wear them because they're tired of them and it's easier for them not to. This is true despite more and more information coming out that even mild cases of covid can cause long lasting harm to the immunity system (as the study that originated this thread shows). People are dropping basic safety measures out of convenience or politics or whatever. If those are your choices, you're certainly allowed to make them, and you can mock me all you want for taking basic, rational precautions for my family and doing what we can not to catch and spread a debilitating, life-threatening disease. Our family has done what we can. Good luck with yours.

Truth. We are doing all we can to prevent getting Covid too, I cannot understand those who don't, but we will come out ahead in the long game, our kids will not have cognitive delays from multiple covid infections and we won't be disabled in the nursing home from them. I can't believe how many people are apparently ok with this.

But you do know that you're just delaying the inevitable. Covid is not going away, it will continue to circulate and have seasonal surges, like other common viruses.

Of course you and your family can do whatever you feel necessary, but I don't think I'd set myself and my kids up to think that a mild case of covid next January, and one the following year, and so on, is going to lead to cognitive delays.

DP. I think many places are moving in the right direction about cleaning the air - France, Belgium, California. The situation isn't static, and for our family, the long we delay infection, the more time for advanced vaccines and solid air quality improvements to happen.

This Italian study just came out today:

Conclusions: Our study demonstrated for the first time the persistence of LV myocardial deformation abnormalities in previously healthy children with an asymptomatic or mildly symptomatic (WHO stages 0 or 1) COVID-19 course after an average follow-up of 148 ± 68 days. A more significant involvement was found in children affected during the second wave. These findings imply that subclinical LV dysfunction may also be a typical characteristic of COVID-19 infection in children and are concerning given the predictive value of LV longitudinal strain in the general population.

And then when you actually read the study…

Global longitudinal strain (post-COVID-19: −20.5 ± 2.9%; CTRL: −21.8 ± 1.7%; p < 0.001) was significantly reduced in children belonging to the post-COVID-19 group compared to controls, although still within the normal range (Figure 1A).



Thirty-seven post-COVID-19 children reached a follow-up of >240 days since the acute onset of the disease, with a mean GLS of −20.1 ± 2.8%. Overall, 28 children were examined at a follow-up of 180–240 days with a mean GLS of −20.6 ± 4.4%, and the remaining 92 children were seen before 180 days of follow-up, with a GLS of −20.7 ± 2.4%. No significant differences were seen among those three follow-up groups (p = NS) (Figure 3A).

The three follow up groups are not the controls, which isn't good news from my perspective if we are talking about significant reductions in LV longitudinal strain. We need more research on this.

We will always "need more research". There will always be uncertainty.

Yes, but there are enough red flags for some of us that living like it’s 2019 with isn’t wise. My MIL had heart failure that started with LV issues. I would never want any significant reductions for my child, even if still in normal range, in cardiac matters. Hopefully omicron does not cause the same reductions, since that is when most kids got infected.

That's because you believe pandemic restrictions have no real harms. And maybe they don't for you, I don't know.

We've had COVID twice, once from a daycare outbreak and once from an asymptomatic HCW family member we were staying with. Wearing masks outside the home would not have prevented either infection. We also have a young child.who can't mask properly (she was "masking" when she got COVID) who really needs all the social exposure she can get, whose behavior changes dramatically when she wears mask improperly. So some of us have other considerations (which will be dismissed as "making it about mental health" by some of you). So no, an observational study about non clinically significant changes is not going to change my behavior. You do you, I'll do me, you'll judge and feel superior and I'll ignore your self-righteous ass.

Mature response. I definitely think pandemic restrictions have costs, and I was a different poster responding as noted above. I don’t think anybody should be forced to mask right now, but I do it because of the precautionary principle. I don’t think I’m better than people who don’t mask. I think it would be healthy if you took a step back and separated out people being self-righteous about masks versus possible long-term issues with children and Covid. I don’t think anyone of us wants harm on children, and politicizing the issue so as to downplay possible research isn’t helpful either.

I mean you're basically telling people to be afraid when their children are unmasked around others. That's horrible for young children, I'm sorry. There are other health priorities for children besides COVID.

No, I’m saying we need more research on these issues and we need better indoor air quality standards and processes. Telling people to be afraid is pointless.

So you posted this study on DCUM so readers will start their own studies on these issues and establish better indoor quality standards and processes?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just don’t get PP’s black and white thinking. Either she wears masks for the rest of her life around her friends or she drops them entirely? I wear a mask if I’m in a crowded indoor location where I’m not taking or exercising. It decreases my risk and is almost no burden to me.

Yes, I don't understand this either. It's either decide to wear masks now and forever and ever amen or drop them entirely? Science progresses. Circumstances change. I think people are creating this strawman to make their choice of ignoring the health risks to their families seem more logical. Given the huge amount of progress made on covid over the last 2 years, it's not logical to think covid safety won't further progress for the next 40 years, but that's what folks are telling themselves to make dropping safeguards seem like a balanced choice. It isn't fact based or truthful, but it's convenient.

Same with the argument that everyone will get covid eventually so why bother with masks. High quality masks have been proven to work. People who don't wear them will on the whole get covid more frequently and/or get exposed to higher more debilitating doses of it when they do, and will spin the long covid and decreased immunity lotteries every time. That's why it's reasonable to bother, on the whole, and many people don't find it very difficult. But hey, we all have to make and live with our own choices.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I just don’t get PP’s black and white thinking. Either she wears masks for the rest of her life around her friends or she drops them entirely? I wear a mask if I’m in a crowded indoor location where I’m not taking or exercising. It decreases my risk and is almost no burden to me.

+1

I have a hard time, socializing and interacting with work colleagues while masked. So I don’t mask in those situations, and accept the risk. When I’m in the airport or on an airplane I am not trying to socialize so I wear a mask.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just don’t get PP’s black and white thinking. Either she wears masks for the rest of her life around her friends or she drops them entirely? I wear a mask if I’m in a crowded indoor location where I’m not taking or exercising. It decreases my risk and is almost no burden to me.

Yes, I don't understand this either. It's either decide to wear masks now and forever and ever amen or drop them entirely? Science progresses. Circumstances change. I think people are creating this strawman to make their choice of ignoring the health risks to their families seem more logical. Given the huge amount of progress made on covid over the last 2 years, it's not logical to think covid safety won't further progress for the next 40 years, but that's what folks are telling themselves to make dropping safeguards seem like a balanced choice. It isn't fact based or truthful, but it's convenient.

Same with the argument that everyone will get covid eventually so why bother with masks. High quality masks have been proven to work. People who don't wear them will on the whole get covid more frequently and/or get exposed to higher more debilitating doses of it when they do, and will spin the long covid and decreased immunity lotteries every time. That's why it's reasonable to bother, on the whole, and many people don't find it very difficult. But hey, we all have to make and live with our own choices.

For a young child, masking for another year means another key year in their social development.

Also, numerous factors will determine how often a person gets COVID, not just the extent to which they wear masks. Masking is probably one of the least important factors. Certainly, for an adult, it's one of the ones they can most control, and also one that impacts them daily in a variety of ways, whether you choose to acknowledge it or not, whether you ridicule those issues or not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just don’t get PP’s black and white thinking. Either she wears masks for the rest of her life around her friends or she drops them entirely? I wear a mask if I’m in a crowded indoor location where I’m not taking or exercising. It decreases my risk and is almost no burden to me.

Yes, I don't understand this either. It's either decide to wear masks now and forever and ever amen or drop them entirely? Science progresses. Circumstances change. I think people are creating this strawman to make their choice of ignoring the health risks to their families seem more logical. Given the huge amount of progress made on covid over the last 2 years, it's not logical to think covid safety won't further progress for the next 40 years, but that's what folks are telling themselves to make dropping safeguards seem like a balanced choice. It isn't fact based or truthful, but it's convenient.

Same with the argument that everyone will get covid eventually so why bother with masks. High quality masks have been proven to work. People who don't wear them will on the whole get covid more frequently and/or get exposed to higher more debilitating doses of it when they do, and will spin the long covid and decreased immunity lotteries every time. That's why it's reasonable to bother, on the whole, and many people don't find it very difficult. But hey, we all have to make and live with our own choices.

For a young child, masking for another year means another key year in their social development.

Also, numerous factors will determine how often a person gets COVID, not just the extent to which they wear masks. Masking is probably one of the least important factors. Certainly, for an adult, it's one of the ones they can most control, and also one that impacts them daily in a variety of ways, whether you choose to acknowledge it or not, whether you ridicule those issues or not.

DP. It is not to ridicule parents. I’m not advocating for masking two or three year olds by mandate. To me, the real question is if we discover through more research that Covid is actually harming most childrens’ LV function, it is likely that most parents would agitate for better indoor air quality, starting with daycares where kids are most vulnerable. If you knew that repeat infections were going to cause cardiac harm, I’m sure you would change whatever you could to protect your child.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just don’t get PP’s black and white thinking. Either she wears masks for the rest of her life around her friends or she drops them entirely? I wear a mask if I’m in a crowded indoor location where I’m not taking or exercising. It decreases my risk and is almost no burden to me.

Yes, I don't understand this either. It's either decide to wear masks now and forever and ever amen or drop them entirely? Science progresses. Circumstances change. I think people are creating this strawman to make their choice of ignoring the health risks to their families seem more logical. Given the huge amount of progress made on covid over the last 2 years, it's not logical to think covid safety won't further progress for the next 40 years, but that's what folks are telling themselves to make dropping safeguards seem like a balanced choice. It isn't fact based or truthful, but it's convenient.

Same with the argument that everyone will get covid eventually so why bother with masks. High quality masks have been proven to work. People who don't wear them will on the whole get covid more frequently and/or get exposed to higher more debilitating doses of it when they do, and will spin the long covid and decreased immunity lotteries every time. That's why it's reasonable to bother, on the whole, and many people don't find it very difficult. But hey, we all have to make and live with our own choices.

For a young child, masking for another year means another key year in their social development.

Also, numerous factors will determine how often a person gets COVID, not just the extent to which they wear masks. Masking is probably one of the least important factors. Certainly, for an adult, it's one of the ones they can most control, and also one that impacts them daily in a variety of ways, whether you choose to acknowledge it or not, whether you ridicule those issues or not.

DP. It is not to ridicule parents. I’m not advocating for masking two or three year olds by mandate. To me, the real question is if we discover through more research that Covid is actually harming most childrens’ LV function, it is likely that most parents would agitate for better indoor air quality, starting with daycares where kids are most vulnerable. If you knew that repeat infections were going to cause cardiac harm, I’m sure you would change whatever you could to protect your child.

But I don't, nor am I qualified to assess the scientific data cardiac harms of COVID on children. And neither are you, I suspect.

[Anonymous]

I am qualified to assess that the fact that my child's social behavior changes when she wears a mask is not great for her, and that she needs all the social exposure she can get at this age, and that it will take a lot for me to limit that exposure outside of LIMITED periods of time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just don’t get PP’s black and white thinking. Either she wears masks for the rest of her life around her friends or she drops them entirely? I wear a mask if I’m in a crowded indoor location where I’m not taking or exercising. It decreases my risk and is almost no burden to me.

Yes, I don't understand this either. It's either decide to wear masks now and forever and ever amen or drop them entirely? Science progresses. Circumstances change. I think people are creating this strawman to make their choice of ignoring the health risks to their families seem more logical. Given the huge amount of progress made on covid over the last 2 years, it's not logical to think covid safety won't further progress for the next 40 years, but that's what folks are telling themselves to make dropping safeguards seem like a balanced choice. It isn't fact based or truthful, but it's convenient.

Same with the argument that everyone will get covid eventually so why bother with masks. High quality masks have been proven to work. People who don't wear them will on the whole get covid more frequently and/or get exposed to higher more debilitating doses of it when they do, and will spin the long covid and decreased immunity lotteries every time. That's why it's reasonable to bother, on the whole, and many people don't find it very difficult. But hey, we all have to make and live with our own choices.

For a young child, masking for another year means another key year in their social development.

Also, numerous factors will determine how often a person gets COVID, not just the extent to which they wear masks. Masking is probably one of the least important factors. Certainly, for an adult, it's one of the ones they can most control, and also one that impacts them daily in a variety of ways, whether you choose to acknowledge it or not, whether you ridicule those issues or not.

DP. It is not to ridicule parents. I’m not advocating for masking two or three year olds by mandate. To me, the real question is if we discover through more research that Covid is actually harming most childrens’ LV function, it is likely that most parents would agitate for better indoor air quality, starting with daycares where kids are most vulnerable. If you knew that repeat infections were going to cause cardiac harm, I’m sure you would change whatever you could to protect your child.

But I don't, nor am I qualified to assess the scientific data cardiac harms of COVID on children. And neither are you, I suspect.

This isn’t the flex you think it is. Residents of Flint Michigan & Jackson Mississippi also are not experts in detecting lead in water, but they absolutely have a vested interest in agitating for clean water.

[Anonymous]

I don't remember seeing anyone on this thread argue that parents should be forced to mask a young child who has difficulty with and emotional issues connected to masking.

Parents are allowed to make whatever choices they want at this point. Good luck.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am qualified to assess that the fact that my child's social behavior changes when she wears a mask is not great for her, and that she needs all the social exposure she can get at this age, and that it will take a lot for me to limit that exposure outside of LIMITED periods of time.

I think we’ve seen you on the health pages before, and should not expect anything constructive out of engaging. Why do you repeatedly come to these Covid threads?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't remember seeing anyone on this thread argue that parents should be forced to mask a young child who has difficulty with and emotional issues connected to masking.

Parents are allowed to make whatever choices they want at this point. Good luck.

No just people crowing about how THEIR children won't have cognitive disabilities and the rest of us will.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don't remember seeing anyone on this thread argue that parents should be forced to mask a young child who has difficulty with and emotional issues connected to masking.

Parents are allowed to make whatever choices they want at this point. Good luck.

I don't recall any of the pro-maskers here acknowledging that masks can have real effects on people's mental health. In fact, they ridiculed that notion.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just don’t get PP’s black and white thinking. Either she wears masks for the rest of her life around her friends or she drops them entirely? I wear a mask if I’m in a crowded indoor location where I’m not taking or exercising. It decreases my risk and is almost no burden to me.

Yes, I don't understand this either. It's either decide to wear masks now and forever and ever amen or drop them entirely? Science progresses. Circumstances change. I think people are creating this strawman to make their choice of ignoring the health risks to their families seem more logical. Given the huge amount of progress made on covid over the last 2 years, it's not logical to think covid safety won't further progress for the next 40 years, but that's what folks are telling themselves to make dropping safeguards seem like a balanced choice. It isn't fact based or truthful, but it's convenient.

Same with the argument that everyone will get covid eventually so why bother with masks. High quality masks have been proven to work. People who don't wear them will on the whole get covid more frequently and/or get exposed to higher more debilitating doses of it when they do, and will spin the long covid and decreased immunity lotteries every time. That's why it's reasonable to bother, on the whole, and many people don't find it very difficult. But hey, we all have to make and live with our own choices.

For a young child, masking for another year means another key year in their social development.

Also, numerous factors will determine how often a person gets COVID, not just the extent to which they wear masks. Masking is probably one of the least important factors. Certainly, for an adult, it's one of the ones they can most control, and also one that impacts them daily in a variety of ways, whether you choose to acknowledge it or not, whether you ridicule those issues or not.

DP. It is not to ridicule parents. I’m not advocating for masking two or three year olds by mandate. To me, the real question is if we discover through more research that Covid is actually harming most childrens’ LV function, it is likely that most parents would agitate for better indoor air quality, starting with daycares where kids are most vulnerable. If you knew that repeat infections were going to cause cardiac harm, I’m sure you would change whatever you could to protect your child.

But I don't, nor am I qualified to assess the scientific data cardiac harms of COVID on children. And neither are you, I suspect.

This isn’t the flex you think it is. Residents of Flint Michigan & Jackson Mississippi also are not experts in detecting lead in water, but they absolutely have a vested interest in agitating for clean water.

That's not the flex you think it is. We are talking about cardiac harms of COVID on children. Not lead in the water which has proven and well-documented harms.